Should We Trade Mason?

[RavensIQ]

[quote name='mhead66' post='167150' date='Mar 11 2009, 02:55 PM']Boldin IS a great WR... and would be a huge gain for the Ravens.

But compare Boldin to Warner.

Warner is willing to sacrifice some of his money to sign Boldin. He didn't say he would defer his money, to receive the same amount in later years. He said he would take 2 million less.

Boldin has been with the Cards for 6 years. This is the 4th time he's publicly complained about his contract.

Compare the two players, and their attitudes.

Boldin is excellent, but he could be a headache...[/quote]


Hurt Warner is getting paid over $10M a year. Larry Fitgerald is getting paid $10M a year. Boldin is getting paid like $3M a year. I wonder why Boldin is upset?

By the way, Kurt Warner is all talk bcuz he hasn't agreed to anything contractually yet saying, "if Boldin resigns he'll get such and such''. It's all BS. He was just saying the right things at the right times, so people would be happy. I never bought it for one minute. Bottom line:Kurt Warner is not giving up any money for Boldin.

So it's not a matter of IF Boldin is getting traded, it's a matter of when. And if you're Ozzie and you're interested, you have to think about every possibility and scenario for trying to attain Anquan Boldin. Ideally you would like to do so by keeping your 1st round pick. If Mason and a draft pick can get it done, then great, lets explore that option.

To say Boldin isn't the right guy for our team bcuz he's having financial feuds with his team isn't fair. Boldin and Flacco equals a lot of good things for years to come.

[RavensIQ]

[quote name='GermanRavensFan' post='167151' date='Mar 11 2009, 02:58 PM']Be realistic. Boldin will never be here.

Our Pass offense isnt struggling because of our receivers. A great receiver would be an improvement, but he would not transform it into a TOP 5 Pass-O. There are several factors.

If Boldin would come here, he would defenitely not have the numbers he wants to have -> distraction.[/quote]


Boldin is not a numbers guy. He doesn't play for catches he plays for wins. The only thing that is causing Boldin to look like a drama WR is the fact that Cardinals won't pay him. He deserves to be paid. So why is everyone on his case?

by the way if Derrick Mason can have 80 recpetions, over 1000 yards receiving, and 5+ touchdowns in our system, then what makes you think Anquan Boldin can't???

[nextgen_RavensFan]

I am a true Mason fan. I have spoken on his dedication to the team and definately would not be for trading him ecspecially for Boldin and a pic in any round.

[mhead66]

[quote name='RavensIQ' post='167163' date='Mar 11 2009, 03:20 PM']Hurt Warner is getting paid over $10M a year. Larry Fitgerald is getting paid $10M a year. Boldin is getting paid like $3M a year. I wonder why Boldin is upset?

By the way, Kurt Warner is all talk bcuz he hasn't agreed to anything contractually yet saying, "if Boldin resigns he'll get such and such''. It's all BS. He was just saying the right things at the right times, so people would be happy. I never bought it for one minute. Bottom line:Kurt Warner is not giving up any money for Boldin.

So it's not a matter of IF Boldin is getting traded, it's a matter of when. And if you're Ozzie and you're interested, you have to think about every possibility and scenario for trying to attain Anquan Boldin. Ideally you would like to do so by keeping your 1st round pick. If Mason and a draft pick can get it done, then great, lets explore that option.

To say Boldin isn't the right guy for our team bcuz he's having financial feuds with his team isn't fair. Boldin and Flacco equals a lot of good things for years to come.[/quote]
I must say you make some good points.

I've always been a fan of using the draft, instead of free agency - unless it's a top 10 pick, draft picks are much easier on the salary cap, you usually get them for 4-5 years relatively cheaply. Many of the most successful franchises build this way - like Indy and Pitt, who won the SB with only 2 FA starters.

Having said that, giving up Mason and a 2nd for (only) 28 year old Boldin may be a good move. Even teams relying primarily on the draft can plug in a hole with an occasional free agent, if they're close to contending... like the Ravens definitely are.

And I would hate giving up a 1st round pick - you may trade a future Ray Lewis or Jon Ogden (or maybe a Travis Taylor )... but a 2nd - that could be worth it.

