[News] Joe Flacco, Dennis Pitta Don't Foresee Change At Offensive Coordinator

[The Beak]

marty the wig is so incompetent, he knows only to pass pass pass, we need a RAVEN style OC run first punch you in the mouth type guy, not the puussies we have on staff now

[Maurice0094]

  38 minutes ago, Maurice0094 said:

Ray Lewis used to get defensive coordinators head coaching jobs and Joe Flacco now get offensive coordinators pink slips.....with that being said it will be funny to see what OC we hire. I am interested to see if they go after Mike McCoy or Anthony Lynn? Dean Pees needs to keep a look out too because Rex is probably never going to get a HC job again which might lend to him coming back to B'more with Ed Reed as his secondary coach.

Really??? OK. Not seeing Rex coming back here at all. Leslie Frazier is our secondary's coach, and has drastically improved those guys. I think the article says that they don't believe we are changing OC's at all. It appears that all of the Monday Morning GM's have their opinions as usual, but the real front office has others. But I'm just guessing that the folks here just seem to know more than they do.

Drastically really?? The same secondary that gets fried against good qb's and the average ones? The point that i was making was OC has been changed in fact because Trestman was fired and the interim Marty didn't do that well either keep the job. I Prefer Tuesday Morning GM BTW.

[RavenManiac#7]

I'm far from alone in thinking that not making a change at OC would be a HUGE mistake. Of course, the only one who's opinion matters is Mr. Steve Biscotti. I can only hope, and pray, that for the good of his team he mandates to Harbaugh if, in fact, he even keeps Him on board that he replace both his OC and his DC. Indeed, I think that our owner should make it a requirement of Harbaugh for him to have Any chance as returning as our HC. Actually, I think both the short, and long, term interests of the team would be best served by making a clean sweep of our coaching staff by replacing all three of these men. Poor Joe. Having to endure yet another change in his OC isn't idea, but I believe that the best interests of the team require it. Here's to hoping Mr. Bisciotti comes to the same conclusion.

[Rat]

Reference Joe's comments.....my thoughts about this year to Joe about our OC are simple... You weren't asked because the problem is the "man in your mirror".....that is and has been our teams problem on offense.

[RavenManiac#7]

  2 hours ago, law215 said:

Marty should not return in any capacity. Joe has not develop since his been his QB coach and the offense stinks.

Yanda's response makes me believe no one, including himself, challenges the coaches on anything.

I hope so too, when's the likely timeframe of when we'll know?

  1 hour ago, jsarrocohome@yahoo.com said:

Harbaughs been HC for 9 years 1 Division title the first job of head coach win your Division 1 in 9 not very good that's the bottom line

He won 2, 2011 and 2012, also went 12-4 in 2010. Not many coaches have 10 playoff wins, Marvin Lewis has more division titles is he better?

Yes, I think that he is.

[RavenManiac#7]

but we need new coaches if they don't fire these guys we will be siting in the same position next year fire john dean marty and start from scratch thats the only way we ever win another super bowl please steve fire them for the greater good of this team

Here, Here! AMEN!

[RavenManiac#7]

  1 hour ago, DENNYK said:

Just thinking of how stubborn Harbaugh can be and you can bet that he will stand behind keeping Marty and Dean as his coordinators. It will be interesting to see what really goes down next week at the State of The Ravens meeting with Steve B. I would think that he is not going to be receptive to sitting pat on the present coaching staff. We need to jettison some players that cannot step their game up too. We all know who they are. I am losing my faith in Joe Cool too. He just seems so disinterested in the games now. No fire and after all, he has the SB ring, the money and many team records. Time to begin planning on his replacement and drafting for the future QB of this team.

If no changes are made harbaugh will be going down with a sinking ship Bill Belicheck got rid of pees because his defense couldn't hold leads late and marty was fired from the jets for not knowing how to call agame

And nothing seems to have changed with either Pees Or Marty.

[The Greek]

harbs knows he is on the hot seat so if he feels he can win with marty and dean than that is his decision and he should also be prepared for his ship to sink and be out after 2017. jmo

[hen826957]

Ray Lewis used to get defensive coordinators head coaching jobs and Joe Flacco now get offensive coordinators pink slips.....with that being said it will be funny to see what OC we hire. I am interested to see if they go after Mike McCoy or Anthony Lynn? Dean Pees needs to keep a look out too because Rex is probably never going to get a HC job again which might lend to him coming back to B'more with Ed Reed as his secondary coach.

It's a shame that it seems like Ray Lewis is the Ravens meaning without Ray there no Ravens anymore if you know what l'm saying. It it might be stupid but it just me.

