[News] Late For Work 5/4: What It Would Have Cost To Trade Up For A First-Round Receiver

[BR News]

ESPN’s Scott Van Pelt shared a touching tribute to Holly Heap on SportsCenter. May 9 is a day to watch. Well wishes to Justin Forsett in retirement. Ravens Vice President of Football Video Operations Jon Dubé is headed to the Hall of Fame.

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[whobilly]

To late to start whining about not getting a WR in the Draft. Bottom line is that we better come up with somebody considering we have ONE legitimate WR on the roster in Mike Wallace.

[axisofeeble]

OK,Love to Todd Heap&Family......Do we have in house,on roster enough talent for Greg Roman to make an 0-line capable of getting US a thousand yard rusher who can make a yard on 3rd down? Terrance West is serviceable,Danny Woodhead is reliable pass catcher but 3rd and short still depends on a center,guard,tackle that can create space. Greg Roman can't open the hole unless Ozzie has given him the players. Siragosa,Jensen,a math whiz can't turn last yr's 4th rounder into Ray Rice..........................or can they?

[rmcjacket23]

To late to start whining about not getting a WR in the Draft. Bottom line is that we better come up with somebody considering we have ONE legitimate WR on the roster in Mike Wallace.

Well, proven to be one legitimate WR.

Others will be stepping up. Not like we need 3-4 of them anyway, because we can't sustain that many in this offense.

[Tsizzle24]

Even though a WR in the draft would have been preferred, i think this year is going to be good for Perriman. He has only really played one season and a lot of WR take off on the second year. Also he will have more balls thrown at him and more chances to prove himself now that he will take on a big role in the offense. Also my thoughts and prayers are with the Heap family.

[RavensDE]

Are people really that upset we didn't take a WR?

WR's generally take a year or two to adjust to the pros and are at high risk of not panning out compared to other positions. There was no offensive savior here. We had a great draft by all accounts. People give us B's because they feel we needed offensive talent, but say we got great value at every pick. If we are depending on our fresh out college pass catchers to save us we are not a top flight organization. If we are getting the best players we can out of the draft and patching short term holes in free agency we are setting the best course for long term success.

[The Greek]

do not need a 1st round receiver to win it all. need receivers that are hungry for the ball and can suit up every week and a oc and receivers coach that are good

[BlueHenToRaven]

I think Mangold will suit up for us next year. He hasn't signed anywhere else and the report a few weeks ago stated that the sides would continue communicating. He hasn't been signed yet by any other team, which gives me hope. Hopefully he can be similar to Matt Birk. I like the idea of starting Siragusa at LG, moving Yanda back to the right and putting Lewis at RT. If Mangold also signs, I like the prospect of having that O-line. Im not too confident in Jensen or Urschel, until they prove me wrong that is. And im, like most of us here, hoping Q comes back. If not though, what about Vincent Jackson? I think he is still a FA and he is more reliable than any receiver we have now. I also believe Cruz can still produce in a West Coast system, so maybe give him a try? Just some thoughts.

[BlueHenToRaven]

do not need a 1st round receiver to win it all. need receivers that are hungry for the ball and can suit up every week and a oc and receivers coach that are good

I agree. Look at the top ranked receivers over the past few years, OBJ, Calvin Johnson, Dez Bryant, Jordy Nelson, Julio Jones etc.. What two things do they have in common?
1.) They have extremely high receiving yards per year and their QB's put up a lot of passing yards
2.) With the exception of Jordy Nelson (from many years ago) none of these receivers make their teams win a superbowl. Look at the golden team, the patriots. Who is their best receiver? Edelman who definitely wasn't a first rounder. The pats are able to use smart playcalls and "hungry" receivers to win. As well as a balanced offense with a running ability. Same as the Seahawks a few years back. They had a good ground game and a good defense.

Point is, they didn't rely on a big receiver to get them a championship. They are balanced offensive teams with a good defense. Well, I believe our defense will be top 5 and hopefully our line can hold up and we get mangold. I also believe Marty wont make it for very long as OC.

[Raven1995]

Are people really that upset we didn't take a WR?