Contingent upon the Ravens being able to sign Boldin to a long term deal.

[bscott57]

[quote name='nextgen_RavensFan' post='167167' date='Mar 11 2009, 03:31 PM']I am a true Mason fan. I have spoken on his dedication to the team and definately would not be for trading him ecspecially for Boldin and a pic in any round.[/quote]

Wow, not sure how many times this needs to be said but this is a business. Mason is great and has been the most underrated WR in the NFL the last 2 years, HOWEVER to say you would not trade him for Boldin and ANY round draft pick is absolutely absurd. We can love our Ravens til the cows come home but you need to look at these things under an objective eye, I am sure there are people here that will want Ray Lewis suiting up at Mic linebacker well into his 50's.

Come on with this nonsense. If we have the opportunity to get Boldin for Mason and keep our 1st rounder it is an absolute no-brainer. And to say he has been upset with his contract a lot recently is fair, but he also is in a different situation than any other WR in the NFL, he is a top 8 (arguably top 5) WR on this league but has a guy higher up on that list on his own team getting a larger contract. If I or anyone else on this board were in his situation you would have felt the same way, the guys a surefire 12 TD, 1000 yards guy every year no matter who is throwing him the ball, and up until last year it was debatable who the better WR in the Cardinals organization was. Keep this in mind if it were flip-flopped Fitz wouldnt be the happiest guy in Arizona either, would we not want him? The point is Arizona made the decision that Fitz was their number 1 priority and that upset Boldin and rightfully so, as Ravens fans who wouldnt love the idea of having him play with Flacco and be our undisputed #1 guy, even if that means parting ways with the best WR the Ravens have had in their short history in D Mase (although this is a very unlikely scenario).

[neepo13]

[quote name='RavensIQ' post='167163' date='Mar 11 2009, 03:20 PM']Hurt Warner is getting paid over $10M a year. Larry Fitgerald is getting paid $10M a year. Boldin is getting paid like $3M a year. I wonder why Boldin is upset?

By the way, Kurt Warner is all talk bcuz he hasn't agreed to anything contractually yet saying, "if Boldin resigns he'll get such and such''. It's all BS. He was just saying the right things at the right times, so people would be happy. I never bought it for one minute. Bottom line:Kurt Warner is not giving up any money for Boldin.

So it's not a matter of IF Boldin is getting traded, it's a matter of when. And if you're Ozzie and you're interested, you have to think about every possibility and scenario for trying to attain Anquan Boldin. Ideally you would like to do so by keeping your 1st round pick. If Mason and a draft pick can get it done, then great, lets explore that option.

To say Boldin isn't the right guy for our team bcuz he's having financial feuds with his team isn't fair. Boldin and Flacco equals a lot of good things for years to come.[/quote]

I understand what you are saying but at some point these guys have to honor the agreements that they sign. They cant throw a hissy fit everytime one of their teammates get paid more then them. Boldin had the chance to negotiate and opted to sign the extenstion that he signed with the Cardinals. This isnt the same situation that the Cardinals had with Warner and Fitzgerald. Fitzgerald was asked by the Cardinals to sign an extenstion because the final two years of his rookie contract were a massive cap hit. So, he actually took a pay cut. And Warner being on the open market had every right to sign a new deal. Anquan Boldin has no right to be angry about the organization paying Warner and Fitzgerald more then him. If anything he's jealous.

[bscott57]

[quote name='neepo13' post='167179' date='Mar 11 2009, 03:59 PM']I understand what you are saying but at some point these guys have to honor the agreements that they sign. They cant throw a hissy fit everytime one of their teammates get paid more then them. Boldin had the chance to negotiate and opted to sign the extenstion that he signed with the Cardinals. This isnt the same situation that the Cardinals had with Warner and Fitzgerald. Fitzgerald was asked by the Cardinals to sign an extenstion because the final two years of his rookie contract were a massive cap hit. So, he actually took a pay cut. And Warner being on the open market had every right to sign a new deal.[b] Anquan Boldin has no right to be angry about the organization paying Warner and Fitzgerald more then him. If anything he's jealous.[/quote][/b]

I couldnt disagree more, that is why he wants out of Arizona. Boldin is a Top 8 WR in this league and makes plays very very few WR out there can make. He is getting the raw end of the deal as until the playoff this past year there was no proof in the numbers he was better or more valuable than Fitzgerald, and jealousy will fuel his fire as soon as he gets out of Arizona. I would love to have him in Baltimore and let this be the town he proves to everyone he was underappreciated in Arizona and he was the one deserving of the huge contract, people seem to forget they BOTH started in the Pro Bowl together.

