2016 Playoff Discussion

[52520Andrew]

4 hours ago, PurpleCity5 said:

Dan Quinn was the DC of Seattle during that annihilation of that historic Broncos offense in 2014 SB. I wouldn't sleep on his ability to game plan. I think Houston showed that New England offense isn't unstoppable, they certainly are not more talented than their 2014 offense IMO. 

Seahawks defense is a lot better than Atlanta

[DomMcRaven]

4 hours ago, 52520Andrew said:

Seahawks defense is a lot better than Atlanta

Same goes with the Texans defense > Falcons defense

[52520Andrew]

5 minutes ago, DomMcRaven said:

Same goes with the Texans defense > Falcons defense

That is also a good point, that Texans defense was loaded without Watt which is pretty scary if they get him back healthy next year.

[DomMcRaven]

2 hours ago, 52520Andrew said:

That is also a good point, that Texans defense was loaded without Watt which is pretty scary if they get him back healthy next year.

I hope they never get a legit QB. That's a dangerous team if they got someone like Rivers. 

[PurpleCity5]

15 hours ago, 52520Andrew said:

Seahawks defense is a lot better than Atlanta

Of course, but that offense that he played is definitely better than this Patriots offense. Denver's offense that year is debated as one of the best ever. He schemed and called one of the best games ever as a DC IMO. No secret this teams gets really good and goes to a SB two years into his arrival, I think he might be heading towards a storied coaching career. 

Edited January 26 by PurpleCity5

[52520Andrew]

46 minutes ago, PurpleCity5 said:

Of course, but that offense that he played is definitely better than this Patriots offense. Denver's offense that year is debated as one of the best ever. He schemed and called one of the best games ever as a DC IMO. No secret this teams gets really good and goes to a SB two years into his arrival, I think he might be heading towards a storied coaching career. 

The 2013 Seattle defense is one of the greatest defenses of all time. The Falcons defense is 25th in yards allowed and 27th in points per game for this year. That is a pretty big jump. I like Quinn too but don't try to compare this defense to one of the best all time and don't try to tell me the Pats offense is at a level similar to this Falcons defense.

9 hours ago, DomMcRaven said:

I hope they never get a legit QB. That's a dangerous team if they got someone like Rivers. 

They pretty much have everything except QB. Imagine if they had taken Carr in 2014 instead of Su'a Filo

[PurpleCity5]

23 minutes ago, 52520Andrew said:

The 2013 Seattle defense is one of the greatest defenses of all time. The Falcons defense is 25th in yards allowed and 27th in points per game for this year. That is a pretty big jump. I like Quinn too but don't try to compare this defense to one of the best all time and don't try to tell me the Pats offense is at a level similar to this Falcons defense.

I didn't even make the comparison, lol. The key element that I'm talking about is not the fact that he coached an amazing defense but the fact that his defense completely destroyed and annihilated one of the greatest offenses ever. As much praise as you would like to give Seattle's defense that year, I could exactly give to Denver's offense. You can have a defense as great as Seattle, but I think your making the task of limiting that Denver's offense easier than it sounds because it wasn't. Yes, he had an amazing defense, but the type of offense he was going up against is nothing to forget about. It was a crazy loaded and talented offense and I think offensively was as good as Seattle's was defensively. 

The Patriots offense is not at a similar level to this Falcons offense, but they've put out better offenses and teams before. Of course offensively they're better than the Falcons are defensively, but history shows you can limit Brady on the Big stage. 

[Pats]

We are more well rounded than the falcons in my opinion. Better defense definitely and they are slightly better on offense. I think it goes 30-27 our way.

[52520Andrew]

2 hours ago, PurpleCity5 said:

I didn't even make the comparison, lol. The key element that I'm talking about is not the fact that he coached an amazing defense but the fact that his defense completely destroyed and annihilated one of the greatest offenses ever. As much praise as you would like to give Seattle's defense that year, I could exactly give to Denver's offense. You can have a defense as great as Seattle, but I think your making the task of limiting that Denver's offense easier than it sounds because it wasn't. Yes, he had an amazing defense, but the type of offense he was going up against is nothing to forget about. It was a crazy loaded and talented offense and I think offensively was as good as Seattle's was defensively. 

