The Perriman Thread

[BmoreBird22]

5 hours ago, Tru11 said:

when did perriman beat those guys?

his lone TD in his career came against an undrafted rookie CB lol.

im really to lazy to look it up but i bet that when i take torrey first 2 seasons and stack them up against perriman taking in consideration stats, competition and such that torrey will blow perriman away in everything.

im rooting as hard as i can for perriman to become a great player for us but so far he has not even earned the right to be in torrey shadow.

You talked about Torrey's first two seasons, but since Perriman has played nine games, as others have pointed out, we should look at nine games, in regards to your latest question.

Also, it isn't about nine games. I was saying, as others have, that Torrey didn't make these catches in four seasons here WITH four TCs, but Perriman does it in nine games (really one) with no TCs.

Understanding the thread as a whole is important for every post.

[BmoreBird22]

17 minutes ago, Tru11 said:

also perriman is taller then torrey.

he is supposed to be better at high pointing a ball and take it away from a defender.

So why is Darren Waller not better at that than OBJ (5'11")?

Also, I think the height difference is 1-2 inches, so nothing so significant that it'd give him a massive advantage 

Edited November 18, 2016 by BmoreBird22

[Tru11]

1 minute ago, BmoreBird22 said:

You talked about Torrey's first two seasons, but since Perriman has played nine games, as others have pointed out, we should look at nine games, in regards to your latest question.

Also, it isn't about nine games. I was saying, as others have, that Torrey didn't make these catches in four seasons here WITH four TCs, but Perriman does it in nine games (really one) with no TCs.

Understanding the thread as a whole is important for every post.

i dont see myself asking any question in this quote.

i dont even see the word consistency or mentioning of 9 weeks in that quote.

again where did i use any of the words you used in your awnser to the question i did not ask.
not even the person i asked the question to used any of those words.

seems to me you are just using your creative to put words in my mouth.

 

[Tru11]

2 minutes ago, BmoreBird22 said:

So why is Darren Waller not better at that than OBJ (5'11")?

Also, I think the height difference is 1-2 inches, so nothing so significant that it'd give him a massive advantage 

ask darren waller that.

he should be able to win any jump ball situation over OBJ.
if he cant then its on him.

again why are you putting words in my mouth?
where did i say he should have a massive advantage?

 

[redrum52]

You can call him what you want... Doesn't make it true.

[darklight1216]

Please be respectful of one another, everyone.

[kennethyamini1989]

wow this thread is still going? 

[BmoreBird22]

2 hours ago, Tru11 said:

ask darren waller that.

he should be able to win any jump ball situation over OBJ.
if he cant then its on him.

again why are you putting words in my mouth?
where did i say he should have a massive advantage?

Not like there's more to it, like vertical jumping ability, timing, concentration, or anything like that...

I never said you said he should have a massive advantage, but you said he should be better at it because he's taller, which equates to height being an advantage. I'm saying two inches is an inconsequential advantage.

From your post, anyone would rightfully infer that you are implying that height is an advantage. You can say something without saying it. That's one neat trick with the English language.

Edited November 18, 2016 by BmoreBird22

[Purple_City39]

5 hours ago, Tru11 said:

plays like?

 

His first catch in Buffalo.  The catch against Norman where Norman was on his back like a cape.  The TD against Cleveland.  Cleveland sucks but the body control, flexibility, and ball locating ability, along with the fact he trapped the ball with his hands alone, are things Torrey never did in one play.  I was a huge fan of Torrey and wished he'd have stayed, but they aren't comparable from a pure talent perspective 

[BmoreBird22]

1 hour ago, Tru11 said:

i dont see myself asking any question in this quote.

i dont even see the word consistency or mentioning of 9 weeks in that quote.

again where did i use any of the words you used in your awnser to the question i did not ask.
not even the person i asked the question to used any of those words.

seems to me you are just using your creative to put words in my mouth.

7 hours ago, Tru11 said:

when did perriman beat those guys?

his lone TD in his career came against an undrafted rookie CB lol.

im really to lazy to look it up but i bet that when i take torrey first 2 seasons and stack them up against perriman taking in consideration stats, competition and such that torrey will blow perriman away in everything.

im rooting as hard as i can for perriman to become a great player for us but so far he has not even earned the right to be in torrey shadow.

 

2 hours ago, Tru11 said:

So the situations you just described never happend with torrey?

Here- I'll break it down for you post by post.

As for your first post about mentioning nine weeks, you mentioned that Torrey's first two seasons would blow Perriman's out of the water. People retorted, rightfully so, that Perriman has played a whole nine games, thus making the whole idea of comparing 38 games to 9 (including the playoffs) an extremely unfair advantage clearly tipped in the favor of Torrey.