WR's generally take a year or two to adjust to the pros and are at high risk of not panning out compared to other positions. There was no offensive savior here. We had a great draft by all accounts. People give us B's because they feel we needed offensive talent, but say we got great value at every pick. If we are depending on our fresh out college pass catchers to save us we are not a top flight organization. If we are getting the best players we can out of the draft and patching short term holes in free agency we are setting the best course for long term success.

No, I don't think upset over Receivers, the top 3 were gone by the time the Ravens picked. Also, 3 Quarterbacks were taken and OJ Howard fell to us. A great TE (Sharpe, Heap) and Running Game is also what the Ravens were known for besides a Great Defense.

[rmcjacket23]

  49 minutes ago, RavensDE said:

Are people really that upset we didn't take a WR?

WR's generally take a year or two to adjust to the pros and are at high risk of not panning out compared to other positions. There was no offensive savior here. We had a great draft by all accounts. People give us B's because they feel we needed offensive talent, but say we got great value at every pick. If we are depending on our fresh out college pass catchers to save us we are not a top flight organization. If we are getting the best players we can out of the draft and patching short term holes in free agency we are setting the best course for long term success.

No, I don't think upset over Receivers, the top 3 were gone by the time the Ravens picked. Also, 3 Quarterbacks were taken and OJ Howard fell to us. A great TE (Sharpe, Heap) and Running Game is also what the Ravens were known for besides a Great Defense.

I mean that's great, but you also have a bunch of young TEs on the roster already, so do we just throw them away?

There's what we WERE known for, and there's what we are NOW known for. They don't have to be the same thing.

We didn't used to be a team that invested heavily in the QB position. Now we are, and so are all the consistent good teams in this league.

Times change. Teams change.

[Raven1995]

  7 minutes ago, Raven1995 said:

  51 minutes ago, RavensDE said:

Are people really that upset we didn't take a WR?

WR's generally take a year or two to adjust to the pros and are at high risk of not panning out compared to other positions. There was no offensive savior here. We had a great draft by all accounts. People give us B's because they feel we needed offensive talent, but say we got great value at every pick. If we are depending on our fresh out college pass catchers to save us we are not a top flight organization. If we are getting the best players we can out of the draft and patching short term holes in free agency we are setting the best course for long term success.

No, I don't think upset over Receivers, the top 3 were gone by the time the Ravens picked. Also, 3 Quarterbacks were taken and OJ Howard fell to us. A great TE (Sharpe, Heap) and Running Game is also what the Ravens were known for besides a Great Defense.

I mean that's great, but you also have a bunch of young TEs on the roster already, so do we just throw them away?

There's what we WERE known for, and there's what we are NOW known for. They don't have to be the same thing.

We didn't used to be a team that invested heavily in the QB position. Now we are, and so are all the consistent good teams in this league.

Times change. Teams change.

We have a bunch of Tight Ends that were on Injured Reserve last year, Ben Watson 37 in December, Williams and Gilmore. One who is more of a blocking tight end who has been suspended 2 times and one more will be out of the league. Pitta who is one of my favorites but he gets no YAC. Tight End is still very important in the NFL and its not one of the Ravens Strengths as so many people beleive.

[Rayner]

Never mind trading up and giving up a king's ransom for, let's face it, WRs that don't have the talent levels or college production as most of the last few classes (And that's before all 3 of their injury histories are taken into account) when there were 3 players that I would have loved but wouldn't have pegged falling to us going 14th, 15th and 17th. How much would it have cost to move up a couple of spots to get "The next Ed Reed" or Suggs heir apparent? A 4th?

[BlueHenToRaven]

  8 minutes ago, rmcjacket23 said:

  15 minutes ago, Raven1995 said:

  59 minutes ago, RavensDE said:

Are people really that upset we didn't take a WR?

WR's generally take a year or two to adjust to the pros and are at high risk of not panning out compared to other positions. There was no offensive savior here. We had a great draft by all accounts. People give us B's because they feel we needed offensive talent, but say we got great value at every pick. If we are depending on our fresh out college pass catchers to save us we are not a top flight organization. If we are getting the best players we can out of the draft and patching short term holes in free agency we are setting the best course for long term success.

No, I don't think upset over Receivers, the top 3 were gone by the time the Ravens picked. Also, 3 Quarterbacks were taken and OJ Howard fell to us. A great TE (Sharpe, Heap) and Running Game is also what the Ravens were known for besides a Great Defense.

