Year 2/3 potential breakout players

[Jacquouille]

1 hour ago, RayRayRaven said:

hate to tell ya this but u doan train up hands a guy got em or he doan

http://jugssports.com/football/football-passing-machine/

[rossihunter2]

22 minutes ago, Jacquouille said:

http://jugssports.com/football/football-passing-machine/

It's almost like the hands of our secondary didn't improve after spending an offseason working on catching drills...

[January J]

Im looking for Perriman , Patrick Onsuwaur , and Matt Judon to take that next step. Waller as well. Would be nice if Zadarius did but as of now I'm just not seeing it. KC is a big question mark. Moore can't do nothing but trend up BC he played god awful his rookie season. Had high hopes for Dixon but that suspension really dampened my expectations for him- hopefully he powers through and provides a spark in week 5 once the team really settles in and we begin to see things shape up. 

[January J]

5 hours ago, PurpleHorseman said:

I wanted to cut Wallace to give our young WRs opportunity. We need for a young receiver to break out. I like Chris Moore better than Perriman. We should draft a WR in the first 3 rounds. I like Davis in round1, Stewart, Westbrook and JuJu round2-3. 

Our young WRs as in all 2 of them? You know we need 6-7 receivers to feild a team right? And you wanted to give up our only current veteran in that group?

Edited April 7 by January J

[PurpleHorseman]

1 hour ago, January J said:

Our young WRs as in all 2 of them? You know we need 6-7 receivers to feild a team right? And you wanted to give up our only current veteran in that group?

Ravens probably bring in a vet WR and except for Perriman the young WRs won't get that many snaps.

[PurpleHorseman]

1 hour ago, January J said:

Im looking for Perriman , Patrick Onsuwaur , and Matt Judon to take that next step. Waller as well. Would be nice if Zadarius did but as of now I'm just not seeing it. KC is a big question mark. Moore can't do nothing but trend up BC he played god awful his rookie season. Had high hopes for Dixon but that suspension really dampened my expectations for him- hopefully he powers through and provides a spark in week 5 once the team really settles in and we begin to see things shape up. 

Onsuwaur?? He is known for some training camp cheap shots and he is a step up candidate? How much of that is based on superstition? because of undrafted linebackers playing well like Bart,Ellerbe,Orr

[rmcjacket23]

20 minutes ago, PurpleHorseman said:

Ravens probably bring in a vet WR and except for Perriman the young WRs won't get that many snaps.

They'll get snaps if they earn them, which is what training camp/preseason is for.

Frankly, if any of them are worth anything, I'd expect them to outplay a veteran journeyman that we would sign at this point in order to get those snaps.

That's why Aiken isn't here anymore. Because he couldn't outplay Steve Smith and earn more playing time.

[PurpleHorseman]

35 minutes ago, rmcjacket23 said:

They'll get snaps if they earn them, which is what training camp/preseason is for.

Frankly, if any of them are worth anything, I'd expect them to outplay a veteran journeyman that we would sign at this point in order to get those snaps.

That's why Aiken isn't here anymore. Because he couldn't outplay Steve Smith and earn more playing time.

I agree but have to get snaps to earn more. Waiting for that young wr that impresses coaches when he first practices 

Edited April 7 by PurpleHorseman

[rmcjacket23]

5 minutes ago, PurpleHorseman said:

I agree but have to get snaps to earn more. Waiting for that young wr that impresses coaches when he first practices 

Right, but those snaps come in the preseason and in training camp. That's when young players earn their playing time in the regular season.

Teams don't have the luxury of just throwing super young players out there in real games in order to "get snaps". That's how teams lose football games and coaches and GMs get fired.

If a guy is good, he's going to show you he's good in the offseason.