[Alexir]

^Agree with bscott57

[agpowell]

Sigh, okay. Why would Boldin want to come here? We may be a younger team and definitely on the rise, but he is with the Cardinals who made the superbowl last year and there window of opportunity is right now, and probably as long as Warner is there and they keep the pieces in place. Why would Boldin want to come here when he is guaranteed AT LEAST 1000 yards in the pass-happy Cards offense. And why would the Cardinals take Mason and a 2nd round pickfor Boldin? I dont see the value their tbh. Mason only has a couple of good years left, and i dont think they would be able to draft someone of Boldin's standard with a 2nd round pick so there is no value in the trade...
Can people let go of the Boldin thing! It's done! He's not going to come! It was always a piper dream at best, he doesn't even want out of Az anymore. Let it go, find something new to talk about!

[agpowell]

***pipe dream. Thoughts anyone?

[bscott57]

[quote name='agpowell' post='167208' date='Mar 11 2009, 04:57 PM']***pipe dream. Thoughts anyone?[/quote]

Ya he probably wont come and your right the chances are very slim. Thats not the point, its that Ravens fans wouldnt give up Mason and a draft pick (not the 1st) for Boldin.

But I need to disagree that the Cardinals couldnt use a 2nd rounder and Mason and help their team. As many people on here have stated, Boldin hasnt always been the happiest guy in AZ and Breaston showed last year he can have a major impact. I realize this Mason talk was all started here on the forum but his leadership and experience could be an asset to that Cardinals WR corps and would also relieve alot of this pressure on the cap with a lot of $ wrapped up in 2 Qb's and 2 Wr's. The question is whether or not we would do that, but we obviously wouldnt get a proven talent such as Boldin in even the 1st round.

[Tywithay]

To the person that said the Cardinals couldn't get a Anquan Boldin in the 2nd round, don't forget Boldin himself was a 2nd rounder because he had issues with his 40 time. There's guys every year that drop because they didn't run a 4.4, if somebody likes Nicks or Britt fell into the 2nd round, it's a possibility, I highly doubt the trade would even be feasable until draft day though. I say wait until April and see what happens, Boldin will be in red until then for sure.

[agpowell]

I guess you could argue that there might be a potential Boldin-like talent in the 2nd round...or you could argue as i will that why not keep Boldin seeing as he's young, proven and productive. What your saying is get a receiver who most likely wont but possibly will be as good as Boldin in a few years...which by then Warner would have retired and the Cardinals window of opportunity will most likely have closed.

[bscott57]

[quote name='Tywithay' post='167212' date='Mar 11 2009, 05:16 PM']To the person that said the Cardinals couldn't get a Anquan Boldin in the 2nd round, don't forget Boldin himself was a 2nd rounder because he had issues with his 40 time. There's guys every year that drop because they didn't run a 4.4, if somebody likes Nicks or Britt fell into the 2nd round, it's a possibility, I highly doubt the trade would even be feasable until draft day though. I say wait until April and see what happens, Boldin will be in red until then for sure.[/quote]

Ya but that is down the road, Boldin has proven he is a force. For every 2nd round sensation like Boldin or 7th round (I think) TO there are a lot more guys like Travis Taylor who never pan out. No one can say for sure Nicks or Britt will be a dominant Pro Bowl WR like Boldin, even though I am a Tar Heel I would love to see us take Nicks.

[pathic357]

NO!! WE Need To Keep Mason...Did You not see Him Put his Health on the line last year,Playing with a seperated Shoulder. He is The Man and All He wants to Do get A Contract Extension And Finish His career As A Raven And I Feel He deserves It. We Had alot of injurys doing the playoffs...That was one of the reason we didnt beat The Steelers...WE Were Hurting!!! Bottom Line Is Give Him What He Wants dont trade him.

