2016 Playoff Discussion

[52520Andrew]

52 minutes ago, PurpleCity5 said:

Denver's offense wasn't just great, it was all-time great. They were top 3 all time in 3 category's, PPG,  First downs per game, and YPG. Tied for first in 50 point games and since 1990 in total points scored, the 2013 Denver Broncos were/are #1 in the league. and had they won that SB, they would have been agreed upon by many as the greatest offense ever. That takes a whole lot of game-planning and scheming to stop. Also, that same season the Patriots beat the Seahawks, Denver nearly did as well at Century link with them not even being able to get the ball back in OT.

I don't think this Patriots defense is as good as some make it to be. Don't get me wrong, it's a good defense but I wouldn't put it in the elite category. I think they're very dependent on scheme and game-planning given the lack of All-Pro(Even Pro Bowl) talent on that defense. Also, when addressing their #1 opponents PPG, I honestly have to say that their stat is pretty inflated given the severe lack of elite or upper echelon of NFL offenses they played. I would not put Buffalo, New York Jets, or Miami near that category. They played 6 of the bottom ten teams in the lowest PPG category which consists of LA Rams, Cleveland Browns, NY Jets, Houston Texans, Cincinnati Bengals and San Francisco 49ers. Denver and Baltimore themselves weren't exactly great scoring offenses coming in at 20 and 21st respectively. The only team they played within the top ten in scoring PPG was Arizona and we know how their season went down. I can't give them credit for limiting Pitt to 17 without Big Ben in the game honestly. To their credit Buffalo is 10th in scoring PPG, but that's a very inconsistent offense that shouldn't even be mentioned in the same breath of the top offenses. 

Seattle comes in at 17th and they had a very poor showing their defensively, then Miami at 19th. Meanwhile, their SB opponent, Atlanta Falcons were #1 in the league putting up an insane 34.4 PPG. 

All of the great SB Defenses all have one thing in common, they can rush the passer and NE isn't really great at that. While ATL isn't great at that either, they have someone who can consistently do it in Vic Beasley. I understand Bill is going to come up with something and surprise us, but ATL has someone of a brilliant defensive mind in Dan Quinn who knows how to limit(Not stop) top NFL offenses. 

 

Yeah I am not saying Denver was bad or not an all time great offense, I am saying Seattle was an all time great defense. And it was largely the same group that next year against the Pats. And it is far better than the current Falcons defense which is average at best going against a top 5 offense. An all time great defense and an all time great offense isn't a huge gap. An average defense against a top 5 offense is. There is a big difference and the 2014 Super Bowl is a much better comparison if we are looking at past matchups since it was actually against the Pats but even that was a much better defense than this Falcons group.

Agree the Falcons will score points as even if the Pats put in a bunch of resources to take away Julio the Falcons have other ways to beat the Pats unless they totally wet the bed. Summed up my thoughts on that a couple posts up.

As for the Falcons I don't see an interior pass rush from them and that is the key to beat Brady. Brady can get rid of the ball very quick and if you don't get in his face immediately then he will get the ball out. That quick passing attack is key. I don't think either side get much of a pass rush though and I think the Pats have the edge on coaching and defense but the Falcons have the edge on offense. If the Falcons offense plays lights out they will probably win, if the Pats defense limits them to about 30, they have a decent shot.

 

[PurpleCity5]

On 1/31/2017 at 4:47 PM, 52520Andrew said:

Yeah I am not saying Denver was bad or not an all time great offense, I am saying Seattle was an all time great defense. And it was largely the same group that next year against the Pats. And it is far better than the current Falcons defense which is average at best going against a top 5 offense. An all time great defense and an all time great offense isn't a huge gap. An average defense against a top 5 offense is. There is a big difference and the 2014 Super Bowl is a much better comparison if we are looking at past matchups since it was actually against the Pats but even that was a much better defense than this Falcons group.

Agree the Falcons will score points as even if the Pats put in a bunch of resources to take away Julio the Falcons have other ways to beat the Pats unless they totally wet the bed. Summed up my thoughts on that a couple posts up.

As for the Falcons I don't see an interior pass rush from them and that is the key to beat Brady. Brady can get rid of the ball very quick and if you don't get in his face immediately then he will get the ball out. That quick passing attack is key. I don't think either side get much of a pass rush though and I think the Pats have the edge on coaching and defense but the Falcons have the edge on offense. If the Falcons offense plays lights out they will probably win, if the Pats defense limits them to about 30, they have a decent shot.