[-Truth-]

15 hours ago, PurpleHorseman said:

Young was amazing especially for an undersized rookie. But to be fair Ramsey is asked to do things that would never be asked of young. You will find Ramsey man up on Julio Jones,AJ Green and Beckham. That will never be asked of Young. And I'm very biased for undersized cornerbacks. Whether it be zone cornerbacks and especially shutdown man up cornerbacks. Butler is my favorite cornerback in the NFL. And I really like Tavon Young to. A very good player. If Young were even 5'10 190 he would be a pro bowler and maybe even borderline allpro

My comment was referring solely to last season. Moving forward, I wouldn't be surprised if Ramsey built on his immense success in December and continued the trend. He's the safest bet to be his draft class' best CB in 2017. That being said, with respect to their 2016 schedules, Ramsey didn't face neither Green, nor Jones nor Beckham Jr. Ramsey played in the slot against Green Bay in week 1 with Davon House at LCB with no rotation. Then they begun shifting him around between LCB, slot and RCB, which is an impressive feat in its own right and something Ramsey deserves a heap of credit for. But he wasn't tasked with always sticking to the No.1. In week 4, he lined up over T.Y. Hilton, Phillip Dorsett and Chester Rogers. The case was similar in their week 17 match up. He did shadow DeAndre Hopkins heavily as he did Amari Cooper. Young's placement was certainly more nondiscriminatory, but by virtue of Jimmy Smith being solely an RCB, Young was mostly at LCB with sparse slot duties, and the LCB is the No.1 CB spot where you're normally going to see No.1 WRs, i.e. playing most of his coverage snaps against Antonio Brown in week 9. With regards to just the 2016 campaign, their degree of difficulty wasn't all too different, meaning that we should be able to pan the two performances against each other on a relatively even playing field without it seeming far-fetched. That likely will change in the future.

[-Truth-]

18 hours ago, RayRayRaven said:

davesta wheres I come from they call that cherri picin.  see hows he choses one mnth to make his case ramsey was as a rook da 8 best corner givin up a qb 68percant ratin not 8 best rook cb 8 best cb now i know what u sayin u  sayin i doan pay no attentshon to figurs i go by the eye test and what sida the feild there qb is picin on well bro me to and gues where who they throw at?  that right mr yung.  was he an improv ovah write?  sur he was but is he r guy? 5 9 177 lb  hes not long for a season and they picin on him to boot if jimmi smith is ok yung will be hard pushed to start over car doan thing he will 

 

Alluding to the fact that Ramsey had a terrific finish to his season but dismissing the notion of him being a shutdown CB in 2016 because he was uneven through his first 10 games is cherry picking? I would've understood had the sentence with the "In November" line been by itself, but the sentence prior about the first of the season is there to provide context. The stats given in November weren't from just November. They were his collective stats from his very first game until the time they were given. Unless you believe that you can earn a season-long title in a handful of games that erase and absolve everything prior, it's a fairly relevant misapprehension. I pray that typing out your current format isn't impeding your ability to comprehend the standard form of the language. Oh, and cherry picking is bypassing the fact that I stated that I personally feel that Ramsey will likely play as well in 2017 as he did during his stellar finish. Please try again.

Edited April 7 by -Truth-

[RayRayRaven]

2 hours ago, -Truth- said:

. Please try again.

well if ya thing you smartar than me join the draff contest we see who knows playas gotz a cb for the ravens that is gonna be there and will blow ur doors off but I doan thing u know cbs proof me wrong

Edited April 7 by RayRayRaven

[PurpleHorseman]

3 hours ago, -Truth- said:

