Week 9: The Good, Bad and Ugly vent thread

[trevorsteadman]

4 minutes ago, jimmypowder said:

Our D played great but can we please hold on to some easy interceptions?? 

Webb,Weddle,Mosley all should have had picks. 

We should have picked Ben off 4 times in this game. 

I agree and Orr was close to having one right at the beginning of the game. Honestly we need to catch those. This game shouldn't of been as close as it was. Defense played fantastic but it could've been better. This game shouldn't of been 1 score we could've been up 40. 

[nextgen_RavensFan]

1 hour ago, jazz1988 said:

CJ Mosley was great in coverage that guy may end up with 7 interceptions or something before the season ends.

If we would have had the ball bounce our way we would be leading the league in int's. Yesterday Weddle was so surprised that the ball was given as a gift that he could not hold onto it. I almost cried laughing as i know that feeling. I am so proud of our defense. 

[jimmypowder]

Just now, nextgen_RavensFan said:

If we would have had the ball bounce our way we would be leading the league in int's. Yesterday Weddle was so surprised that the ball was given as a gift that he could not hold onto it. I almost cried laughing as i know that feeling. I am so proud of our defense. 

Ed Reed would have never missed that ball,ever. Nor the one Webb should have caught. 

[trevorsteadman]

1 minute ago, BmoreBird22 said:

As far as the above goes on Pees, one thing I noticed was a ton of single high safety looks. Weddle was mostly in the box or in the slot with Webb playing deep. The Ravens crowded the LoS and basically said, "Beat us deep."

Eventually, a team is going to figure it out because Pees did not stray from that. The Ravens sold out to stop Bell and often rotated bracket coverage on Brown, but they were willing to give up the deep portions of the field.

And I think part of it is people's expectations. Defense doesn't give up a third down until five minutes until the fourth. No one reasonably expects that to keep up, but it just makes it look worse when it happens a few times in the fourth and not in the first three.

Also, the Ravens really need a consistent edge rusher because a lot of Ben's big fourth quarter shots came from busted plays where interior pressure collapsed the pocket, but outside rushers were no where to be found.

Yep and that is why the Steelers started moving the ball in the 4th. Most their completions were for like 20-25 yards to Eli Rodgers and a few to Antonio Brown. It worked early because you can tell something was wrong with Big Ben. Inaccurate passes led to our defense looking better than it really was at some points. Usually he would hit those but that is what happens when you play your QB 20 days after a surgery that is said to take 4-5 weeks to heal. 

But I am starting to get excited for Judon. Za'Darius Smith has been pretty bad but Judon getting 3 sacks in two games makes me feel better about our pass rush. 

[trevorsteadman]

1 minute ago, jimmypowder said:

Ed Reed would have never missed that ball,ever. Nor the one Webb should have caught. 

Or the one Mosley had and the one Orr almost had lol.... Too many missed opportunities. It's like our defense didn't want Big Ben benched at halftime so they let a couple slide in fear of Landry Jones stepping in and lighting us up lmao.

[Sami84]

3 minutes ago, trevorsteadman said:

Or the one Mosley had and the one Orr almost had lol.... Too many missed opportunities. It's like our defense didn't want Big Ben benched at halftime so they let a couple slide in fear of Landry Jones stepping in and lighting us up lmao.

 

actually when judon sacked geno smith and injured him i said..its over now..fitz will win the game for them.

[ravensdfan]

7 hours ago, BOLDnPurPnBlacK said:

We barely got pressure all game. We blitzed sparingly, so rushing 3-4 guys was exactly what he did all game. 

And the DBs decide how far off the line they start their drop. No defensive play call indicates press at the line or drop 10 yds. 

Thats a decision each individual DB makes based on his match up and the WR alignment. 

Nothing at all to do with Pees. 

All the Pees defenders make this claim and it is just pure horse hockey. Are you trying to say that one of the questions for any DB before they come here is "Do you give a bazillion yard cushion in the 4th quarter with the game on the line? No? Oh I'm sorry, you can't play here then. Thanks for coming in."

You see, it isn't about keeping the play in front of you, everyone gets that. It is about keeping the play so far in front of you, that you have zero chance of coming forward to make the tackle before they gain a zillion yards and have zero chance of ever making any play on the ball or breaking it up. This is what Pees does in the 4th almost without exception. Your statement is most likely a fact throughout the game, but with the consistency that we give those insane cushions, that is definitely a Pees' call. I do not believe that every DB we've ever had since Pees came here chooses to give those crazy cushions. It defies any logic.

[rmw10]

8 minutes ago, BmoreBird22 said:

As far as the above goes on Pees, one thing I noticed was a ton of single high safety looks. Weddle was mostly in the box or in the slot with Webb playing deep. The Ravens crowded the LoS and basically said, "Beat us deep."