 

I understand that Seattle is an all-time great defense, but the point I'm getting across is that all-time great defense came across an all-time great offense. It takes a lot of game-planning and really good play calling to stop an offense as good as Denver's with or without all-pro talent on defense and I give credit to Quinn for that. NE did beat that group, but Denver nearly did as well and lets not forget that Seattle had that game won if not for that blatant INT at the end of the game, otherwise they would've been given credit for forcing two turnovers against a magnificent offense with a defense that wasn't 100% and was losing players as the game went on. I don't think the Patriots played the same 2013 Seahawks defense to be honest with you. 

I don't think the Falcons have an impressive defense, but I don't think they're as bad as some say. Since week 11 the Falcons have allowed more than 21 points twice and one was against in which K.C got eight from a pick 6 and a 2PT return. I also think they played two pretty good games recently against Green bay(Who was hot) and Seattle (who completely killed the Patriots defense in Gillette). You can get a good game from this defense honestly, I don't think they're like a defense like San Francisco or Cleveland who are prone to getting pancaked any given week. Since the week 11 bye I think some people can call them a good defense with the adjustments they've made, I would honestly put them in the 13-20 range among defenses if the bye week is any indication of what they are, they're a young defense and needed to gel, it took time, but I think they're showing of what they're capable of. 

I may sound overly optimistic since I'm talking about them going up against the best QB/HC duo, but they've been stopped before, everyone has. A HC as good as Belichick will even match-up against defensive geniuses like Dan Quinn who can come up with some damn good game-plans too.

I don't see an impressive pass rush from the Patriots either, I think they're very over-reliant on scheming up blitzes. They do a great job of shifting that DL and keep teams guessing, but as I said before, they're going up against a whole different animal in Atlanta. I get that Pittsburgh offense can be great, but this Falcons offense is historic and undoubtedly the best in the league. 

We'll see how the Patriots fare, but this Falcons offense is historic, I think their defense is going to have a tough task as well, if the Falcons defense can hold their own then they can take it. 

I'm not saying their going to win, I just think some people should give them a shot before handing the trophy to the Patriots. 

[DomMcRaven]

I'm really looking forward for the season to end. I have very little interest in this year's Super Bowl. 

[JO_75]

13 hours ago, DomMcRaven said:

I'm really looking forward for the season to end. I have very little interest in this year's Super Bowl. 

I know it's the Super Bowl but I'm curious to see the ratings. Sure the QB matchup is great but outside of it, how much interest is there outside of New England and Atlanta.

[Pats]

4 hours ago, JO_75 said:

I know it's the Super Bowl but I'm curious to see the ratings. Sure the QB matchup is great but outside of it, how much interest is there outside of New England and Atlanta.

New england/boston has always been a big market so that sides OK. Atlanta not so much, it will get some bandwagoners for sure though at least. Big markets are typically boston, PA, NY, LA(except for hockey) Chicago and texas.

[JO_75]

Is it me or am I the only one that can't figure out why the NFL doesn't look at college stadiums for Super Bowl locations? When some of these college stadiums can reach over 100K in seating, it boggles me how they haven't tried one at Ann Arbor, Ohio Stadium, Bryant Denny Stadium in Alabama. 

[Moderator 3]

4 minutes ago, JO_75 said:

Is it me or am I the only one that can't figure out why the NFL doesn't look at college stadiums for Super Bowl locations? When some of these college stadiums can reach over 100K in seating, it boggles me how they haven't tried one at Ann Arbor, Ohio Stadium, Bryant Denny Stadium in Alabama. 

Alcohol limitations?  Beer is a huge sponsor.

[Tank 92]

14 minutes ago, Moderator 3 said:

Alcohol limitations?  Beer is a huge sponsor.

No reason they couldn't sell at a pro game. 

[JO_75]

21 minutes ago, Moderator 3 said:

Alcohol limitations?  Beer is a huge sponsor.

 

5 minutes ago, Tank 92 said:

No reason they couldn't sell at a pro game. 

Also Bowl Games are played at NFL Stadiums and don't have any issues. 

