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Ravens sign S Tony Jefferson

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On 3/9/2017 at 0:09 PM, redrum52 said:

Pats game.  Weddle center field.  Td after biting on PA.

That was also the game that Weddle intercepted Brady's pass in the end zone, preventing a touchdown, which happened a few plays after he sacked Brady as well.  Let's not forget the positive plays.

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3 minutes ago, New Guy said:

That was also the game that Weddle intercepted Brady's pass in the end zone, preventing a touchdown, which happened a few plays after he sacked Brady as well.  Let's not forget the positive plays.

Happy to be quoted for your first post.  Trust me, I love the move, but even when he was signed I questioned how much time they really thought they would get out of him.  I just felt like being a jack a when I posted that.  My only problem with him is how old he is at this point.

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3 minutes ago, redrum52 said:

Happy to be quoted for your first post.  Trust me, I love the move, but even when he was signed I questioned how much time they really thought they would get out of him.  I just felt like being a jack a when I posted that.  My only problem with him is how old he is at this point.

Weddle's athleticism is declining but several things about his game don't really age. I could honestly see him having two more high level years before his game declines because of his instincts and football iq. It's why I was happy with the move.

 

 

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Just now, LosT_in_TranSlatioN said:

Weddle's athleticism is declining but several things about his game don't really age. I could honestly see him having two more high level years before his game declines because of his instincts and football iq. It's why I was happy with the move.

 

 

I agree.  Not much to add.... yup

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23 hours ago, Tru11 said:

not really though.
it was cover 3 and weddle was responsible for the deep middle.

young was lined up on mitchell with elam on hogan on 1 side with webb on edelman on the opposite site.
Wright was deep on webb side while Weddle was line up as the deep safety over the middle about 14 yards from LOS.

after the snap young dropped deep letting mitchell go over the middle while webb pressed edelman before passing him on to wright.
Weddle bit on the fake and the rest is history.
 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P1TP5qF5IN4

at the 50 second mark you will get the best view of where everybody was standing and if you play it from there , you will clearly see young dropping into his deep zone letting his receiver loose and same goes for webb who after pressing edelman drop in his zone and look at brady.

doubt it was a misalignment by webb as he was the only guy in press coverage lol

if weddle does note bite on the fake then this play wont happen.

In all the time I have watched film, I literally cannot recall a single instance where 2 corners (in a standard or nickel set) were stacked versus an unbunched 3-WR set.  And if it were ever to be done, you can be sure Dean Pees wouldn't be the guy to revolutionize.

Webb was absolutely out of position since Wright would have had to be a fish out of water in the slot instead of his normal RCB.


Weddle should not have fallen on the sword for the play, but he probably thought it would help from a leadership perspective. The problem is that anyone reviewing the top view can see that while he did take a step in (bit on PA), the much bigger problem was the corner in the wrong spot.

 

Edited by Filmstudy
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2 minutes ago, Filmstudy said:

In all the time I have watched film, I literally cannot recall a single instance where 2 corners (in a standard or nickel set) were stacked versus an unbunched 3-WR set.  And if it were ever to be done, you can be sure Dean Pees wouldn't be the guy to revolutionize.

The Saints did it in a similar fashion when they played the Lions in the playoffs. They literally lined up like ST gunners on Johnson in the red zone and both pressed him to keep the ball away from him.

But yeah, other than that, it's a unique alignment.

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Just now, BmoreBird22 said:

The Saints did it in a similar fashion when they played the Lions in the playoffs. They literally lined up like ST gunners on Johnson in the red zone and both pressed him to keep the ball away from him.

But yeah, other than that, it's a unique alignment.

3 spread receivers?  I'd like to see that if you can point out a specific play.

Edited by Filmstudy
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I just watched the play on top view again and it's pretty obvious Webb failed to follow Hogan motioning from left to right.  Take a look at the coaches film and you can see Elam simply realigns to make the best of a bad situation.

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13 minutes ago, Filmstudy said:

3 spread receivers?  I'd like to see that if you can point out a specific play.

Oh, three spread? I'm not entirely sure. 

I just know they used two directly on the LoS to cover Megatron.

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4 minutes ago, BmoreBird22 said:

Oh, three spread? I'm not entirely sure. 

I just know they used two directly on the LoS to cover Megatron.

Was that the 2011 playoffs?

Edited by Filmstudy
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33 minutes ago, Filmstudy said:

In all the time I have watched film, I literally cannot recall a single instance where 2 corners (in a standard or nickel set) were stacked versus an unbunched 3-WR set.  And if it were ever to be done, you can be sure Dean Pees wouldn't be the guy to revolutionize.