As for consistency, this goes back to the third post. You asked if it ever happened with Torrey. Torrey certainly had an impressive catch here or there, but it was with no consistency that he made these catches. Breshad has made several in nine short games (with no TC to boot), so this is where the idea of consistency comes into play. Perriman is doing it more frequently in nine games than Torrey did in four seasons in Baltimore. Also, again, the post about nine games comes into play because it's very impressive to see a receiver who was considered incredibly raw make some of the plays he did only nine games into his career.

And I'm about to drop a real groundbreaking bomb here for you... Sometimes when you make a post, people will give a retort that fits the context of the post, but not necessarily use the same wording. BOOM. Amazing. What's even crazier is that you don't even have to ask an a question to get a reply. Mind is blown. WOW.

Now, why are the above different than you asking the question about all passes to Torrey being perfect? Since this discussion started today, no one (that I saw, I know I definitely didn't) mentioned quarterback play. We're talking about their play independent of the quarterback, so there's zero chance you could even make an inference about anyone saying Torrey had perfect quarterback play or anything close. 

Do you now understand how a message board works?

Edited November 18, 2016 by BmoreBird22

[Tru11]

59 minutes ago, BmoreBird22 said:

 

Here- I'll break it down for you post by post.

As for your first post about mentioning nine weeks, you mentioned that Torrey's first two seasons would blow Perriman's out of the water. People retorted, rightfully so, that Perriman has played a whole nine games, thus making the whole idea of comparing 38 games to 9 (including the playoffs) an extremely unfair advantage clearly tipped in the favor of Torrey.

As for consistency, this goes back to the third post. You asked if it ever happened with Torrey. Torrey certainly had an impressive catch here or there, but it was with no consistency that he made these catches. Breshad has made several in nine short games (with no TC to boot), so this is where the idea of consistency comes into play. Perriman is doing it more frequently in nine games than Torrey did in four seasons in Baltimore. Also, again, the post about nine games comes into play because it's very impressive to see a receiver who was considered incredibly raw make some of the plays he did only nine games into his career.

And I'm about to drop a real groundbreaking bomb here for you... Sometimes when you make a post, people will give a retort that fits the context of the post, but not necessarily use the same wording. BOOM. Amazing. What's even crazier is that you don't even have to ask an a question to get a reply. Mind is blown. WOW.

Now, why are the above different than you asking the question about all passes to Torrey being perfect? Since this discussion started today, no one (that I saw, I know I definitely didn't) mentioned quarterback play. We're talking about their play independent of the quarterback, so there's zero chance you could even make an inference about anyone saying Torrey had perfect quarterback play or anything close. 

Do you now understand how a message board works?

 

you dont decide for me what my intention is with any post.

my question was related to what i quoted and that alone.

that is the point of using quotes.

you quote the part that you want to reply to.

unlike you i dont have the passion nor the dedication to keeps tabs on what everyone is saying at any point in any thread.

i quote what i want to reply to and go with that.

my discussion was with the mod and my question thus was directed at him based on what he said in that specific text that i quoted.

if you want to jump in and make up your own stuff based on what you think someone else meant then thats on you.
unless you can quote specifically where i said anything that you used in your awnser to my questionn that was not directed at you, dont go and put words in my mouth on what you think that i meant.

if i want to ask a general question i will do that , if i want to be very specific i will do that just.
english is not my first language but its not so bad that i need people like you to decide what i meant or what i dont meant.

 

Edited November 18, 2016 by Tru11

[Deflated Football]

1 hour ago, kennethyamini1989 said:

wow this thread is still going? 

It's your fault lol

[Tru11]

1 hour ago, BmoreBird22 said:

Not like there's more to it, like vertical jumping ability, timing, concentration, or anything like that...

I never said he should have a massive advantage, but you said he should be better at it because he's taller, which equates to height being an advantage. I'm saying two inches is an inconsequential advantage.

From your post, anyone would rightfully infer that you are implying that height is an advantage. You can say something without saying it. That's one neat trick with the English language.

height is an advantage.

a taller person supposed to have and advantage over a smaller person in a jump ball situation.

that advantage should increase when the difference in height increases.

a 6`2 WR going against a 6`0 corner should have an advantage over a 6`0 WR going against a 6`0 corner.

if you are 5`10 would you rather go up against OBJ , AJ Green or Calvin Johnson in a jump ball situation?

