[News] 5 Under-The-Radar Players Boosting The Ravens

[BR News]

Head Coach John Harbaugh said the ‘foundation of our football team is really strong’ thanks to some unheralded players such as defensive end Lawrence Guy, linebacker Zachary Orr and right tackle Rick Wagner.

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[ravens4life86]

I especially agree with the 1st 3.
Wagner has been steady force at RT, but Ravens will have to replace him with Lewis next year and draft more G/T or G/Cs in draft next year.

Orr I would say is impressed me big time, hes playing at pro bowl level as the weak side LBr to Mosley. Though you see hes clearly not as good as without mosley when Mosley was out.

Guy, 1 of those glue guys

[objective view]

I don't know, maybe it's me but I have seen nothing out of Webb. He is always late in coverage and trailing and when he approaches a ball carrier to tackle him, he Never wraps up, it's always one of those hit and miss body throws. He would be my first cut especially considering his salary. Yes I recognize he is a great guy in the community and I appreciate that but were talking on field football here.

[jboy19]

Is it a coincidence that 4/5 are in a contract year?

[ravens4life86]

jboy19, I just checked. Your right 4/5 are free agents this year. Webb is next year, along with a important class that includes Jernigan,Mosley,Dumervil.

However Zach Orr is RFA hes definitely coming back, maybe even sign him to a deal. Then mosley next year.
Everyone else Guy,Juice,Wagner replace through draft

[Crusader]

I like Orr. I knew he would take A Brown spot when I seen him run from side to side. Kyle is a great blocker. One of the few players that are not on the O line that can. Guy not only can play but will bring character to this team. As for PFF, I could care less what they report. Most of the crap they pedal don't make sense to the human eye.

[Zeus]

And yet the O line falls asleep after the first q

[J.O.14]

jboy19, I just checked. Your right 4/5 are free agents this year. Webb is next year, along with a important class that includes Jernigan,Mosley,Dumervil.

However Zach Orr is RFA hes definitely coming back, maybe even sign him to a deal. Then mosley next year.
Everyone else Guy,Juice,Wagner replace through draft

Good news about Orr is that ILB usually come fairly cheap (at least a lot cheaper than other positions). Kuechly is the exception to the rule. I think we could get him at a fairly decent rate. Mosley would be the one who could be asking for a good bit of money. I'd like to know where Orr ranks according to PFF this season. Mosley ranks 7th at his position, so I know Orr is lower than that because he didn't make that list. Mosley has quietly been having a good season. Don't let those 48 more tackles fool you, though I do realize Orr has been playing well himself.

We need to keep Juice, Guy, and Webb. Wagner is replaceable with Lewis. But all have been having a good season, which has helped with our success.

[Purple Dawg 96]

No surprise to me! The Ravens have a reputation of their drafting abilities in the NFL and to those Ravens fans that question it this season "KICK ROCKS"!

[Crusader]

  On Thursday, December 01, 2016 at 6:09 PM, ravens4life86 said:

jboy19, I just checked. Your right 4/5 are free agents this year. Webb is next year, along with a important class that includes Jernigan,Mosley,Dumervil.

However Zach Orr is RFA hes definitely coming back, maybe even sign him to a deal. Then mosley next year.
Everyone else Guy,Juice,Wagner replace through draft

Good news about Orr is that ILB usually come fairly cheap (at least a lot cheaper than other positions). Kuechly is the exception to the rule. I think we could get him at a fairly decent rate. Mosley would be the one who could be asking for a good bit of money. I'd like to know where Orr ranks according to PFF this season. Mosley ranks 7th at his position, so I know Orr is lower than that because he didn't make that list. Mosley has quietly been having a good season. Don't let those 48 more tackles fool you, though I do realize Orr has been playing well himself.

We need to keep Juice, Guy, and Webb. Wagner is replaceable with Lewis. But all have been having a good season, which has helped with our success.

I would keep Wanger over Webb. Webb's best days are past him.

[rossihunter2]

i think its far more likely that wagner stays than brandon williams - wagner is a right tackle with not much buzz league-wide whereas brandon williams is a pro-bowl level nose tackle probably better than snacks harrison who got nearly something like 8mill a year which is huge for a d lineman who cannot rush the passer

webb isnt really the either/or here

[cbrook1862]

Webb can go. He's done some good things, but too many time he has been a liability in coverage, whether he's covering somebody or offering help for the CB. With Webb's inconsistent play and age, Weddle's age, Elam not turning out how we thought, and Terrence Brooks not on the team anymore, we are thin and vulnerable at the safety position. Safety should be one of our biggest need this offseason.