My comment was referring solely to last season. Moving forward, I wouldn't be surprised if Ramsey built on his immense success in December and continued the trend. He's the safest bet to be his draft class' best CB in 2017. That being said, with respect to their 2016 schedules, Ramsey didn't face neither Green, nor Jones nor Beckham Jr. Ramsey played in the slot against Green Bay in week 1 with Davon House at LCB with no rotation. Then they begun shifting him around between LCB, slot and RCB, which is an impressive feat in its own right and something Ramsey deserves a heap of credit for. But he wasn't tasked with always sticking to the No.1. In week 4, he lined up over T.Y. Hilton, Phillip Dorsett and Chester Rogers. The case was similar in their week 17 match up. He did shadow DeAndre Hopkins heavily as he did Amari Cooper. Young's placement was certainly more nondiscriminatory, but by virtue of Jimmy Smith being solely an RCB, Young was mostly at LCB with sparse slot duties, and the LCB is the No.1 CB spot where you're normally going to see No.1 WRs, i.e. playing most of his coverage snaps against Antonio Brown in week 9. With regards to just the 2016 campaign, their degree of difficulty wasn't all too different, meaning that we should be able to pan the two performances against each other on a relatively even playing field without it seeming far-fetched. That likely will change in the future.

I know that. I mean going forward Ramsey will be asked to do things that young would never be allowed. I like and root for smaller cornerbacks.  But don't compare Young to Ramsey.  Because that is what it looks like you are implying although I know you know that Ramsey is going to be the better player.

Edited April 7 by PurpleHorseman

[PurpleHorseman]

3 hours ago, -Truth- said:

Alluding to the fact that Ramsey had a terrific finish to his season but dismissing the notion of him being a shutdown CB in 2016 because he was uneven through his first 10 games is cherry picking? I would've understood had the sentence with the "In November" line been by itself, but the sentence prior about the first of the season is there to provide context. The stats given in November weren't from just November. They were his collective stats from his very first game until the time they were given. Unless you believe that you can earn a season-long title in a handful of games that erase and absolve everything prior, it's a fairly relevant misapprehension. I pray that typing out your current format isn't impeding your ability to comprehend the standard form of the language. Oh, and cherry picking is bypassing the fact that I stated that I personally feel that Ramsey will likely play as well in 2017 as he did during his stellar finish. Please try again.

Cherry picking is what you are doing to. Although you do acknowledge Ramsey is the superior player and will outplay Young next year by far.

[LosT_in_TranSlatioN]

4 minutes ago, PurpleHorseman said:

I know that. I mean going forward Ramsey will be asked to do things that young would never be allowed.

Young honestly flashed CB #1 ability last year. There's a very real chance he becomes a top 15 guy.

 

And don't give me the size crap. Brandon Flowers was a top OUTSIDE CB for years at 5'9 and did well vs. guys who are 6'3+. Same goes for Jason Verertt who was great last season. Even made a pro bowl.. Young plays bigger than his size, and did very well after mostly playing the outside last season. I know fans want a bigger corner, but Young is the real deal on the outside. 

 

I do think Ramsey has top 5-10 potential at the position, but if the team views Young as a potential #1 CB, then he will be given the same responsibilities as Ramsey. Which btw, they might. Young is that good

[GrimCoconut]

26 minutes ago, LosT_in_TranSlatioN said:

Young honestly flashed CB #1 ability last year. There's a very real chance he becomes a top 15 guy.

 

And don't give me the size crap. Brandon Flowers was a top OUTSIDE CB for years at 5'9 and did well vs. guys who are 6'3+. Same goes for Jason Verertt who was great last season. Even made a pro bowl.. Young plays bigger than his size, and did very well after mostly playing the outside last season. I know fans want a bigger corner, but Young is the real deal on the outside. 

 

I do think Ramsey has top 5-10 potential at the position, but if the team views Young as a potential #1 CB, then he will be given the same responsibilities as Ramsey. Which btw, they might. Young is that good

Jason Verrett, Brandon Flowers, Antoine Winfield, Chris Harris Jr are all very close to Young in height.

[JoeyFlex5]

13 hours ago, LosT_in_TranSlatioN said:

Young honestly flashed CB #1 ability last year. There's a very real chance he becomes a top 15 guy.

 

And don't give me the size crap. Brandon Flowers was a top OUTSIDE CB for years at 5'9 and did well vs. guys who are 6'3+. Same goes for Jason Verertt who was great last season. Even made a pro bowl.. Young plays bigger than his size, and did very well after mostly playing the outside last season. I know fans want a bigger corner, but Young is the real deal on the outside. 