[whobilly]

  1 hour ago, OUravensfan said:

  3 hours ago, law215 said:

Marty should not return in any capacity. Joe has not develop since his been his QB coach and the offense stinks.

Yanda's response makes me believe no one, including himself, challenges the coaches on anything.

I hope so too, when's the likely timeframe of when we'll know?

  2 hours ago, jsarrocohome@yahoo.com said:

Harbaughs been HC for 9 years 1 Division title the first job of head coach win your Division 1 in 9 not very good that's the bottom line

He won 2, 2011 and 2012, also went 12-4 in 2010. Not many coaches have 10 playoff wins, Marvin Lewis has more division titles is he better?

Yes, I think that he is.

Thank God you're not making coaching decisions. Marvin Lewis? Is it because he has accomplished so much in the playoffs or is there another reason?

[Drinkmore Beer]

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing time after time and expecting a different result.

[Crusader]

Ever since 2013 this team became a freaking mess. Ravens always had a winning season after even an 8-8 season. Not since 1996 to 1998 have they had so many 8-8 or below records in a row. My three reasons Joe's contract, Ozzie draft picks, and Johns play calls.

[RavenManiac#7]

Of course JF and DP dont see any change coming. Sundays game was all about setting franchise marks and getting stats. This team has abandon the running game way to much. Flacco is not an elite Qb to be having 40+ attempts per game he shines at 25 to 30 with the running backs get 20+ carriers to setup play action and bootlegs but enough on him. I have said this for years and will say it again JH is a terrible at challenges,decisions,game planning and half time adjustments. We had players like Q,Ray and Ed helping with adjustments that made Harbaugh look good. Those players are gone and goes to show JH looks lost as a head coach. Kub helped while he was here 2 Hc was better than 1 mentality was the key for that 1 season. IMO we need to replace both coordinators and possible the HC. Pees has always been terrible and for the top 5 defense we had look at our opponents offense over a 16 game season the ones that had a legit offenses schooled our so call top 5 defense. I really hope Steve looks at all these comments from fans and the media and make the right decision to move this once winning franchise back to top level

Absolutely, wholeheartedly agree!

[RavenManiac#7]

Now that's a damn shame !
We get a couple fast receivers and they give up on the long ball !
We get a couple very promising running backs and they give up on the run !
All the Dinking and dunking to get us to less than the 1st down marker, hasn't worked either ! Flacco is no Tom Brady !
I mean what's Joe in his 8th year and still throwing off his back foot ?

I absolutely agree. Poor coaching decisions, and Joe shows definite signs of actually regressing as opposed to improving. Sad state of affairs and not at all conducive to improvement. The ball's in your court Mr. Bisciotti. The future of our team is directly in your hands and the decisions you make will determine our fate in both the short and long term.

[RavenManiac#7]

  14 hours ago, Minionhunter said:

For everyone that is panning Ozzie, I really think you need to look at turnover in the scouting staff. It has been plundered of all the most valuable talent, so much so that it may have compromised the ability of Ozzie to get it right. I think that this would be an awesome research article for Hensley or Zerbiac to tackle.

I agree Minionhunter.  Also, I think Harbs has increasingly had more influence over the draft in the last five yrs or so, which may point to the ineffectiveness of our latest draft classes.

I posted this in another thread that I think is worth taking a second look:

"I posed the question I did earlier in the thread about how much impact Harbs actually has in the overall draft process.  When I was reading and researching to find out as much as I could about how our draft strategy works and who is the most influential I went back as far as I could so that I could see if there had been any major trends and/or shifts in our draft strategy, especially since Harbs arrived to see if our recent down trend in the last five years or so could be traced to Harbs' influence.  Personally, I thought there had been and from what I read it would seem to indicate that this could be possible.

Here are some of the better sources I read that can give you good insight into our draft process and how it has evolved through the years, and you and others can draw your own conclusions:

2009:  http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/19/sports/football/19ravens.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

2013:  http://grantland.com/features/bill-barnwell-baltimore-consistent-winning/

2013:  http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000212663/printable/whos-ireallyi-in-charge-afc-north-hierarchies-run-the-gamut

2016:  http://russellstreetreport.com/2016/02/01/lombardis-way/a-shift-in-the-ravens-war-room/

2016:  http://russellstreetreport.com/2016/10/18/lombardis-way/the-heat-is-on-for-harbaugh/

Here are two good articles that let you know about Harbs' philosophies:

2014:  http://www.ncregister.com/daily-news/super-bowl-winning-coach-makes-the-most-of-each-moment

2016:  http://www.ndinsider.com/football/notebook-harry-hiestand-s-influence-pays-draft-dividends/article_f86a17c2-0e81-11e6-b260-a3f63e6e91f8.html

These articles have a lot of similarities and some differences, but they do give a good overall impression as to the draft strategy.  Some folks may be familiar with the sources already, but when read all together they draw a definitive picture. The article from the National Catholic Register which was a Q & A, pretty much sums up Harbs' approach to how he views the draft as evidenced by the quotes below:

"After you got back from Afghanistan, you went to the NFL Combine in Indianapolis. Is the combine really necessary? Do you get to learn things about players that you didn’t already know?

