Week 14: The Good, the Bad, the Ugly discussion/rant Patriots edition

[Cillmatic]

13 minutes ago, OUravensfan said:

Can someone breakdown the play where Perriman seemingly didn't see the ball or let it go through his hands? What happened there, looked like a big play opportunity.

Regardless, we will need another good WR next year, probably through FA, Steve Smith will be gone, we cannot go into the season with only  Perriman and Wallace, neither have proven to be consistent 8 catch a game players.

Miscue

[OUravensfan]

These guys that only return kicks are head cases, they're irrational because they feel the need to justify their existence and roster spot and make terrible decisions 

Edited December 13, 2016 by OUravensfan

[ravensdfan]

3 hours ago, BmoreBird22 said:

Except that- whose job is it to go out there and execute a play? Just saying.

It was in response to Pollard's post about having to coach now that Reed & Lewis are gone. So again, exactly who would be responsible for that on the defensive side?

 

 

[JoeyFlex5]

32 minutes ago, OUravensfan said:

Can someone breakdown the play where Perriman seemingly didn't see the ball or let it go through his hands? What happened there, looked like a big play opportunity.

Regardless, we will need another good WR next year, probably through FA, Steve Smith will be gone, we cannot go into the season with only  Perriman and Wallace, neither have proven to be consistent 8 catch a game players.

I think the play call was a skinny post and flacco saw the soft spot and hoped perriman saw the same. Because there was a huge open zone there and I saw it before the snap and I had a feeling that was coming lol

[trevorsteadman]

30 minutes ago, OUravensfan said:

Can someone breakdown the play where Perriman seemingly didn't see the ball or let it go through his hands? What happened there, looked like a big play opportunity.

Regardless, we will need another good WR next year, probably through FA, Steve Smith will be gone, we cannot go into the season with only  Perriman and Wallace, neither have proven to be consistent 8 catch a game players.

Miscue I think Flacco forced it because Perriman had a beat but he didn't turn in time. Would've been a spectacular play if he turned in time. 

While I agree that the team needs another weapon... How many receivers in the league are 8 catches a game players? I'm hoping the team targets Garcon in free agency. Steve Smith is still not making as much of an impact this season as hoped. Wallace has been fantastic and Perriman has been buried on the depth chart but has made some big plays. 

[Drew P]

1 minute ago, trevorsteadman said:

Miscue I think Flacco forced it because Perriman had a beat but he didn't turn in time. Would've been a spectacular play if he turned in time. 

While I agree that the team needs another weapon... How many receivers in the league are 8 catches a game players? I'm hoping the team targets Garcon in free agency. Steve Smith is still not making as much of an impact this season as hoped. Wallace has been fantastic and Perriman has been buried on the depth chart but has made some big plays. 

Meanwhile Brady gets it done with Chris Hogan. It doesn't matter if they added AJ, Julio and Antonio. Passing the ball 27 times in the first half is High School crap.

[terps85]

37 minutes ago, OUravensfan said:

Can someone breakdown the play where Perriman seemingly didn't see the ball or let it go through his hands? What happened there, looked like a big play opportunity.

Regardless, we will need another good WR next year, probably through FA, Steve Smith will be gone, we cannot go into the season with only  Perriman and Wallace, neither have proven to be consistent 8 catch a game players.

It looked like Perriman didn't pick up the blitz and was running a deep route. ESPN had a weird lack of replays so that's just based on the live watch, but I'm pretty sure that's what happened. 

[Militant X 1]

3 hours ago, Tank 92 said:

lol.... Sorry Mili, nothing personal. I was beat and should have gone to bed. We good. 

Nothing personal taken!  And, of course we're good Tank!  We always will be! 

[Rav'n Maniac]

For me, this entire game was down right ugly from the get go. It was so bad, I couldn't stand to watch anymore so I turned it off at the half.

[trevorsteadman]

1 minute ago, Drew P said:

Meanwhile Brady gets it done with Chris Hogan. It doesn't matter if they added AJ, Julio and Antonio. Passing the ball 27 times in the first half is High School crap.

Hogan has been in the league longer and understood and saw the situation. Perriman did not. He is still a young player who has made plays for this team. He just needs time this is his FIRST SEASON. 

