State of the Ravens going into 2017

[balfan23]

3 hours ago, Jonah DeVito said:

Agreed, Im much more concerned with the lack of pass rush and adding another corner over WR. 

No doubt. #1 need is pass rush. IMO, it was a lack of a pass rush that ended our season on Christmas Day. I thought that we were going to be in good shape with Doom returning and having a few games to get himself back into game shape. Unfortunately, he was totally invisible vs. PIT. 

[Ravens419]

I really think Garçon, or Vincent Jackson or Alshon Jeffery will be here next season who would you guys want the most of the three? 

[Ravens419]

11 minutes ago, balfan23 said:

Well, I don't know ... the problem with that approach is that you can guarantee that a young gun comes in here and turns this unit around, he'll be gone in a year to be the HC somewhere else. There are a lot of success stories around the league with former HCs, who go back to being a coordinator and settle into that role permanently. Kubiak could have been a long term solution had his dream job not come open. He was turning down other offers for HC elsewhere. Todd Haley, Wade Phillips ... before that Dick LeBeau. 

If Joe is starting slow and ending the season strong, is it possible that it is this crazy lack of consistency that is causing the problem? If we can say he's finished strong this season, then would it make sense to keep the guy who only was here for a part of the season? I don't know ... I just feel like the lack of consistency is a major problem and bringing in some wunderkind to use our OC position as a stepping stone is not what we need. 

I think this was joes best season I'll say it once and I'll say it again I liked what I saw from him those first 6-8 games I give the man a pass he was coming off an MCL/ACL tear he should've been out for a year but thanks to today's doctors and technology we got him out there early you have to understand that does a lot to a players head especially his first major injury I'd say second half of the season Joe is here to stay and I'm okay with that 

[Militant X 1]

3 hours ago, Ravens419 said:

For all you who say Suggs is done and he seems like he plans to be here next year how do you bench him he is the emotional leader of this team I'd just like to know if you really find it realistic he isn't starting next year 

How many sacks on Big Ben did his "emotions" have last night?

[codizzle]

6 minutes ago, Militant X 1 said:

How many sacks on Big Ben did his "emotions" have last night?

Haha mili that's cold 

[The Raven]

7 minutes ago, Militant X 1 said:

How many sacks on Big Ben did his "emotions" have last night?

Ooof. Tough but fair.

[allblackraven]

7 minutes ago, Militant X 1 said:

How many sacks on Big Ben did his "emotions" have last night?

It's hardly Sizzle's fault that he has to play with one arm and after rehab for torn achilles at 34 yo. Still managed to be our best OLB this season.

[Ravens419]

9 minutes ago, Militant X 1 said:

How many sacks on Big Ben did his "emotions" have last night?

I can't argue with that the quote below basically says what I was going to say 

2 minutes ago, The Raven said:

Ooof. Tough but fair.

 

3 minutes ago, allblackraven said:

It's hardly Sizzle's fault that he has to play with one arm and after rehab for torn achilles at 34 yo. Still managed to be our best OLB this season.

But I tend to agree more with what he's saying above he has one arm at 34yo give him a break he still had a halfway decent season I think a healthy Suggs will be good for this team doom scares me but I still believe in both of them HEALTHY that's why I don't see pass rush a huge area of improvement not saying we couldn't add to that area for some help but we don't need an overhaul 

[hn68wb4]

47 minutes ago, balfan23 said:

Well, I don't know ... the problem with that approach is that you can guarantee that a young gun comes in here and turns this unit around, he'll be gone in a year to be the HC somewhere else. There are a lot of success stories around the league with former HCs, who go back to being a coordinator and settle into that role permanently. Kubiak could have been a long term solution had his dream job not come open. He was turning down other offers for HC elsewhere. Todd Haley, Wade Phillips ... before that Dick LeBeau. 