[ravensfan2430]

is this fantasy talk????? we are not getting boldin

[Troy SmiTH Xx]

I'm tired of all the wishful thinking about getting Boldin. It's not going to happen.

And No, trading Mason in a unintelligent idea.

[Marc2k6]

[quote name='Alexir' post='167083' date='Mar 11 2009, 01:06 PM']Mason is unhappy with his current contract and wants an extentsion. Should we trade him and a 2nd round pick for the disgruntled Boldin and maybe a corner like Ralph Brown, just for depth.[/quote]


What? What G.M. in his/her right mind would trade Boldin for a 35 year old WR and a 2nd round draft pick?

[agpowell]

[quote name='Marc2k6' post='167239' date='Mar 11 2009, 09:55 PM']What? What G.M. in his/her right mind would trade Boldin for a 35 year old WR and a 2nd round draft pick? [/quote]

Uhuh thats a better way of putting what i was trying to say

[T-Sizzle55]

[quote name='Alexir' post='167099' date='Mar 11 2009, 01:32 PM']I'm not saying Mason isn't a warrior but I dont want to give him a 3 year deal and having a 38 year old getting embarassed out there. For example, I love Matt Stover and what hes done for us but we have to move on. The reason no free agents wanted to come over here was because we didn't have an offense and Mason didnt really have many options.

Please give me some examples of Boldin's "TO Attitude" because I have never seen or read it. If he isnt such a team player why is warner begging the front office to sign him....[/quote]

They are treating him like a second rate WR because Fitzgerals is there, but he is a bonafide #1 WR. Boldin is the man. He's not a Diva, he's a hard worker who puts the team first. He blocks! He broke 7 bones in his face that was put back together with titanium screws and he played the following sunday. You can't question a guy's toughness when he does something like that. Unbelievable work ethic (he has workout videos on YouTube.com), he never quits, and his drive to win is up there with the finest in the league. He has more TDs than Terrell Owens did last year. He was upset with management not the QB. Warner wanted to give him some of his own money if he'd stay.

Arizona probably won't want Mason. Maybe Heap and 3rd round pick. They will probably ask for Suggs or a 1st, 3rd, 5th round picks. As Ozzie might say right player wrong price.

[neepo13]

[quote name='bscott57' post='167187' date='Mar 11 2009, 04:14 PM'][/b]

I couldnt disagree more, that is why he wants out of Arizona. Boldin is a Top 8 WR in this league and makes plays very very few WR out there can make. He is getting the raw end of the deal as until the playoff this past year there was no proof in the numbers he was better or more valuable than Fitzgerald, and jealousy will fuel his fire as soon as he gets out of Arizona. I would love to have him in Baltimore and let this be the town he proves to everyone he was underappreciated in Arizona and he was the one deserving of the huge contract, people seem to forget they BOTH started in the Pro Bowl together.[/quote]
Please read the entire post again and slowly this time. The point of it went way over your head.

[quote name='neepo13' post='167179' date='Mar 11 2009, 03:59 PM']I understand what you are saying but at some point these guys have to honor the agreements that they sign. They cant throw a hissy fit everytime one of their teammates get paid more then them. Boldin had the chance to negotiate and opted to sign the extenstion that he signed with the Cardinals. This isnt the same situation that the Cardinals had with Warner and Fitzgerald. Fitzgerald was asked by the Cardinals to sign an extenstion because the final two years of his rookie contract were a massive cap hit. So, he actually took a pay cut. And Warner being on the open market had every right to sign a new deal. Anquan Boldin has no right to be angry about the organization paying Warner and Fitzgerald more then him. If anything he's jealous.[/quote]


It has nothing to do with his value to the Cardinals or who, out of him and Fitz, is the better reciever. My point is that Boldin had his opportunity to negotiate with the Cardinals when he signed the deal that he signed in 2006. He cant hate on Fitzgerald and Warner because they got their opportunity to negotiate with the Cardinals and were able to land a larger contract. If he didnt like the deal that was laid out in front of him when he originally signed his extenstion, he shouldnt have signed it. If you make a committment you honor it, whether the market value for your position increases or not.