 

I do think Ramsey has top 5-10 potential at the position, but if the team views Young as a potential #1 CB, then he will be given the same responsibilities as Ramsey. Which btw, they might. Young is that good

Tavon isn't just short though, he's a little guy in general. Those guys for the most part are short but still broad, young plays the ball well against guys big and little, but the size thing showed up when he tried to tackle dez and got rolled 10 yards downfield into the end zone. That wasn't a ballskills and height thing, that was him just being too little in general. 

I think tavon is gonna be a stud though, don't get me wrong, I see a league best slot corner with him, but as a #1 I don't think he'll hold up nearly as well. Still good, but facing those big powerful guys he's gonna have troubles

[January J]

21 hours ago, PurpleHorseman said:

Onsuwaur?? He is known for some training camp cheap shots and he is a step up candidate? How much of that is based on superstition? because of undrafted linebackers playing well like Bart,Ellerbe,Orr

Yes Onsuwaur. Some of it is just a hunch I'll admit but I like his feirce  attitude. Some looked at it as cheap shots and some looked at it as giving his all until the whistle. We need him to take that type of mindset out on other teams. And the coaches seem to have a lot of confidence in him.

You heard it here first!!

[Tank 92]

1 hour ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

Tavon isn't just short though, he's a little guy in general. Those guys for the most part are short but still broad, young plays the ball well against guys big and little, but the size thing showed up when he tried to tackle dez and got rolled 10 yards downfield into the end zone. That wasn't a ballskills and height thing, that was him just being too little in general. 

IDK.......Dez has rolled over guys much bigger than Tavon, he's a pretty powerful runner. I think more often than not Young showed he's a sure tackler and can hold his own even when up against much larger players. I'd actually say that he has already proven to be better than our #1 in that regard.

Agree though that his small stature will be a disadvantage at times, but could also be an advantage as he is much quicker and nimble than the prototypical tall guy corner. 

[Tank 92]

I like Perriman as #1 on my list here. It seems he has the heart, desire and football smarts to be a good one. Just needs to stay healthy long enough to get acclimated to the NFL. And lose the board hands of course.

Correa has to be the guy on D. He's just turning 23 and had to learn a bunch last year. I look for the Tasmanian devil type performances from KC.   lol

[Halshayeji]

5 hours ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

Tavon isn't just short though, he's a little guy in general. Those guys for the most part are short but still broad, young plays the ball well against guys big and little, but the size thing showed up when he tried to tackle dez and got rolled 10 yards downfield into the end zone. That wasn't a ballskills and height thing, that was him just being too little in general. 

I think tavon is gonna be a stud though, don't get me wrong, I see a league best slot corner with him, but as a #1 I don't think he'll hold up nearly as well. Still good, but facing those big powerful guys he's gonna have troubles

I agree, he certainly would struggle against 6"3 WRs. If Young young keeps improving like he did last year then he might matchup better against smaller guys like Odell, stills, a.Brown, and those elusive WRs. Jimmy can handle the bigger guys and he usually does great against them. 

[-Truth-]

21 hours ago, PurpleHorseman said:

I know that. I mean going forward Ramsey will be asked to do things that young would never be allowed. I like and root for smaller cornerbacks.  But don't compare Young to Ramsey.  Because that is what it looks like you are implying although I know you know that Ramsey is going to be the better player.

The future change is precisely what I alluded to finishing my last post with the ending of my post being, "That likely will change in the future." We've been in agreement about the 2017 season and beyond, so there's no reason to continue debating the point. In fact, Young could lose time at LCB due to circumstance after the Brandon Carr signing. That being said, with regards to the 2016 season, I'll compare them as I see fit. There hasn't been a basis not to. Both performed well overall this season after early struggles. Ramsey switched between all three CB spots, Young switched between LCB and slot, with more of the former. Ramsey shadowed in a few games. Young didn't. Young faced better WRs. What pertinent information can you offer about their 2016 campaigns that make the them incomparable?