I mean that's great, but you also have a bunch of young TEs on the roster already, so do we just throw them away?

There's what we WERE known for, and there's what we are NOW known for. They don't have to be the same thing.

We didn't used to be a team that invested heavily in the QB position. Now we are, and so are all the consistent good teams in this league.

Times change. Teams change.

We have a bunch of Tight Ends that were on Injured Reserve last year, Ben Watson 37 in December, Williams and Gilmore. One who is more of a blocking tight end who has been suspended 2 times and one more will be out of the league. Pitta who is one of my favorites but he gets no YAC. Tight End is still very important in the NFL and its not one of the Ravens Strengths as so many people beleive.

If Pitta stays healthy, he is good. He might not get the YAC but he makes contested catches and moves the chains. I like Boyle, he has a chance to be great if he stays out of trouble. I think Williams will end up being a bust and Watson is definitely questionable after an achillies injury, but we shall see. But the one nobody is talking about is Darren Waller. Im pretty high on him. Hes big, hes got decent speed and he can catch. Also if Gillmore stays healthy, he is good too.

I think a combination of Pitta, Gillmore, Waller and Boyle is a good group. Pitta and Waller will be consistent. Gillmore may get hurt and if that trend continues, we may have to cut ties. But I don't see a problem with Pitta, Waller and Boyle (proided he doesn't get suspended)

[RavensDieHard21]

What was even the point of showing what it would have taken to get a first round receiver? This class was vastly overrated, built on hopes that they would all develop into great WR. Each has major question marks in relation to their game. Make no mistake Bout it, there wasn't any Amari Cooper's or Julio Jones in this draft. 

If any had fallen then likely they would be BPA potentially, but none were worth sacrificing more than an additional mid round pick to get.

[rmcjacket23]

  42 minutes ago, rmcjacket23 said:

  49 minutes ago, Raven1995 said:

  1 hour ago, RavensDE said:

Are people really that upset we didn't take a WR?

WR's generally take a year or two to adjust to the pros and are at high risk of not panning out compared to other positions. There was no offensive savior here. We had a great draft by all accounts. People give us B's because they feel we needed offensive talent, but say we got great value at every pick. If we are depending on our fresh out college pass catchers to save us we are not a top flight organization. If we are getting the best players we can out of the draft and patching short term holes in free agency we are setting the best course for long term success.

No, I don't think upset over Receivers, the top 3 were gone by the time the Ravens picked. Also, 3 Quarterbacks were taken and OJ Howard fell to us. A great TE (Sharpe, Heap) and Running Game is also what the Ravens were known for besides a Great Defense.

I mean that's great, but you also have a bunch of young TEs on the roster already, so do we just throw them away?

There's what we WERE known for, and there's what we are NOW known for. They don't have to be the same thing.

We didn't used to be a team that invested heavily in the QB position. Now we are, and so are all the consistent good teams in this league.

Times change. Teams change.

We have a bunch of Tight Ends that were on Injured Reserve last year, Ben Watson 37 in December, Williams and Gilmore. One who is more of a blocking tight end who has been suspended 2 times and one more will be out of the league. Pitta who is one of my favorites but he gets no YAC. Tight End is still very important in the NFL and its not one of the Ravens Strengths as so many people beleive.

Right, but you can't bank on injured players staying injured forever.

We still have young guys like Maxx, Gillmore, Boyle and Waller, in addition to a guy like Pitta.

I didn't see the position was a strength of ours, but adding one rookie TE to the mix wouldn't make it a strength either.

[rmcjacket23]

  36 minutes ago, Raven1995 said:

  42 minutes ago, rmcjacket23 said:

  49 minutes ago, Raven1995 said:

  1 hour ago, RavensDE said:

Are people really that upset we didn't take a WR?

WR's generally take a year or two to adjust to the pros and are at high risk of not panning out compared to other positions. There was no offensive savior here. We had a great draft by all accounts. People give us B's because they feel we needed offensive talent, but say we got great value at every pick. If we are depending on our fresh out college pass catchers to save us we are not a top flight organization. If we are getting the best players we can out of the draft and patching short term holes in free agency we are setting the best course for long term success.