Eventually, a team is going to figure it out because Pees did not stray from that. The Ravens sold out to stop Bell and often rotated bracket coverage on Brown, but they were willing to give up the deep portions of the field.

And I think part of it is people's expectations. Defense doesn't give up a third down until five minutes until the fourth. No one reasonably expects that to keep up, but it just makes it look worse when it happens a few times in the fourth and not in the first three.

Also, the Ravens really need a consistent edge rusher because a lot of Ben's big fourth quarter shots came from busted plays where interior pressure collapsed the pocket, but outside rushers were no where to be found.

I think that worked because we were dominating them in man coverage.  Ben certainly wasn't sharp, but he also didn't have many places to throw the ball.

We started giving up the yards and first downs in the 4th when we moved to the soft zone.  They abandoned the "beat us deep" thing which was the smart move.  If they were going to move the ball on us, let them run down the clock while they do it instead of hitting the bomb and giving a chance at more possessions.

I definitely get the argument that sometimes the soft defense is too soft, but regardless of what some people think, it's a smart move to start giving up chunks.

[rmw10]

2 minutes ago, ravensdfan said:

All the Pees defenders make this claim and it is just pure horse hockey. Are you trying to say that one of the questions for any DB before they come here is "Do you give a bazillion yard cushion in the 4th quarter with the game on the line? No? Oh I'm sorry, you can't play here then. Thanks for coming in."

You see, it isn't about keeping the play in front of you, everyone gets that. It is about keeping the play so far in front of you, that you have zero chance of coming forward to make the tackle before they gain a zillion yards and have zero chance of ever making any play on the ball or breaking it up. This is what Pees does in the 4th almost without exception. Your statement is most likely a fact throughout the game, but with the consistency that we give those insane cushions, that is definitely a Pees' call. I do not believe that every DB we've ever had since Pees came here chooses to give those crazy cushions. It defies any logic.

Someone clearly doesn't understand how zone coverages work...

[trevorsteadman]

4 minutes ago, Sami84 said:

actually when judon sacked geno smith and injured him i said..its over now..fitz will win the game for them.

I said the exact same thing during the game. 

[BmoreBird22]

15 minutes ago, trevorsteadman said:

Yep and that is why the Steelers started moving the ball in the 4th. Most their completions were for like 20-25 yards to Eli Rodgers and a few to Antonio Brown. It worked early because you can tell something was wrong with Big Ben. Inaccurate passes led to our defense looking better than it really was at some points. Usually he would hit those but that is what happens when you play your QB 20 days after a surgery that is said to take 4-5 weeks to heal. 

But I am starting to get excited for Judon. Za'Darius Smith has been pretty bad but Judon getting 3 sacks in two games makes me feel better about our pass rush. 

Ben wasn't great by any stretch, but whoever lined up across from Jimmy was blanked. He was just like glue.

That allowed Webb and Weddle to rotate over to Tavon and Powers. The corners all had outstanding games.

[BmoreBird22]

9 minutes ago, rmw10 said:

Someone clearly doesn't understand how zone coverages work...

I'd be curious to see if she actually charts the average drop depths.

[rmw10]

2 minutes ago, BmoreBird22 said:

Ben wasn't great by any stretch, but whoever lined up across from Jimmy was blanked. He was just like glue.

That allowed Webb and Weddle to rotate over to Tavon and Powers. The corners all had outstanding games.

I mentioned it earlier in this thread, but Powers has been somewhat of an unsung hero since Young moved outside and opened up the slot role.  He might not be doing anything spectacular, but he's doing his job and doing it well.   Far cry from his struggles over the summer.

[BmoreBird22]

Just now, rmw10 said:

I mentioned it earlier in this thread, but Powers has been somewhat of an unsung hero since Young moved outside and opened up the slot role.  He might not be doing anything spectacular, but he's doing his job and doing it well.   Far cry from his struggles over the summer.

I think a lot of that is him actually being used in the slot and having Weddle behind him.

[trevorsteadman]

4 minutes ago, BmoreBird22 said:

Ben wasn't great by any stretch, but whoever lined up across from Jimmy was blanked. He was just like glue.

That allowed Webb and Weddle to rotate over to Tavon and Powers. The corners all had outstanding games.

Jimmy Smith is the most underrated guy in the NFL. He only had a bad season last year because of an injury which is everything when you are a corner and have to react to receivers. And I agree all corners played well. I was afraid seeing Young start outside and heard that Wright was inactive but Young surprised me. I gave him a yard time for that big play against Odell but honestly that was a bad play call defensively to begin with. 

2 minutes ago, rmw10 said:

I mentioned it earlier in this thread, but Powers has been somewhat of an unsung hero since Young moved outside and opened up the slot role.  He might not be doing anything spectacular, but he's doing his job and doing it well.   Far cry from his struggles over the summer.

