Who/What Was the #1 Top Reason For Missing Playoffs?

[PurpleCity5]

I know one guy going down to injury shouldn't ruin your season but we badly missed what Jimmy Smith gave us. 

• Jimmy Smith was the 10th ranked CB with a passer rating of 68.5 allowed. 
• Jimmy Smith was only targeted 5.5 times per game.
• Smith very rarely allowed big plays with 9.48 yards per catch, lowest among #1 CBs. 
• Players in Jimmy's coverage had a catch rate of 45%, 2nd lowest among #1 CBs 

When Jimmy goes out, that breaks down our entire defensive coverage. Pees needs to drop more guys back in coverage, that being Orr/Judon/Smith/Mosley, then he's forced to play more cover 2/single high safety coverage so he doesn't get beat on the back end. Then that moves Jarraud Powers and Shareece Wright to the #1 and #3 spots respectively and they did not have good games at all when forced to that roll. 

We're going to need a healthy Jimmy Smith next year if we want to contend. Our defense broke down twice without him, getting depth there will be important but without him we suffered badly. 

 

Edited January 19 by PurpleCity5

[OLD SCHOOL SMASH BALL]

On 1/8/2017 at 1:37 PM, SuperBowl84 said:

They always say does prevent defense only prevent you from winning, haha.

After watching these playoff games, the better receivers just torch these zone defenses. Its a wonder why a lot of defenses keep doing it. You would think if you HAVE to play zone, there might be some alternate version you could try to get one of your 5 defenders 10 feet away from the open receiver to slam some kind of tighter coverage or something, these better receivers just sit in the soft spots constantly and wreak havoc, just looks too easy to beat.

[codizzle]

Joe flacco 

6.42 YPA is lowest in NFL history when passer goes over 4K

that and Jimmy smith were the reasons Ravens weren't in foxboro last week 

 

 

[usmccharles]

On 1/19/2017 at 11:06 AM, PurpleCity5 said:

I know one guy going down to injury shouldn't ruin your season but we badly missed what Jimmy Smith gave us. 

• Jimmy Smith was the 10th ranked CB with a passer rating of 68.5 allowed. 
• Jimmy Smith was only targeted 5.5 times per game.
• Smith very rarely allowed big plays with 9.48 yards per catch, lowest among #1 CBs. 
• Players in Jimmy's coverage had a catch rate of 45%, 2nd lowest among #1 CBs 

When Jimmy goes out, that breaks down our entire defensive coverage. Pees needs to drop more guys back in coverage, that being Orr/Judon/Smith/Mosley, then he's forced to play more cover 2/single high safety coverage so he doesn't get beat on the back end. Then that moves Jarraud Powers and Shareece Wright to the #1 and #3 spots respectively and they did not have good games at all when forced to that roll. 

We're going to need a healthy Jimmy Smith next year if we want to contend. Our defense broke down twice without him, getting depth there will be important but without him we suffered badly. 

 

Do you (or anyone) have the capabilities to see the stats of passes attempted/passes completed with total yards and TDs for the entire season?

[PurpleCity5]

4 hours ago, usmccharles said:

Do you (or anyone) have the capabilities to see the stats of passes attempted/passes completed with total yards and TDs for the entire season?

I don't, but some people here have have PFF and other various subscriptions. 

Edited January 25 by PurpleCity5

[Tank 92]

9 hours ago, codizzle said:

Joe flacco 

6.42 YPA is lowest in NFL history when passer goes over 4k

Don't you think a part of this is a function of receivers not getting YAC?  Seems Pittta was sliding, falling on pretty much every ball he caught. While I recall Wallace sometimes running downfield, can't remember Smitty getting much. Don't get me wrong, I know Joe was part of the problem, but seems it was exasperated by lack of YAC. 

I know I must be missing something here, but don't see why team average yardage of pass doesn't equal team average yards of reception. Also interesting that opponents average was 6.8 yds(?).

http://www.espn.com/nfl/team/stats/_/name/bal/baltimore-ravens

Edited January 25 by Tank 92

[VermontRaven]

4 hours ago, Tank 92 said:

Don't you think a part of this is a function of receivers not getting YAC?  Seems Pittta was sliding, falling on pretty much every ball he caught. While I recall Wallace sometimes running downfield, can't remember Smitty getting much. Don't get me wrong, I know Joe was part of the problem, but seems it was exasperated by lack of YAC. 

