[News] Eisenberg: Ravens Draft Illustrates Major Philosophical Shift

[BR News]

After one playoff in the past four years, the Ravens are going back to the old approach. Baltimore has now built a defense capable of putting games on its shoulders.

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[objective view]

We needed an additional corner badly, especially one who can play the bump game on the shorter routes. Well done, as for all the rest of the defensive picks, well we just keep spending high picks on the same positions. No's 2 and 3 last year were also on edge rusher and d-Line as well as many other picks the last several years.

Balanced teams win SB's and we have a huge investment in our QB position so it makes no sense to CHEAP the O-Line and let him get killed back there trying to score enough points to win?

Mark me worried at this point and PLEASE remember, it's a crap shoot how much of an impact a draft choice will make in year 1 so we may have short changed the O and still not fixed the D.....

[ByTheBay]

I feel like this was an appropriate response to Flacco's mediocre play since his big game and contract. They tried building the team around Joe, hoping he would be like other top QB's and carry the team but he couldn't. You can say he never had pieces surrounding him to succeed and to a point I would agree but remember it was just last year that many of you were calling our receiver group the best in Ravens history. At least before the season started. Fact is Joe had adequate skill players to work with and should be able to produce more than he has. His injury sucked, sure, but he was what 1-6 before he got hurt? I'm not Joe bashing. He is a serviceable QB. But he is not someone to build a team around. The FO has now refocused their attention to what has worked in the past and that is a dominating defense. I for one couldn't be happier. I am do glad we don't have to sit through another season of defense falling short at the end of games. Joe will score points and hopefully they will be enough to win. 

[ravens4life86]

Eisenberg well if your going to go back to our roots and rely on the defense, you gotta take care of the defense.
Joe cant chuck it 40x a game like last year, even 2000 ravens, Legion of Boom, 85 Bears get tired after a while. So its on the OCs and Harbaugh to organize the offense around the defense. Run the dang ball.

All we heard last year was "Marty believes in running the ball"
And every week 5 rushes, 10 rushes to 40 passes.. leaving our defense exposed. So many 3&outs. Unacceptable

[Maurice0094]

I'm good with the Ravens trying to take pass rushers and helping the secondary with young playmakers. I honestly understand the rationale behind not drafting a Wr just to draft a position of need because defensive players were graded higher. But with they still have a question mark at the other MLB spot. Orr is gone Correa wasn't drafted to play MLB nor did he receive very many if any snaps their in regular season. He got beat out by Onwuasor another udfa that actually played on D and special teams. I would've felt comfortable with them getting a MLB to grow next to C.J. and has that experience of playing that position.

[RavenRampage]

Run the ball and crush the opposing offense. Do that and we'll be fine.

[The Greek]

Eisenberg well if your going to go back to our roots and rely on the defense, you gotta take care of the defense.
Joe cant chuck it 40x a game like last year, even 2000 ravens, Legion of Boom, 85 Bears get tired after a while. So its on the OCs and Harbaugh to organize the offense around the defense. Run the dang ball.

All we heard last year was "Marty believes in running the ball"
And every week 5 rushes, 10 rushes to 40 passes.. leaving our defense exposed. So many 3&outs. Unacceptable

big reason for the lack of runs was due to the o-line always having someone injured and different combinations on the line each week caused a lack of having a cohesive unit and allowing these guys from getting into a rhythm

[The Greek]

i still am not sold on our current stable of rb's.

[Wisdom]

Finally the light bulb came on.  You can not build a team around "Jump Ball Joe" he is far too inaccurate and simple minded to carry a NFL team.  With this draft, I'm so happy, the Ravens are getting back to their hard-hitting defensive ways  and not a continuation of Flacco's inept dog and pony show . 

[RavensBaltimore]

I don't think there was any philosophical change at all, let alone a major one. This draft was labeled as deep with pass rushers and corners, and one of the weskest for o-linemen in a while. I think Ozzie just took what was available to him. There were some receivers projected to us, but none of them lasted beyond the top 10.

[EddiOK]

Love our D, worried about our O.

[EddiOK]

Usually, changes in philosophy do not and cannot turn on a dime overnight. If the philosophical change in approach is true, then I expect that to be a 2-3 year transition to being the team resembling that style. So that means potentially 1-2 more years of middling, not-yet-fully-developed, average team stats and finishes before the break out comes.