No, I don't think upset over Receivers, the top 3 were gone by the time the Ravens picked. Also, 3 Quarterbacks were taken and OJ Howard fell to us. A great TE (Sharpe, Heap) and Running Game is also what the Ravens were known for besides a Great Defense.

I mean that's great, but you also have a bunch of young TEs on the roster already, so do we just throw them away?

There's what we WERE known for, and there's what we are NOW known for. They don't have to be the same thing.

We didn't used to be a team that invested heavily in the QB position. Now we are, and so are all the consistent good teams in this league.

Times change. Teams change.

We have a bunch of Tight Ends that were on Injured Reserve last year, Ben Watson 37 in December, Williams and Gilmore. One who is more of a blocking tight end who has been suspended 2 times and one more will be out of the league. Pitta who is one of my favorites but he gets no YAC. Tight End is still very important in the NFL and its not one of the Ravens Strengths as so many people beleive.

If Pitta stays healthy, he is good. He might not get the YAC but he makes contested catches and moves the chains. I like Boyle, he has a chance to be great if he stays out of trouble. I think Williams will end up being a bust and Watson is definitely questionable after an achillies injury, but we shall see. But the one nobody is talking about is Darren Waller. Im pretty high on him. Hes big, hes got decent speed and he can catch. Also if Gillmore stays healthy, he is good too.

I think a combination of Pitta, Gillmore, Waller and Boyle is a good group. Pitta and Waller will be consistent. Gillmore may get hurt and if that trend continues, we may have to cut ties. But I don't see a problem with Pitta, Waller and Boyle (proided he doesn't get suspended)

I will caution you... last year Pitta wasn't moving the chains at all. Not only was he not getting YAC, he also wasn't moving the chains. He had one of the lower percentages of receptions for first downs among the primary pass catchers last season.

[rmcjacket23]

Never mind trading up and giving up a king's ransom for, let's face it, WRs that don't have the talent levels or college production as most of the last few classes (And that's before all 3 of their injury histories are taken into account) when there were 3 players that I would have loved but wouldn't have pegged falling to us going 14th, 15th and 17th. How much would it have cost to move up a couple of spots to get "The next Ed Reed" or Suggs heir apparent? A 4th?

Well if you don't think they are going to be at the level of those players (and they most likely won't, since you're talking about basically two HOFers), then there's really no point in giving up anything for them.

Entirely possible that Bowser or Williams could be the Suggs heir apparent.

And based on the trade value chart, it would have cost a 3rd to move up from 16 to 14.

[ellicottraven]

If trading up for a WR was so seriously considered, it baffles me as to the reason they didn't select a top 5-10 talent in the best receiving TE to come out in the past several years - OJ Howard. He would be a great move the chains TE and a mismatch on gameday. He would also be a huge upgrade on our oft injured TE group.

[TheGeneticBeastLobster]

  27 minutes ago, BlueHenToRaven said:

  45 minutes ago, Raven1995 said:

  50 minutes ago, rmcjacket23 said:

  57 minutes ago, Raven1995 said:

  1 hour ago, RavensDE said:

Are people really that upset we didn't take a WR?

WR's generally take a year or two to adjust to the pros and are at high risk of not panning out compared to other positions. There was no offensive savior here. We had a great draft by all accounts. People give us B's because they feel we needed offensive talent, but say we got great value at every pick. If we are depending on our fresh out college pass catchers to save us we are not a top flight organization. If we are getting the best players we can out of the draft and patching short term holes in free agency we are setting the best course for long term success.

No, I don't think upset over Receivers, the top 3 were gone by the time the Ravens picked. Also, 3 Quarterbacks were taken and OJ Howard fell to us. A great TE (Sharpe, Heap) and Running Game is also what the Ravens were known for besides a Great Defense.

I mean that's great, but you also have a bunch of young TEs on the roster already, so do we just throw them away?

There's what we WERE known for, and there's what we are NOW known for. They don't have to be the same thing.

We didn't used to be a team that invested heavily in the QB position. Now we are, and so are all the consistent good teams in this league.

Times change. Teams change.