If Joe is starting slow and ending the season strong, is it possible that it is this crazy lack of consistency that is causing the problem? If we can say he's finished strong this season, then would it make sense to keep the guy who only was here for a part of the season? I don't know ... I just feel like the lack of consistency is a major problem and bringing in some wunderkind to use our OC position as a stepping stone is not what we need. 

I don't think there's much danger of a young guy coming in and suddenly getting a HC job after one year at OC. I don't think anyone is going to come in and turn us into the Falcons, but someone can come in and at least make our offense competent enough to have more than 2 or 3 drives per game with god-knows how many 3 and outs. 

Yes there are success stories of former head coaches, the problem is that there's plenty of guys that don't work out as well. That's true of either scenario, hiring a former HC or rolling the dice on a new guy, success stories happen in both scenarios. As far as we're concerned, we aren't finding the former HCs that work out, Kubiak is the only one. 

[gtalk12]

51 minutes ago, Ravens419 said:

I really think Garçon, or Vincent Jackson or Alshon Jeffery will be here next season who would you guys want the most of the three? 

 

I love Alshon the most here and he is only 26.....Jackson is 33 and has had some injuries (dude is a monster when healthy) but how many times are we going to bring in those guys to be our #1? Garcon is 30 and probably a better fit for Flacco.

[Ravens419]

2 minutes ago, gtalk12 said:

 

I love Alshon the most here and he is only 26.....Jackson is 33 and has had some injuries (dude is a monster when healthy) but how many times are we going to bring in those guys to be our #1? Garcon is 30 and probably a better fit for Flacco.

I personally love Alshon also I would like him the most then Garçon but bringing in Garçon seems like our FO move someone old and decently cheap... eye roll 

[rmw10]

1 hour ago, balfan23 said:

The only way we part ways with Wallace is if we intend to use that cap space + a little more to make a bigger move to bring in a high priced WR. As you said, there is no way Perriman or Aiken will be our #1 next year. I know that's not our style, but we may be looking at taking that kind of bigger step to shake things up. 

And I don't think that's something that's really in the cards unless that acquisition comes via trade, and we know how much we value draft picks.  It's always possible of course, but highly unlikely.  In my eyes, there's very little chance Wallace isn't on this team next year.

[PurpleCity5]

2 hours ago, rmw10 said:

It's expensive, but I don't think you have much choice but to try to extend him or keep him at that number if you really have to.  You can't go into the season with Perriman as your #1, and we'd have only Campanaro and Moore behind him.

I don't even think we should even go to next season with Wallace as our #1, I think I would prefer to replace Wallace with someone better and give Perriman the development and reps he needs. That said, that would be my preference, however two problems, pass rush deserves the most attention and will need cap space. 2nd, there's not one guy I would drop money on in this FA class. 

[jboy19]

Torrey Smith and Victor Cruz seem like they'll definitely be cap casualties (Cobb and Maclin also possibilities). Id also think that Allen Hurns could be gotten in a trade for pretty cheap, but that's not a great contract to pick up. Hopefully that position is moreso addressed in the draft. Wallace, Perriman, Moore and Campanaro definitely isn't an ideal receiving corps, but I dont think any of the free agents are worth as much as theyll get paid. 

[Ravensfan23]

I said this right after the game yesterday. It's hard to say a loss was a good thing but I think in the long run much like the 2011 AFCCG heartbreak this might be blessing in disguise. Here's why.

If the Ravens find a way to win that game, the complete collapse by Pees' defense might be swept under the rug because of the Division win and almost certain playoff win at home. Now the Ravens have to take a really close look at this defense and the lack of pass rush/success blitz packages. 

If the Ravens win that game, addressing the issue of the interior oline might be swept under the rug because numbers wise the offense actually had a strong day. However now because the entire team has to be looked at, the Center and G positions have to be addressed. Is Lewis the answer a G and can Urschel or Skura be the answer. I think Zuttah isn't. 

If the Ravens win that game, Marty is easily the OC moving forward. However now the Ravens have room and time to actually do a true search. If he's the right guy cool, but there should be others who get a interview. 