I agree he made some key tackles but it did scare me because they weren't the cleanest tackles. He was always in the right place at the right time hopefully he can start wrapping up better to make me feel better about myself lol

[BmoreBird22]

15 minutes ago, rmw10 said:

I think that worked because we were dominating them in man coverage.  Ben certainly wasn't sharp, but he also didn't have many places to throw the ball.

We started giving up the yards and first downs in the 4th when we moved to the soft zone.  They abandoned the "beat us deep" thing which was the smart move.  If they were going to move the ball on us, let them run down the clock while they do it instead of hitting the bomb and giving a chance at more possessions.

I definitely get the argument that sometimes the soft defense is too soft, but regardless of what some people think, it's a smart move to start giving up chunks.

I think the biggest thing for me is that it wasn't the zone defense; it was a total ineptitude to rushing the passer. 

Ben was having so much time and so easily to just move outside the pocket and it really made the Ravens pay. I think if the Ravens had a 2014 style duo of Suggs and Doom, this defense would be tops in the league and you don't see those chunks.

[trevorsteadman]

1 minute ago, BmoreBird22 said:

I think a lot of that is him actually being used in the slot and having Weddle behind him.

I knew we were getting a steal in free agency and I was actually surprised he was struggling early but I think he may have finally found his niche in this defense. 

[BmoreBird22]

Just now, trevorsteadman said:

Jimmy Smith is the most underrated guy in the NFL. He only had a bad season last year because of an injury which is everything when you are a corner and have to react to receivers. And I agree all corners played well. I was afraid seeing Young start outside and heard that Wright was inactive but Young surprised me. I gave him a yard time for that big play against Odell but honestly that was a bad play call defensively to begin with. 

I agree he made some key tackles but it did scare me because they weren't the cleanest tackles. He was always in the right place at the right time hopefully he can start wrapping up better to make me feel better about myself lol

With Young, apparently he allowed seven catches on 11 targets for just 42 yards. 

They were trying to avoid Jimmy on Brown, so Young ended up with him more often than not, but he more than held his own.

[rmw10]

Just now, BmoreBird22 said:

I think the biggest thing for me is that it wasn't the zone defense; it was a total ineptitude to rushing the passer. 

Ben was having so much time and so easily to just move outside the pocket and it really made the Ravens pay. I think if the Ravens had a 2014 style duo of Suggs and Doom, this defense would be tops in the league and you don't see those chunks.

That definitely showed up a few times in the 4th Q.  When the pass rush was getting some push, the Steelers were getting the dinks and dunks that you typically give up in zone.  When there was no pass rush, that's when they were getting the big chunks.

My main point was that the secondary just didn't fall flat like many people (not you) seem to believe.  The secondary as a whole played an outstanding game.

[trevorsteadman]

2 minutes ago, BmoreBird22 said:

I think the biggest thing for me is that it wasn't the zone defense; it was a total ineptitude to rushing the passer. 

Ben was having so much time and so easily to just move outside the pocket and it really made the Ravens pay. I think if the Ravens had a 2014 style duo of Suggs and Doom, this defense would be tops in the league and you don't see those chunks.

It's sad to think that we may not have that pressure ever again.. Luckily we are finally getting pressure from the interior. Jernigan has been a godsend this season and it helps when Pierce is pushing their entire o-line as well. I don't think we see Doom play like Doom unless he comes back and we are in the playoffs. It's going to take him a long time to come back. Pass rushers are hard to come by and Suggs' days are limited. 

[BmoreBird22]

1 minute ago, rmw10 said:

That definitely showed up a few times in the 4th Q.  When the pass rush was getting some push, the Steelers were getting the dinks and dunks that you typically give up in zone.  When there was no pass rush, that's when they were getting the big chunks.

My main point was that the secondary just didn't fall flat like many people (not you) seem to believe.  The secondary as a whole played an outstanding game.

I also don't think it's some brand of Pees defense.

It's pretty absurd for a defense to only give up zero third downs before the fourth. That won't ever hold for rhe entire game.

[jboy19]

41 minutes ago, VermontRaven said:

While you can debate personnel groups, I loved the idea of bringing in an extra lineman to "protect Joe at all cost"  Maybe Hurst is the best man for the job in that situation, rather than moving Lewis or Yanda around and bringing in Urschel. (Jensen and Ducasse were inactive so those were the only options with an extra lineman)

I think he was only in because Gillmore was out and Maxx was on IR. From what I saw, he didnt bring much as a blocker. My issue is that we kept running formations with him that weren't working. 

[rmw10]

6 minutes ago, jboy19 said:

I think he was only in because Gillmore was out and Maxx was on IR. From what I saw, he didnt bring much as a blocker. My issue is that we kept running formations with him that weren't working. 