We have a bunch of Tight Ends that were on Injured Reserve last year, Ben Watson 37 in December, Williams and Gilmore. One who is more of a blocking tight end who has been suspended 2 times and one more will be out of the league. Pitta who is one of my favorites but he gets no YAC. Tight End is still very important in the NFL and its not one of the Ravens Strengths as so many people beleive.

If Pitta stays healthy, he is good. He might not get the YAC but he makes contested catches and moves the chains. I like Boyle, he has a chance to be great if he stays out of trouble. I think Williams will end up being a bust and Watson is definitely questionable after an achillies injury, but we shall see. But the one nobody is talking about is Darren Waller. Im pretty high on him. Hes big, hes got decent speed and he can catch. Also if Gillmore stays healthy, he is good too.

I think a combination of Pitta, Gillmore, Waller and Boyle is a good group. Pitta and Waller will be consistent. Gillmore may get hurt and if that trend continues, we may have to cut ties. But I don't see a problem with Pitta, Waller and Boyle (proided he doesn't get suspended)

I will caution you... last year Pitta wasn't moving the chains at all. Not only was he not getting YAC, he also wasn't moving the chains. He had one of the lower percentages of receptions for first downs among the primary pass catchers last season.

I think he had the lowest percentage in the league of first downs per catch... He's catching everything but still not moving very well.

[bioLarzen]

14 minutes ago, ellicottraven said:

If trading up for a WR was so seriously considered, it baffles me as to the reason they didn't select a top 5-10 talent in the best receiving TE to come out in the past several years - OJ Howard. He would be a great move the chains TE and a mismatch on gameday. He would also be a huge upgrade on our oft injured TE group.

http://russellstreetreport.com/2017/05/03/street-talk/ravens-wise-pass-o-j-howard/

Edited 3 hours ago by bioLarzen

[bioLarzen]

12 minutes ago, TheGeneticBeastLobster said:

I think he had the lowest percentage in the league of first downs per catch... He's catching everything but still not moving very well.

Since there were guys with a 0% first down rate, I doubt he had the lowest figure...

[RavenROC]

Chris Godwin was the answer. We passed on him twice in the 3rd, and he was taken by the Bucs 6 picks after we took Tim Williams.

https://www.thefantasyfootballers.com/articles/reception-perception-chris-godwin-underrated-wide-receiver-2017-nfl-draft/

 

I like the draft outside of the 3rd round, I think Humphrey is a ready to play class act, Tyus Bowser looks like a beast, even the O-lineman and safety picks. But to pass on a player as promising as Godwin twice, at a position of need, and take Tim Williams with all his off the field / character concerns...it feels like a risk we didn't need to take. Maybe he's a steal, who knows, but IMO one of those 3rd rd picks should have been Godwin.

[b93333]

  59 minutes ago, Raven1995 said:

  1 hour ago, rmcjacket23 said:

  1 hour ago, Raven1995 said:

  1 hour ago, RavensDE said:

Are people really that upset we didn't take a WR?

WR's generally take a year or two to adjust to the pros and are at high risk of not panning out compared to other positions. There was no offensive savior here. We had a great draft by all accounts. People give us B's because they feel we needed offensive talent, but say we got great value at every pick. If we are depending on our fresh out college pass catchers to save us we are not a top flight organization. If we are getting the best players we can out of the draft and patching short term holes in free agency we are setting the best course for long term success.

No, I don't think upset over Receivers, the top 3 were gone by the time the Ravens picked. Also, 3 Quarterbacks were taken and OJ Howard fell to us. A great TE (Sharpe, Heap) and Running Game is also what the Ravens were known for besides a Great Defense.

I mean that's great, but you also have a bunch of young TEs on the roster already, so do we just throw them away?

There's what we WERE known for, and there's what we are NOW known for. They don't have to be the same thing.

We didn't used to be a team that invested heavily in the QB position. Now we are, and so are all the consistent good teams in this league.

Times change. Teams change.

We have a bunch of Tight Ends that were on Injured Reserve last year, Ben Watson 37 in December, Williams and Gilmore. One who is more of a blocking tight end who has been suspended 2 times and one more will be out of the league. Pitta who is one of my favorites but he gets no YAC. Tight End is still very important in the NFL and its not one of the Ravens Strengths as so many people beleive.