21 hours ago, PurpleHorseman said:

Cherry picking is what you are doing to. Although you do acknowledge Ramsey is the superior player and will outplay Young next year by far.

I'm cherry picking because I'm unwilling to apply a season-long earned title of 2016 shutdown corner to a corner who was uneven in his first 10 games and terrific through his last 6, even when I'm alluding to the fact that he's likely to continue the latter trend? Which part of this is cherry picking? The part where I cover the entire scope of his season, mentioning the rough stretch and praising the fantastic finish, or the part where I make sure to state that it's probable that he has a better 2017? Your points thus far has been hinged on shadowing, while casually sidestepping the fact that LCBs are prone to covering No.1 WRs by virtue of the position, and height. There's a bit of irony in the cherry picking accusation.

[JoeyFlex5]

4 hours ago, -Truth- said:

The future change is precisely what I alluded to finishing my last post with the ending of my post being, "That likely will change in the future." We've been in agreement about the 2017 season and beyond, so there's no reason to continue debating the point. In fact, Young could lose time at LCB due to circumstance after the Brandon Carr signing. That being said, with regards to the 2016 season, I'll compare them as I see fit. There hasn't been a basis not to. Both performed well overall this season after early struggles. Ramsey switched between all three CB spots, Young switched between LCB and slot, with more of the former. Ramsey shadowed in a few games. Young didn't. Young faced better WRs. What pertinent information can you offer about their 2016 campaigns that make the them incomparable?

I'm cherry picking because I'm unwilling to apply a season-long earned title of 2016 shutdown corner to a corner who was uneven in his first 10 games and terrific through his last 6, even when I'm alluding to the fact that he's likely to continue the latter trend? Which part of this is cherry picking? The part where I cover the entire scope of his season, mentioning the rough stretch and praising the fantastic finish, or the part where I make sure to state that it's probable that he has a better 2017? Your points thus far has been hinged on shadowing, while casually sidestepping the fact that LCBs are prone to covering No.1 WRs by virtue of the position, and height. There's a bit of irony in the cherry picking accusation.

I would say cherry picking is calling a guy an all pro because he had a strong November and December... 

taking into consideration a shaky first 10 weeks is actually the exact opposite of cherry picking

[-Truth-]

16 hours ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

I would say cherry picking is calling a guy an all pro because he had a strong November and December... 

taking into consideration a shaky first 10 weeks is actually the exact opposite of cherry picking

Thank you. Definitely agreed there.

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

On 4/8/2017 at 8:02 AM, January J said:

Yes Onsuwaur. Some of it is just a hunch I'll admit but I like his feirce  attitude. Some looked at it as cheap shots and some looked at it as giving his all until the whistle. We need him to take that type of mindset out on other teams. And the coaches seem to have a lot of confidence in him.

You heard it here first!!

Onwuasor** pretty sure is how it's spelled. 

And to your point he was earning defensive snaps as the year went on. Yea it still requires a big leap to project a breakout year for him, but it's not solely based on the training camp skirmishes like the other poster suggested. 

If a rookie UDFA Safety that's a converted WR is getting defensive snaps at LB on a top 10 ranked defense in the NFL -- the kid is a football player. Period. 

I picked him as my surprise guy to make the roster and have an impact last year, and I'd say he accomplished that. 

And honestly, barring Foster dropping to us at 16 or us signing an obvious FA upgrade, Onwuasor is probably in the competition with Correa and Levine for that starting ILB job along with a draft pick or UDFA. 

Dont be completely shocked if he wins it either. 

Edited April 9 by BOLDnPurPnBlacK

[Halshayeji]

14 hours ago, BOLDnPurPnBlacK said:

Onwuasor** pretty sure is how it's spelled. 