I know I must be missing something here, but don't see why team average yardage of pass doesn't equal team average yards of reception. Also interesting that opponents average was 6.8 yds(?).

http://www.espn.com/nfl/team/stats/_/name/bal/baltimore-ravens

I think the average yardage per pass includes incompletions and completions.  Avg. yardage per RECEPTION only counts completed passes.

[Tank 92]

45 minutes ago, VermontRaven said:

I think the average yardage per pass includes incompletions and completions.  Avg. yardage per RECEPTION only counts completed passes.

ahhh.......I see said the blind man as he picked up his hammer and saw.  Makes sense.

[AsianRice]

JIMMY SMITH....

 

we better draft or trade to get a another shut down corner!....

[redrum52]

12 hours ago, AsianRice said:

JIMMY SMITH....

 

we better draft or trade to get a another shut down corner!....

Like top wide outs they don't grow on trees.  Would rather draft a cb and trade for a wr.

[PurpleCity5]

2 minutes ago, redrum52 said:

Like top wide outs they don't grow on trees.  Would rather draft a cb and trade for a wr.

I wouldn't be hard press for an elite CB because of how expensive and how hard they are to get. If I'm the Ravens I'm just looking for someone who doesn't get beat. Don't let up the big plays and don't be a bum in coverage. Doesn't have to be a play-maker and doesn't have to be a superstar or anything of that nature, just someone who doesn't get beat play after play. That's the type of #2 CB I'm looking for. 

[redrum52]

19 minutes ago, PurpleCity5 said:

I wouldn't be hard press for an elite CB because of how expensive and how hard they are to get. If I'm the Ravens I'm just looking for someone who doesn't get beat. Don't let up the big plays and don't be a bum in coverage. Doesn't have to be a play-maker and doesn't have to be a superstar or anything of that nature, just someone who doesn't get beat play after play. That's the type of #2 CB I'm looking for. 

Same

[Tank 92]

1 hour ago, PurpleCity5 said:

I wouldn't be hard press for an elite CB because of how expensive and how hard they are to get. If I'm the Ravens I'm just looking for someone who doesn't get beat. Don't let up the big plays and don't be a bum in coverage. Doesn't have to be a play-maker and doesn't have to be a superstar or anything of that nature, just someone who doesn't get beat play after play. That's the type of #2 CB I'm looking for. 

Problem is we don't really have a #1 CB that can be depended upon. I hate to be pessimistic but it seems it's not a matter of whether Smith will miss more games but when and how many. If I'm the Ravens' FO I'm working off of lessons learned and planning for his replacement. The immediate underlying issue is Jimmy's huge cap number for 2017 that kind of ties their hands. Do they restructure again with the hopes that he is going to have a reversal of fortune at some point?  IDK

[PurpleCity5]

16 minutes ago, Tank 92 said:

Problem is we don't really have a #1 CB that can be depended upon. I hate to be pessimistic but it seems it's not a matter of whether Smith will miss more games but when and how many. If I'm the Ravens' FO I'm working off of lessons learned and planning for his replacement. The immediate underlying issue is Jimmy's huge cap number for 2017 that kind of ties their hands. Do they restructure again with the hopes that he is going to have a reversal of fortune at some point?  IDK

You don't have a choice but to rely on Smith to play those games for you 2017 and be a #1 CB due to the money that you're paying him. I don't think his cap hit and absent cap savings can actually allow you to function as if he isn't on the roster. Furthermore the collapsed we suffered on defense with him out shows you that you have to rely on him more than ever. I think the Ravens should focus more on finding someone alongside Smith than someone to replace him. 

You can restructure, but he can easily turn the Ravens away and there won't be much they can say about it. He knows what he's worth and the Ravens do to. With the way our defense has played without him, it might be bold thing to say to a few people here but that cap hit is worth it if that's what they are without him. 