If Pitta stays healthy, he is good. He might not get the YAC but he makes contested catches and moves the chains. I like Boyle, he has a chance to be great if he stays out of trouble. I think Williams will end up being a bust and Watson is definitely questionable after an achillies injury, but we shall see. But the one nobody is talking about is Darren Waller. Im pretty high on him. Hes big, hes got decent speed and he can catch. Also if Gillmore stays healthy, he is good too.

I think a combination of Pitta, Gillmore, Waller and Boyle is a good group. Pitta and Waller will be consistent. Gillmore may get hurt and if that trend continues, we may have to cut ties. But I don't see a problem with Pitta, Waller and Boyle (proided he doesn't get suspended)

Moves the chains? He set a new NFL record for the most "failed receptions"... remember that stat? It roughly meant a reception that didn't get close to the 1st down marker.

[Rayner]

  48 minutes ago, Rayner said:

Never mind trading up and giving up a king's ransom for, let's face it, WRs that don't have the talent levels or college production as most of the last few classes (And that's before all 3 of their injury histories are taken into account) when there were 3 players that I would have loved but wouldn't have pegged falling to us going 14th, 15th and 17th. How much would it have cost to move up a couple of spots to get "The next Ed Reed" or Suggs heir apparent? A 4th?

Well if you don't think they are going to be at the level of those players (and they most likely won't, since you're talking about basically two HOFers), then there's really no point in giving up anything for them.

Entirely possible that Bowser or Williams could be the Suggs heir apparent.

And based on the trade value chart, it would have cost a 3rd to move up from 16 to 14.

Bowser and Williams Combined could be Suggs heir apparent. And notice the quotation mark around the next Ed Reed. There's almost a 0% chance that Hooker becomes as good as the best player in his position in the history of Football, but his massive upside and similarities and we could have someone as close as you can get. The 3rd we spent on Williams could have been used to move up for either (Even though I think Williams is massive value that late)

[rmcjacket23]

  33 minutes ago, rmcjacket23 said:

  1 hour ago, Rayner said:

Never mind trading up and giving up a king's ransom for, let's face it, WRs that don't have the talent levels or college production as most of the last few classes (And that's before all 3 of their injury histories are taken into account) when there were 3 players that I would have loved but wouldn't have pegged falling to us going 14th, 15th and 17th. How much would it have cost to move up a couple of spots to get "The next Ed Reed" or Suggs heir apparent? A 4th?

Well if you don't think they are going to be at the level of those players (and they most likely won't, since you're talking about basically two HOFers), then there's really no point in giving up anything for them.

Entirely possible that Bowser or Williams could be the Suggs heir apparent.

And based on the trade value chart, it would have cost a 3rd to move up from 16 to 14.

Bowser and Williams Combined could be Suggs heir apparent. And notice the quotation mark around the next Ed Reed. There's almost a 0% chance that Hooker becomes as good as the best player in his position in the history of Football, but his massive upside and similarities and we could have someone as close as you can get. The 3rd we spent on Williams could have been used to move up for either (Even though I think Williams is massive value that late)

Right, but I'm not trading Williams + Humphrey for Barnett. That trade doesn't make a lot of sense to me.

[BlueHenToRaven]

  37 minutes ago, BlueHenToRaven said:

  55 minutes ago, Raven1995 said:

  1 hour ago, rmcjacket23 said:

  1 hour ago, Raven1995 said:

  1 hour ago, RavensDE said:

Are people really that upset we didn't take a WR?

WR's generally take a year or two to adjust to the pros and are at high risk of not panning out compared to other positions. There was no offensive savior here. We had a great draft by all accounts. People give us B's because they feel we needed offensive talent, but say we got great value at every pick. If we are depending on our fresh out college pass catchers to save us we are not a top flight organization. If we are getting the best players we can out of the draft and patching short term holes in free agency we are setting the best course for long term success.

No, I don't think upset over Receivers, the top 3 were gone by the time the Ravens picked. Also, 3 Quarterbacks were taken and OJ Howard fell to us. A great TE (Sharpe, Heap) and Running Game is also what the Ravens were known for besides a Great Defense.

I mean that's great, but you also have a bunch of young TEs on the roster already, so do we just throw them away?

There's what we WERE known for, and there's what we are NOW known for. They don't have to be the same thing.

