Should Ravens focus on building an Elite Offense or Defense?

[kennethyamini1989]

We all know the motto, Offense wins games, but Defense wins championships. With that said, there are grave deficiancies on both sides of the ball for the Ravens. Going into the 2017 Season should they focus on building an elite offense around Joe or build a great D and run the ball? 

[hn68wb4]

Keep building D, fix the run game, with that Flacco will be more efficient. That's the formula our championships are built on, no reason to abandon that. Our D is only a couple pieces away from being truly elite, depth is the concern. We've got the D to win games if our offense gives them a bit of help beyond 3 and outs all game. Over the second half of the season our Oline has started to turn around and play pretty great, Zuttah and Ducasse are the obvious weak links there, good news is that we've already got a plan to remove one of those, i.e. Alex Lewis at LG, Yanda back to RG, now we just need to find a replacement for Zuttah and we've got the line that is pretty damn good with a year of development. Flacco has also turned his season completely around, after starting the season with 9 TDs to 9 interceptions, he's had 11 TDs to 5 interceptions, he's regaining his confidence that the injury briefly took from him, now he's being more efficient. Since getting healthy Dixon has proven to be a good RB, great pass catcher and is a surprisingly tough runner, West is a good backup.

We've got a young core for the defense in place with a great vet or two, add a pass rusher and secondary depth and we're good. Defense should be the focus, and making the offense more reliable, do that and we've got a great team.

We've already got many of the pieces in place, fix center, fix depth, and this team can go far. If we don't drop those gimme games early this season then we'd be sitting pretty in the playoff picture right now. We've only got ourselves to blame. Come out firing next season, be angry for missing the playoffs two seasons in a row, and just win, that's all we can say.

Edited December 30, 2016 by hn68wb4

[kjbmore]

5 hours ago, kennethyamini1989 said:

We all know the motto, Offense wins games, but Defense wins championships. With that said, there are grave deficiancies on both sides of the ball for the Ravens. Going into the 2017 Season should they focus on building an elite offense around Joe or build a great D and run the ball? 

We seem to be a bit away from building a great Offense- I think we should go back to our roots and build a power run game - grab some linemen and WR in FA and the draft and let them compete for positions.

spend our top 2 picks on rush and CB in the draft and add some pieces also in FA add that unit is close to being elite - when healthy 

[DomMcRaven]

Elite defense with a decent offense (like the 2014 offense) =  10 or 11 wins

[Rav'n Maniac]

I may be going against the grain here a bit but, I want to see us build a beast of an offense. Something that will strike fear into the hearts of opponents and force their backs to the wall. A true scoring machine that can dominate games on the ground and through the air.

A strong offense with a efficient defense is something we've never had here and could be just what we need to string a couple more championships together. 

[K-Dog]

Why does it have to be OR ?

[BmoreBird22]

I remember a stat once about winning percentages for quarterbacks when a team scored more than 25 points and not a single one had a win percentage above .500. 

If you can get a defense that only allows 14 points, all your offense has to do is get two touchdowns and a field goal, or just get to the 35 and let Tucker nail five field goals. 

Conversely, if your defense gives up 30 points, you have to score 31 and that's four touchdowns and a field goal. Not easy to do on a consistent basis.

[JoeyFlex5]

Will never be that black and white, it's about what part of each side is elite. 

Build an elite OL and run game, play to the strength of the personnel like running the ball and going deep with the speed and using TEs for the possession game. Keep a TE on the field at all times and avoid the shotgun on first and second down and snap the freaking ball before you hit 3 seconds on the play clock to keep teams from teeing off in the pass rush. 

On defense, maintain balance and build depth. Find a solution for Jimmy Smith and our ridiculous spirals when he goes down. Keep solid guys across the whole field. Elite pass rushers are nice but having 11 solid players is better, that way an offense is less able to target one liability player all day. 

 

Its about balance, well roundedness, and limiting mistakes. Not building one side of the ball to be elite.

