[News] Late For Work 1/11: Is Joe Flacco Holding Ravens Back? Steve Smith Vehemently Defends His QB

[ALSKAN RAVEN FAN]

4 minutes ago, rmcjacket23 said:

Steve told us he was retiring after LAST season, and only came back because he didn't want to retire injured.

Everybody knew this was Steve's last year before the season even started. It surprised nobody. There wasn't a single, reasonable fan who was expecting him back after this season. Everybody knew that one way or another, he was done with the Ravens after 2016.

I concur I don't know who or what the people who thought differently about SSS retiring were listening to.

[ByTheBay]

1 hour ago, sp3ctor said:

I'm so glad the trolls on this board are not any of the following people: this team's owner, this team's GM, this team's President, or any other position of authority within the organization. Steve Bisciotti is a self-made BILLIONAIRE, CEO, philanthropist, and entrepreneur. He knows how to run a business. It isn't coincidence that two superbowls have come to Baltimore since he took over as owner. He's steady, calm, cool, and collected. He isn't going to make rash decisions based off of small sample sizes. Joe had a down year, but not when his offensive line held up. Harbs made a few bad calls this year as HC, but ultimately had his medicre, unbalanced lineup poised to take out the second, or possibly best, AFC team this year on Christmas day, Ozzie missed on some top picks, yet his gems in the later rounds, including multiple starters. The fact is that this team is fine and would benefit from a season of continuity. We are one offensive weapon away from being a powerhouse offense and if Mornhinweg can get back to the simplified West Coast offense Kubes installed in 2014, we will be a force next season. Think about it: Kubes offense WITH legit burners means Flacco moves on from the check-downs. But honestly most important factor I really hope the critics keep in mind this off season: one season is not a sufficient sample size to tell what you do or do not have. Scientists don't run two or three experiments and declare it 100% proven. They run hundreds of tests and weigh all options that might prove their hypothesis wrong. The simple fact is that all of the people criticizing the main pieces of this organization always point to one or two things and try and pass it off as "fact" The only fact I see here is that this organization is a great position to compete with the Steelers next season for AFC North supremacy and that's all we can hope for at this point, because last I checked, had we made the playoffs, with the absolute garbage competition during the Wild Card Weekend, we could have made a splash. The critics would have fizzled out had that happened. We were 8 inches away from that. Remember how close we came and come talk to me next year if we've regressed.

Couple of things...

Biscotti bought the Ravens in 2004. We won our first SB in 2000. We were the greatest defense of all time and owned by the late Art Model. 

Joe has had down years in 3 of the last 4. 

Yes we played Pit hard. We always do. We beat them last year with Ryan Mallett at QB. The Browns play us hard. It's part of being so familiar with each other and not a sign of how good we may or may not be. 

We are the same team going into the offseason minus our #1 receiver SSS. We are more than a single offensive weapon from being a powerhouse. That would only bring us back to where we already were last year. 

Marty will not be bringing in Kubiaks system. He will have Marty's system. We will have to wait to see what that is but dont expect miracles. Kubiak was great while it lasted but now it's gone. Marty also doesn't seem to like the run and I dont see how that will change next year. 

One season sample size? Flacco is going into his 10th season. How much more time do we need to figure it out? I have always supported Joe because he USED to be January Joe and that was exciting. I also thought it was better than being one of the miserable teams looking for their franchise guy but after seeing his numbers sit at the bottom of the league I may be kidding myself. Statistically it couldn't be much worse. Because of his extention we are stuck with him for the time being. 

[Crusader]

Keep in mind Joe was playing like crap before he got hurt and after he got paid. As for the cordinators, it's Joe who keep saying "it just football" and the Ravens playbook was easily read by opponents. Joe needs to recommit himself or his fellow players will start questioning him which is worse than fans. If your a number one receiver would you come hear or another franchise QB lead team?

[whobilly]

Keep in mind Joe was playing like crap before he got hurt and after he got paid. As for the cordinators, it's Joe who keep saying "it just football" and the Ravens playbook was easily read by opponents. Joe needs to recommit himself or his fellow players will start questioning him which is worse than fans. If your a number one receiver would you come hear or another franchise QB lead team?