We didn't used to be a team that invested heavily in the QB position. Now we are, and so are all the consistent good teams in this league.

Times change. Teams change.

We have a bunch of Tight Ends that were on Injured Reserve last year, Ben Watson 37 in December, Williams and Gilmore. One who is more of a blocking tight end who has been suspended 2 times and one more will be out of the league. Pitta who is one of my favorites but he gets no YAC. Tight End is still very important in the NFL and its not one of the Ravens Strengths as so many people beleive.

If Pitta stays healthy, he is good. He might not get the YAC but he makes contested catches and moves the chains. I like Boyle, he has a chance to be great if he stays out of trouble. I think Williams will end up being a bust and Watson is definitely questionable after an achillies injury, but we shall see. But the one nobody is talking about is Darren Waller. Im pretty high on him. Hes big, hes got decent speed and he can catch. Also if Gillmore stays healthy, he is good too.

I think a combination of Pitta, Gillmore, Waller and Boyle is a good group. Pitta and Waller will be consistent. Gillmore may get hurt and if that trend continues, we may have to cut ties. But I don't see a problem with Pitta, Waller and Boyle (proided he doesn't get suspended)

I will caution you... last year Pitta wasn't moving the chains at all. Not only was he not getting YAC, he also wasn't moving the chains. He had one of the lower percentages of receptions for first downs among the primary pass catchers last season.

Pitta had 86 catches last year and 37 first downs which is 43%. Steve Smith Last year had 70 catches for 39 first downs which is 55% roughly. There isn't much difference between the numbers. Compared to other starting TE's, Charles Clay was 38%, Ryan griffin was 38%, Will Tye 33%, Larry Donnel 20%, Jason Witten 47%, Julious Thomas 50%, Vernon Davis 50%, Jermaine Gresham 51%, Delanie Walker and Zach Ertz 53%. All of these Tight ends did slightly better or worse than Pitta. And in perspective to receivers, Larry Fitzgerald 55%, Edelman 56%, Golden Tate 50%, Jamison Crowder 50%, Tavon Austin 40%. All of these receivers caught at least 50 passes and their percentages aren't much better than Pitta. plus if you watched the games last year, very rarely were the passes to Pitta on target. Many times he had to reach up over his head or make a shoestring catch which hinders your ability tomove after catching the pass.

Pitta did have 37 first downs, which IMO is pretty good for a tight end. There were only 6 tight ends that had more first downs: Greg Olson (54), Jimmy Graham (45), Zach Ertz (42), Kyle Rudolph (50), Jordan Reed (41) and Travis Kelce (55).
And you may notice that there really wasn't mch of a receiving threat other than these tight ends for their respective team, except for Jimmy Graham (Doug Baldwin), Travis Kelce (Jeremy Maclin) and Jordan Reed (Jackson and Garcon). The others were the primary receivers for their teams, especially Rudolph with Bradford just dumping it to running backs and tight ends.

[rmcjacket23]

  30 minutes ago, TheGeneticBeastLobster said:

I think he had the lowest percentage in the league of first downs per catch... He's catching everything but still not moving very well.

Since there were guys with a 0% first down rate, I doubt he had the lowest figure...

Qualifying participants, of course.

[BlueHenToRaven]

  16 minutes ago, rmcjacket23 said:

  37 minutes ago, BlueHenToRaven said:

  55 minutes ago, Raven1995 said:

  1 hour ago, rmcjacket23 said:

  1 hour ago, Raven1995 said:

  1 hour ago, RavensDE said:

Are people really that upset we didn't take a WR?

WR's generally take a year or two to adjust to the pros and are at high risk of not panning out compared to other positions. There was no offensive savior here. We had a great draft by all accounts. People give us B's because they feel we needed offensive talent, but say we got great value at every pick. If we are depending on our fresh out college pass catchers to save us we are not a top flight organization. If we are getting the best players we can out of the draft and patching short term holes in free agency we are setting the best course for long term success.

No, I don't think upset over Receivers, the top 3 were gone by the time the Ravens picked. Also, 3 Quarterbacks were taken and OJ Howard fell to us. A great TE (Sharpe, Heap) and Running Game is also what the Ravens were known for besides a Great Defense.

I mean that's great, but you also have a bunch of young TEs on the roster already, so do we just throw them away?