The Patriots offense is not at a similar level to this Falcons offense, but they've put out better offenses and teams before. Of course offensively they're better than the Falcons are defensively, but history shows you can limit Brady on the Big stage. 

My point is that while Denver's offense was great, Seattle had easily the best defense that year and one of the best all time. It wasn't nearly as big a gap as the Atlanta defense vs New England. Compared to a great offense still with New England and an average at best defense from Atlanta, I'd say there is a much bigger gap. You are talking about a fairly even matchup with the 2013 Super Bowl but this is not and the Falcons will have a much harder time limiting the Pats. So while I think it is great to bring that up, I don't see how it has much to do with this current matchup, especially considering Brady put up 28 on largely the same group the next year and the Seahawks blew a 10 point 4th quarter lead. 

[Tank 92]

1 hour ago, 52520Andrew said:

My point is that while Denver's offense was great, Seattle had easily the best defense that year and one of the best all time. It wasn't nearly as big a gap as the Atlanta defense vs New England. Compared to a great offense still with New England and an average at best defense from Atlanta, I'd say there is a much bigger gap. You are talking about a fairly even matchup with the 2013 Super Bowl but this is not and the Falcons will have a much harder time limiting the Pats. So while I think it is great to bring that up, I don't see how it has much to do with this current matchup, especially considering Brady put up 28 on largely the same group the next year and the Seahawks blew a 10 point 4th quarter lead. 

You really can't use past tournament history to make any sort of assumptions about this game.

It seems pretty basic. If the Falcons can get pressure on brady which it seems they are well equipped to do, and Ryan shows up, I think they win and it won't be close. 

Edited January 26 by Tank 92

[52520Andrew]

9 minutes ago, Tank 92 said:

You really can't use past tournament history to make any sort of assumptions about this game.

It seems pretty basic. If the Falcons can get pressure on brady which it seems they are well equipped to do, and Ryan shows up, I think they win and it won't be close. 

I agree, especially when different teams are involved

Outside of Beasley, who do the Falcons have to rush the passer? Not seeing how they are well equipped to do so

[Tank 92]

19 minutes ago, 52520Andrew said:

I agree, especially when different teams are involved

Outside of Beasley, who do the Falcons have to rush the passer? Not seeing how they are well equipped to do so

 

Dwight Freeney and Courtney Upshaw!  lol

Don't know much about them, but they seemed to get good pressure on Rogers while working against that top notch O line.

[52520Andrew]

Just now, Tank 92 said:

 

Dwight Freeney and Courtney Upshaw!  lol

Don't know much about them, but they seemed to get good pressure on Rogers while working against that top notch O line.

We will see with Freeney as he has been defying age for a while now

Not that confident in Upshaw though lol

Falcons need to get pressure up the middle though, that is most effective against Brady, get him on the move and flustered. Problem is Brady knows this and he gets the ball out as early as he can with that quick passing game. We were getting great pressure on him in 2014 and he just would get rid of the ball quick during that second half and neutralized it and took advantage of our secondary. Now the Falcons secondary is not that bad but I am not as sold on their pass rushers. 

Also when bringing up the Packers game, Rodgers likes to hold onto the ball for as long as he can which makes it easier to get pressure on him. Sometimes it pays off(like the Adams TD against the Giants or of course the Cook play) and other times it hurts him. Brady is kinda the anti-Rodgers in that regard so the Falcons will have to get creative to get Brady on the move. Good thing for Atlanta is that they will have more room for error due to their offense but it won't be easy.

[Inqui]

1 hour ago, 52520Andrew said:

We will see with Freeney as he has been defying age for a while now

Maybe he and James Harrison are sharing, uh, notes on how to beat Father Time.