 

 

Edited November 18, 2016 by Tru11

[usmccharles]

41 minutes ago, Tru11 said:

height is an advantage.

a taller person supposed to have and advantage over a smaller person in a jump ball situation.

that advantage should increase when the difference in height increases.

a 6`2 WR going against a 6`0 corner should have an advantage over a 6`0 WR going against a 6`0 corner.

if you are 5`10 would you rather go up against OBJ , AJ Green or Calvin Johnson in a jump ball situation?

Just to add fuel to the fire, vertical is more important when you are talking about a difference of 3" or so, imo.  I had about a 37" vertical when I played ball but im short, I could easily out rebound guys taller than me. 

[Tru11]

3 minutes ago, usmccharles said:

Just to add fuel to the fire, vertical is more important when you are talking about a difference of 3" or so, imo.  I had about a 37" vertical when I played ball but im short, I could easily out rebound guys taller than me. 

stop playing with bums and find better players?

[Ravensfan23]

5 hours ago, BmoreBird22 said:

To this point, if Joe throws it almost immediately off the snap, like a fade, and Perriman gets stymied at the snap, then sure, it's Perriman's fault. But if Perriman struggles off the line, but still gets downfield and Joe overthrows him as he's getting downfield and has his man beat, then that's on Joe.

It depends. Not just Perriman but any WR. You still have to give the QB a favorable target at the top of the route. If you beat your man downfield but you don't stack the DB or leave enough room on the sideline than the WR coach is probably blaming the WR. 

But my post wasn't to imply that Perriman or Joe deserves or don't deserve blame for miscommunication early on. I was just saying that even though Perriman isn't putting up great numbers, you can see how well he's developing imo and if that continues I think he'll be head and shoulders above Torrey. And that's no knock to Torrey. 

[BmoreBird22]

6 hours ago, Tru11 said:

 

you dont decide for me what my intention is with any post.

my question was related to what i quoted and that alone.

that is the point of using quotes.

you quote the part that you want to reply to.

unlike you i dont have the passion nor the dedication to keeps tabs on what everyone is saying at any point in any thread.

i quote what i want to reply to and go with that.

my discussion was with the mod and my question thus was directed at him based on what he said in that specific text that i quoted.

if you want to jump in and make up your own stuff based on what you think someone else meant then thats on you.
unless you can quote specifically where i said anything that you used in your awnser to my questionn that was not directed at you, dont go and put words in my mouth on what you think that i meant.

if i want to ask a general question i will do that , if i want to be very specific i will do that just.
english is not my first language but its not so bad that i need people like you to decide what i meant or what i dont meant.

You are correct, but maybe if you were more clear and chose your words better, there wouldn't be room for interpretation or any inferences. Notice how when you asked about throwing perfect passes to Torrey you couldn't find evidence to show that you didn't pull that claim out of your butt, but when you make these claims, I can quote you and connect the dots for you to show you how these conclusions are reached?

Or maybe this entire thread happened in like an hour for a lot of this, so I read a post and then have a memory of what someone said an hour ago. Crazy, right?

You have quoted me and replied to me, but given that this is an ongoing discussion, isolating any single post throughout a discussion and saying that that's the only post that matters is highly stupid because that's not how it works. It's an on going discussion and all is fair game.

And I replied to what you quoted for the mod (maybe, not entirely sure, but I quoted you at some point) and you chose to reply. Also, this is a discussion board with hundreds of members, so more people may reply to you.

Again, you don't have to say something explicitly for there to be another meaning or to imply something. Like with your saying Perriman should be better at jump balls than Torrey because he's taller, you implied height is an advantage. Did you come out and say that? No, but you acknowledged that's part of what you meant. So, no, it doesn't just stop always at, "This is what I said and that's that." We can take inferences and implied meanings and use them in discussion.

If you don't want people deciding what you said, don't leave any room for interpretation. I was able to pull posts and show you exactly how someone would connect the dots, but when you said something along the lines of, "So Torrey got perfect passes always?", we know you pulled that out of your butt because you can't pull that anywhere from my posts because I left no room for anyone to misinterpret that I was talking about quarterback play. See how that works? Also, I hope you see the irony in that post and then you coming here saying, "Don't put words in my mouth." In like 95% of the "discussions" I see you having, that's exactly what you do.

Edited November 19, 2016 by BmoreBird22

[BmoreBird22]

1 hour ago, Tru11 said:

height is an advantage.

a taller person supposed to have and advantage over a smaller person in a jump ball situation.

that advantage should increase when the difference in height increases.

a 6`2 WR going against a 6`0 corner should have an advantage over a 6`0 WR going against a 6`0 corner.

if you are 5`10 would you rather go up against OBJ , AJ Green or Calvin Johnson in a jump ball situation?

To answer that question, I'd want to go against AJ Green because OBJ has a vertical that is about 10 inches higher than that of Green, so the height advantage is irrelevant. Johnson has a vertical that's actually two inches less than OBJ, for the record.