[PersianRaven]

I have liked Lawrence Guy and Brent Urban for a long time. Guy is like the second coming of Kelly Gregg. He's humble and a hard worker. As Sizzle said, a blue-collar guy. Urban has been involved in almost every single one of our blocked FGs or Extra points and that 6'7 figure explains why.

[sizzlingdoom]

I don't know, maybe it's me but I have seen nothing out of Webb. He is always late in coverage and trailing and when he approaches a ball carrier to tackle him, he Never wraps up, it's always one of those hit and miss body throws. He would be my first cut especially considering his salary. Yes I recognize he is a great guy in the community and I appreciate that but were talking on field football here.

I agree 100%. There's NO way we can go into next year counting on him as the starting FS. He can still help us with our goal this year so I don't want to say too much but I agree. His best days are far behind him. I think he should return some punts this year though. really. maybe the browns will take him for a 6th in the offseason

[RaRaRavens]

6 hours ago, rossihunter2 said:

i think its far more likely that wagner stays than brandon williams - wagner is a right tackle with not much buzz league-wide whereas brandon williams is a pro-bowl level nose tackle probably better than snacks harrison who got nearly something like 8mill a year which is huge for a d lineman who cannot rush the passer

webb isnt really the either/or here

I sadly agree. Would love to see Williams stay, especially since he's not one of those one-year-wonders like Mcphee or Kruger were, Williams is a true franchise cornerstone around whom you can build a great defense. But unfortunately I too don't see Oz opening up the checkbook for him. He'll rather take the 3rd round comp pick and gamble with our other D-linemen (Jernigan, Pierce and Davis) to fill his shoes. And I'm afraid it might backfire like it did, to some extent, with KO.

It sounds more believable that Wagner will get resigned which, I think, is again a risky move. If they resign him, they will probably way overpay him. It's the first solid year from him. Yeah, I know, he's flashed before, but always been up and down. And even this year did not start so well for him. So there's no real reason to believe that he'll be consistently dominant in years to come. Yet he'll be paid that way.

I'd much prefer the more expensive, yet much safer and impactful signing of Williams. Because don't forget that Alex Lewis was drafted with OT position in mind. So we could look a replacement for Wagner from the draft or move Lewis to RT, Urschel to LG and find solid depth from the draft, which we have always been good at.

Edited December 2, 2016 by RaRaRavens
Grammar

[RaRaRavens]

6 hours ago, Crusader said:

I would keep Wanger over Webb. Webb's best days are past him.

I wouldn't keep either. Yes, Wagner would not get paid top dollar for RT. But considering the fact that all his years so far have been very up and down, there is no reason to believe he'll be a consistently dominant going forward. But he'd probably be paid that way.

 

Webb can stay IMO if he takes at least 60% pay cut down to 3mil. It'll probably still be too much for a FS playing the way he's playing, but at that rate it can at least be a discussion. Otherwise he should be the first guy out from the team.

[RaRaRavens]

Would love to see most of them back, but the most important thing - DO NOT OVERPAY ANY OF THEM!

None of them are impact players, difference makers, worthy of top money, though some of them probably want to be paid that way.

[HoldingCall]

  6 hours ago, Crusader said:

I would keep Wanger over Webb. Webb's best days are past him.

I wouldn't keep either. Yes, Wagner would not get paid top dollar for RT. But considering the fact that all his years so far have been very up and down, there is no reason to believe he'll be a consistently dominant going forward. But he'd probably be paid that way.

 

Webb can stay IMO if he takes at least 60% pay cut down to 3mil. It'll probably still be too much for a FS playing the way he's playing, but at that rate it can at least be a discussion. Otherwise he should be the first guy out from the team.

The back end was the team's weakness for the past few years and you would do what to maintain the strength of this year? Sorry, but that is one area that I'd want to maintain as I strengthen perhaps the Center of the OL and another quality CB.