[redrum52]

I think pass rush, OL and CB in that order.  Wr will work itself out with a better OL.  Pass rush has to be addressed though. 

Edited December 30, 2016 by redrum52

[Tru11]

4 hours ago, K-Dog said:

Why does it have to be OR ?

Salary cap.

 

[rmcjacket23]

Isn't this the same as the "State of the Ravens" thread that already exists?

[K-Dog]

34 minutes ago, Tru11 said:

Salary cap.

 

Cap says we have to choose one or the other?

That is a strange rule.

[AnthonyGames]

I think we continue to build defense and work on run game. On offense, outside side of the center position (and possible a guard) and another WR to replace SSS, I think we are solid enough to win. You look at all the top teams this year and they can run the ball. Smash mouth run game provides balance is passing game. Our o-line is a good center away from being very legit. Our RBs are looking really good going forward. If all our TEs are healthy (I'm looking at you Maxx Williams), we are solid there. The development of Perriman is crucial, too.

On defense we saw glimpses this year that we can be the best in the league. I think we are above average in every position group on D, outside of an effective pass rusher and one more good cornerback for depth.

My dream scenario for draft: Round 1: Pass Rusher. Round 2: Cornerback (a lot of depth in class). Round 3: Center.

Free agency: 1. Resign Wagner! 2. Go after FA receiver (Jeffery or Stills). 3. Resign Brandon Williams, which would be a lot of $$$....OR do we trust Piece enough to play NT?

[PurpleCity5]

It's absolutely the offense that needs help. Yeah the defense lost it against Pitt but how many games did the offense lose us? Plenty more, its been a very disappointing unit and you're going to have to do some serious work there because these last two years have been unbearable on offense. 

[Tru11]

6 minutes ago, K-Dog said:

Cap says we have to choose one or the other?

That is a strange rule.

players cost money.

cap limits the money you can spend on players.

should not be to hard for you to put these things together.

pretty much impossible to build an elite offense and defense, especially when a few players take majority of the cap......

[usmccharles]

39 minutes ago, AnthonyGames said:

I think we continue to build defense and work on run game. On offense, outside side of the center position (and possible a guard) and another WR to replace SSS, I think we are solid enough to win. You look at all the top teams this year and they can run the ball. Smash mouth run game provides balance is passing game. Our o-line is a good center away from being very legit. Our RBs are looking really good going forward. If all our TEs are healthy (I'm looking at you Maxx Williams), we are solid there. The development of Perriman is crucial, too.

On defense we saw glimpses this year that we can be the best in the league. I think we are above average in every position group on D, outside of an effective pass rusher and one more good cornerback for depth.

My dream scenario for draft: Round 1: Pass Rusher. Round 2: Cornerback (a lot of depth in class). Round 3: Center.

Free agency: 1. Resign Wagner! 2. Go after FA receiver (Jeffery or Stills). 3. Resign Brandon Williams, which would be a lot of $$$....OR do we trust Piece enough to play NT?

I was with you for most this,  then you bring Jeffery into the conversation  which made me shiver.... I just can't understand how you guys want this guy

[Willbacker]

13 hours ago, hn68wb4 said:

Keep building D, fix the run game, with that Flacco will be more efficient. That's the formula our championships are built on, no reason to abandon that. Our D is only a couple pieces away from being truly elite, depth is the concern. We've got the D to win games if our offense gives them a bit of help beyond 3 and outs all game. Over the second half of the season our Oline has started to turn around and play pretty great, Zuttah and Ducasse are the obvious weak links there, good news is that we've already got a plan to remove one of those, i.e. Alex Lewis at LG, Yanda back to RG, now we just need to find a replacement for Zuttah and we've got the line that is pretty damn good with a year of development. Flacco has also turned his season completely around, after starting the season with 9 TDs to 9 interceptions, he's had 11 TDs to 5 interceptions, he's regaining his confidence that the injury briefly took from him, now he's being more efficient. Since getting healthy Dixon has proven to be a good RB, great pass catcher and is a surprisingly tough runner, West is a good backup.

