2017-Big board

[Darhk_Raven]

4 hours ago, JO_75 said:

Interesting to see if this changes his draft stock. Maybe he falls to us at 16?

Ian Rapaport thinks he's still a top 10 guy.

[ravensnation5220]

Pre combine big board: 

I left qbs and players with off feild issues. Note some players may be ranked lower than they should because of off feild issues ( either character or injury)

1. Myles Garrett
2. Deshaun watson
3. Jonathan Allen
4. Solomon Thomas
5. Jamal Adams
6. Malik hooker
7. Reuben Foster
8. Leonard Fournette
9. Jalen Tabor
10. Derek Barnett
11. Corey Davis
12. Marshon lattimore
13. Mike Williams
14. Sidney Jones
15. Oj Howard
16. Quincy Wilson
17. Taco Charlton
18. Marlon Humphrey
19. Dalvin Cook
20. Forrest Lamp
21. Takk McKinley
22. Cam Robinson
23. Malik McDowell
24. John ross
25. Haason Reddick
26. David Njoku
27. Zach Cunningham
28. Tim Williams
29. Mitch trubisky
30. Christian mccafrey
31. Jabrill Peppers
32. Tre davious white
33. Adoree jackson
34. Carl lawson
35. Obi melifonwu
36. Gareon conley
37. Jourdan Lewis
38. Dan Feeney
39. Jarrad Davis
40. Tj watt
41. Budda baker
42. Cooper kupp
43. Montravious Adams
44. Alvin kamara
45. Zay Jones
46. Fabian Moreau
47. Pat elfien
48. Garrett Bolles
49. Cordrea tankersly
50. Desmond king
 

[rossihunter2]

I'm nearly ready to post a big board here but i'm not sure how deep to go in terms of numbers... I don't know whether to do the top 32 or a top 50 or a top 64 or a top 100/102 or something like that...

[JoeyFlex5]

28 minutes ago, rossihunter2 said:

I'm nearly ready to post a big board here but i'm not sure how deep to go in terms of numbers... I don't know whether to do the top 32 or a top 50 or a top 64 or a top 100/102 or something like that...

Most team oriented big boards can cover 2 rounds worth of possibilities with 30-40 players. If you're talking league wide big boards with zero positIons in mind then it's a different story

[rossihunter2]

50 minutes ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

Most team oriented big boards can cover 2 rounds worth of possibilities with 30-40 players. If you're talking league wide big boards with zero positIons in mind then it's a different story

I guess it's more of a personally inflected Baltimore board but then again isn't everyone's?

ill think on it some more and maybe just post as far down my board (currently up to about 130) as I feel I've watched enough of a player to make a decent representation of their value vs people I have around similar spots - so maybe like the first 70-80... I shall think on this and maybe post tomorrow

[RavensDieHard21]

I want to do another board, but combine will shatter it quickly lol

[rossihunter2]

here it is then - i decided to do top 50 because i couldn't decide where to cut it off (my board currently goes up to 121 without qbs)

 

1	Myles Garrett	EDGE
2	Jonathan Allen	DL
3	Jamal Adams	S
4	Reuben Foster	ILB
5	Malik Hooker	S
6	Derek Barnett	EDGE
7	Marshon Lattimore	CB
8	Solomon Thomas	DL
9	Sidney Jones	CB
10	Corey Davis	WR
11	Mike Williams	WR
12	Dalvin Cook	RB
13	Quincy Wilson	CB
14	Charles Harris	EDGE
15	Leonard Fournette	RB
16	Malik Mcdowell	DL
17	Ryan Ramcyzk	OL
18	Dan Feeney	OL
19	Tim Williams	EDGE
20	Budda Baker	S
21	Forest Lamp	OL
22	Cam Robinson	OL
23	TJ Watt	EDGE
24	OJ Howard	TE
25	Gareon Conley	CB
26	John Ross	WR
27	Tradavius White	CB
28	Garrett Bolles	OL
29	Carl Lawson	EDGE
30	Taco Charlton	EDGE
31	Desmond King	CB
32	Teez Tabor	CB
33	Takk Mckinley	EDGE
34	Jabrill Peppers	S
35	Hasson Reddick	EDGE
36	Christian Mccaffrey	RB
37	Pat Elflein	OL
38	David Njoku	TE
39	Zay Jones	WR
40	Adoree Jackson	CB
41	Ryan Anderson	EDGE
42	Zach Cunningham	ILB
43	Cooper Kupp	WR
44	Ethan Pocic	OL
45	Obi Melifonwu	S
46	Marlon Humphrey	CB
47	Fabian Moreau	CB
48	Jourdan Lewis	CB
49	Evan Engram	TE
50	Jarrad Davis	ILB