Overall this team just hasn't performed like a playoff or championship caliber team and missing the playoffs should highlight that. If the Ravens walked out of Pit with a win, which they should have, but if they did the Ravens would have probably ignored the discipline issues, the inability to close out games, the long lapses of focus in the middle of games it seems and how they seemed to shrink in big games. One of the headlines I read today said the Ravens have to do some soul searching and i couldn't agree more. I don't think this team is far off,  but I also don't think they can approach the offseason as if they are 1 of 2 pieces away either if that makes sense. 

 

 

[Ravenseconbeast]

22 hours ago, ravens rule said:

Going into flacco's 10th season why is WR still a huge question mark ? 

It's easy, Flacco sucks.  

You can go back to Jets game this season(perhaps the most pathetic team this past decade).  Flacco went 0 TD + 2 INT + just barely over 55%completion rate.  
Then look at any QB that went against Jets this season.   He is the least efficient 3rd down QB starter this season.   Lower than Bortles and Osweiler.

You have a veteran QB that has the same trait:  Overt inaccurate throws(overthrow/underthrows), Zero sense of field awareness, Eyeing 1 target almost all the time, Systematic QB that only knows how to hit stride with highly established veteran WRs.  

 

Joe has zero chance when it comes to building rapport with new receivers.  

I am almost 100% sure we will draft quite a few handful of WR @ this draft, but more likely than not, he will fall into relying on veteran WRs next year(whoever that might be).   

[Ravens419]

3 minutes ago, jboy19 said:

Torrey Smith and Victor Cruz seem like they'll definitely be cap casualties (Cobb and Maclin also possibilities). Id also think that Allen Hurns could be gotten in a trade for pretty cheap, but that's not a great contract to pick up. Hopefully that position is moreso addressed in the draft. Wallace, Perriman, Moore and Campanaro definitely isn't an ideal receiving corps, but I dont think any of the free agents are worth as much as theyll get paid. 

Would love to see Cruz I think he's been swept under the rug by OBJ he could fit in here great

[rmw10]

17 minutes ago, PurpleCity5 said:

I don't even think we should even go to next season with Wallace as our #1, I think I would prefer to replace Wallace with someone better and give Perriman the development and reps he needs. That said, that would be my preference, however two problems, pass rush deserves the most attention and will need cap space. 2nd, there's not one guy I would drop money on in this FA class. 

Sounds fine and dandy, but how exactly are you going replace him with someone better?  We've been looking for a guy like that for a very long time.  We're not going to sign a #1 in FA and there's no way we cut him before the draft.  That leaves trade or nothing.

[Ravenseconbeast]

4 minutes ago, Ravens419 said:

Would love to see Cruz I think he's been swept under the rug by OBJ he could fit in here great

Watched plenty of Giants game.  Cruz is done.  He is a drop machine and he has absolutely no speed.   He had plenty of opportunity with Eli this season as #3 WR. 

All he did for Giants is tip the balls and make it into INTs.   

If Garcon is available I'd go after him than Cruz.

[Ravens419]

3 minutes ago, Ravenseconbeast said:

Watched plenty of Giants game.  Cruz is done.  He is a drop machine and he has absolutely no speed.   He had plenty of opportunity with Eli this season as #3 WR. 

All he did for Giants is tip the balls and make it into INTs.   

If Garcon is available I'd go after him than Cruz.

I guess the few games I watched were different but yeah Garçon is second on my list behind Alshon

[PurpleCity5]

2 hours ago, rmw10 said:

Sounds fine and dandy, but how exactly are you going replace him with someone better?  We've been looking for a guy like that for a very long time.  We're not going to sign a #1 in FA and there's no way we cut him before the draft.  That leaves trade or nothing.

That's absolutely true and that's the problem, who are you going to replace him with? If a player like Brandon Marshall comes along who is a great WR but seems to bounce around is there then sure but if not then I guess you're going to stick with him. FWIW, I think Alshon Jeffery is a better player and at the same price I'm taking Alshon all the way. That's literally the only guy I could think of right now and even he has his question marks. 