[BmoreBird22]

A lot of being made of the Patriots top ranked defense in PPG and I think the story line is way overblown. They played three offenses in the top 10 (Cardinals, Bills, and Steelers). They played five teams in the bottom six, including the bottom four, and the rest were teams ranked 17 or worse. The three best quarterbacks they played were Roethlisberger (in NE in the playoffs), Palmer in week one, and Russel Wilson. The Patriots lost one of those games and very easily could have lost the other had Arizona not missed a FG. Other than that, the Patriots faced the likes of a hobbled Flacco, Charlie Whitehurst, Landry Jones, Matt Moore, Blaine Gabbert, Jared Goff, etc. 

Too much is being made of the Falcons "bad defense." Couple things to consider here. 1. The Falcons scored a first drive TD in eight straight games. Opponents were way too often playing from behind and were forced to play catch up. The Falcons were more than willing to concede yardage if it meant the clock was being run off. 2. Look at the Falcons pre and post bye week. If you exclude week 17 when the Falcons had the division wrapped up, they gave up an average of 16.7 PPG following the bye week. The Falcons shut Rodgers and the high powered Packers out for over two and a half quarters until the game was well out of hand.

The Falcons don't actually have to stop the Patriots and Tom Brady- they just have to limit him because Matt Ryan and the Falcons offense will get their points in bunches.

[Pats]

I'm sick of pregame talk that's why I always avoid superbowl media weeks. No more speculation let's jsut see what happens.

[usmccharles]

17 minutes ago, BmoreBird22 said:

A lot of being made of the Patriots top ranked defense in PPG and I think the story line is way overblown. They played three offenses in the top 10 (Cardinals, Bills, and Steelers). They played five teams in the bottom six, including the bottom four, and the rest were teams ranked 17 or worse. The three best quarterbacks they played were Roethlisberger (in NE in the playoffs), Palmer in week one, and Russel Wilson. The Patriots lost one of those games and very easily could have lost the other had Arizona not missed a FG. Other than that, the Patriots faced the likes of a hobbled Flacco, Charlie Whitehurst, Landry Jones, Matt Moore, Blaine Gabbert, Jared Goff, etc. 

Too much is being made of the Falcons "bad defense." Couple things to consider here. 1. The Falcons scored a first drive TD in eight straight games. Opponents were way too often playing from behind and were forced to play catch up. The Falcons were more than willing to concede yardage if it meant the clock was being run off. 2. Look at the Falcons pre and post bye week. If you exclude week 17 when the Falcons had the division wrapped up, they gave up an average of 16.7 PPG following the bye week. The Falcons shut Rodgers and the high powered Packers out for over two and a half quarters until the game was well out of hand.

The Falcons don't actually have to stop the Patriots and Tom Brady- they just have to limit him because Matt Ryan and the Falcons offense will get their points in bunches.

This.  Look at the level of competition

[JO_75]

53 minutes ago, Pats said:

I'm sick of pregame talk that's why I always avoid superbowl media weeks. No more speculation let's jsut see what happens.

I found myself this season avoiding pregame shows more and more throughout the season. I use to watch NFL Network every day during the season, watch Total Access, get up early to watch Gameday Morning, watch Gameday Final, etc. I even watched the pregames on Monday and Thursdays but now, I just wait until about 5 minutes before kickoff to turn the TV on. I haven't even watched NFL Network at all this week, I'm ready to see what happens. 

Sure it's fun to see the talking heads predictions and the cool segments they come up with, interviews with players, but now it's just whatever.

Best of Luck to you guys on Sunday, I think you know who everyone here is rooting for but regardless who wins I just want to see some good football.

[Pats]

19 minutes ago, JO_75 said:

I found myself this season avoiding pregame shows more and more throughout the season. I use to watch NFL Network every day during the season, watch Total Access, get up early to watch Gameday Morning, watch Gameday Final, etc. I even watched the pregames on Monday and Thursdays but now, I just wait until about 5 minutes before kickoff to turn the TV on. I haven't even watched NFL Network at all this week, I'm ready to see what happens. 

Sure it's fun to see the talking heads predictions and the cool segments they come up with, interviews with players, but now it's just whatever.

Best of Luck to you guys on Sunday, I think you know who everyone here is rooting for but regardless who wins I just want to see some good football.

Thanks man haha yeah I figured but I don't mind that's why everyone has their own preferances.  Yeah there are far too talking heads and speculations and stupid personalities and this and that and It drives me crazy. Now I just am like ok let's play the game none of this build up is fun or interesting. 