It comes down to who is paying the most. Period.

[whobilly]

  2 hours ago, sp3ctor said:

I'm so glad the trolls on this board are not any of the following people: this team's owner, this team's GM, this team's President, or any other position of authority within the organization. Steve Bisciotti is a self-made BILLIONAIRE, CEO, philanthropist, and entrepreneur. He knows how to run a business. It isn't coincidence that two superbowls have come to Baltimore since he took over as owner. He's steady, calm, cool, and collected. He isn't going to make rash decisions based off of small sample sizes. Joe had a down year, but not when his offensive line held up. Harbs made a few bad calls this year as HC, but ultimately had his medicre, unbalanced lineup poised to take out the second, or possibly best, AFC team this year on Christmas day, Ozzie missed on some top picks, yet his gems in the later rounds, including multiple starters. The fact is that this team is fine and would benefit from a season of continuity. We are one offensive weapon away from being a powerhouse offense and if Mornhinweg can get back to the simplified West Coast offense Kubes installed in 2014, we will be a force next season. Think about it: Kubes offense WITH legit burners means Flacco moves on from the check-downs. But honestly most important factor I really hope the critics keep in mind this off season: one season is not a sufficient sample size to tell what you do or do not have. Scientists don't run two or three experiments and declare it 100% proven. They run hundreds of tests and weigh all options that might prove their hypothesis wrong. The simple fact is that all of the people criticizing the main pieces of this organization always point to one or two things and try and pass it off as "fact" The only fact I see here is that this organization is a great position to compete with the Steelers next season for AFC North supremacy and that's all we can hope for at this point, because last I checked, had we made the playoffs, with the absolute garbage competition during the Wild Card Weekend, we could have made a splash. The critics would have fizzled out had that happened. We were 8 inches away from that. Remember how close we came and come talk to me next year if we've regressed.

Couple of things...

Biscotti bought the Ravens in 2004. We won our first SB in 2000. We were the greatest defense of all time and owned by the late Art Model. 

Joe has had down years in 3 of the last 4. 

Yes we played Pit hard. We always do. We beat them last year with Ryan Mallett at QB. The Browns play us hard. It's part of being so familiar with each other and not a sign of how good we may or may not be. 

We are the same team going into the offseason minus our #1 receiver SSS. We are more than a single offensive weapon from being a powerhouse. That would only bring us back to where we already were last year. 

Marty will not be bringing in Kubiaks system. He will have Marty's system. We will have to wait to see what that is but dont expect miracles. Kubiak was great while it lasted but now it's gone. Marty also doesn't seem to like the run and I dont see how that will change next year. 

One season sample size? Flacco is going into his 10th season. How much more time do we need to figure it out? I have always supported Joe because he USED to be January Joe and that was exciting. I also thought it was better than being one of the miserable teams looking for their franchise guy but after seeing his numbers sit at the bottom of the league I may be kidding myself. Statistically it couldn't be much worse. Because of his extention we are stuck with him for the time being. 

So Ryan Fitzpatrick or EJ Manuel is the answer?

[whobilly]

The Flacco Defender Squad is out in full force today! They feel validated by Steve Smith's remarks.

If it's BECAUSE of the system: Why not keep it simple by running the ball more?
If it's BECAUSE of the injury: Why not keep it simple by running the ball more?
If it's BECAUSE the receivers dropped passes: Why not keep it simple by running the ball more?

New OC, bum knee, "bad receivers" - no problem! We'll throw it 670 times. That's the solution!

The points in Joe's defense do have validity - but Joe is still the one playing and throwing and leading the offense; so he inherently is accountable for the way he plays.

If we get the same ol' next year, then what? What excuses will be made then? If by then you can't accept reality, then you're either too stupid to see it, or you're turning a blind eye because you're emotionally invested in Joe Flacco.

Next year better be different!

So Ryan Fitzpatrick or EJ Manuel will get us over the hump? Or better yet Rivers or Matt Ryan because they've accomplished SO much in the post season.

[metalraven]

55 minutes ago, rmcjacket23 said:

Simple answer... because we weren't very good at running the ball when we did. So why would doing something more of something you're not good at be a good thing?