At the combine, the scouts are mostly rounding out their knowledge of players they’ve already studied a lot. However, coaches are a different story, since we are just beginning the evaluation process on this draft class. Coaches can learn a great deal by seeing the players up close at the combine. We start with that information and build on it up until the draft in May.

"You didn’t need to look for any kickers, did you?

No, certainly not. Justin Tucker is a tremendous kicker and young man. He exemplifies what we look for in players. There’s the obvious necessity of physical strength and skills, but above and beyond those, we look for mental characteristics. Those can make or break a draft pick. Work ethic, decision-making skills and interest in team unity are some of the things that go to make up what we call that “football intelligence.” This outweighs physical qualities 3 to 1."

Very interesting and insightful as to what he values most in a player, I'd say!

I have more questions than answers, lol.   If Ozzie has been so successful with the "right player, right price" mantra that emphasizes the "evaluating and valuing players" strategy so well over his tenure as the Ravens GM, as his drafting and free agency record suggests, then why the dip in the draft over the last five yrs. give or take?  The outlier to that question could point to Harbs.  Once Harbs' won a SB  in accordance with his record, did he feel that gave him more leverage to step in and influence the draft?  If Biscotti wanted the scouts and coaches to work together, unlike they didn't do well under Billick, could it be that Harbs gets the ear of Biscotti more than Ozzie? 

Obviously, something isn't working because this team lacks an identity imho...are we a defensive team or an offensive team...and if offense is it run or pass?  Whatever the issues are, how can you stack a draft board when you don't have a clear vision of what you want the team to be? I would tend to agree with you ellicottraven, let the scouts scout and the coaches coach! This would only be a problem if the coach can't coach the team that is drafted, lol."

Super, and Very insightful post, Grapple. I couldn't agree more. I just hope that Mr. Bisciotti can see just how far down his team has fallen. The need for a major overhaul could not be more obvious. His decisions will go a long way in determining our short and long term future. I have lost all confidence in any chance that we will improve if our owner insists on keeping the stars quo. I honestly think he needs to blow things up for our best chance to begin our climb back to respectiblitiy. What do you think, Mr. Bisciotti?

[RavenManiac#7]

It honestly was not Marty IMO. Flacco is to blame for the lack of audibles when the defense knows exactly which play we are about to run. That starts in practice. That "Joe Cool" slogan also backfires at us. I like that he stays calm in tense situations but I would rather see a QB play with more enthusiasm and determination to win. That means calling audibles and being a vocal leader.

Also, the announcers in almost every game for us have all said the same thing over and over again......."Nobody is getting open". Our receivers having a hard time getting open has also been killing this offense.

I still think that as long as Harbaugh is here this team will continue to be mediocre at best. I said back in 2012 that he took the credit from Ray Lewis. People forget that Harbaugh came the same offseason that we drafted Flacco & Ray Rice. Ray Rice who was the sole reason for us even being in the playoffs. Which I still cannot forgive Ozzie Newsome and Steve Biscotti for. I mean, these guys literally played God by choosing to not give Rice a second chance. But thats another topic. Regardless, all this team needed was a good QB and we got that with Flacco, and also got a beam of light with Ray Rice. Ray Lewis was already the vocal leader, heart & soul, and coach of this team. Harbaugh was just a guy filling in the hole of "Head Coach". Get harbaugh outta here, but do not just bring in any guy. We either need Ray Lewis as HC or an old school, hard nosed, smash mouth football kind of Head Coach. In all serious, if I were Ozzie I would get on the phone and see if Ray is interested in a coaching position.