 

Edited January 26 by PurpleCity5

[Tank 92]

2 minutes ago, PurpleCity5 said:

You don't have a choice but to rely on Smith to play those games for you 2017 and be a #1 CB due to the money that you're paying him. I don't think his cap hit and absent cap savings can actually allow you to function as if he isn't on the roster. Furthermore the collapsed we suffered on defense with him out shows you that you have to rely on him more than ever. I think the Ravens should focus more on finding someone alongside Smith than someone to replace him. 

You can restructure, but he can easily turn the Ravens away and there won't be much there can say about it. He knows what he's worth and the Ravens do to. With the way our defense has played without him, it might be bold thing to say to a few people here but that cap hit is worth it if that's what they are without him. 

 

While Jimmy is a talented player, his importance to the performance of the D was amplified by the lack of quality depth at CB. There simply wasn't anyone to step up and fill the gap created by his absence. They thought Wright was that guy but we know how that worked out. 

I think you're right that they plan for a complementary player to play beside him, but also plan for depth to step up when Smith goes down. The fall off just can't be as great as it was and I don't think they will ignore what that meant last year. Hope for the best, plan for the worst. But as you point out, they kicked the can down the road with him and that huge 2017 cap number somewhat limits the options. 

Don't want to ignore Tavon in these scenarios either. While it seems that his size limits him a bit, I think he will be more than capable to fill in the #2 role in the future. His limitations were exposed last year, but another year's experience and better play from his counterpart on the outside should do wonders for his performance. I'm sure the plan is for him to play the slot, but you have to think he will improve with time and be an option on the outside as well. 

[nextgen_RavensFan]

I know it sounds irrational but i wish  with players that based money on playing time like an incentive. I know it sounds cruel as you cannot help but get hurt at some point in the NFL but when you are an impact player and you are off of the field the team suffers so the end product is not as good. So compensation back to the team for not being on the field would be awesome. 

[PurpleCity5]

10 hours ago, Tank 92 said:

While Jimmy is a talented player, his importance to the performance of the D was amplified by the lack of quality depth at CB. There simply wasn't anyone to step up and fill the gap created by his absence. They thought Wright was that guy but we know how that worked out. 

I think you're right that they plan for a complementary player to play beside him, but also plan for depth to step up when Smith goes down. The fall off just can't be as great as it was and I don't think they will ignore what that meant last year. Hope for the best, plan for the worst. But as you point out, they kicked the can down the road with him and that huge 2017 cap number somewhat limits the options. 

Don't want to ignore Tavon in these scenarios either. While it seems that his size limits him a bit, I think he will be more than capable to fill in the #2 role in the future. His limitations were exposed last year, but another year's experience and better play from his counterpart on the outside should do wonders for his performance. I'm sure the plan is for him to play the slot, but you have to think he will improve with time and be an option on the outside as well. 

The guys they had behind him certainly didn't help, but lets not forget that for the first half of the season, this was a secondary that was ranked in the top 5 statistically, I think at their peak they were #3 statistically speaking. Shareece Wright was having bad games even with Jimmy in the line up, most notably Oakland and Jacksonville, he was benched after and the team still put a secondary that can be argued as a top 5 secondary overall. The fact that the Ravens didn't have good play at all at #2 and were still holding it down against the passing game speaks for Jimmy's worth. Credit to Weddle and Webb for fantastic play in the backfield but they couldn't save this secondary when Jimmy went out. 

As far as a complimentary guy goes to step up in Jimmy's absence, that's fine but if you're the Ravens then I think you hope that Jimmy can play a full season for you. He's too good of a player and talent that you have to rely upon him. I posted some statistics up above of what the Ravens had with Jimmy in the line up and it just shows what the guy can do for you. As I said, taking the cap number I have into account and what we lost with him, I can honestly say that cap number that we're taking from him is worth it if that's his value. 

I like Tavon as well, he was a guy who played bigger than his size in College but against guys like Dez Bryant and Branden LaFell, he wasn't really beaten by extraordinary route running or burnt in any manner, he was beaten by being physically taken to school. I think Young has to prove that he can match up with bigger receivers in the future. He might have to put on more weight. Chris Harris Jr(And I'm only comparing them in terms of size) is not the biggest CB out there but he's pretty damn strong at 200 LBs and allows opposing receivers to beat him by height.  