 

this will inevitably keep changing as i fall in and out of love with prospects depending on the tape i watch, my feelings about need, and what skills i prioritise over others - this board does not include qbs for obvious reasons but i imagine at least 4 qbs will be gone by the time we pick in the 2nd and maybe 1 or two more by the time we pick in the 3rd

even as i type im having a couple of feelings about certain guys over certain other guys lol already and i haven't even posted yet so im gonna post before i decide to change my mind

[jboy19]

Here are my top 32 (not considering position/off-field issues/injuries- except for tiebreakers; out of 113 currently reviewed prospects): 

1. Myles Garrett, DE/OLB, Texas A&M
2. Jonathan Allen, DE, Alabama
3. Jamal Adams, S, LSU
4. Reuben Foster, ILB, Alabama
5. Dalvin Cook, HB, Florida State
6. Leonard Fournette, HB, LSU
7. Marshon Lattimore, CB, Ohio State
8. Malik Hooker, S, Ohio State
9. Solomon Thomas, DE, Stanford
10. Derek Barnett, DE, Tennessee
11. Quincy Wilson, CB, Florida
12. Dan Feeney, OG, Indiana
13. Garrett Bolles, OT, Utah
14. Corey Davis, WR, Western Michigan
15. O.J. Howard, TE, Alabama
16. Mike Williams, WR, Clemson
17. Christian McCaffrey, RB, Stanford
18. Sidney Jones, CB, Washington
19. Charles Harris, DE/OLB, Missouri
20. Haason Reddick, LB, Temple
21. Ryan Ramczyk, OT, Wisconsin
22. David Njoku, TE, Miami
23. John Ross, WR, Washington
24. Tim Williams, OLB, Alabama
25. Malik McDowell, DT, Michigan State
26. D'Onta Foreman, HB, Texas
27. Joe Mixon, HB, Oklahoma
28. Forrest Lamp, OG/OT, Western Kentucky
29. Taco Charlton, DE/OLB, Michigan
30. Budda Baker, S, Washington
31. Montravius Adams, DT, Auburn
32. Marcus Williams, S, Utah

[rossihunter2]

4 hours ago, jboy19 said:

Here are my top 32 (not considering position/off-field issues/injuries- except for tiebreakers; out of 113 currently reviewed prospects): 

1. Myles Garrett, DE/OLB, Texas A&M
2. Jonathan Allen, DE, Alabama
3. Jamal Adams, S, LSU
4. Reuben Foster, ILB, Alabama
5. Dalvin Cook, HB, Florida State
6. Leonard Fournette, HB, LSU
7. Marshon Lattimore, CB, Ohio State
8. Malik Hooker, S, Ohio State
9. Solomon Thomas, DE, Stanford
10. Derek Barnett, DE, Tennessee
11. Quincy Wilson, CB, Florida
12. Dan Feeney, OG, Indiana
13. Garrett Bolles, OT, Utah
14. Corey Davis, WR, Western Michigan
15. O.J. Howard, TE, Alabama
16. Mike Williams, WR, Clemson
17. Christian McCaffrey, RB, Stanford
18. Sidney Jones, CB, Washington
19. Charles Harris, DE/OLB, Missouri
20. Haason Reddick, LB, Temple
21. Ryan Ramczyk, OT, Wisconsin
22. David Njoku, TE, Miami
23. John Ross, WR, Washington
24. Tim Williams, OLB, Alabama
25. Malik McDowell, DT, Michigan State
26. D'Onta Foreman, HB, Texas
27. Joe Mixon, HB, Oklahoma
28. Forrest Lamp, OG/OT, Western Kentucky
29. Taco Charlton, DE/OLB, Michigan
30. Budda Baker, S, Washington
31. Montravius Adams, DT, Auburn
32. Marcus Williams, S, Utah

there's a couple of interesting things in here: that's the highest i've seen bolles on a big board

i'm not sure i agree with your grades on donta foreman, montravius adams or marcus williams - donta foreman is a good all round back but he doesnt have the star quality that probably precludes him from being a first round talent, i like him but as a back later in day 2 rather than in the 1st he's not a game breaker type player - montravius adams is very good at what he does but what he does is stuff the run and run really slow stunts, he has very little pass rush ability which means he's only going to be playing a third of your snaps on defense which means he'd have to be the absolute best at it to be worth consideration in the 1st round, as it is i think he's at least behind jonathan allen, solomon thomas, malik mcdowell, caleb brentley as a prospect - marcus williams i like a lot and am more surprised that he's this high on your board than anything else just because i've never seen him there before, i have a 2nd round grade on him but maybe you just really like him - i think the thing for me is that however you rate your safeties after the top 3 guys i think there are more corners that you've missed out on that i'd take first

joe mixon shouldn't be on this board, he is undraftable for the ravens because of his off-field and domestic violence issues, i dont mind ranking pure talent like tim williams etc just on talent but mixon won't be on the board so there's no point ranking him at all

but thanks anyway, this was a really interesting board to look through

[jboy19]