[berad]

5 hours ago, Pats said:

We are more well rounded than the falcons in my opinion. Better defense definitely and they are slightly better on offense. I think it goes 30-27 our way.

I tend to agree and I think the big game experience factors in.

The Patriots team is mostly intact - notwithstanding Gronk - something the Falcons haven't faced in the playoffs.

[AsianRice]

I hope the Falcons don't choke, especially Matty ice cuz the Pats come in with lots of SB experiences.....

 

I hope the Falcons stay calm and the play game cuz if they don't, by the time they settle down, it's already over....

[DomMcRaven]

9 hours ago, 52520Andrew said:

My point is that while Denver's offense was great, Seattle had easily the best defense that year and one of the best all time. It wasn't nearly as big a gap as the Atlanta defense vs New England. Compared to a great offense still with New England and an average at best defense from Atlanta, I'd say there is a much bigger gap. You are talking about a fairly even matchup with the 2013 Super Bowl but this is not and the Falcons will have a much harder time limiting the Pats. So while I think it is great to bring that up, I don't see how it has much to do with this current matchup, especially considering Brady put up 28 on largely the same group the next year and the Seahawks blew a 10 point 4th quarter lead. 

Obviously coaching is key, but so is talent. ATL's defense aren't full of scrubs, but that talent on SEA's defense? Sheesh it ain't even close. 

Now pertaining to the following Super Bowl, I believe the Hawks secondary had injuries all across the board. Lane was taken out of the game and the 3 members of the LoB had some sort of leg injury (IIRC). That I believe played a big role in them blowing that lead.

[BmoreBird22]

16 hours ago, 52520Andrew said:

The 2013 Seattle defense is one of the greatest defenses of all time. The Falcons defense is 25th in yards allowed and 27th in points per game for this year. That is a pretty big jump. I like Quinn too but don't try to compare this defense to one of the best all time and don't try to tell me the Pats offense is at a level similar to this Falcons defense.

They pretty much have everything except QB. Imagine if they had taken Carr in 2014 instead of Su'a Filo

I think a very large reason for the poor rankings is that the large majority of their starters are still on their rookie deals with several in year one or two. I think that was largely inexperience.

This defense went out there and shutdown Aaron Rodgers and the Packers, at full strength on offense receiver wise, for over three quarters. For three quarters, the NFL's most talented quarterback in NFL history was shutdown.

[BmoreBird22]

13 hours ago, Pats said:

We are more well rounded than the falcons in my opinion. Better defense definitely and they are slightly better on offense. I think it goes 30-27 our way.

I think that defense is vastly overrated and about to meet it's match.

The list of offenses that the Patriots played pales in comparison to Atlanta. The Patriots have yet to meet an offense even half of what Atlanta is.

[Pats]

1 hour ago, BmoreBird22 said:

I think that defense is vastly overrated and about to meet it's match.

The list of offenses that the Patriots played pales in comparison to Atlanta. The Patriots have yet to meet an offense even half of what Atlanta is.

True, but let's not forget Kansas city put 29 on them and beat them on the road during the season themselves. I've already conceded that I think this will be a shootout.

9 hours ago, berad said:

I tend to agree and I think the big game experience factors in.

The Patriots team is mostly intact - notwithstanding Gronk - something the Falcons haven't faced in the playoffs.

Yeah, this kind of reminds me of our 2003 game against the panthers ina ll honesty. I think it will be the 2nd and last good game of this mediocre playoffs.

[Inqui]

1 hour ago, Pats said:

True, but let's not forget Kansas city put 29 on them and beat them on the road during the season themselves. I've already conceded that I think this will be a shootout.

Yeah, this kind of reminds me of our 2003 game against the panthers ina ll honesty. I think it will be the 2nd and last good game of this mediocre playoffs.

I can't say I blame you for being in a good mood.