28th in rushing attempts, 23rd in YPC. What does that tell us? Not only didn't we run the ball enough, but we also didn't run it well when we did.

If we get the same from Joe in 2017 as we got in 2016, then he will be a starting QB in 2018. We're married... we're not dating.

They seldom gave the run game a chance. You can't build on something that has no foundation. They were slinging the rock from the get go. Hell, even in obvious running situations, they'd throw. Now, you may not have the best run game, but that shouldn't be a cause for complete abandonment of that aspect of the game. Simply put, Flacco isn't good enough to carry an offense for an entire season. He NEEDS a run game to excel. 

 

I understand your argument, and it is valid to a point. The YPC wasn't awesome, but it was enough to use the ground game more. Ground wasn't working, but neither was the pass game - obviously. So I guess it's moot. lol

 

And yes, we get Joe for eternity. But if it's garbage next year, something has to give.

[metalraven]

20 minutes ago, whobilly said:

So Ryan Fitzpatrick or EJ Manuel will get us over the hump? Or better yet Rivers or Matt Ryan because they've accomplished SO much in the post season.

who said anything about those guys? and you can't bring up the post season - we haven't been there lately.

[billiejean]

  8 hours ago, sami said:

this year he had TWO big game receivers. SSS and Wallace not to mention under used Kamar. The receivers aren't his problem. The problem is #1 the system and schemes and routes #2. the offensive line, #3. SSS hit it on the head when he said Joe has had too many OC's. its like learning a new language every year. How can you be comfortable and play up to your potential with that?

Not even close. I would trade SSS AND Wallace for Antonio Brown. You cant and shouldn't put them in the same level. Brown is so good he demands double teams while our 2 top receivers do not. This creates mismatches and allows other receivers to get open. In our first game with pit we locked down brown and no one else was able to find separation. It worked once and then they made adjustments in the following games and guys stepped up. And Aiken was not used very often because he didn't perform when given then chance. He may have been a one year wonder and may not be back next season. 

Also I would never compare Joe to Manning but Petyon changed teams and systems twice in 4 years and Set records, 2 SB appearances and a SB win in denver. So yeah it's Peyton manning but it shows the qb is more than just the system they are in. 

Manning also brings his offense where he goes, except you are right, for that SB win he changed to Kubes, but it was tailored to his strengths at that point in his career.

[rmcjacket23]

2 hours ago, Crusader said:

Keep in mind Joe was playing like crap before he got hurt and after he got paid. As for the cordinators, it's Joe who keep saying "it just football" and the Ravens playbook was easily read by opponents. Joe needs to recommit himself or his fellow players will start questioning him which is worse than fans. If your a number one receiver would you come hear or another franchise QB lead team?

If the Ravens paid me the most, yes, I'd come here. That's priority #1 for the overwhelming majority of FAs.

I do like how fans think that all of these FAs make team selections based on how likely the team is to win. There's maybe a handful of FAs in any given year that make that a priority. 

 

[rmcjacket23]

1 hour ago, metalraven said:

who said anything about those guys? and you can't bring up the post season - we haven't been there lately.

Define lately? I think if you asked most NFL teams, "lately" wouldn't be a 1-2 year window. That's like saying the Seattle Seahawks haven't won a SB "lately".

[rmcjacket23]

1 hour ago, metalraven said:

They seldom gave the run game a chance. You can't build on something that has no foundation. They were slinging the rock from the get go. Hell, even in obvious running situations, they'd throw. Now, you may not have the best run game, but that shouldn't be a cause for complete abandonment of that aspect of the game. Simply put, Flacco isn't good enough to carry an offense for an entire season. He NEEDS a run game to excel. 

 

I understand your argument, and it is valid to a point. The YPC wasn't awesome, but it was enough to use the ground game more. Ground wasn't working, but neither was the pass game - obviously. So I guess it's moot. lol

 

And yes, we get Joe for eternity. But if it's garbage next year, something has to give.

That's on a game to game, week to week case. There were games where I think we did abandon the run (Redskins for example), and there were other games, like Dallas for example, where the boxscore says we didn't run it enough, yet you'd have a hard time naming maybe 1-2 more plays the entire game where running the ball was more effective. 