[sizzlingdoom]

Let all of them walk if it means keeping BWILL. We must keep BWILL. We will be in top 2 stopping the run every year for years if we sign BWILL and hold onto Pierce. That's where Ravens football starts. Stopping the run. Can't remember if it was last year or a couple years ago that we couldn't stop the run....that was maybe the most embarassing experience as a Ravens fan I've had while watching. Out of the guys on this list I'll list them in order of importance to the team imo:
Orr
Wagner
Juice
Guy
Webb- part of the reason I put him last is I've been very unimpressed with his play this year. Esp. with the pieces around him. ( Except our worst defender/player-Wright). He hasn't really been getting burned but there have been a few close ones. And I haven't seen ANY playmaking/ballhawking. Maybe he's saving it for Dec/Jan/Feb ball

[RaRaRavens]

  20 minutes ago, RaRaRavens said:

  6 hours ago, Crusader said:

I would keep Wanger over Webb. Webb's best days are past him.

I wouldn't keep either. Yes, Wagner would not get paid top dollar for RT. But considering the fact that all his years so far have been very up and down, there is no reason to believe he'll be a consistently dominant going forward. But he'd probably be paid that way.

 

Webb can stay IMO if he takes at least 60% pay cut down to 3mil. It'll probably still be too much for a FS playing the way he's playing, but at that rate it can at least be a discussion. Otherwise he should be the first guy out from the team.

The back end was the team's weakness for the past few years and you would do what to maintain the strength of this year? Sorry, but that is one area that I'd want to maintain as I strengthen perhaps the Center of the OL and another quality CB.

Consider this, Webb is getting paid nearly as much as Earl Thomas. Is he playing as well as Earl Thomas?

[RaRaRavens]

10 minutes ago, sizzlingdoom said:

Let all of them walk if it means keeping BWILL. We must keep BWILL. We will be in top 2 stopping the run every year for years if we sign BWILL and hold onto Pierce. That's where Ravens football starts. Stopping the run. Can't remember if it was last year or a couple years ago that we couldn't stop the run....that was maybe the most embarassing experience as a Ravens fan I've had while watching. Out of the guys on this list I'll list them in order of importance to the team imo:
Orr
Wagner
Juice
Guy
Webb- part of the reason I put him last is I've been very unimpressed with his play this year. Esp. with the pieces around him. ( Except our worst defender/player-Wright). He hasn't really been getting burned but there have been a few close ones. And I haven't seen ANY playmaking/ballhawking. Maybe he's saving it for Dec/Jan/Feb ball

I'm on board 100% with you. The rule of thumb to building a great football team, at least a great Ravens team, should be to build outward from between the numbers. On both sides of the ball. Ofcourse there needs to be some balance, but cornerstone to everything else is the line. We've always been in competition, if we've had great offensive and/or defensive lines. We can have the best skill position players in the league, nothing will get done if O-line or D-line is leaky.

Edited December 2, 2016 by RaRaRavens
Grammar

[HoldingCall]

Let all of them walk if it means keeping BWILL. We must keep BWILL. We will be in top 2 stopping the run every year for years if we sign BWILL and hold onto Pierce. That's where Ravens football starts. Stopping the run. Can't remember if it was last year or a couple years ago that we couldn't stop the run....that was maybe the most embarassing experience as a Ravens fan I've had while watching. Out of the guys on this list I'll list them in order of importance to the team imo:
Orr
Wagner
Juice
Guy
Webb- part of the reason I put him last is I've been very unimpressed with his play this year. Esp. with the pieces around him. ( Except our worst defender/player-Wright). He hasn't really been getting burned but there have been a few close ones. And I haven't seen ANY playmaking/ballhawking. Maybe he's saving it for Dec/Jan/Feb ball

I would flip Guy and Juice, then flip Webb and Juice. Not because Juice isn't worthy but because the back end is so important and having Weddle play with someone he has experience with and trust. The Back end burned the team in 2014 and maybe cost another Superbowl appearance. Besides, Big Ben will have a field day on any inexperience there.

[HoldingCall]

9 minutes ago, RaRaRavens said:

Consider this, Webb is getting paid nearly as much as Earl Thomas. Is he playing as well as Earl Thomas?

He will take some cut because he is currently under a CB contract. However, you cannot get into comparing the contracts of other team's players, lots are overpaid and lots are underpaid. Take Joe's contract for example just 15% of his contract for next season would greatly help the team. 

[RaRaRavens]

  1 hour ago, RaRaRavens said:

Consider this, Webb is getting paid nearly as much as Earl Thomas. Is he playing as well as Earl Thomas?