[law215]

I have just as critical of OZ recent drafts as anybody. What I like about this draft, is that it address the needs. After Mike Williams and Cory Davis were, I don't trust Ravens drafting a WR. When has that ever paid huge dividends?

Should they not draft pass rushers because they have Kafusi, Correa, and Judon? Not draft a corner because they got 31 yr old B. Carr? So go into another season praying J. Smith stays healthy and add some mid round corner to cover guys like Brown, Bryant, Green?

Oz, needs to follow up by doing what he has done successfully. Find a vet Wr (Boldin, Cruz, V Jackson are available), wait for cuts to fill in pieces and depth.

[RavensBaltimore]

I feel like this was an appropriate response to Flacco's mediocre play since his big game and contract. They tried building the team around Joe, hoping he would be like other top QB's and carry the team but he couldn't. You can say he never had pieces surrounding him to succeed and to a point I would agree but remember it was just last year that many of you were calling our receiver group the best in Ravens history. At least before the season started. Fact is Joe had adequate skill players to work with and should be able to produce more than he has. His injury sucked, sure, but he was what 1-6 before he got hurt? I'm not Joe bashing. He is a serviceable QB. But he is not someone to build a team around. The FO has now refocused their attention to what has worked in the past and that is a dominating defense. I for one couldn't be happier. I am do glad we don't have to sit through another season of defense falling short at the end of games. Joe will score points and hopefully they will be enough to win. 

I don't see how you can say he had adequate skill players when his top playmaker by far was a 37 y/o coming off an Achilles tear, who's play was diminishing the year before he got here. Then it was Wallace, who's career was taking a nose dive before he got here. People are acting like we gave Joe a legit chance to carry the team, but who did we draft for him? A bunch of TEs that can't stay healthy and Perriman, who has had one healthy season and was still very raw. Plus the line has had trouble opening up holes in the running game and giving Joe time to throw recently. There is not a qb in the league who could successfully carry a team with that. The only time hes had a realistic chance since the SB was 2014, and the offense put up at least 30 in consecutive playoff games. Even then, he didn't have a great receiving corps, just a solid one, but that's all he needs. You absolutely can build a team around Joe, but he needs more than aging veterans who are in decline, as everyone does.

[benipvl]

This article is a joke. The ravens did not change their philosophy about having a great offensive team. The year after the superbowl they lacked talent everywhere. The only year the offense was put as a priority is the year with Kubiak when we got Steve Smith and we lost to the Patriots because we couldn't hold 2 14 point leads and we drafted perriman. We haven't surrounded Flacco with the talent, if we had our O-line wouldn't be in shambles, and we would have drafted more Wrs. The defense was always a priority we just lacked the talent after the superbowl and we've been rebuilding on that side of the ball. Obviously we need a great defense but this draft was the one where we badly needed another piece on the offense. Next years draft should solely be based on offense. We need to go the way of Dallas and draft an offensive linemen early, a WR, and a RB. Our skilled positions on offense have always been lacking and we rely on players from other teams for it.

[JamesA119]

I have just as critical of OZ recent drafts as anybody. What I like about this draft, is that it address the needs. After Mike Williams and Cory Davis were, I don't trust Ravens drafting a WR. When has that ever paid huge dividends?

Should they not draft pass rushers because they have Kafusi, Correa, and Judon? Not draft a corner because they got 31 yr old B. Carr? So go into another season praying J. Smith stays healthy and add some mid round corner to cover guys like Brown, Bryant, Green?

Oz, needs to follow up by doing what he has done successfully. Find a vet Wr (Boldin, Cruz, V Jackson are available), wait for cuts to fill in pieces and depth.

Agree

[Glen1024]

Coaching is the main variable with joe and how he plays. Conservative play calling he becomes an excellent game manager(cam). Aggressive play caller( Caldwell) had joe scratching that elite surface, same as with kubiak a great play caller who got more out of much less talent in 2014 than we did last year. Tressman was horrible and it showed with the level of play of joe and the entire offense, marty wasn't much better but was thrown in the fire midseason and gets a pass from me. Point I want to make is that the competency of the coaching goes a long way in how the offense looks on the field....fix the interior of the line and coach to the strength of the talent we have and offense should be fine. But this draft was all about improving a defense that struggled to hold on to leads in the 4th quarter for some time now and on paper it looks great for the most part....we lost at least 3 games last year because of the defense giving the lead up late including the game against the steelers that decided the north champion. Remember that feeling we would get anytime the d would get on the field late only needing 1 stop, hopefully this draft addressed that in a big way