 Harbaugh said this and I agree, the Ravens need two things at CB, Jimmy Smith to be healthy and another CB. 

 

[Jonah DeVito]

On 1/19/2017 at 2:06 PM, PurpleCity5 said:

I know one guy going down to injury shouldn't ruin your season but we badly missed what Jimmy Smith gave us. 

• Jimmy Smith was the 10th ranked CB with a passer rating of 68.5 allowed. 
• Jimmy Smith was only targeted 5.5 times per game.
• Smith very rarely allowed big plays with 9.48 yards per catch, lowest among #1 CBs. 
• Players in Jimmy's coverage had a catch rate of 45%, 2nd lowest among #1 CBs 

When Jimmy goes out, that breaks down our entire defensive coverage. Pees needs to drop more guys back in coverage, that being Orr/Judon/Smith/Mosley, then he's forced to play more cover 2/single high safety coverage so he doesn't get beat on the back end. Then that moves Jarraud Powers and Shareece Wright to the #1 and #3 spots respectively and they did not have good games at all when forced to that roll. 

We're going to need a healthy Jimmy Smith next year if we want to contend. Our defense broke down twice without him, getting depth there will be important but without him we suffered badly. 

 

Can someone tell me how, with these stats, Jimmy is still so underrated. When healthy I honestly think he's our best player on defense. 

[rmcjacket23]

9 minutes ago, Jonah DeVito said:

Can someone tell me how, with these stats, Jimmy is still so underrated. When healthy I honestly think he's our best player on defense. 

Don't think he's the best player on defense, but I think he's unquestionably the most valuable at this point.

I think the only other player you could argue is more valuable at this point is Weddle, and we don't know what our defense looks like without Weddle. We know what it looks like without Jimmy, and its not nearly as good.

[PurpleCity5]

1 hour ago, Jonah DeVito said:

Can someone tell me how, with these stats, Jimmy is still so underrated. When healthy I honestly think he's our best player on defense. 

Our best player on defense? You can make the argument, I know Weddle and Mosley were amazing. He certainly proved that he was very valuable to this team. Makes me happy to see the Jimmy trolls vanish. 

[terrynjulia03]

Personally in the 1st if Hooker is off the board, highly likely, than I want Humphrey from Bama. The absolute breakdown of the D when we only had 1 corner out there(Young) just shows we need another guy. Move Young to the slot. 

[JoeyFlex5]

41 minutes ago, terrynjulia03 said:

Personally in the 1st if Hooker is off the board, highly likely, than I want Humphrey from Bama. The absolute breakdown of the D when we only had 1 corner out there(Young) just shows we need another guy. Move Young to the slot. 

there are other corners at 16, marlon humphrey is a project and pretty risky to hinge our secondarys future on. might i suggest you look at quincy wilson, sidney jones, tre'davious white, and marshon lattimore(lattimore likely wont be there but hes the stud corner of the class)

[Swift 1]

Can I blame the NFL . They devised a system to punish all talented teams. The make the best team draft last in every round. They manufactured a pay system here the winners  could only have a payroll the same as the losers. Do you think they did all that to punish Baltimore? Do you think he NFL likes you guys calling  8 and 8 mediocre when thats what they  have been striving for since day one. I am sorry for being Capt Obvious but it gets a little hard to keep reading that the Ravens din not do this and Ravens did not do that,. 

PS I know the NFL  has not had much influence on the Pats or the Browns but they are working on it Look at Jacksonville and the Raiders/

Edited January 29 by Swift 1

[RavenManiac#7]

There were many reasons, of course, but #1...John Harbaugh. He has so many deficiencies as a HC that they're too numerous to list. But, I'll just sum it up by saying that his boneheaded decisions cost us several wins this year. That just doesn't happen when you have a good HC. His bad decisions have only continued even After the season as we now know that both our inept OC and DC will be coming back along with John next year. Obviously, what I would have done about it is to fire him and find a better HC. Harbaugh's early success is Not due to his abilities as a HC. He just rode the coattails of Ray Lewis. Now that Ray's gone, Harbs is showing just how lacking his skills as a HC are. Just one fan's opinion.

[Adreme]

On the field Ray was a liability the year they won the Super Bowl.