I think if you'd have seen us be more effective running the ball, especially earlier in the season, you'd have seen us run it more.

I want to fix the quality before I fix the quantity.

[ByTheBay]

3 hours ago, whobilly said:

So Ryan Fitzpatrick or EJ Manuel will get us over the hump? Or better yet Rivers or Matt Ryan because they've accomplished SO much in the post season.

 

3 hours ago, metalraven said:

who said anything about those guys? and you can't bring up the post season - we haven't been there lately.

I know, why do some fans insist on going to extremes as their only argument? When will they learn that when someone suggests that Flacco is not doing what he is paid to do, the response has to be better than "oh so you'd rather have Mark Sanchez?" Or Andy Dalton can't win a playoff game. Same sorry response comes in defending Harbaugh, who I like by the way but its not like there are no replacements for him. The hard part for some to understand is that unlike QB's, there are many unknown canadates out there. Of course extensive football experience is needed to be a head coach but I think the main focus is their ability to deligate and motivates. You dont need to be restricted to the OC/DC/HC carousel to find that. 

[FloridaRaven]

I'm thinking that since he retired whilst a Raven and on Ravens' stationery, that means he retired a Raven. He'd now have to ask for reinstatement in order to retire as a Panther.

[RaRaRavens]

8 hours ago, rmcjacket23 said:

Steve told us he was retiring after LAST season, and only came back because he didn't want to retire injured.

Everybody knew this was Steve's last year before the season even started. It surprised nobody. There wasn't a single, reasonable fan who was expecting him back after this season. Everybody knew that one way or another, he was done with the Ravens after 2016.

Yes, there was no realistic chance of him being back in '17. But not once did he say he had made a definite decision. Rather, at the beginning of December I think it was, when asked about 2017 season, Smith said he will make his retirement decision in February after taking some time off. Instead, after one of the most depressing months of football I've witnessed the Ravens play, he made the decision literally after the final whistle blew in week 17. 

So don't come here talking that his decision was made long before our season ended. He might have been leaning one way or the other, but it's painfully obvious that the month of December made his retirement decision way more obvious one.

Edited January 12 by RaRaRavens

[sami]

  15 hours ago, sami said:

this year he had TWO big game receivers. SSS and Wallace not to mention under used Kamar. The receivers aren't his problem. The problem is #1 the system and schemes and routes #2. the offensive line, #3. SSS hit it on the head when he said Joe has had too many OC's. its like learning a new language every year. How can you be comfortable and play up to your potential with that?

Not even close. I would trade SSS AND Wallace for Antonio Brown. You cant and shouldn't put them in the same level. Brown is so good he demands double teams while our 2 top receivers do not. This creates mismatches and allows other receivers to get open. In our first game with pit we locked down brown and no one else was able to find separation. It worked once and then they made adjustments in the following games and guys stepped up. And Aiken was not used very often because he didn't perform when given then chance. He may have been a one year wonder and may not be back next season. 

Also I would never compare Joe to Manning but Petyon changed teams and systems twice in 4 years and Set records, 2 SB appearances and a SB win in denver. So yeah it's Peyton manning but it shows the qb is more than just the system they are in. 

if Antonio Brown had been in our system and SSS had been with the Steelers, SSS would have had a way better year. Our system just don't use the WR to their capabilities.

[sizzlingdoom]

  11 hours ago, metalraven said:

The Flacco Defender Squad is out in full force today! They feel validated by Steve Smith's remarks.

If it's BECAUSE of the system: Why not keep it simple by running the ball more?
If it's BECAUSE of the injury: Why not keep it simple by running the ball more?
If it's BECAUSE the receivers dropped passes: Why not keep it simple by running the ball more?

New OC, bum knee, "bad receivers" - no problem! We'll throw it 670 times. That's the solution!

The points in Joe's defense do have validity - but Joe is still the one playing and throwing and leading the offense; so he inherently is accountable for the way he plays.

If we get the same ol' next year, then what? What excuses will be made then? If by then you can't accept reality, then you're either too stupid to see it, or you're turning a blind eye because you're emotionally invested in Joe Flacco.