Edited Sunday at 07:02 PM by Glen1024

[JamesA119]

I feel like this was an appropriate response to Flacco's mediocre play since his big game and contract. They tried building the team around Joe, hoping he would be like other top QB's and carry the team but he couldn't. You can say he never had pieces surrounding him to succeed and to a point I would agree but remember it was just last year that many of you were calling our receiver group the best in Ravens history. At least before the season started. Fact is Joe had adequate skill players to work with and should be able to produce more than he has. His injury sucked, sure, but he was what 1-6 before he got hurt? I'm not Joe bashing. He is a serviceable QB. But he is not someone to build a team around. The FO has now refocused their attention to what has worked in the past and that is a dominating defense. I for one couldn't be happier. I am do glad we don't have to sit through another season of defense falling short at the end of games. Joe will score points and hopefully they will be enough to win. 

Couldn't agree more. Fans that think if we just had that elite WR that our offense would be better; if we just give Flacco more weapons etc. To me that's a nirvana. Flacco cannot carry a team. He can however win games if it's presented to him. That means you need a dominant D to allow him to go and drive the dagger.
Don't discount the morale aspect of a game. A great D affects the morale of a game. Flacco sometimes acts as though he'd prefer to be invisible on the sidelines during games. We need that mojo back. I hate the patriots and would never root for them, but if you are an offensive player whom would you prefer to patrol the sidelines when things aren't going exactly as planned? Flacco or Brady?

We could have the best WRs on the planet on paper, and we could feel good about them in the preseason, however by mid season we will all be looking for excuses why they weren't any good. Of course Flacco never has anything to do with it. Even though he is behind every pass whether the WR catches it or not.

The front office isn't perfect but this is what they do. They live and breathe football. I hear that Ozzie never misses a practice much less a game. 4 yrs is a long time. To us somethings might look like a fluke, but to them, there's seldom any flukes in football.

They love Flacco for sure because let's face it; all the good QBs in the world right now are already starting for a team. You just can't go and get one. I'm sure they understand that there have been too many changes at the OC however he is going into his 10th year. So they know who they have. And they might well be thinking that without a dominant D there's no way to the promised land.

[RavenInWoodlawn]

LOL Jaime, please point out all these players the team invested in supporting Joe after the Super Bowl. We won the Super Bowl and on the back of Joe, and promptly traded away his go to guy, spent all the savings and cap money we had on defensive guys...half of whom were total busts and didn't last half the season, and then in the following 2 drafts...2013 and 2014, we had 7 picks in the top 3 rounds...and spent 6 of the 7 on defensive players!

That's not surrounding Joe with all the tools and weapons he needed to succeed. Jamie what in the world have you been watching since then?

[JamesA119]

LOL Jaime, please point out all these players the team invested in supporting Joe after the Super Bowl. We won the Super Bowl and on the back of Joe, and promptly traded away his go to guy, spent all the savings and cap money we had on defensive guys...half of whom were total busts and didn't last half the season, and then in the following 2 drafts...2013 and 2014, we had 7 picks in the top 3 rounds...and spent 6 of the 7 on defensive players!

That's not surrounding Joe with all the tools and weapons he needed to succeed. Jamie what in the world have you been watching since then?

Mr Woodlawn I can't tell you how disappointed I get when I hear the argument that Flacco carried us to the Super Bowl on his back. He surely played well (11 TD, 0 int) Did you watch Peyton Manning's post game interview after the mile high miracle? Reporters asked him why he didn't throw long much of the game. His response? " ... with #20 back there .... had to be careful with pushing the ball downfield ..."
The mile high miracle pass was awesome. It was really just short of a Hail Mary pass. That game ended on an int by Corey Graham a defensive player. The AFC championship in New England: we held the Patriots scoreless in the second half. We were down 17-7 at the half and won 27-17. People always down play the incredible play of the defense because of Flacco's offensive out put in that playoff run.

[Ravenslifer]

"The Ravens endeavored to surround Joe Flacco with all the tools and weapons he needed to carry them. Their priority became giving him the best possible chance to succeed."

What a crock - they traded away Boldin the first month after winning the Superbowl, spent ZERO picks in the draft on offense, said Torrey and Jacoby were starters, and we relied on undrafted rookie Marlon Brown and a 36 year old tight end the entire 2013 season - Flacco proceeds to have his worst season as a pro. Then the front office admitted their mistake by signing SSS and Owen Daniels - surprise surprise, Flacco has his best season as a pro.