If the Ravens were dumb enough to fire him he would have his pick of coaching vacancies to choose from because the league knows what a lot of people here miss and that is that John is a top 5 head coach who is a master at getting the most out of his players every week.

Edited January 31 by Adreme

[frozen joe flacco fan]

On ‎1‎/‎30‎/‎2017 at 1:51 PM, Adreme said:

On the field Ray was a liability the year they won the Super Bowl.

If the Ravens were dumb enough to fire him he would have his pick of coaching vacancies to choose from because the league knows what a lot of people here miss and that is that John is a top 5 head coach who is a master at getting the most out of his players every week.

I find your post amusing. While Ray was not playing at full strength the year we won the Super Bowl and was certainly past his peak, he was an inspiration to his teammates on and off the field. That's an intangible. His leadership and inspiration was highly motivational for the team and they rode the crest of an emotional wave to and thru the SB.

As for John getting the most out of his players every week, he did just the opposite this year. Most of our fan base assumed we would be in the playoffs in 2016 and predicted a winning season. The team under-achieved this year and he failed miserably to get the most out of his players in the last four weeks of the season when our record was 1-3. With our destiny in our own hands and a record of 8-6 at the time, he failed to get the most out of his players in the last two weeks of the season. The truth is this. John Harbaugh and Mike Tomlin are good cheerleaders but neither is a Top Five coach. I disagree that he would have his pick of NFL head coaching positions if he left the Ravens. Jim Harbaugh wasn't in big demand when he left the Niners. He might have his pick of cheerleading squads though.

[usmccharles]

5 minutes ago, frozen joe flacco fan said:

I find your post amusing. While Ray was not playing at full strength the year we won the Super Bowl and was certainly past his peak, he was an inspiration to his teammates on and off the field. That's an intangible. His leadership and inspiration was highly motivational for the team and they rode the crest of an emotional wave to and thru the SB.

As for John getting the most out of his players every week, he did just the opposite this year. Most of our fan base assumed we would be in the playoffs in 2016 and predicted a winning season. The team under-achieved this year and he failed miserably to get the most out of his players in the last four weeks of the season when our record was 1-3. With our destiny in our own hands and a record of 8-6 at the time, he failed to get the most out of his players in the last two weeks of the season. The truth is this. John Harbaugh and Mike Tomlin are good cheerleaders but neither is a Top Five coach. I disagree that he would have his pick of NFL head coaching positions if he left the Ravens. Jim Harbaugh wasn't in big demand when he left the Niners. He might have his pick of cheerleading squads though.

Or maybe Jim wanted to take the college job because he knows he could be there for ten plus years easily.  Even though i said what i said in the other thread about sometimes needing a change, i still think John is a top coach, as does most of the analysts around the league. 

[trevorsteadman]

8 hours ago, frozen joe flacco fan said:

I find your post amusing. While Ray was not playing at full strength the year we won the Super Bowl and was certainly past his peak, he was an inspiration to his teammates on and off the field. That's an intangible. His leadership and inspiration was highly motivational for the team and they rode the crest of an emotional wave to and thru the SB.

As for John getting the most out of his players every week, he did just the opposite this year. Most of our fan base assumed we would be in the playoffs in 2016 and predicted a winning season. The team under-achieved this year and he failed miserably to get the most out of his players in the last four weeks of the season when our record was 1-3. With our destiny in our own hands and a record of 8-6 at the time, he failed to get the most out of his players in the last two weeks of the season. The truth is this. John Harbaugh and Mike Tomlin are good cheerleaders but neither is a Top Five coach. I disagree that he would have his pick of NFL head coaching positions if he left the Ravens. Jim Harbaugh wasn't in big demand when he left the Niners. He might have his pick of cheerleading squads though.

That motivation only really inspired the offense though. The defense was a liability in the playoffs. Not only Ray, but the entire defense.

Most fans think their team can make the playoffs someway somehow. And the Ravens were 5 inches away from playing in a must win in Cincinnati to be in the playoffs. I wouldn't even count that Bengals game because after that heartbreaker to Pittsburgh most fans would rather have the higher draft pick. 

Jim Harbaugh went to Michigan because he got paid the same he did in San Francisco. He easily could've been a head coach again in the NFL.