[52520Andrew]

On 2/1/2017 at 10:43 PM, PurpleCity5 said:

I understand that Seattle is an all-time great defense, but the point I'm getting across is that all-time great defense came across an all-time great offense. It takes a lot of game-planning and really good play calling to stop an offense as good as Denver's with or without all-pro talent on defense and I give credit to Quinn for that. NE did beat that group, but Denver nearly did as well and lets not forget that Seattle had that game won if not for that blatant INT at the end of the game, otherwise they would've been given credit for forcing two turnovers against a magnificent offense with a defense that wasn't 100% and was losing players as the game went on. I don't think the Patriots played the same 2013 Seahawks defense to be honest with you. 

I don't think the Falcons have an impressive defense, but I don't think they're as bad as some say. Since week 11 the Falcons have allowed more than 21 points twice and one was against in which K.C got eight from a pick 6 and a 2PT return. I also think they played two pretty good games recently against Green bay(Who was hot) and Seattle (who completely killed the Patriots defense in Gillette). You can get a good game from this defense honestly, I don't think they're like a defense like San Francisco or Cleveland who are prone to getting pancaked any given week. Since the week 11 bye I think some people can call them a good defense with the adjustments they've made, I would honestly put them in the 13-20 range among defenses if the bye week is any indication of what they are, they're a young defense and needed to gel, it took time, but I think they're showing of what they're capable of. 

I may sound overly optimistic since I'm talking about them going up against the best QB/HC duo, but they've been stopped before, everyone has. A HC as good as Belichick will even match-up against defensive geniuses like Dan Quinn who can come up with some damn good game-plans too.

I don't see an impressive pass rush from the Patriots either, I think they're very over-reliant on scheming up blitzes. They do a great job of shifting that DL and keep teams guessing, but as I said before, they're going up against a whole different animal in Atlanta. I get that Pittsburgh offense can be great, but this Falcons offense is historic and undoubtedly the best in the league. 

We'll see how the Patriots fare, but this Falcons offense is historic, I think their defense is going to have a tough task as well, if the Falcons defense can hold their own then they can take it. 

I'm not saying their going to win, I just think some people should give them a shot before handing the trophy to the Patriots. 

An all time great defense vs an all time great offense is an even match or close to it. The Falcons defense vs Pats offense is more of a mismatch and a tougher task.

I have said my piece on this stuff though and we seem to actually agree on nost of this stuff. I even said I don't think either team will get much of a pass rush

I think both teams have a good shot at this and it will probably come down to a couple plays at the end. I just hope the Falcons at least show up to play, wouldn't break my heart if the Pats don't though

[K-Dog]

I don't know what to make of this ....

 

[Tank 92]

1 hour ago, K-Dog said:

I don't know what to make of this ....

 

I'm with this!   A Falcon win is a win for the Good Guys!  

[Tank 92]

18 hours ago, usmccharles said:

This.  Look at the level of competition

I'm not saying they haven't been a good team but they pretty much get a cakewalk to the #1 seed every year. 

[usmccharles]

Just now, Tank 92 said:

I'm not saying they haven't been a good team but they pretty much get a cakewalk to the #1 seed every year. 

Agreed.  Im sure if we had that schedule we could of had a record style defense. 

[K-Dog]

1 hour ago, Tank 92 said:

I'm with this!   A Falcon win is a win for the Good Guys!  

Oh I want the Falcons to win too for sure.  That logo is just strange...

[JO_75]

Predictions anyone? 

[K-Dog]

2 hours ago, JO_75 said:

Predictions anyone? 

I would prefer it be Atlanta by 47, but sadly I think it will be NE by 17.

[JO_75]

You know, I can understand making Super Bowl matchup t-shirts ahead of time and making shirts/hats and stuff for sale ahead of time for every team. It's worse when you put the shirt up for sale when the Packers loss to the Falcons, just disrespectful to the Falcons. 

http://www.nflshop.com/catalog/product/Mens_New_England_Patriots_vs._Green_Bay_Packers_Pro_Line_by_Fanatics_Branded_Black_Super_Bowl_LI_Dueling_Matchup_T-Shirt/

Edited February 5 by JO_75

[BmoreBird22]

10 hours ago, JO_75 said:

Predictions anyone? 

I made a Super Bowl thread. I'm about to post my prediction in there.