1 minute ago, rossihunter2 said:

there's a couple of interesting things in here: that's the highest i've seen bolles on a big board

i'm not sure i agree with your grades on donta foreman, montravius adams or marcus williams - donta foreman is a good all round back but he doesnt have the star quality that probably precludes him from being a first round talent, i like him but as a back later in day 2 rather than in the 1st he's not a game breaker type player - montravius adams is very good at what he does but what he does is stuff the run and run really slow stunts, he has very little pass rush ability which means he's only going to be playing a third of your snaps on defense which means he'd have to be the absolute best at it to be worth consideration in the 1st round, as it is i think he's at least behind jonathan allen, solomon thomas, malik mcdowell, caleb brentley as a prospect - marcus williams i like a lot and am more surprised that he's this high on your board than anything else just because i've never seen him there before, i have a 2nd round grade on him but maybe you just really like him - i think the thing for me is that however you rate your safeties after the top 3 guys i think there are more corners that you've missed out on that i'd take first

joe mixon shouldn't be on this board, he is undraftable for the ravens because of his off-field and domestic violence issues, i dont mind ranking pure talent like tim williams etc just on talent but mixon won't be on the board so there's no point ranking him at all

but thanks anyway, this was a really interesting board to look through

Thanks for the feedback, this is my first year experimenting with trying to quantify "ratings" for players- so I am interested in seeing how things turn out. I am trying to figure out a better way to somewhat overcome the issue of "well-rounded" players ending up higher than others- so for Garrett Bolles, since I consider him a great run-blocker and above-average pass-blocker he is going to score better than Ryan Ramczyk (who I think is a better pass-blocker, but worse run-blocker) and Cam Robinson (who many might consider a better run-blocker than Bolles- not me though). Ultimately, I do think Bolles is going to end up being the best tackle out of this draft. I honestly don't really know why people aren't higher on him.

 I love Marcus Williams instincts though, aside from Adams and maybe Hooker, I don't think any of the other safeties in this class are as mentally ready as he is for the next level. I think the corners in this class are good, but I think that there is a top tier (Lattimore, Wilson, Jones) and a slight dropoff to the second tier (Conley, Humphrey, White, Awuzie, Tabor). Ultimately I would probably take a couple of these guys over Williams since CB is a glaring need. 

I am bigger on Montravius Adams though because I think he has rare athletic ability for a 300+ pounder. I think he can develop into one of the best 3T/5T tackles in the league- and that was before I even saw that he ran a 4.87(??) 40 at the combine. I like Brantley but I don't think his athleticism puts him on Adams level. 

And since this is a learning experience for me, I didn't mind putting Joe Mixon on, he won't be this high on any boards (and is probably off the boards of 20+ teams). I don't know if he'll play a down in the NFL, but I think seeing how his traits translate to the NFL is a helpful part of the learning process for me. I'm definitely not trying to understate the significance of his incident or condone his activity or anything. This is meant to be more of a general big board than a Ravens-specific one.

 

 

[JoeyFlex5]

Ravens specific

1. Myles Garrett 

2. Jamal Adams 

3. Jonathan Allen 

4. Derek Barnett 

5. Marshon Lattimore 

6. Malik hooker(falls due to surgery) 

7. Mike Williams 

8. Reuben foster

9. Sidney jones 

10. Leonard fournette 

11. Solomon Thomas 

12. Quincy Wilson 

13. OJ Howard 

14. Corey Davis 

15. Marlon Humphrey 

16. Tim Williams 

17. Jabrill peppers 

18. TJ watt(criminally underrated)

19. Charles Harris 

20. Budda baker 

21. Dan feeney 

22. Evan engram(also underrated) 

23. Haason reddick 

24. Tredavious white 

25. Forrest lamp 

 

that's a blind top 25 specific to the ravens needs and I will add to it when I'm at a computer and it's less of a hassle

 

[rossihunter2]

44 minutes ago, jboy19 said:

Thanks for the feedback, this is my first year experimenting with trying to quantify "ratings" for players- so I am interested in seeing how things turn out. I am trying to figure out a better way to somewhat overcome the issue of "well-rounded" players ending up higher than others- so for Garrett Bolles, since I consider him a great run-blocker and above-average pass-blocker he is going to score better than Ryan Ramczyk (who I think is a better pass-blocker, but worse run-blocker) and Cam Robinson (who many might consider a better run-blocker than Bolles- not me though). Ultimately, I do think Bolles is going to end up being the best tackle out of this draft. I honestly don't really know why people aren't higher on him.

 I love Marcus Williams instincts though, aside from Adams and maybe Hooker, I don't think any of the other safeties in this class are as mentally ready as he is for the next level. I think the corners in this class are good, but I think that there is a top tier (Lattimore, Wilson, Jones) and a slight dropoff to the second tier (Conley, Humphrey, White, Awuzie, Tabor). Ultimately I would probably take a couple of these guys over Williams since CB is a glaring need. 