This is why talking heights is entirely irrelevant. OBJ is a good four or five inches shorter than AJ Green, but if they jumped side by side, OBJ would be up higher. 

So, no, a smaller person isn't supposed to have a huge advantage over the smaller person.

[Ravensfan23]

5 hours ago, Tru11 said:

So the situations you just described never happend with torrey?

 

I'm not saying it didn't happen with Torrey. What i'm saying is that Torrey didn't do it consistent enough and rarely did he run strong routes. Of course with Perriman it's a very small sample size, but he's showing traits of a #1 WR and that's what the Ravens have been looking for. Hopefully he is that guy. Torrey was great though. I really wanted him to stay and be apart of this team for a long time. 

Let me ask you, do you feel Torrey was a #1 for this team or would have been moving forward?

[gtalk12]

3 hours ago, kennethyamini1989 said:

wow this thread is still going? 

YOUR FAULT

[Cillmatic]

Yo mods,  mind closing this thread? It's getting REALLY pointless.

Edited November 19, 2016 by Cillmatic

[BmoreBird22]

42 minutes ago, Cillmatic said:

Yo mods,  mind closing this thread? It's getting REALLY pointless.

I concur

[Moderator 3]

Stop posting and it'll close itself.

[redrum52]

5 hours ago, Tru11 said:

stop playing with bums and find better players?

Lol

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

On 11/18/2016 at 2:27 PM, Tru11 said:

dear god have we sunken so low that people are now impressed with catches that are not inbound?

also i take any of torrey 2 TDs against champ in the afc championship game over those you have described.
id take torrey game winning TD against the steelers at heinz field after he had a big drop on the previous play.

his entire performance against the pats on the day his brother died is probably the most impressive game i ever seen a ravens receiver play given the circumstances.
interestingly in that game he made a great leaping TD catch high pointing the ball.
he also had a pretty nice run after the catch.
not to mention he made a pretty good diving catch that went for a TD with a defender all over him.

 

 

so you are confirming that torrey did indeed face the situations that perriman has faced as in the mods description?

yes or no is enough.

also perriman is taller then torrey.
he is supposed to be better at high pointing a ball and take it away from a defender.

 

Whether he got the toe in or not isn't the point. 

The athletic ability it took to CATCH the ball was impressive. It's not about the individual play and the result, but the fact that his athletic ability and talents allow your QB to make throws and for him to make catches that most other WRs in the NFL just cannot. 

And ok, take whatever game or catches of Torrey's you want. The ones I pointed out had a higher level of difficulty. 

Perriman is showing the potential to be able to do more things, make more difficult catches and be available as a higher volume pass catcher as well. 

 

And besides having TC's under his belt that Perriman hasn't had, Torrey was also a big part of the offense from day 1. He didn't have SSS, Wallace and Aiken ahead of him. He had Boldin. Walked right in as the #2 since Lee Evans was hurt. 

By next year, maybe even the end of this season I expect this not to even be a conversation. I'm confident Perriman will become a true #1 that can do it all and routinely go over 1,000 yds and 8 or so TDs. 

[-Truth-]

There's no way to compare Breshad Perriman and Torrey Smith objectively at this juncture as far as production is concerned. Could we discuss their skill sets? To some degree. Otherwise, we're 9 games into Perriman's career after 2 significant injury scares that cost him both offseasons and we're throwing out Smith's games from his 2nd season that came with at least 18 games under his belt, somehow comparing the two on an even scale. Let's not get carried away here.

[kennethyamini1989]

He's a bust at  this point. 

[reed20]

Not every team is the Cleveland Browns, eh Perriman?

[kennethyamini1989]

On 11/18/2016 at 5:53 PM, Ravensfan23 said:

I'm not saying it didn't happen with Torrey. What i'm saying is that Torrey didn't do it consistent enough and rarely did he run strong routes. Of course with Perriman it's a very small sample size, but he's showing traits of a #1 WR and that's what the Ravens have been looking for. Hopefully he is that guy. Torrey was great though. I really wanted him to stay and be apart of this team for a long time. 

Let me ask you, do you feel Torrey was a #1 for this team or would have been moving forward?

He was a strong #2...#1, no, but I feel like part of the problem is the QB and lack of a running game. When Ravens had a running game. Torrey was right there with the #1s, if not #1. 

[LosT_in_TranSlatioN]

3 minutes ago, reed20 said:

Not every team is the Cleveland Browns, eh Perriman?

It'd help if they actually targeted him eh reed20? 

 

I only caught the second half but he got open a few times. No looks whatsoever