Next year better be different!

So Ryan Fitzpatrick or EJ Manuel will get us over the hump? Or better yet Rivers or Matt Ryan because they've accomplished SO much in the post season.

Are you kidding me???? If the Ravens had Rivers or Ryan for the past 7 years, we would surely have more than 2 rings

[sizzlingdoom]

Is Flacco holding the Ravens back? Ummm, YES. Flacco, Harbaugh, and his staff. But at least none of them play crucial roles in winning......O, WAIT... :(

[20306cab]

Is Flacco holding the Ravens back? Ummm, YES. Flacco, Harbaugh, and his staff. But at least none of them play crucial roles in winning......O, WAIT... :(

And at least they aren't overpaid.

[Rav'n Maniac]

One of three things is going to result here. Either we will become worse, stay the same or improve. The latter is what I choose to believe as I see that they understand our needs. They realize we have to build our Oline and are making it a  priority as nothing will improve on offense without it. I also see they understand that they must create cap room in order to fill the main positions of need at WR, OLB and CB. I expect that they will accomplish what is necessary to move forward and show improvement. 

[J.O.14]

  14 hours ago, whobilly said:

  17 hours ago, metalraven said:

The Flacco Defender Squad is out in full force today! They feel validated by Steve Smith's remarks.

If it's BECAUSE of the system: Why not keep it simple by running the ball more?
If it's BECAUSE of the injury: Why not keep it simple by running the ball more?
If it's BECAUSE the receivers dropped passes: Why not keep it simple by running the ball more?

New OC, bum knee, "bad receivers" - no problem! We'll throw it 670 times. That's the solution!

The points in Joe's defense do have validity - but Joe is still the one playing and throwing and leading the offense; so he inherently is accountable for the way he plays.

If we get the same ol' next year, then what? What excuses will be made then? If by then you can't accept reality, then you're either too stupid to see it, or you're turning a blind eye because you're emotionally invested in Joe Flacco.

Next year better be different!

So Ryan Fitzpatrick or EJ Manuel will get us over the hump? Or better yet Rivers or Matt Ryan because they've accomplished SO much in the post season.

Are you kidding me???? If the Ravens had Rivers or Ryan for the past 7 years, we would surely have more than 2 rings

Absolutely not. Completely disagree. Same could be said if you gave Flacco the weapons Ryan has. If Flacco had Julio Jones, my goodness. Rivers is a good QB, but in my opinion Rivers and Flacco are very similar QBs in their style of play. Both can make any throw on the field, step up their play when game is on the line, and both are known for bone headed decisions.

[sizzlingdoom]

  7 hours ago, sizzlingdoom said:

  14 hours ago, whobilly said:

  18 hours ago, metalraven said:

The Flacco Defender Squad is out in full force today! They feel validated by Steve Smith's remarks.

If it's BECAUSE of the system: Why not keep it simple by running the ball more?
If it's BECAUSE of the injury: Why not keep it simple by running the ball more?
If it's BECAUSE the receivers dropped passes: Why not keep it simple by running the ball more?

New OC, bum knee, "bad receivers" - no problem! We'll throw it 670 times. That's the solution!

The points in Joe's defense do have validity - but Joe is still the one playing and throwing and leading the offense; so he inherently is accountable for the way he plays.

If we get the same ol' next year, then what? What excuses will be made then? If by then you can't accept reality, then you're either too stupid to see it, or you're turning a blind eye because you're emotionally invested in Joe Flacco.

Next year better be different!

So Ryan Fitzpatrick or EJ Manuel will get us over the hump? Or better yet Rivers or Matt Ryan because they've accomplished SO much in the post season.