We've got a young core for the defense in place with a great vet or two, add a pass rusher and secondary depth and we're good. Defense should be the focus, and making the offense more reliable, do that and we've got a great team.

We've already got many of the pieces in place, fix center, fix depth, and this team can go far. If we don't drop those gimme games early this season then we'd be sitting pretty in the playoff picture right now. We've only got ourselves to blame. Come out firing next season, be angry for missing the playoffs two seasons in a row, and just win, that's all we can say.

Totally agree with this and I'm thinking the next 2 drafts on defense and drafting 2 interior Olinemen in the middle of our draft this year. Just not exactly sure what we can do at center but I'm not liking Zuttah

5 minutes ago, usmccharles said:

I was with you for most this,  then you bring Jeffery into the conversation  which made me shiver.... I just can't understand how you guys want this guy

You know how it is. Everybody wanting the big cheeze and not considering the salary cap. Probally need to go out and get some sort of possession receiver within the 2-3 mil range.

[usmccharles]

45 minutes ago, Willbacker said:

You know how it is. Everybody wanting the big cheeze and not considering the salary cap. Probally need to go out and get some sort of possession receiver within the 2-3 mil range.

Yea I have no issue with that,  worked well with SSr and Boldin.   Clearly it would be awesome to have an elite wr like that,  but why would anyone want to pay that much for an injury prone ped user.   I'd much rather fill other holes,  I still think you build winning teams from the inside out.  I'd gladly take Garcon over Jeffery 

[Willbacker]

1 minute ago, usmccharles said:

Yea I have no issue with that,  worked well with SSr and Boldin.   Clearly it would be awesome to have an elite wr like that,  but why would anyone want to pay that much for an injury prone ped user.   I'd much rather fill other holes,  I still think you build winning teams from the inside out.  I'd gladly take Garcon over Jeffery 

Defintly Garcon would be a much better option but he still may be too pricey but it does seem like he'd be the same m.o. like Mason,Boldin and SSS which hey I'm not complaining.

[usmccharles]

45 minutes ago, Willbacker said:

Defintly Garcon would be a much better option but he still may be too pricey but it does seem like he'd be the same m.o. like Mason,Boldin and SSS which hey I'm not complaining.

Yea I don't get some people.  They complain about us going out getting 'bargain bin' old vets who actually come in produce rather than getting young guys, yet they sit here and complain about the lack of production from the young wrs....no win situation for some people

[redrum52]

To get an elite defense and offense at the same time is usually the stars aligning.  Foundation needs to be there, player on rookie deals must have developed well and you need the right amount of cap to take on either depth or another key players at a position.  That's why when team usually have an elite defense, it doesnt usually stay that way for long.  Depth leaves, key vets get old and the rookie deal stars get paid, crippling cap.  Look at the Bengals.  They're on the way down because they couldn't manage to win a single game with all the young talent they had.  Now guys are leaving and we could continue to see them drop.

[Glen1024]

Offense sells tickets defense wins games is how the saying goes....but definitely keep adding pieces to the defense, the fact we were in every game despite dismal offense for the most part is a testament to what a great defense can do and we're only a few pieces away from being truly elite on that side again

[ravensnj]

4 hours ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

Will never be that black and white, it's about what part of each side is elite. 

Build an elite OL and run game, play to the strength of the personnel like running the ball and going deep with the speed and using TEs for the possession game. Keep a TE on the field at all times and avoid the shotgun on first and second down and snap the freaking ball before you hit 3 seconds on the play clock to keep teams from teeing off in the pass rush. 

On defense, maintain balance and build depth. Find a solution for Jimmy Smith and our ridiculous spirals when he goes down. Keep solid guys across the whole field. Elite pass rushers are nice but having 11 solid players is better, that way an offense is less able to target one liability player all day. 

 

Its about balance, well roundedness, and limiting mistakes. Not building one side of the ball to be elite.