 

it was zone coverage.

webb and elam as the inside corners/safeties where responsible for the flats.
young and wright where responsible for the deep part on their side of the field.
weddle was responsible for the deep middle.
orr and mosley where responsible for the middle of the field.

with no outside receiver on wright side it makes perfect sense to stack behind webb.
it would be foolish to line up all the way outside to cover nobody.

had either edelman or anyone else motioned to the outside you would have seen wright move that way as well.

heck if hogan moved that way , elam would have moved closer to the inside but he would not have followed nor would it have changed any of the alignment other then wright lining up across of him like young did on his side.

Cover3_medium.png

This is basicially the principle of the call.
only the pats had no outside receiver on wright side of the field which is why he moved to a spot behind webb which gave an unusual look.

the SS is elam, the S is Webb.
Hogan and edelman are the inside receivers.

Key to recognizing the play call is watching where young and wright are dropping back to after the snap and what webb does after releasing edelman.

you will specifically see young dropping back deep into his zone where no receiver is rather then following his receiver go over the middle.

apologies for any spelling errors cause its late lol
 

Edited by Tru11
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Just now, Tru11 said:

it was zone coverage.

webb and elam as the inside corners/safeties where responsible for the flats.
young and wright where responsible for the deep part on their side of the field.
weddle was responsible for the deep middle.
orr and mosley where responsible for the middle of the field.

with no outside receiver on wright side it makes perfect sense to stack behind webb.
it would be foolish to line up all the way outside to cover nobody.

had either edelman or anyone else montioned to the outside you would have seen wright move that way as well.

heck if hogan moved that way , elam would have moved closer to the inside but he would not have followed nor would it have changed any of the alignment other then wright lining up across of him like young did on his side.

Cover3_medium.png

This is basicially the principle of the call.
only the pats had no outside receiver on wright side of the field which is why he moved to a spot behind webb which gave an unusual look.

the SS is elam, the S is Webb.
Hogan and edelman are the inside receivers.

 


 

2 problems with this explanation:

There were 2 receivers on Wright's side (the OLS) as the signals were being called (Hogan motioned from left to right).

The play you diagram is for a heavy nickel set (3 safeties).  Webb was playing SCB vs NE at this point in the game.  He simply brain farted and forgot to move with the Receiver motioning to the slot right.

But I'll tell you what.  Find me another instance during the Pees era that meets the criteria:

  • 3 WRs unbunched
  • Nickel set with 3 CBs
  • 2 of the 3 corners are stacked on 1 receiver

It simply doesn't happen unless there is a [profanity deleted]up.

You showed the broadcast video on Youtube.  Do you have access to Game Pass?  Coming from a big Webb fan (look at the tweet above) it's painfully obvious what happened.

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1 hour ago, Filmstudy said:

2 problems with this explanation:

There were 2 receivers on Wright's side (the OLS) as the signals were being called (Hogan motioned from left to right).

The play you diagram is for a heavy nickel set (3 safeties).  Webb was playing SCB vs NE at this point in the game.  He simply brain farted and forgot to move with the Receiver motioning to the slot right.

But I'll tell you what.  Find me another instance during the Pees era that meets the criteria:

  • 3 WRs unbunched
  • Nickel set with 3 CBs
  • 2 of the 3 corners are stacked on 1 receiver

It simply doesn't happen unless there is a [profanity deleted]up.

You showed the broadcast video on Youtube.  Do you have access to Game Pass?  Coming from a big Webb fan (look at the tweet above) it's painfully obvious what happened.

it was zone coverage not man coverage.

even if webb did motion with hogan , weddle was still the deep safety standing the furthest from the line of scrimmage.

he would still have to cover the middle of the field.
the same area where hogan caught the pass and towards the endzone.

also wright was not stacked on edelman.
he was a good 9 yards deep which makes sense since he was supposed to cover the deep left anyways.

again though in zone coverage if you want to keep the assignments as simple as possible , the last thing you want to do is travel with receivers in motion.
it would then require very good communication to reorder everyone assignments and with young , elam , wright and to a degree orr on the field that does not seem a very smart thing to do.
would be even harder since weddle would have to make the calls but he was 12 yards deep.

also webb in press on edelman should tell you his assignment was to do just that and then drop into his zone , rather then travel and give edelman a free release.

Before we continue im actually curious in what you think weddle was supposed to do standing 12 yards deep in the middle of the field.
Also im curious as to why he did not call for adjustments based on hogan going in motion.
how does webb motioning with hogan change weddle responsibility to cover the deep middle?

 

Edited by Tru11
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Just now, Tru11 said:

 

Before we continue im actually curious in what you think weddle was supposed to do standing 12 yards deep in the middle of the field.
Also im curious as to why he did not call for adjustments based on hogan going in motion.
 

 

Weddle was the deep safety on the offensive left side, Elam was the deep safety on the ORS.  Simple cover 2 with CBs screwing it up underneath.

 

I answered your question, now have you reviewed the top view?

Edited by Filmstudy
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2 minutes ago, Filmstudy said:

Weddle was the deep safety on the offensive left side, Elam was the deep safety on the ORS.  Simple cover 2 with CBs screwing it up underneath.