I know we're not getting a #1 WR but I don't think signing one is a horrible idea, It's not like we're developing one and then keeping one is going to be cheap either. If Ozzie could grab Julio Jones, Odell Beckham or Antonio Brown for $70M he would do it, but he knows for a fact that he won't win that bidding war. 

The missing element to this offense has always been a play-maker. That's a proven fact and right now, with the way the offense has preformed this year, you could argue that play-maker might be up there with OLB, and CB. It holds this offense back year after year honestly. 

[Ravens419]

5 minutes ago, PurpleCity5 said:

That's absolutely true and that's the problem, who are you going to replace him with? If a player like Brandon Marshall comes along who is a great WR but seems to bounce around is there then sure but if not then I guess you're going to stick with him. FWIW, I think Alshon Jeffery is a better player and at the same price I'm taking Alshon all the way. That's literally the only guy I could think of right now and even he has his question marks. 

I know we're not getting a #1 WR but I don't think signing one is a horrible idea, It's not like we're developing one and then keeping one is going to be cheap either. If Ozzie could grab Julio Jones, Odell Beckham or Antonio Brown for $70M he would do it, but he knows for a fact that he won't win that bidding war. 

The missing element to this offense has always been a play-maker. That's a proven fact and right now, with the way the offense has preformed this year, you could argue that play-maker might be up there with OLB, and CB. It holds this offense back year after year honestly. 

Couldn't have said it better myself 

[Deflated Football]

Alshon should come relatively cheap but his injuries scare me. But still, I'd double dip and be greedy and sign both him and Garçon. Those two plus BP, Wallace and camp would be ridiculous. We need to surround Joe with as many playmakers as possible. If the defense keeps letting the other team score 30+, that just means that we have to outscore everyone. Imagine if we got Payton in here too.

[ALPHA]

If we can draft/build a monster oline and pass rush then that addresses the majority of our problems, a strong ground game helps Flacco, a strong pass rush helps our secondary and we clear cap space for the type of big money marquee players that are generally unavailable to us.

[Ravens419]

1 minute ago, Deflated Football said:

Alshon should come relatively cheap but his injuries scare me. But still, I'd double dip and be greedy and sign both him and Garçon. Those two plus BP, Wallace and camp would be ridiculous. We need to surround Joe with as many playmakers as possible. If the defense keeps letting the other team score 30+, that just means that we have to outscore everyone. Imagine if we got Payton in here too.

If we could pull off both I'd be amazed but Garçon is getting old he shouldn't be all that expensive but he will still take some but I'd like to try and get Mo Claiborne also Mo and Jeffery and I'd be a happy camper 

[Static]

I think we have to let BWill walk. 

 

Shelon Pierce makes me believe he will be much of the same as BWill.

 

Lock up Wagner,  We need stability on our O-line plus he CAN play at a probowl level. Not that he does at all times though. Linemen always seem to age like fine wine.

Edited December 27, 2016 by Static

[Glen1024]

4 hours ago, Militant X 1 said:

How many sacks on Big Ben did his "emotions" have last night?

Lets not forget what happened to this defense last year without him, I know it doesn't answer your question but suggs without a doubt is the heart of this defense

[ALPHA]

I've seen Jeffreys FA market value put at around 5 years $55-60M, not exactly cheap but a bargain if he can stay healthy.

[Deflated Football]

28 minutes ago, Ravens419 said:

If we could pull off both I'd be amazed but Garçon is getting old he shouldn't be all that expensive but he will still take some but I'd like to try and get Mo Claiborne also Mo and Jeffery and I'd be a happy camper 

I'd go one step further and say Stephon Gilmore and Alshon

[Deflated Football]

17 minutes ago, ALPHA said:

I've seen Jeffreys FA market value put at around 5 years $55-60M, not exactly cheap but a bargain if he can stay healthy.

I don't think he gets that much, at least not yet. Wouldn't be surprised if he signs a one year prove it deal to be honest