Adding those players would help as they are all upgrades from what we currently have. But the team shouldn't of abandoned the run in the first half. Kudos from them getting back on track in the second half and that helped them start moving the ball, but I feel like something was said to Marty at half time to run the ball more. 
 

Also throwing 2 yard dump passes every time is a joke. I know the Patriots have a phenomenal secondary but they need to work more deep and intermediate passes. That is why the team exploded against the Dolphins. Dixon shouldn't be your primary receiver. 

[terps85]

The more I think about it, the more genius their gameplan on defense was. We've seen time and time again Flacco almost creating pressure in his head when getting confused. While they only rushed 3 the majority of the time, they did it while showing blitz and rushing different guys. Flacco then panics and checks down every damn play too quickly. If I'm a DC, I'm doing this to him every single game. 

[trevorsteadman]

Just now, Rav'n Maniac said:

For me, this entire game was down right ugly from the get go. It was so bad, I couldn't stand to watch anymore so I turned it off at the half.

The team looked better in the second half and moved the ball. But what killed the team a lot was that safety (Devin Hester is great at getting us inside our own 5 yard line) and that block field goal that someone should've saw was going to get jumped. I saw it 10 seconds before it happened. Too many miscues this team had a chance to win at the end as well.

[edthehead]

1 hour ago, rmcjacket23 said:

Why would anybody care what Bernard Pollard says again? 

you do not have to care or like 

tbh just forget the messenger, read the message

I am a true Ravens fanatic,

do you think we ran the ball enough?

do you think we was in a hurry up offense at the end of the game?

what about matt elam being here and john simon starting in houston?

c'mon bruh you have to be honest, all coaches make mistake all QB's make mistake

I get that ,because I am A crazy fan of this team and city and state 

Park heights, pimlico road to be exact, 

what I am trying to say is this,

 now what pollard said is similar to what I think harb wanted a certain team and he has it, so coach it up

we have no sense of urgency, hester is pure GARBAGE, we can not cut him because his salary is guaranteed,

  

 

[terps85]

55 minutes ago, Drew P said:

That "on sides" kick was not only poorly executed but was an awful decision considering they had 2 TO's and the 2 MIN warning.

Talked about this earlier in the thread. Game was essentially over with a first down. Clock was at 2:03 so a return gets rid of 2 minute warning. I'd much rather lose being aggressive and trying to get the ball rather than trying to stop best QB of all time. Plus, best case you stop them and get the ball at around the 35-40 with no TO's (assuming Hester catches the punt). If you get the kick, you obviously have the all at the 45/50 with your TO's left. If they get it and go 3 and out, you get it at the 15/20 (again assuming Hester catches it lol). I think the 20 yards or so is worth the gamble, especially when factoring in the opposing QB. 

[rmcjacket23]

1 hour ago, BmoreBird22 said:

Just went back and watched and you are right. 

Would have been an incredibly difficult catch, but damn, he should have still at least caused an incompletion.

He would have been better off turning his head and letting the ball hit him square in the back than what he did.

It wasn't a good decision by Joe to throw it, yet by NFL standards Wallace was still clearly open, even in double coverage.

Same thing on the post over the middle. Ball was not that accurate, but it should be a completion 100% of the time. 

[Militant X 1]

10 hours ago, OUravensfan said:

Didn't have it tonight, sad. Would have been cool if they could of taken advantage of some opportunities, Wallace and Perriman had huge drops, one led to a pick.

Well, you know how I feel about that "breakout" term constantly being thrown around in reference to the Ravens offense in that Dolphins game OU. Can't stand it! That performance of theirs was truly an aberration.  Remember, I mentioned that "IF" they could have that type of performance...against the Patriots...in Foxboro and in PRIME TIME then "maybe" it could be considered a so-called "breakout" for them.  Now, their piss poor performance that we've been accustomed to seeing this ENTIRE season doesn't absolve the defense or special teams in this game either because they were trash too! 