And finally, his wanting out of Arizona,right now, has nothing to do with his not being paid as a top wr. He's angry because he felt that the organization promised him another extenstion and then backed off on that promise. That I can understand but thats not what the person I was replying to said.

[Sherb]

mason just wants a place he can call home 2 years from now we cant trade him after all hes done for us last year

[SnOoPy]

keep Mason please!he love the Ravens and hopefully he retire as a raven..

[Reddawn36]

sorry its 2:13 where i live as i am typing this and i know i should read so i know if its already been answered or not, but the reason boldin is disgruntled is because the cardinals said that they didn't have the money to give him an extension or something like that, and than turned around and gave a huge extension to larry fitzgerald, (that is not me hating on fitz, i love fitz) but has more to do with the card's organization lying to boldin then turn around and give the money to another player (a better one, but yet another one) as far as him yelling at his coach, ray lewis does the same damn thing if/when they pull him out for 3rd down, thats all about their competitiveness, plz don't mold him into a T.O. type

[Reddawn36]

and yes, mason does deserve to retire a raven, so does stover, wouldn't hurt to have boldin, but get the reciever through the draft, because for any1 hoping on boldin even when his contract is up, they'll just franchise him, kind of like what we do with suggs, plus he's almost 30 himself, nothing wrong with that, good 5 years left in him as a reciever, but get a reciever in the draft, you won't match what mason is worth to us, no matter who you bring in.... in short, mason is like the ed reed and/or ray lewis of offense, the players respect him, and will play for him, shoot there was one game where mark clayton was blocking two people because mason couldn't get his arm up due to his shoulder, thats leadership right there

[raylewis52reed20]

I just dont get these threads that discuss things that are so far-fetched it makes you laugh. Like why dont we just talk about Jay Cutler getting traded to the Ravens for Flacco? I mean Jay Cutler is upset so why doesnt he belong on the Ravens.....Not every NFL player who is upset or gets released belongs on the Ravens....I mean some of these topics are just so unfeasible that it makes me wonder if people even think before they start a thread.....Boldin will sign with the Cardinals in the next two weeks....Get over it

[codizzle]

[quote name='raylewis52reed20' post='167400' date='Mar 12 2009, 01:57 AM']Like why dont we just talk about Jay Cutler getting traded to the Ravens for Flacco? I mean Jay Cutler is upset so why doesnt he belong on the Ravens.....[/quote]
wow now that u mention it ???? maybe it could happen

[RavensIQ]

[quote name='raylewis52reed20' post='167400' date='Mar 12 2009, 02:57 AM']I just dont get these threads that discuss things that are so far-fetched it makes you laugh. Like why dont we just talk about Jay Cutler getting traded to the Ravens for Flacco? I mean Jay Cutler is upset so why doesnt he belong on the Ravens.....Not every NFL player who is upset or gets released belongs on the Ravens....I mean some of these topics are just so unfeasible that it makes me wonder if people even think before they start a thread.....Boldin will sign with the Cardinals in the next two weeks....Get over it[/quote]


How is it so unfeasible? What's confusing to me are the people that knock down reasoning with ignorance. (Not directed towards you RayLewis52reed20 or anyone inparticular for that matter)

Lets try to mix some logic into the equation b4 we start throwing words like "unintelligent" and "ridiculous" around.

The reason people make all these threads about acquiring the latest name in free agency is obvious: they want our team to become better.

I don't think the general conscientious is to grab everyone and anyone that becomes available but rather 1 or 2 or maybe even 3 players. As players are signed/released throughout the next several months new names will come up which will lead into new questioning about whether or not that particular player(s) could be included into that "1-3 additional off season pickups" category.

No one is suggesting we sign Holt + Harrison + Pace + trade for Boldin + sign a CB + trade for peppers + a LB + a Kicker ect, ect...It's more along the lines of addressing 1 or 2 of these positions, not every single need that comes to mind. And until these 1-3 needs/wants are met, then when a new player comes onto the scene, it's only fair to discuss the potential impact that he could have on our team.