I strongly agree with nearly everything you posted with the sole exception that I think that Marty deserves more blame than you same content with attributing to him. But, as it pertains to Joe, let me say that I have always been a fan of Joe. In fact, I have only three Ravens jerseys, and his is one of them, along with Ray Lewis and Ed Reed's. But, I played a Lot of highly competitive sports in my lifetime, and I have been described as "the most competitive player I have Ever seen", and "you are the kind of player who would bite a player's eye in order to win a game". Now, of course, that last one was meant tetorically. I would Never bite someone's eye. That was said to make a point. And I was, unquestionably, my team's leader consistently year after year. I was a very vocal one who lead by example. While, I believe, there is something not say about "keeping cool" under Any circumstances one finds himself/herself in every game, I believe that it can, also, be counterproductive if overdone, since it might send the wrong message. Sometimes, some extra fire needs to be encouraged. Now, personal circumstances forced me to give up my dream of playing shortstop in the major leagues, according to the strong opinions of several major league scouts, I, nevertheless, was able to begin playing fast pitch softball at the most competitive level in both Maryland and in National Tournaments. Many, many coaches stated the opinion that I was, br far, the best shortstop in Maryland. I say all this NOT to tout my own horn but, rather, to try to legitimize my opinion as being one that may carry more weight than the average fan's. If whet I read by another poster on this website claiming that Joe was seen laughing boisterously with Big Ben after the Christmas Day game, I'm sorry, but that does not sit well with me. If that truly did happen, then Joe is just NOT competitive enough to suit me as our QB. I know, beyond the shadow of a doubt, that I would NEVER have been able to do Anything like that. You see, as competitive as I was, and am, I, absolutely, Hated losing even more than I Loved winning. That being the case, one would NEVER have found me laughing with my victor after my team failed to win our game against their team. Joe, you need more fire in your belly, plain and simple.

[The Mom Gene]

2 hours ago, Maurice0094 said:

Drastically really?? The same secondary that gets fried against good qb's and the average ones? The point that i was making was OC has been changed in fact because Trestman was fired and the interim Marty didn't do that well either keep the job. I Prefer Tuesday Morning GM BTW.

The numbers are real...

Mornhinweg was promoted from quarterbacks coach in Week 6 after a deflating 16-10 home loss to the Washington Redskins. In his 11 games calling plays, the Ravens averaged 22.6 points per game. That would rank 18^th in the NFL.

Baltimore’s offense got better as the year went on. It moved the ball with more efficiency over the four-game span from Week 13 to Week 16. The Ravens averaged 28.8 points over that period and Flacco turned in some of his best games.

The Ravens threw their way to a 38-point outburst against the Miami Dolphins and had strong showings in New England, versus the Philadelphia Eagles and in Pittsburgh.

 

Just sayin!

[Maurice0094]

  2 hours ago, Maurice0094 said:

Drastically really?? The same secondary that gets fried against good qb's and the average ones? The point that i was making was OC has been changed in fact because Trestman was fired and the interim Marty didn't do that well either keep the job. I Prefer Tuesday Morning GM BTW.

The numbers are real...

Mornhinweg was promoted from quarterbacks coach in Week 6 after a deflating 16-10 home loss to the Washington Redskins. In his 11 games calling plays, the Ravens averaged 22.6 points per game. That would rank 18^th in the NFL.

Baltimore’s offense got better as the year went on. It moved the ball with more efficiency over the four-game span from Week 13 to Week 16. The Ravens averaged 28.8 points over that period and Flacco turned in some of his best games.

The Ravens threw their way to a 38-point outburst against the Miami Dolphins and had strong showings in New England, versus the Philadelphia Eagles and in Pittsburgh.

 

Just sayin!

I didn't see touchdowns I saw checkdowns, Pass to run ratio was horribly one sided, even after OC change. Offensive line was banged up but I didn't see consistency from week to week as that line jelled. Which to me equals another OC.

[Tdot.to.Bmore]

Harbaugh just announced that they are keeping all 3 coordinators this year :s

[The Mom Gene]

6 minutes ago, Maurice0094 said:

I didn't see touchdowns I saw checkdowns, Pass to run ratio was horribly one sided, even after OC change. Offensive line was banged up but I didn't see consistency from week to week as that line jelled. Which to me equals another OC.

So, let's go back to TIME..  It takes time for plays to develop downfield.  TIME which Joe very rarely had.  THAT is why you saw checkdowns.  Because he was consistently being rushed, especially up the middle (which means missed blocks by the Center or RB), and on the right side.  Even the Cincinnati announcers were noting how our receivers didn't have time to get open, and that Joe was rushed.  When the media of the opposing team is saying these things...  you know you have a problem somehwere...  and it isn't always at OC.  7 different OLine configurations in 5 games.  I just finished posting this on another thread..  Once Stanley came back, Yanda moved to LG, it was better.  Lewis never made it back, and the right side was weak at best, always substituting.  Watch a Dallas game and look at the time that Prescott has to make his plays....  Clean pocket almost every play.  THAT is a good O-Line.

[BigUgly]

Harbaugh just announced that they are keeping all 3 coordinators this year :s

Amazing! Harbs is daring Biscuit to fire him sooner than the end of next year. Let's see what transpires after the State of the Ravens presser.