He will take some cut because he is currently under a CB contract. However, you cannot get into comparing the contracts of other team's players, lots are overpaid and lots are underpaid. Take Joe's contract for example just 15% of his contract for next season would greatly help the team. 

Ironic that you mention overpaid-underpaid players, cause Webb certainly is overpaid, when you consider his salary and his playing level. So you are right in that he must take a (considerable) pay cut. He's due to make 7.5 next year. At least 2.5 off of that. I'm just not sure if he'll agree to that, but I don't see him being worth more than 5mil.

[sizzlingdoom]

  2 hours ago, sizzlingdoom said:

Let all of them walk if it means keeping BWILL. We must keep BWILL. We will be in top 2 stopping the run every year for years if we sign BWILL and hold onto Pierce. That's where Ravens football starts. Stopping the run. Can't remember if it was last year or a couple years ago that we couldn't stop the run....that was maybe the most embarassing experience as a Ravens fan I've had while watching. Out of the guys on this list I'll list them in order of importance to the team imo:
Orr
Wagner
Juice
Guy
Webb- part of the reason I put him last is I've been very unimpressed with his play this year. Esp. with the pieces around him. ( Except our worst defender/player-Wright). He hasn't really been getting burned but there have been a few close ones. And I haven't seen ANY playmaking/ballhawking. Maybe he's saving it for Dec/Jan/Feb ball

I would flip Guy and Juice, then flip Webb and Juice. Not because Juice isn't worthy but because the back end is so important and having Weddle play with someone he has experience with and trust. The Back end burned the team in 2014 and maybe cost another Superbowl appearance. Besides, Big Ben will have a field day on any inexperience there.

I know I know, but can you imagine if we replaced Webb with Berry?

[Rav'n Maniac]

I'm sure Ozzie will do his best to keep the nucleus of this team together. The only one I see as an issue keeping is BWill and it will be on him to decide on his future. It will come down to whether he wants to stay here on a modest contract or if he wants to chase the green.

[sizzlingdoom]

I'm sure Ozzie will do his best to keep the nucleus of this team together. The only one I see as an issue keeping is BWill and it will be on him to decide on his future. It will come down to whether he wants to stay here on a modest contract or if he wants to chase the green.

I say the way we've been wasting money and draft picks over the past several years, we might as well "waste"/pay a few extra millions to keep him. We HAVE to keep him. Sizzle is almost gone and BWIll/Mosely are set to lead the D. We instantly become SOFTER without him. Ravens start with stopping the run. We have to keep our build the D from the middle out mentality. Pierce+BWILL and Mosely is an amazing start to that. Just because he's not in position to put up big stats, doesn't mean anything. I think he's the most important player on D behind Sizzle. Then Weddle

[ibleedpurpleandblack]

I feel confident with more experience these young guys will become even better WHICH means we can competitive for the next several years!!

There are two guys who I think need mentioning as well - Brent Urban and Matthew Judon. There is also obviously something the team sees which is why Judon is not suited up every week but when he's in it seems he's always making plays and around the ball.

Just wish more of our young receivers and tight ends would step up!!!

[The Greek]

glad to see perriman and correia make the list. they have been studs thus far

[hereweare]

10 hours ago, cbrook1862 said:

Webb can go. He's done some good things, but too many time he has been a liability in coverage, whether he's covering somebody or offering help for the CB. With Webb's inconsistent play and age, Weddle's age, Elam not turning out how we thought, and Terrence Brooks not on the team anymore, we are thin and vulnerable at the safety position. Safety should be one of our biggest need this offseason.

3 hours ago, sizzlingdoom said:

I know I know, but can you imagine if we replaced Webb with Berry?

Since we dreaming lol Imagine if the cowboys draft day trade went through.... Weddle and Ramsey back there  ruthless. (no idea what the oline would look like but we talking safety right now! lol)

2 hours ago, Rav'n Maniac said:

I'm sure Ozzie will do his best to keep the nucleus of this team together. The only one I see as an issue keeping is BWill and it will be on him to decide on his future. It will come down to whether he wants to stay here on a modest contract or if he wants to chase the green.

The vibe I'm getting from virtually everyone on this board is either A) Bwill has played out of our price tag or B ) "sign him at all costs" lol
My question would be.. the instant reaction is that we draft DL too well and have depth at DL to pay for what BWill is going to get. Logical. But, we have paid top DT's (Ngata) in the past. So why not Bwill? It depends how vital they view BWill I guess?