And to your point he was earning defensive snaps as the year went on. Yea it still requires a big leap to project a breakout year for him, but it's not solely based on the training camp skirmishes like the other poster suggested. 

If a rookie UDFA Safety that's a converted WR is getting defensive snaps at LB on a top 10 ranked defense in the NFL -- the kid is a football player. Period. 

I picked him as my surprise guy to make the roster and have an impact last year, and I'd say he accomplished that. 

And honestly, barring Foster dropping to us at 16 or us signing an obvious FA upgrade, Onwuasor is probably in the competition with Correa and Levine for that starting ILB job along with a draft pick or UDFA. 

Dont be completely shocked if he wins it either. 

I'd be pleasantly surprised if he does win it. Also il def give you credit for calling it a year ago when none of us could even spell his name. Oh wait we still can't lol

in all seriousness, Levine is probably a just a backup. A really good one at that but he's probably a third down guy if he earns it. "Onwuasor" won't be competing with Levine.

to solidify your point, Onwuasor won't need to do too much with Mosley next to him, Wedle and Jefferson behind him, and Bwill in front of him. That mean streak got him in some trouble but il gladly take it if he strikes fear in WRs running inside.

[January J]

15 hours ago, BOLDnPurPnBlacK said:

Onwuasor** pretty sure is how it's spelled. 

And to your point he was earning defensive snaps as the year went on. Yea it still requires a big leap to project a breakout year for him, but it's not solely based on the training camp skirmishes like the other poster suggested. 

If a rookie UDFA Safety that's a converted WR is getting defensive snaps at LB on a top 10 ranked defense in the NFL -- the kid is a football player. Period. 

I picked him as my surprise guy to make the roster and have an impact last year, and I'd say he accomplished that. 

And honestly, barring Foster dropping to us at 16 or us signing an obvious FA upgrade, Onwuasor is probably in the competition with Correa and Levine for that starting ILB job along with a draft pick or UDFA. 

Dont be completely shocked if he wins it either. 

Thanks I knew I probably botched it. But yeah there's something to be said about him earning more playing time like you said- I mean he wasn't going to be playing over Orr the way Zachary was playing- but had Orr not balled out like that Peanut could've had a nice season last year. Now that Orr stepped down I believe its his time. Don't get me wrong I'd LOVE to see KC step up- but I think Peanut ( lol much easier to spell) literally man-handles his way onto the starting roster. We need some guys that will strike fear in our opponents and play a little nasty. Not quite like Burfict - but you get the idea.

Edited April 10 by January J

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

18 minutes ago, January J said:

Thanks I knew I probably botched it. But yeah there's something to be said about him earning more playing time like you said- I mean he wasn't going to be playing over Orr the way Zachary was playing- but had Orr not balled out like that Peanut could've had a nice season last year. Now that Orr stepped down I believe its his time. Don't get me wrong I'd LOVE to see KC step up- but I think Peanut ( lol much easier to spell) literally man-handles his way onto the starting roster. We need some guys that will strike fear in our opponents and play a little nasty. Not quite like Burfict - but you get the idea.

Yea, i like his potential. He plays bigger than his size, has ball/cover skills bc of his past as a WR and S. He was a D1 recruit (Arizona I think) that got kicked off for off field stuff, and then really turned his life around.

Love those kind of stories.

And hes got a mean streak.

Not like he played a ton... we're talking a couple snaps here, cpl snaps there. But he had a FF against NE, then logged 4 D snaps against PHI, 6 in the biggest game of the year against PITT, and then got the start and played the majority of our snaps (42) in the meaningless CIN tilt.

Played well on ST all year... and actually logged more DEF snaps than Correa last year overall and at ILB.

Had 10 tackles and a FF in 60 snaps on defense. Not a great sample size, but good production. And its telling that he was used the most in the most important games. 

 

I really like this kid and think he's got a shot to play a role this year, and be another UDFA that really sticks here. Prob as a ST leader early, but that just forces his way on the field more and more.