[The Mom Gene]

2 minutes ago, BigUgly said:

Amazing! Harbs is daring Biscuit to fire him sooner than the end of next year. Let's see what transpires after the State of the Ravens presser.

Where did you get this one?  He's not daring anyone to do anything. 

[BigUgly]

  3 minutes ago, BigUgly said:

Amazing! Harbs is daring Biscuit to fire him sooner than the end of next year. Let's see what transpires after the State of the Ravens presser.

Where did you get this one?  He's not daring anyone to do anything. 

By retaining his coordinators, Harbs is basically putting the reason for consistent on-field disappointment squarely on Ozzie. Since we all know the owner finds the teams' performance to be unacceptable, he will determine where to make the change - coaching or talent acquisition. He won't accept the status quo. I think he gives Ozzie the vote of confidence over Harbs in that case.

[Crusader]

Harbaugh just announced that they are keeping all 3 coordinators this year :s

All I can say is good luck with that.

[The Mom Gene]

14 minutes ago, BigUgly said:

By retaining his coordinators, Harbs is basically putting the reason for consistent on-field disappointment squarely on Ozzie. Since we all know the owner finds the teams' performance to be unacceptable, he will determine where to make the change - coaching or talent acquisition. He won't accept the status quo. I think he gives Ozzie the vote of confidence over Harbs in that case.

That doesn't mean he's gonna fire Harbaugh before the end of next season though.  I have to say that I agree with Pitta and Joe to a degree.  We haven't had consistency on this team in these positions since the Super Bowl.  Sometimes the only way to improve isn't always to create a revolving door, "until you get the right person in here", as much as it is to train your people to be the right guy.  Sometimes that takes time and work.  If these guys work that well with this coordinator, and don't want another change, I'd say let's see what that does before we go throwing people under the bus.   If some members here had their way, they'd completely clean house.

[The Beak]

13 minutes ago, The Mom Gene said:

That doesn't mean he's gonna fire Harbaugh before the end of next season though.  I have to say that I agree with Pitta and Joe to a degree.  We haven't had consistency on this team in these positions since the Super Bowl.  Sometimes the only way to improve isn't always to create a revolving door, "until you get the right person in here", as much as it is to train your people to be the right guy.  Sometimes that takes time and work.  If these guys work that well with this coordinator, and don't want another change, I'd say let's see what that does before we go throwing people under the bus.   If some members here had their way, they'd completely clean house.

Yes, I am one of those "members " that wants to completely clean house. I would like to see consistency too, just not consistently bad . Wigs and Pees were fired from other teams because they were bad OCs, harbaugh doesn't have Ray's coattails  to ride on anymore. Steve Bisciotti is a great owner, its time for him to take charge and replace this staff. I bet he will give them 1 more year, so maybe a playoff in 2019. 

[CQ1]

If this joke of an offense (nothing toward Marty, here; he was put in an awkard position to start) continues, etc., you can go blow your Purple smoke to someone else that you think had just fell off the turnip truck. I'm tired of the same old, same old.
I have no issue rooting on someone else, or spending my Ravens related monies elsewhere as well. There is MUCH more in life to focus on that a greedy sport- as they all are becoming

[The Beak]

48 minutes ago, BigUgly said:

Amazing! Harbs is daring Biscuit to fire him sooner than the end of next year. Let's see what transpires after the State of the Ravens presser.

Agree with you , JH never holds anyone directly responsible, Hopefully Steve B sees right through JH and fires him sooner rather than later.

[jravens1313]

BOOOOOOOO

[jravens1313]

  54 minutes ago, BigUgly said:

By retaining his coordinators, Harbs is basically putting the reason for consistent on-field disappointment squarely on Ozzie. Since we all know the owner finds the teams' performance to be unacceptable, he will determine where to make the change - coaching or talent acquisition. He won't accept the status quo. I think he gives Ozzie the vote of confidence over Harbs in that case.

That doesn't mean he's gonna fire Harbaugh before the end of next season though.  I have to say that I agree with Pitta and Joe to a degree.  We haven't had consistency on this team in these positions since the Super Bowl.  Sometimes the only way to improve isn't always to create a revolving door, "until you get the right person in here", as much as it is to train your people to be the right guy.  Sometimes that takes time and work.  If these guys work that well with this coordinator, and don't want another change, I'd say let's see what that does before we go throwing people under the bus.   If some members here had their way, they'd completely clean house.

Problem is Marty throws the ball 40 times a game and doesn't. Joe Flacco will never be successful in that style of offense. It just wears out our defense and they eventually breakdown.