It was definitely only because Gillmore was out and Pitta is about as bad of a blocking TE as you'll see.  I'm hoping Gillmore is back, but with a short week, you might see Hurst out there as the blocker again.  You can tell they just didn't want to make a roster move at TE.

[trevorsteadman]

3 minutes ago, rmw10 said:

It was definitely only because Gillmore was out and Pitta is about as bad of a blocking TE as you'll see.  I'm hoping Gillmore is back, but with a short week, you might see Hurst out there as the blocker again.  You can tell they just didn't want to make a roster move at TE.

I actually liked what I saw from Waller didn't he have a couple catches? It was only 17 yards but he was getting open. More than we have really seen from Gillmore all year. 

[rmw10]

18 minutes ago, trevorsteadman said:

I actually liked what I saw from Waller didn't he have a couple catches? It was only 17 yards but he was getting open. More than we have really seen from Gillmore all year. 

I was referring more to the blocking aspect of TE, in this case.

[rudywasoffsides]

Y'all loved to crucify Michael Oher when he got penalized, but I don't think he ever got flagged 4 times in one game like Stanley did yesterday, even when he was a rookie for us. We should have traded up for Ramsey or Elliott because Stanley doesn't know how to block without being penalized. When he can even make it on the field he hasn't had a game all year without a penalty. Bring on the negs for frying our golden boy future franchise cornerstone of a left tackle...

[rmw10]

2 minutes ago, rudywasoffsides said:

Y'all loved to crucify Michael Oher when he got penalized, but I don't think he ever got flagged 4 times in one game like Stanley did yesterday, even when he was a rookie for us. We should have traded up for Ramsey or Elliott because Stanley doesn't know how to block without being penalized. When he can even make it on the field he hasn't had a game all year without a penalty. Bring on the negs for frying our golden boy future franchise cornerstone of a left tackle...

Yeah because 1 game defines a career...

Harbaugh actually addressed this after the game.  He said Ronnie's footwork was a little rusty coming off a foot injury, so he was trying to compensate in other areas to make up for the deficiencies there.  It certainly wasn't a good game for him, but it sounds like they know what the problem was already.

[jboy19]

25 minutes ago, rudywasoffsides said:

Y'all loved to crucify Michael Oher when he got penalized, but I don't think he ever got flagged 4 times in one game like Stanley did yesterday, even when he was a rookie for us. We should have traded up for Ramsey or Elliott because Stanley doesn't know how to block without being penalized. When he can even make it on the field he hasn't had a game all year without a penalty. Bring on the negs for frying our golden boy future franchise cornerstone of a left tackle...

Honestly, I wasn't too surprised with the rustiness. Despite the penalties, Stanley has the potential to be a great blocker and hasn't had nearly the same struggles Oher had on the left side. 

[DenverRaven]

27 minutes ago, rudywasoffsides said:

Y'all loved to crucify Michael Oher when he got penalized, but I don't think he ever got flagged 4 times in one game like Stanley did yesterday, even when he was a rookie for us. We should have traded up for Ramsey or Elliott because Stanley doesn't know how to block without being penalized. When he can even make it on the field he hasn't had a game all year without a penalty. Bring on the negs for frying our golden boy future franchise cornerstone of a left tackle...

You do realize we'd have no LT right now, right? Like, we'd literally have Hurst out there every game.

The negs are because you don't seem to understand how hard LT is to pick up. The fact that Stanley is out there starting, with a rookie LG next to him is pretty much unheard of. The Ravens were the first team to start a rookie at LT and LG in 25 years. They aren't prefect? Whine harder, because otherwise you get Hurst as a permanent fixture. He also missed the last 4 games with an injury. Pretty sure an 80% Stanley is still better than Hurst.

Edited November 7, 2016 by DenverRaven

[JoeyFlex5]

1 hour ago, ravensdfan said:

All the Pees defenders make this claim and it is just pure horse hockey. Are you trying to say that one of the questions for any DB before they come here is "Do you give a bazillion yard cushion in the 4th quarter with the game on the line? No? Oh I'm sorry, you can't play here then. Thanks for coming in."

You see, it isn't about keeping the play in front of you, everyone gets that. It is about keeping the play so far in front of you, that you have zero chance of coming forward to make the tackle before they gain a zillion yards and have zero chance of ever making any play on the ball or breaking it up. This is what Pees does in the 4th almost without exception. Your statement is most likely a fact throughout the game, but with the consistency that we give those insane cushions, that is definitely a Pees' call. I do not believe that every DB we've ever had since Pees came here chooses to give those crazy cushions. It defies any logic.

Not a pees defender but it's true. The dbs choose their depth. The problem is the philosophy. At the end of the game we take what was working and then scrap it. Off man and tight zones and mixed blitzes work for 3 quarters and then suddenly we play soft zones and 4 Man rushes and get wrecked. But the dbs DO choose their depth.