Are you kidding me???? If the Ravens had Rivers or Ryan for the past 7 years, we would surely have more than 2 rings

Absolutely not. Completely disagree. Same could be said if you gave Flacco the weapons Ryan has. If Flacco had Julio Jones, my goodness. Rivers is a good QB, but in my opinion Rivers and Flacco are very similar QBs in their style of play. Both can make any throw on the field, step up their play when game is on the line, and both are known for bone headed decisions.

they've always had to carry their teams. Give those 2 qbs Ravens defenses....=multiple rings imo

[rmcjacket23]

7 hours ago, RaRaRavens said:

Yes, there was no realistic chance of him being back in '17. But not once did he say he had made a definite decision. Rather, at the beginning of December I think it was, when asked about 2017 season, Smith said he will make his retirement decision in February after taking some time off. Instead, after one of the most depressing months of football I've witnessed the Ravens play, he made the decision literally after the final whistle blew in week 17. 

So don't come here talking that his decision was made long before our season ended. He might have been leaning one way or the other, but it's painfully obvious that the month of December made his retirement decision way more obvious one.

So you were already aware that he wouldn't be back in 2017. Why does anything you said after that matter at all even a little bit?

You literally said you knew before the season started that he wouldn't be back. So whats the difference if he makes his retirement decision in December or February? What impact does that have on the Baltimore Ravens?

What this sounds to me, quite simply, is that YOU weren't convinced that he wouldn't be back (despite him telling you that unequivocally) and held out some sort of false hope that he would be.

Why that is I have no idea...

[rmcjacket23]

4 hours ago, 20306cab said:

And at least they aren't overpaid.

There's no such thing as overpaid in the NFL...

People are paid whatever a team is willing to pay them. That's what somebodies worth is.

[Chuckx999]

I'll bet if we had a QB like Tom Brady Steve Smith would never want to retire.

[RaRaRavens]

1 hour ago, rmcjacket23 said:

So you were already aware that he wouldn't be back in 2017. Why does anything you said after that matter at all even a little bit?

You literally said you knew before the season started that he wouldn't be back. So whats the difference if he makes his retirement decision in December or February? What impact does that have on the Baltimore Ravens?

What this sounds to me, quite simply, is that YOU weren't convinced that he wouldn't be back (despite him telling you that unequivocally) and held out some sort of false hope that he would be.

Why that is I have no idea...

Are you even reading what I'm saying?! The fact that he didn't even give returning a second thought shows that he does not have belief in this team. 

[rmcjacket23]

17 minutes ago, RaRaRavens said:

Are you even reading what I'm saying?! The fact that he didn't even give returning a second thought shows that he does not have belief in this team. 

You are aware that there are 32 NFL teams in this league and Steve Smith didn't have a contract with any of them, thus making him a FA?

So if Steve Smith didn't have belief in this team and wanted to continue to play, why doesn't he just go play for somebody else?

But he retired. So what does that mean? It means he doesn't want to play for ANYBODY. 

You can keep trying to spin his retirement to fit whatever false narrative you want to create that says that he retired because he lost faith in the Ravens and blah blah blah. He retired because he doesn't want to play anymore for anybody. This ain't complicated.

[bigcatfrank1]

  On 1/11/2017 at 6:21 PM, whobilly said:

  On 1/11/2017 at 2:37 PM, metalraven said:

The Flacco Defender Squad is out in full force today! They feel validated by Steve Smith's remarks.

If it's BECAUSE of the system: Why not keep it simple by running the ball more?
If it's BECAUSE of the injury: Why not keep it simple by running the ball more?
If it's BECAUSE the receivers dropped passes: Why not keep it simple by running the ball more?

New OC, bum knee, "bad receivers" - no problem! We'll throw it 670 times. That's the solution!

The points in Joe's defense do have validity - but Joe is still the one playing and throwing and leading the offense; so he inherently is accountable for the way he plays.

If we get the same ol' next year, then what? What excuses will be made then? If by then you can't accept reality, then you're either too stupid to see it, or you're turning a blind eye because you're emotionally invested in Joe Flacco.

Next year better be different!

So Ryan Fitzpatrick or EJ Manuel will get us over the hump? Or better yet Rivers or Matt Ryan because they've accomplished SO much in the post season.