I'm with you on everything, except you mention going deep. With our personal we can get deep, but once there we don't fight for the ball, nor has the ball been spot on. We need better chemistry and aggressive wideouts.  I will also continue to post that we need a real slot receiver, someone quick, who puts the fear in opposing defenses, with his play making abilities. 

Solid depth on defense is the name of the game. Having one player go down, shouldn't implode the entire defensive side of the ball.

 

I especially like:  snap the freaking ball before you hit 3 seconds on the play clock to keep teams from teeing off in the pass rush. 

Edited December 31, 2016 by ravensnj

[JoeyFlex5]

On 12/30/2016 at 4:42 PM, Willbacker said:

Defintly Garcon would be a much better option but he still may be too pricey but it does seem like he'd be the same m.o. like Mason,Boldin and SSS which hey I'm not complaining.

I'm not sure where anyone even gets the idea that he's leaving dc. Talk around skins nation is Garcon is their top priority this off-season.

[Willbacker]

6 hours ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

I'm not sure where anyone even gets the idea that he's leaving dc. Talk around skins nation is Garcon is their top priority this off-season.

Yeah I was basically thinking he'd be a better option than Jeffries imo.

[ellicottraven]

We are Baltimore! Defense is us and we are Defense! End of discussion.

[JoeyFlex5]

1 hour ago, Willbacker said:

Yeah I was basically thinking he'd be a better option than Jeffries imo.

i agree, garcon would be a dream pickup for us and another addition in the long line of quality FA WR signings weve made, but jeffrey would be more realistic. although i dont think were gonna be targeting jeffrey. 

one guy who i think isnt getting enough attention is vincent jackson. i know hes up there in age, but i dont think tampa is gonna be breaking the bank for him and will let him walk, and i think he could be a quality pickup on a 1 year deal for 2-3mil which i think is very realistic and fair. hes always been a sure handed big bodied receiver and i think he and joe would get familiar with eachother really quick. 

im beginning to think that the clamoring for a stud WR to grow with joe is overrated, weve done so well with free agents and so poor with drafting them, why not keep doing what works? its obvious joe prefers throwing to a savvy veteran and i think he fits the mold. not to mention its always good to give joe at least one guy who can make a contested catch and bail him out on occasion.

[Willbacker]

9 hours ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

i agree, garcon would be a dream pickup for us and another addition in the long line of quality FA WR signings weve made, but jeffrey would be more realistic. although i dont think were gonna be targeting jeffrey. 

one guy who i think isnt getting enough attention is vincent jackson. i know hes up there in age, but i dont think tampa is gonna be breaking the bank for him and will let him walk, and i think he could be a quality pickup on a 1 year deal for 2-3mil which i think is very realistic and fair. hes always been a sure handed big bodied receiver and i think he and joe would get familiar with eachother really quick. 

im beginning to think that the clamoring for a stud WR to grow with joe is overrated, weve done so well with free agents and so poor with drafting them, why not keep doing what works? its obvious joe prefers throwing to a savvy veteran and i think he fits the mold. not to mention its always good to give joe at least one guy who can make a contested catch and bail him out on occasion.

Its hard to say what we gonna do at WR and I do think Vincent Jackson would be in that price range and I like it but I like to see only 1 yr deal. Michael Floyd could be interesting to where I think he could be had on a prove it deal. I went to OTC to check on FA WRs and tried to see if there was any lesser knowns I thought could be a good signing and I didn't see much. Aiken was there and he could be had for reasonable money but I'm thinking we can go with Perrriman,Wallace and Camp for top 3 now cuz I don't think Ozzie gonna mess with his comp pick formula so we may have to look for later cuts which will happen

One interesting name I noticed tho was Adam Thielen who's in RFA. Would you make a play for him if he's offered a 2nd rd tender. At least we could force the Vikings to pay more lol.

[Davesta]

I just can't see Joe flacco being a elite QB like he was during the Super Bowl run for 16 games + playoffs. Got to take the highs and the lows (and I mean low) with Joe. So I say elite defense to bail him out. 

[Cillmatic]

Why not just have them both be really good? Use draft picks that won't be resigned as little flair ups.