There's what we WERE known for, and there's what we are NOW known for. They don't have to be the same thing.

We didn't used to be a team that invested heavily in the QB position. Now we are, and so are all the consistent good teams in this league.

Times change. Teams change.

We have a bunch of Tight Ends that were on Injured Reserve last year, Ben Watson 37 in December, Williams and Gilmore. One who is more of a blocking tight end who has been suspended 2 times and one more will be out of the league. Pitta who is one of my favorites but he gets no YAC. Tight End is still very important in the NFL and its not one of the Ravens Strengths as so many people beleive.

If Pitta stays healthy, he is good. He might not get the YAC but he makes contested catches and moves the chains. I like Boyle, he has a chance to be great if he stays out of trouble. I think Williams will end up being a bust and Watson is definitely questionable after an achillies injury, but we shall see. But the one nobody is talking about is Darren Waller. Im pretty high on him. Hes big, hes got decent speed and he can catch. Also if Gillmore stays healthy, he is good too.

I think a combination of Pitta, Gillmore, Waller and Boyle is a good group. Pitta and Waller will be consistent. Gillmore may get hurt and if that trend continues, we may have to cut ties. But I don't see a problem with Pitta, Waller and Boyle (proided he doesn't get suspended)

I will caution you... last year Pitta wasn't moving the chains at all. Not only was he not getting YAC, he also wasn't moving the chains. He had one of the lower percentages of receptions for first downs among the primary pass catchers last season.

I think he had the lowest percentage in the league of first downs per catch... He's catching everything but still not moving very well.

look it up, its not even close. He isn't near the worst

[BlueHenToRaven]

  1 hour ago, BlueHenToRaven said:

  1 hour ago, Raven1995 said:

  1 hour ago, rmcjacket23 said:

  1 hour ago, Raven1995 said:

  2 hours ago, RavensDE said:

Are people really that upset we didn't take a WR?

WR's generally take a year or two to adjust to the pros and are at high risk of not panning out compared to other positions. There was no offensive savior here. We had a great draft by all accounts. People give us B's because they feel we needed offensive talent, but say we got great value at every pick. If we are depending on our fresh out college pass catchers to save us we are not a top flight organization. If we are getting the best players we can out of the draft and patching short term holes in free agency we are setting the best course for long term success.

No, I don't think upset over Receivers, the top 3 were gone by the time the Ravens picked. Also, 3 Quarterbacks were taken and OJ Howard fell to us. A great TE (Sharpe, Heap) and Running Game is also what the Ravens were known for besides a Great Defense.

I mean that's great, but you also have a bunch of young TEs on the roster already, so do we just throw them away?

There's what we WERE known for, and there's what we are NOW known for. They don't have to be the same thing.

We didn't used to be a team that invested heavily in the QB position. Now we are, and so are all the consistent good teams in this league.

Times change. Teams change.

We have a bunch of Tight Ends that were on Injured Reserve last year, Ben Watson 37 in December, Williams and Gilmore. One who is more of a blocking tight end who has been suspended 2 times and one more will be out of the league. Pitta who is one of my favorites but he gets no YAC. Tight End is still very important in the NFL and its not one of the Ravens Strengths as so many people beleive.

If Pitta stays healthy, he is good. He might not get the YAC but he makes contested catches and moves the chains. I like Boyle, he has a chance to be great if he stays out of trouble. I think Williams will end up being a bust and Watson is definitely questionable after an achillies injury, but we shall see. But the one nobody is talking about is Darren Waller. Im pretty high on him. Hes big, hes got decent speed and he can catch. Also if Gillmore stays healthy, he is good too.

I think a combination of Pitta, Gillmore, Waller and Boyle is a good group. Pitta and Waller will be consistent. Gillmore may get hurt and if that trend continues, we may have to cut ties. But I don't see a problem with Pitta, Waller and Boyle (proided he doesn't get suspended)

Moves the chains? He set a new NFL record for the most "failed receptions"... remember that stat? It roughly meant a reception that didn't get close to the 1st down marker.

37 first downs and a first down rate of 43%. 37 first downs by anyone is pretty good. Also remember the passes he caught were more likely than not in a 3rd and long situation with the ball being thrown 5 yards down field.