This team has never invested long term in weapons on a consistent basis - there has been a steady revolving door at wide receiver and tight end since 2008 - in the mean time, a player like Andy Dalton, who came in to the league 4 years after Flacco, has had more continuity at the receiver position.

[gooftroop]

Anybody here remember how our defense played in 2012? Or are you confusing that defense with the 2000 squad?

[RavensBaltimore]

  1 hour ago, RavenInWoodlawn said:

LOL Jaime, please point out all these players the team invested in supporting Joe after the Super Bowl. We won the Super Bowl and on the back of Joe, and promptly traded away his go to guy, spent all the savings and cap money we had on defensive guys...half of whom were total busts and didn't last half the season, and then in the following 2 drafts...2013 and 2014, we had 7 picks in the top 3 rounds...and spent 6 of the 7 on defensive players!

That's not surrounding Joe with all the tools and weapons he needed to succeed. Jamie what in the world have you been watching since then?

Mr Woodlawn I can't tell you how disappointed I get when I hear the argument that Flacco carried us to the Super Bowl on his back. He surely played well (11 TD, 0 int) Did you watch Peyton Manning's post game interview after the mile high miracle? Reporters asked him why he didn't throw long much of the game. His response? " ... with #20 back there .... had to be careful with pushing the ball downfield ..."
The mile high miracle pass was awesome. It was really just short of a Hail Mary pass. That game ended on an int by Corey Graham a defensive player. The AFC championship in New England: we held the Patriots scoreless in the second half. We were down 17-7 at the half and won 27-17. People always down play the incredible play of the defense because of Flacco's offensive out put in that playoff run.

No one is saying Flacco won by himself, but he absolutely carried this team to the SB win. The defense made some clutch plays, but they also got torched in the SB, and the mile high miracle wouldn't have been necessary if our ST didn't give up 2 return tds. Flacco was great in every playoff game and was clutch in the 4th qtr. I dont think any other qb has ever won a SB in a postseason where their team gave up more than 30 twice. He torched Denver with the deep ball and carved up the Pats when they played their safeties deep. He had the best statistical postseason ever, and he did it without a dominant player like Moss, Harrison, or Gronk. You can always pick out clutch plays by a defense in any SB run ever. If Joe didn't carry this team to the SB in 2012, then no qb in the history of the game has ever carried their team to the SB. No qb has ever been better or more important to their team's success in a postseaon as Flacco in 2012.

[bioLarzen]

That sounds all nice - but going back to the good old tried-and-true philosophy of putting it all on the shoulders of the D will make it very, very hard to justify a QB at the top of the payroll list... It's like saying I'll take the train to work, but still keep my Lexus...
If they really want to win with the D, Flacco is a luxury. Ryan Mallett is more than capable of manging a Dilfer-like role.

I'm not saying Flacco should be cut, of course - it's just that it's not this easy to "just make a shift"... As long as we have an expensive QB we simply cannot say the O will be the service department to the D

Edited Sunday at 09:43 PM by bioLarzen

[bioLarzen]

1 hour ago, JamesA119 said:

1 hour ago, RavenInWoodlawn said:

LOL Jaime, please point out all these players the team invested in supporting Joe after the Super Bowl. We won the Super Bowl and on the back of Joe, and promptly traded away his go to guy, spent all the savings and cap money we had on defensive guys...half of whom were total busts and didn't last half the season, and then in the following 2 drafts...2013 and 2014, we had 7 picks in the top 3 rounds...and spent 6 of the 7 on defensive players!

That's not surrounding Joe with all the tools and weapons he needed to succeed. Jamie what in the world have you been watching since then?

Mr Woodlawn I can't tell you how disappointed I get when I hear the argument that Flacco carried us to the Super Bowl on his back. He surely played well (11 TD, 0 int) Did you watch Peyton Manning's post game interview after the mile high miracle? Reporters asked him why he didn't throw long much of the game. His response? " ... with #20 back there .... had to be careful with pushing the ball downfield ..."
The mile high miracle pass was awesome. It was really just short of a Hail Mary pass. That game ended on an int by Corey Graham a defensive player. The AFC championship in New England: we held the Patriots scoreless in the second half. We were down 17-7 at the half and won 27-17. People always down play the incredible play of the defense because of Flacco's offensive out put in that playoff run.