Are you kidding me???? If the Ravens had Rivers or Ryan for the past 7 years, we would surely have more than 2 rings

First off we didn't get Ryan or Rivers and we cant get Ryan or Rivers so its a stupid argument. Joe has as a winning record, he has a great playoff record and he appears to still have something left in the tank. Now if you are saying that he is done, you have that right to say get rid of him. QB's do lose it, he has struggled for 3 seasons but to look at it reasonably 1.5 of both last year and part of this year the injury played a role in his physical performance. He did set his yardage record this year, but that is only because the Ravens struggled again running the ball. I say get a RB like Le'veon Bell or Ryan Jenson and the Ravens are in the Playoffs without changing a thing. Make the upgrades at WR/OG/LB/CB and RB the Ravens have a shot at the Ring.

[bigcatfrank1]

  On 1/11/2017 at 6:42 PM, metalraven said:

They seldom gave the run game a chance. You can't build on something that has no foundation. They were slinging the rock from the get go. Hell, even in obvious running situations, they'd throw. Now, you may not have the best run game, but that shouldn't be a cause for complete abandonment of that aspect of the game. Simply put, Flacco isn't good enough to carry an offense for an entire season. He NEEDS a run game to excel. 

 

I understand your argument, and it is valid to a point. The YPC wasn't awesome, but it was enough to use the ground game more. Ground wasn't working, but neither was the pass game - obviously. So I guess it's moot. lol

 

And yes, we get Joe for eternity. But if it's garbage next year, something has to give.

That's on a game to game, week to week case. There were games where I think we did abandon the run (Redskins for example), and there were other games, like Dallas for example, where the boxscore says we didn't run it enough, yet you'd have a hard time naming maybe 1-2 more plays the entire game where running the ball was more effective. 

I think if you'd have seen us be more effective running the ball, especially earlier in the season, you'd have seen us run it more.

I want to fix the quality before I fix the quantity.

Jacket you are absolutely correct, while West and Dixon ran the ball pretty well. They both seemed to have down moments. Lets call them Rookie or development issues. Some backs have natural instincts and take on a full time RB type position, of course we just were not quite so lucky. Bell for the Steelers is a beast as an example. Now The Ravens have to "buck" up, pun intended, and make a tough decision. However based on team history, the Ravens seem to operate best when they have a 3 down back. So I would like to see them go in a different direction, I know its a tough one. There is always a risk. ps that kid for Miami J Aj sure had a great season too!

[bigcatfrank1]

  16 hours ago, sizzlingdoom said:

  On 1/11/2017 at 6:21 PM, whobilly said:

  On 1/11/2017 at 2:37 PM, metalraven said:

The Flacco Defender Squad is out in full force today! They feel validated by Steve Smith's remarks.

If it's BECAUSE of the system: Why not keep it simple by running the ball more?
If it's BECAUSE of the injury: Why not keep it simple by running the ball more?
If it's BECAUSE the receivers dropped passes: Why not keep it simple by running the ball more?

New OC, bum knee, "bad receivers" - no problem! We'll throw it 670 times. That's the solution!

The points in Joe's defense do have validity - but Joe is still the one playing and throwing and leading the offense; so he inherently is accountable for the way he plays.

If we get the same ol' next year, then what? What excuses will be made then? If by then you can't accept reality, then you're either too stupid to see it, or you're turning a blind eye because you're emotionally invested in Joe Flacco.

Next year better be different!

So Ryan Fitzpatrick or EJ Manuel will get us over the hump? Or better yet Rivers or Matt Ryan because they've accomplished SO much in the post season.

Are you kidding me???? If the Ravens had Rivers or Ryan for the past 7 years, we would surely have more than 2 rings

First off we didn't get Ryan or Rivers and we cant get Ryan or Rivers so its a stupid argument. Joe has as a winning record, he has a great playoff record and he appears to still have something left in the tank. Now if you are saying that he is done, you have that right to say get rid of him. QB's do lose it, he has struggled for 3 seasons but to look at it reasonably 1.5 of both last year and part of this year the injury played a role in his physical performance. He did set his yardage record this year, but that is only because the Ravens struggled again running the ball. I say get a RB like Le'veon Bell or Ryan Jenson and the Ravens are in the Playoffs without changing a thing. Make the upgrades at WR/OG/LB/CB and RB the Ravens have a shot at the Ring.

sorry I said Jenson..brain freeze Z. Elliott