While I think most people would agree Mike Tomlin isn't a top 5 coach, I actually think the Steelers have underperformed the last few years for the talent they have. Whether or not that is Mike Tomlin's fault I wouldn't know. But John Harbaugh is getting the most out of his players. The Ravens were 4-2 and easily could've been 6-0 in the division if the ball bounced their way or Jimmy Smith were healthy. John Harbaugh has outcoached every team in the AFC North especially this year. The Bengals and Steelers easily have more playmakers on their team than the Ravens do. 

I was one who thought the Ravens would do better offensively. Between Trestman's system and the fact Flacco's starting weapons were 1) Steve Smith coming off of an achilles injury at the age of 37. 2) Newly signed Mike Wallace. 3) Breshad Perriman who missed entire rookie season and offseason with injuries. 4) Dennis Pitta who has been out of football 2 years with hip surgeries. 5) Terrance West and Kenneth Dixon both are young but have yet to prove they are even close to superstars yet. The chemistry was not there and that is why they held the team back the first 10 or so weeks but near the end it was the defense that was holding the team back. 

Going into the season you could see the talent on paper but going through each player's situation you can easily understand why the team underperformed. For this team going forward I think it was a great thing they are keeping Mornhinweg at OC. Continuity is what the team needs after having 5 OC's in 5 years. Flacco already acts like he likes Marty more than Mark. 

[January J]

On 1/25/2017 at 4:37 AM, Tank 92 said:

Don't you think a part of this is a function of receivers not getting YAC?  Seems Pittta was sliding, falling on pretty much every ball he caught. While I recall Wallace sometimes running downfield, can't remember Smitty getting much. Don't get me wrong, I know Joe was part of the problem, but seems it was exasperated by lack of YAC. 

I know I must be missing something here, but don't see why team average yardage of pass doesn't equal team average yards of reception. Also interesting that opponents average was 6.8 yds(?).

http://www.espn.com/nfl/team/stats/_/name/bal/baltimore-ravens

Our receivers have ALWAYS failed to get many YAC and make plays for Joe. Now i know partly this could have something to do with him not leading them properly and not putting them in position to break free or get momentum- but he's never had a true dominant playmaker. Steve smith was  the closest thing to it and he's obviously more of a possesion type guy. Give him Julio Jones or Antonio brown and I guarantee he would be lighting teams up. Its a shame if we don't ever get him that guy and waste away his prime years.  I think this may be the year we break the trend and make a pretty big splash in FA. for some reason i think it will be jeffrey or marshall. Garcon would be more of our type of move though  - so we"ll see.

However I'm a firm believer that Perriman COULD be that guy. With a full offseason to train and a full camp I think he will make huge strides. He made more spectacular catches last year than anybody on the team- and his speed is next to none. This kids a gazelle. Work on his hands and refine his route running and he could turn into that true #1 playmaker. I think it will take another year or two but I've got high hopes for him. He's took a lot of flack but handled it like a pro.

[trevorsteadman]

49 minutes ago, January J said:

Our receivers have ALWAYS failed to get many YAC and make plays for Joe. Now i know partly this could have something to do with him not leading them properly and not putting them in position to break free or get momentum- but he's never had a true dominant playmaker. Steve smith was  the closest thing to it and he's obviously more of a possesion type guy. Give him Julio Jones or Antonio brown and I guarantee he would be lighting teams up. Its a shame if we don't ever get him that guy and waste away his prime years.  I think this may be the year we break the trend and make a pretty big splash in FA. for some reason i think it will be jeffrey or marshall. Garcon would be more of our type of move though  - so we"ll see.

However I'm a firm believer that Perriman COULD be that guy. With a full offseason to train and a full camp I think he will make huge strides. He made more spectacular catches last year than anybody on the team- and his speed is next to none. This kids a gazelle. Work on his hands and refine his route running and he could turn into that true #1 playmaker. I think it will take another year or two but I've got high hopes for him. He's took a lot of flack but handled it like a pro.

I agree he has only like 5 days of the offseason under his belt in Baltimore. Think of an entire offseason. He was making big plays almost every game as a #3. Definitely someone to watch this coming year.