With all due respect... In 2012 Manning was no longer in the physical condition to just "push the ball downfield"... As the cold weather set in, he was reported to experience a numbness in the tips of his fingers which admittedly bothered him when throwing more longer than short passes, for example...
And I don't think it's even fair to start analyzing if it was the O or the D which took the Ravens to and then won the Super Bowl - it was the combined effort of both.

Edited Sunday at 09:46 PM by bioLarzen

[bioLarzen]

13 minutes ago, gooftroop said:

Anybody here remember how our defense played in 2012? Or are you confusing that defense with the 2000 squad?

It was the defense that kept the Patriots at 13 points in the AFC Championship game, with a big goose egg for the entire second half...

 

So yeah, it wasn't a very bad defense...

[Wisdom]

32 minutes ago, RavensBaltimore said:

No one is saying Flacco won by himself, but he absolutely carried this team to the SB win. The defense made some clutch plays, but they also got torched in the SB, and the mile high miracle wouldn't have been necessary if our ST didn't give up 2 return tds. Flacco was great in every playoff game and was clutch in the 4th qtr. I dont think any other qb has ever won a SB in a postseason where their team gave up more than 30 twice. He torched Denver with the deep ball and carved up the Pats when they played their safeties deep. He had the best statistical postseason ever, and he did it without a dominant player like Moss, Harrison, or Gronk. You can always pick out clutch plays by a defense in any SB run ever. If Joe didn't carry this team to the SB in 2012, then no qb in the history of the game has ever carried their team to the SB. No qb has ever been better or more important to their team's success in a postseaon as Flacco in 2012.

Hilarious,  Flacco did what?  Are you kidding me?  April fool day has come and gone, LOL!

[GENE2407]

The blame for the past few years is simple........bad drafts, bad contracts. Since 2010 we lost most of our all-pro players to age. During that time we've had very poor drafts and we've also given out some very bad high dollar contracts that tied up tons of money (Monroe, J Smith, Webb, Ngata, Flacco). So all it's gonna take are some good drafts in general (offense or defense) and to cut loose some of these salaries (we've already begun that process).

[theduug]

The blame for the past few years is simple........bad drafts, bad contracts. Since 2010 we lost most of our all-pro players to age. During that time we've had very poor drafts and we've also given out some very bad high dollar contracts that tied up tons of money (Monroe, J Smith, Webb, Ngata, Flacco). So all it's gonna take are some good drafts in general (offense or defense) and to cut loose some of these salaries (we've already begun that process).

Bingo.

[JamesA119]

  5 hours ago, JamesA119 said:

  5 hours ago, RavenInWoodlawn said:

LOL Jaime, please point out all these players the team invested in supporting Joe after the Super Bowl. We won the Super Bowl and on the back of Joe, and promptly traded away his go to guy, spent all the savings and cap money we had on defensive guys...half of whom were total busts and didn't last half the season, and then in the following 2 drafts...2013 and 2014, we had 7 picks in the top 3 rounds...and spent 6 of the 7 on defensive players!

That's not surrounding Joe with all the tools and weapons he needed to succeed. Jamie what in the world have you been watching since then?

Mr Woodlawn I can't tell you how disappointed I get when I hear the argument that Flacco carried us to the Super Bowl on his back. He surely played well (11 TD, 0 int) Did you watch Peyton Manning's post game interview after the mile high miracle? Reporters asked him why he didn't throw long much of the game. His response? " ... with #20 back there .... had to be careful with pushing the ball downfield ..."
The mile high miracle pass was awesome. It was really just short of a Hail Mary pass. That game ended on an int by Corey Graham a defensive player. The AFC championship in New England: we held the Patriots scoreless in the second half. We were down 17-7 at the half and won 27-17. People always down play the incredible play of the defense because of Flacco's offensive out put in that playoff run.

With all due respect... In 2012 Manning was no longer in the physical condition to just "push the ball downfield"... As the cold weather set in, he was reported to experience a numbness in the tips of his fingers which admittedly bothered him when throwing more longer than short passes, for example...
And I don't think it's even fair to start analyzing if it was the O or the D which took the Ravens to and then won the Super Bowl - it was the combined effort of both.

That's what I would say. But there are fans who literally think that Flacco put on his cape and told everybody else "... come ride with me.." That my friend is delirious.