Edited January 27 by Inqui

[BmoreBird22]

3 hours ago, Pats said:

True, but let's not forget Kansas city put 29 on them and beat them on the road during the season themselves. I've already conceded that I think this will be a shootout.

Yeah, this kind of reminds me of our 2003 game against the panthers ina ll honesty. I think it will be the 2nd and last good game of this mediocre playoffs.

Circumstances are a little different because 16 points came directly from ST/DEF. 

[JO_75]

Forget about defenses for a bit, because the Super Bowl may have just been decided based on the color of the jerseys. The Atlanta Falcons have chosen to wear their Red Home Uniforms for the big game. Meaning the Patriots are wearing their "Lucky" White jerseys. Now this is where if you believe in stats the game favors Brady and BB getting a fifth championship. 

11 of the Last 12 Super Bowl Champions have worn WHITE... as I said the Falcons are going with their RED home uniform color. The only time this didn't happen was Super Bowl 45 when the Packers wore their Green Home Jerseys and beat the Steelers. Though there have been 2 previous Super Bowls in Houston where the team wearing White... loss both times. Super Bowl 8, the Vikings wore white and loss to the Dolphins. Panthers wore white in Super Bowl 38 and loss to the Patriots.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/2017-super-bowl-uniforms-patriots-get-lucky-white-jerseys-after-falcons-go-red/

 

Edited January 27 by JO_75

[RaineV1]

Since Freeney is a former long time Colt he could put everything he has left into this game just for the sake of beating the Patriots. I think this game is largely going to come down to the Falcons WRs. The Patriots' defense is very good at taking away the top option on other teams and forcing the 2nd, and 3rd Wrs to beat them. So either the other WRs of the Falcons need to step up, or Julio Jones needs to just be able to counter anything Belichick has planned.

[52520Andrew]

11 hours ago, DomMcRaven said:

Obviously coaching is key, but so is talent. ATL's defense aren't full of scrubs, but that talent on SEA's defense? Sheesh it ain't even close. 

Now pertaining to the following Super Bowl, I believe the Hawks secondary had injuries all across the board. Lane was taken out of the game and the 3 members of the LoB had some sort of leg injury (IIRC). That I believe played a big role in them blowing that lead.

Yeah people bring that up about our own defense all the time around here lol

Yeah the injuries are a good point, I thought Seattle had a good blueprint to beat them that year with the press coverage and some nice pass rush, especially with Bennett who played out of his mind that game. I don't think Atlanta has those type of horses up front though and I think people are really underrating the Pats O-line which has taken a huge step forward from where it was the past few years. No Gronk helps though as well but Edelman will be tough for them to cover.

[52520Andrew]

9 hours ago, BmoreBird22 said:

I think a very large reason for the poor rankings is that the large majority of their starters are still on their rookie deals with several in year one or two. I think that was largely inexperience.

This defense went out there and shutdown Aaron Rodgers and the Packers, at full strength on offense receiver wise, for over three quarters. For three quarters, the NFL's most talented quarterback in NFL history was shutdown.

Yeah don't get me wrong, I like Quinn and a lot of their guys but I don't see the talent in the secondary or up front to shut the Pats down. I think the Pats will get their points.

As for the Packers game, I don't think Nelson or Adams were at full strength and the Packers had a lot of injuries on the O-line during the game which really threw them off. Plus the Packers made a lot of dumb mistakes like Crosby missing a field goal and Ripkowski fumbling inside the 10. Those could have easily changed the game and instead it was 17-0 just like that. I think it was one of those game where the Packers just couldn't get anything to go right. Now Atlanta definitely deserves credit because it was a great game from the defense but I think a lot of that was the Packers shooting themselves in the foot and wasting another year of Rodger's prime. 

[52520Andrew]

9 hours ago, BmoreBird22 said:

I think that defense is vastly overrated and about to meet it's match.

The list of offenses that the Patriots played pales in comparison to Atlanta. The Patriots have yet to meet an offense even half of what Atlanta is.