 

I answered your question, now have you reviewed the top view?

that has to be the worst cover 2 excecution in the history of the NFL.
i reviewed it and it does not look like cover 2 to me.

weddle is basicially lined up over center and never really leaves the middle of the field to drop deep left
neither outside CB is even remotely close to the LOS or in press coverage.
both are actually standing and dropping deep.
neither of the lbers drop deep enough to protect the deep middle.
neither of the lbers run to the left side to drop deep or take the flat.
there is absolutely no way a safety drops from his safety spot to line up over a slot receiver in cover 2.

if that was cover 2 then everyone including weddle was wrong in their excecution.

i find cover 3 and weddle falling for a fake from tom brady more plausible tbh.

if that was supposed to be cover 2 then frazier has to be the worst secondary coach ever by...
 

 

 

 

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10 minutes ago, Tru11 said:

that has to be the worst cover 2 excecution in the history of the NFL.
i reviewed it and it does not look like cover 2 to me.

weddle is basicially lined up over center and never really leaves the middle of the field to drop deep left
neither outside CB is even remotely close to the LOS or in press coverage.
both are actually standing and dropping deep.
neither of the lbers drop deep enough to protect the deep middle.
neither of the lbers run to the left side to drop deep or take the flat.
there is absolutely no way a safety drops from his safety spot to line up over a slot receiver in cover 2.

if that was cover 2 then everyone including weddle was wrong in their excecution.

i find cover 3 and weddle falling for a fake from tom brady more plausible tbh.

if that was supposed to be cover 2 then frazier has to be the worst secondary coach ever by...
 

 

 

 

As a completely blown coverage, it should look like utter crap.  

Whatever you think of the play, you must see someone should have been following Hogan from the OLS to the ORS.  Elam made the best of an awful situation by closing halfway, but he was not playing SCB.  If you see plays where the Ravens have 10 on the field (or 9, like once in 2016--the only time in my 18-year database), you see players make on-the-fly adjustments like Elam did on that play.

I respect that you're taking some time trying to review the play, but it doesn't seem like we're going to convince each other.  Let's see what some other folks have to say.

Does anyone know how to post the top view from Game Pass to You Tube?  Will it last if posted under a certain time threshold? 

Edited by Filmstudy
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5 hours ago, Filmstudy said:

As a completely blown coverage, it should look like utter crap.  

Whatever you think of the play, you must see someone should have been following Hogan from the OLS to the ORS.  Elam made the best of an awful situation by closing halfway, but he was not playing SCB.  If you see plays where the Ravens have 10 on the field (or 9, like once in 2016--the only time in my 18-year database), you see players make on-the-fly adjustments like Elam did on that play.

I respect that you're taking some time trying to review the play, but it doesn't seem like we're going to convince each other.  Let's see what some other folks have to say.

Does anyone know how to post the top view from Game Pass to You Tube?  Will it last if posted under a certain time threshold? 

if it where man coverage i would agree with you.
then you should see someone follow and odds are it should have been wright as that was his match up.

however it was zone coverage and cover 3 at that.

wright had to drop into the deep left zone while webb would drop into the left as they actually did after the snap.
young was responsible for the deep right and dropped into that area.

elam was supposed to cover the right flat and it was he left hogan run pas him.

orr and mosley had the middle of field which is where they where albeit both of them bit on brady fake as well as they both took a step towards the LOS rather then dropping deep enough.

that leaves weddle who was responsible for the deep middle where he also lined up as he practically standing over the C but 12 yards deep as the defender furthest back.
however he to fell for the fake and he could not recover.

if either webb or wright followed hogan to the right then the area they had to cover would be wide open lol.
then everyone would had to make actual adjustments on the fly and the areas they where responsible for would had to change.

let me point out though that there is no shame and falling for a fake by tom brady.
dude is arguably the best QB in NFL history.
he is that good.
Weddle got fooled this 1 time and it was a big play.
He still played one hell of a game but he was not mistake free and perfect though.
he was the deep safety in the middle of the field standing the furthest from the LOS for easy and he made an error.
no shame as it came happen to the best of them.....
 



Cover2.png

 

 

this is a nickle cover 2 look.

notice how both Corners dont drop deep.
opposite of what wright and young did.
they lined up further then 5 yards away from the receiver and dropped deep.
a player in montion should not at no point change their assigment.
it also at no point have elam come up from his safety and its actually a huge issue if weddle let elam free lance.

 

Edited by Tru11
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13 minutes ago, Moderator 3 said:

Yeah I saw that back when we signed him. He definitely made the right move lol.

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13 minutes ago, Moderator 3 said:

I'm glad he decided to choose the Ravens.

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My man wants a ring. He knows you get one by beating Brady. You need a defense to do that. This was a team win here. I bet Weddle has a plan for his dream defense, and it started here

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