[-Truth-]

It seems like we're mostly in agreement about Devin Hester. I was hoping we'd switch to Lardarius Webb when our PR waits in our own red zone. He isn't nearly as terrified as Hester to get under the ball. Honestly, looking back at the game, it was a bizarre night. We faced pressure on just 4 of the latter 45 passing attempts; yet on most passing plays, we seemingly either immediately went to the hot read, or went through the first progression and then straight to the check down. We waited a full second before running towards the strongside DL shift on the inevitable subsequent safety. The ball fell straight through Mike Wallace's bread-basket attempt right into Devin McCourty's arms on what was a dangerous throw. We had 4 rushing attempts going into halftime against the Patriots 17 in a two-score game. Justin Tucker took a backward step with 4 seconds left on the game clock, which Shea McClellin used as a cue to time the leap, which took his timing off moving forward. Our punts were almost blocked several times to the point where we had Morgan Cox line up alone in order to execute a hurry up punt to throw off the rush, which was a smart move. We somehow ended up with two fumble recoveries on back-to-back ST returns, and we converted each into scores. We ran an onside kick despite having the two-minute warning and 2 timeouts, which landed on our 47 yard line and lessened the pressure on New England to run the ball. I'd mention Hester willingly giving away field position or the backbreaking penalties that erased our first downs, but those are unfortunately not uncommon occurrences. I am at least pleased that we didn't suffer a blow out loss as it would've likely been demoralizing to the players' mindsets. But t'was not a pretty sight.

Edited December 13, 2016 by -Truth-

[rmcjacket23]

5 minutes ago, edthehead said:

you do not have to care or like 

tbh just forget the messenger, read the message

I am a true Ravens fanatic,

do you think we ran the ball enough?

do you think we was in a hurry up offense at the end of the game?

what about matt elam being here and john simon starting in houston?

c'mon bruh you have to be honest, all coaches make mistake all QB's make mistake

I get that ,because I am A crazy fan of this team and city and state 

Park heights, pimlico road to be exact, 

what I am trying to say is this,

 now what pollard said is similar to what I think harb wanted a certain team and he has it, so coach it up

we have no sense of urgency, hester is pure GARBAGE, we can not cut him because his salary is guaranteed,

  

 

1. The messenger in a lot of cases matters more than the message. Any old idiot can just spew off messages. There's thousands of people who post theories and cliche's on social media every day... most of them don't even know the message themselves.

2. No, we didn't run the ball enough. Though, again, I think a lot of people just want to run the football so we can say we ran the ball instead of running the ball to establish actual production. We're not very good at running the ball, regardless of how many times we do it. 

3. John Simon is a JAG in this league (just another guy). They don't even play the same position, and if John Simon was here, he wouldn't be starting. I'm not even sure he would be playing that much. What skill set does he bring that Albert McClellan doesn't?

4. No disagreement with the need for urgency. 

5. We can cut Hester anytime he wants... his salary doesn't matter. We just don't have a better in-house option at this point.

 

[Edug27]

6 hours ago, kjbmore said:

my point exactly, our problem with our secondary is we're depending on a guy who is injury prone - only reason elam was on the field tonight

need to move on, not totally but we need to build our secondary thinking jimmy will not play - we need to add a #1 corner and i would look to add another corner who can play slot but ok if called to go outside in a pinch

we look like - new #1 corner, #2 Jimmy, Tavon slot, - backups - wright, canady, another slot corner not powers 

when Jimmy smith gets injured because he will, its just a matter of when

#1 corner stays where he is, tavon either bounces out or stays in the slot, wright, canady, draft pick comes in

2014 injured, 2015 injured, 2016 looks like were going down the same road

stop crossing your fingers and hoping injury prone guys will stop being injured, go out and get help 

Jimmy is making a lot of money to be a #2. It would be hard to bring in a number 1 taking the cap into consideration.

[OUravensfan]

Agree we didn't run the ball a lot, but when we do it never works, ever. I'd rather go out throwing with a chance versus pinning us in 3rd and > 5 each time, every good running play was called back anyway. 

[Drew P]

8 minutes ago, terps85 said:

Talked about this earlier in the thread. Game was essentially over with a first down. Clock was at 2:03 so a return gets rid of 2 minute warning. I'd much rather lose being aggressive and trying to get the ball rather than trying to stop best QB of all time. Plus, best case you stop them and get the ball at around the 35-40 with no TO's (assuming Hester catches the punt). If you get the kick, you obviously have the all at the 45/50 with your TO's left. If they get it and go 3 and out, you get it at the 15/20 (again assuming Hester catches it lol). I think the 20 yards or so is worth the gamble, especially when factoring in the opposing QB. 