Yeah I think the Pats defense isn't as good as their ranking. They have some good players sure but I think Atlanta will score their points as there isn't one player you can take away and limit the offense. Not to mention I think the Pats will need to double Julio with Butler if they want a chance and that should open it up for their other guys.

One other thing I think could be big is not having Jamie Collins as the Falcons RB are both good catching the ball and I don't see a guy like Hightower keeping up with them in coverage. 

Not to mention the Falcons O-line being good throughout and Ryan playing at a great level in these playoffs. I think unless the pressure gets to Atlanta that they will score points. The best chance for the Pats is to limit them as best they can and I don't think it will be easy. Bill is one heck of a coach though so given 2 weeks we will see what he can come up with. I have seen some great game planning from that team before.

[Pats]

10 hours ago, Inqui said:

I can't say I blame you for being in a good mood.

Well if pats weren't in the SB my interest would be completely gone. I can enjoy football playoffs even if my team isn't in it. But not with the quality of these games.

[usmccharles]

On ‎1‎/‎23‎/‎2017 at 4:24 PM, Swift 1 said:

There might be a jail term involved. LOL

 

1st offense is a misdemeanor, 2nd is a felony

[PurpleCity5]

On 1/26/2017 at 4:58 AM, 52520Andrew said:

My point is that while Denver's offense was great, Seattle had easily the best defense that year and one of the best all time. It wasn't nearly as big a gap as the Atlanta defense vs New England. Compared to a great offense still with New England and an average at best defense from Atlanta, I'd say there is a much bigger gap. You are talking about a fairly even matchup with the 2013 Super Bowl but this is not and the Falcons will have a much harder time limiting the Pats. So while I think it is great to bring that up, I don't see how it has much to do with this current matchup, especially considering Brady put up 28 on largely the same group the next year and the Seahawks blew a 10 point 4th quarter lead. 

Denver's offense wasn't just great, it was all-time great. They were top 3 all time in 3 category's, PPG,  First downs per game, and YPG. Tied for first in 50 point games and since 1990 in total points scored, the 2013 Denver Broncos were/are #1 in the league. and had they won that SB, they would have been agreed upon by many as the greatest offense ever. That takes a whole lot of game-planning and scheming to stop. Also, that same season the Patriots beat the Seahawks, Denver nearly did as well at Century link with them not even being able to get the ball back in OT.

I don't think this Patriots defense is as good as some make it to be. Don't get me wrong, it's a good defense but I wouldn't put it in the elite category. I think they're very dependent on scheme and game-planning given the lack of All-Pro(Even Pro Bowl) talent on that defense. Also, when addressing their #1 opponents PPG, I honestly have to say that their stat is pretty inflated given the severe lack of elite or upper echelon of NFL offenses they played. I would not put Buffalo, New York Jets, or Miami near that category. They played 6 of the bottom ten teams in the lowest PPG category which consists of LA Rams, Cleveland Browns, NY Jets, Houston Texans, Cincinnati Bengals and San Francisco 49ers. Denver and Baltimore themselves weren't exactly great scoring offenses coming in at 20 and 21st respectively. The only team they played within the top ten in scoring PPG was Arizona and we know how their season went down. I can't give them credit for limiting Pitt to 17 without Big Ben in the game honestly. To their credit Buffalo is 10th in scoring PPG, but that's a very inconsistent offense that shouldn't even be mentioned in the same breath of the top offenses. 

Seattle comes in at 17th and they had a very poor showing their defensively, then Miami at 19th. Meanwhile, their SB opponent, Atlanta Falcons were #1 in the league putting up an insane 34.4 PPG. 

All of the great SB Defenses all have one thing in common, they can rush the passer and NE isn't really great at that. While ATL isn't great at that either, they have someone who can consistently do it in Vic Beasley. I understand Bill is going to come up with something and surprise us, but ATL has someone of a brilliant defensive mind in Dan Quinn who knows how to limit(Not stop) top NFL offenses.