Now onto trading Mason for Boldin and why it's not a [i]stupid[/i] suggestion but rather just a SUGGESTION.

1.) Boldin wants to be released.
2.) Boldin wants a new contract.
3.) The value for Boldin will be at an all time high this year, so if the cardinals do not intend to have plans for Boldin in their immediate future, then now is the time to cash in and get as much value from him then they otherwise would have received, bcuz he's only going to become older, more pissed, less productive, and eventually a free agent.
4.) The Ravens need a #1 WR.
5.) Mason wants an extension or to be released.
6.) Releasing/Trading Mason (35yo) would save around $3M in cap space.
7.) Instead of investing another $10-$12M in an aging WR, why not invest that money into a younger WR? By trading Mason to the Cardinals you kill 3 birds with 1 stone:1) Save Caps Space. 2) Fill the #1 WR hole with Boldin. 3) Find extra cash to sign Boldin with.
8.) Mason would serve as a great number 2 WR during the next 1-2 years for Kurt Warner and the Arizona Cardinals. Trying to find a replacement for the production Boldin created is going to be difficult. Mason at least would serve as a stop gap and will help keep Arizona's passing game elite for as long as Kurt Warner is around.
9.) If they accepted Mason + a 2nd/3rd then we save a 1st round pick.
10.) Mason would be in the NFC and Boldin would be in the AFC. Thus solving the problem of having to face them next year.

I could keep going, but 10 points should be enough to prove my argument. Just because it's unlikely, doesn't mean it's impossible. In 2006 who would have thought we would have had Steve McNair and in 2007 Willis McGahee? And we gave up a lot less than a Pro Bowl Caliber WR + a 2nd round draft pick to acquire them.

[bscott57]

[quote name='neepo13' post='167279' date='Mar 11 2009, 07:21 PM']Please read the entire post again and slowly this time. The point of it went way over your head.




It has nothing to do with his value to the Cardinals or who, out of him and Fitz, is the better reciever. My point is that Boldin had his opportunity to negotiate with the Cardinals when he signed the deal that he signed in 2006. He cant hate on Fitzgerald and Warner because they got their opportunity to negotiate with the Cardinals and were able to land a larger contract. If he didnt like the deal that was laid out in front of him when he originally signed his extenstion, he shouldnt have signed it. If you make a committment you honor it, whether the market value for your position increases or not.

And finally, his wanting out of Arizona,right now, has nothing to do with his not being paid as a top wr. He's angry because he felt that the organization promised him another extenstion and then backed off on that promise. That I can understand but thats not what the person I was replying to said.[/quote]

Um his wanting out of Arizona has everything to do with him not being paid as a top WR, its the fact the Cardinals have made it abundantly clear he is their #2 priority when he believes he is a #1, which he would be in Baltimore. And they backed off because they gave Fitz the extension. You can play devils advocate all you want but the bottom line is Boldin doesnt want to be the red headed step child and looking at his deal next to Fitzgeralds new deal and they arent comparable in any way. Not sure what went over my head...

[3Zach21]

[quote name='bscott57' post='167187' date='Mar 11 2009, 04:14 PM'][/b]

I couldnt disagree more, that is why he wants out of Arizona. Boldin is a Top 8 WR in this league and makes plays very very few WR out there can make. He is getting the raw end of the deal as until the playoff this past year there was no proof in the numbers he was better or more valuable than Fitzgerald, and jealousy will fuel his fire as soon as he gets out of Arizona. I would love to have him in Baltimore and let this be the town he proves to everyone he was underappreciated in Arizona and he was the one deserving of the huge contract, people seem to forget they BOTH started in the Pro Bowl together.[/quote]

Boldin a top 8 WR??? pshhhhhhhhhhh

i'll name 8 better in no particular order

1. Calvin Johnson
2. Andre Johnson
3. Steve Smith
4. Randy Moss
5. Larry Fitzgerald
6. Reggie Wayne
7. Terrell Owens
8. Plaxico Burress

Saying we should trade for Boldin IS LIKE saying we should trade for any other WR. Boldin isn't going anywhere!