Their special teams was worse than the Ravens and that's pretty bad. No way in hell they attempt to return a ball if Tucker boots it. Bad decision by a coach whose facial expression all night looked like he was lost in space.

[Edug27]

48 minutes ago, Alexir said:

I'm not ruling us out of playoffs (obviously still 3 games left), but here are some players that need to be off this team next year:

Cut: Elam, Powers, Webb, Hester, Arrington, Lewis, Wright (don't know his Guaranteed money though).

 

Not certain about all their contracts, so might not make sense to cut some, but I think they need to go.

 

Hopefully we can get Reynolds, Kaufusi, Correa, and Moore involved more next year. Other than them, I've been very impressed with our other rookies. Moore has been good on Specials too.

 

Corner and Safety is a huge need for us going into 2017 draft.

100% agree. SSS needs to retire. Elam, Webb, Hester, Arrington and Lewis need to be cut. If it weren't for his relationship with Flacco, I'd move on from Pitta as well.  I'm also in favor of moving on from Mike Wallace as well. No idea about his salary and all that though.

You have to find yourself a veteran #1 wideout. A sure handed player to move the sticks. Someone like Garçon. Then you move Perriman into the 2 spot. You have to develop Reynolds and Campanaro as the slot guys. While Pitta is a dependable pass catcher,  we need more playmaking from that position. Maxx Williams needs to develop. 

 

[terps85]

3 minutes ago, Drew P said:

Their special teams was worse than the Ravens and that's pretty bad. No way in hell they attempt to return a ball if Tucker boots it. Bad decision by a coach whose facial expression all night looked like he was lost in space.

Any smart coach would have their guy run it out to get rid of the 2 minute warning. At least I would think so lol

[-Truth-]

8 minutes ago, OUravensfan said:

Agree we didn't run the ball a lot, but when we do it never works, ever. I'd rather go out throwing with a chance versus pinning us in 3rd and > 5 each time, every good running play was called back anyway. 

That's not accurate. Minus that foolish half-toss to Dixon at the end of the 3rd quarter that amassed -4 yards, he would've finished with 10 carries for 43 yards. Nothing stellar, but that's after the called back runs, which isn't too shabby. Both Dixon and Terrance West have run the ball 56 combined times coming into this game over their last 3 and they amassed 285 rushing yards in that span while averaging over 5.0 YPC. A far cry from the notion that running never works for us.

Edited December 13, 2016 by -Truth-

[rmcjacket23]

21 minutes ago, terps85 said:

Talked about this earlier in the thread. Game was essentially over with a first down. Clock was at 2:03 so a return gets rid of 2 minute warning. I'd much rather lose being aggressive and trying to get the ball rather than trying to stop best QB of all time. Plus, best case you stop them and get the ball at around the 35-40 with no TO's (assuming Hester catches the punt). If you get the kick, you obviously have the all at the 45/50 with your TO's left. If they get it and go 3 and out, you get it at the 15/20 (again assuming Hester catches it lol). I think the 20 yards or so is worth the gamble, especially when factoring in the opposing QB. 

Pretty spot on actually. I discussed this with my brother when it happened.

Most people look at the onside kick and say "what are you doing". The reality is there's not a whole lot of risk involved there. You're essentially weighing the reward of an onside kick recovery vs giving up about 15-20 yards of field position. I would actually say that the likelihood of us recovering an onside kick was probably higher than the likelihood of us kicking a touchback, forcing the Patriots to a 3 and out, and then driving down the field for a TD with one timeout left. I'm not sure how anybody thinks we were in a position to do that.

The reality is that the way our defense was playing neither decision really meant much. 

[the_pope]

forget the playoffs.  they are not a good team.. they beat up on the really bad teams.  need a new coach and OC.  time has finally come to make changes.  you have dixon and run the ball 4 times.  it's great to be an optimistic fan, but you also have to be realistic.  wait til next year.

[OUravensfan]

Onside kick call was fine, not sure why some are upset about that. Be more upset about the cutesy way Tucker hit it, just do a normal kick and let us have a chance.

[52520Andrew]

Kenneth Dixon dragging Chris Long aLong was pretty funny. 

[jboy19]

Fingers crossed that today is the day Hester's gone. 

[drillem]

Matt Elam and Devon Hester were atrocious in last night's game.  Poster boys for what not to do.