I am bigger on Montravius Adams though because I think he has rare athletic ability for a 300+ pounder. I think he can develop into one of the best 3T/5T tackles in the league- and that was before I even saw that he ran a 4.87(??) 40 at the combine. I like Brantley but I don't think his athleticism puts him on Adams level. 

And since this is a learning experience for me, I didn't mind putting Joe Mixon on, he won't be this high on any boards (and is probably off the boards of 20+ teams). I don't know if he'll play a down in the NFL, but I think seeing how his traits translate to the NFL is a helpful part of the learning process for me. I'm definitely not trying to understate the significance of his incident or condone his activity or anything. This is meant to be more of a general big board than a Ravens-specific one.

 

 

i think the reason people are less high on bolles is because many aren't sure whether he's a tackle or a guard and as a guard he's probably behind robinson and lamp in terms of pure power blocking (something the ravens seem to want to move back towards) and feeney who looks equally well rounded but a little more accomplished as a guard prospect - and then with ramczyk, a tackle prospect is often going to get rated ahead of a guard because of the higher level of technical difficulty because of the larger spaces they need to cover

i've stopped thinking about the corners in tiers because i think the differences between them have become incremental player to player pretty much and because some of the guys who are closer in my mind also have vastly different skillsets - at the moment though i have 10 corners and 5 safeties ahead of marcus williams on my board (if you include jabrill peppers as a safety) but he's still the 52nd player on my board - that probably says more about the strength of the class than marcus williams as a prospect - i think if he makes it to the 3rd round we'll take him but i don't think he'll get that far, but I think there'll probably be better players higher on our board at our spot in the 2nd round

with montravius adams, he may well be athletic but without the ability to rush the passer he shouldn't be a first rounder because he just won't be on the field, you look at the best run stuffing defensive tackles in the league: snacks harrison and brandon williams they were an undrafted free agent and third round pick respectively - i just dont think adams's value is there in the first round and maybe not in the 2nd either - i have him as my 56th player but this doesnt include qbs or DV players

to be honest i dont think you were far off with mixon's true value because he looks electric - might be higher than mccaffrey if i were to rank him, and teams like the lions have outright said that he is absolutely on their board so he may well be that high on 1 or 2 teams' boards that have a stable front office and coaching staff with a lot of success and an owner who can be sold on the player - more likely he drops like tyreek hill did last year but i dont think he drops as far - i hope he goes undrafted just out of moral precedent but he will almost certainly be taken early i think

[January J]

1 hour ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

Ravens specific

1. Myles Garrett 

2. Jamal Adams 

3. Jonathan Allen 

4. Derek Barnett 

5. Marshon Lattimore 

6. Malik hooker(falls due to surgery) 

7. Mike Williams 

8. Reuben foster

9. Sidney jones 

10. Leonard fournette 

11. Solomon Thomas 

12. Quincy Wilson 

13. OJ Howard 

14. Corey Davis 

15. Marlon Humphrey 

16. Tim Williams 

17. Jabrill peppers 

18. TJ watt(criminally underrated)

19. Charles Harris 

20. Budda baker 

21. Dan feeney 

22. Evan engram(also underrated) 

23. Haason reddick 

24. Tredavious white 

25. Forrest lamp 

 

that's a blind top 25 specific to the ravens needs and I will add to it when I'm at a computer and it's less of a hassle

 

Looks pretty spot on but no Cook in the top 25? 

[rossihunter2]

30 minutes ago, January J said:

Looks pretty spot on but no Cook in the top 25? 

to be fair he may well not be on the ravens board that high given some of his past arrest history etc. and especially the animal thing given the nature of the police report from that incident - i imagine he is on the board but probably not as high as other teams have him

[JoeyFlex5]

39 minutes ago, January J said:

Looks pretty spot on but no Cook in the top 25? 

Ravens specific, putting stock in that DV and the animal abuse since those 2 things haunt us. Although with the Elam situation I wonder if we have taken tim Williams off the board as well

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

1. Jonathan Allen

2. Myles Garrett

3. Jamal Adams

4. Derek Barnett

5. Leonard Fournette

6. Reuben Foster

7. Marshon Lattimore

8. Solomon Thomas

9. OJ Howard

10. Malik Hooker

11. Corey Davis

12. Tim Williams

13. Sidney Jones

14. Mike Williams

15. Charles Harris

16. Quincy Wilson

17. Dalvin Cook

18. Malik McDowell

19. Haason Reddick

20. Garrett Bolles

21. John Ross

22. Christian McCaffery

23. Marlon Humphrey 

24. Cam Robinson

25. Caleb Brantley

26. Teez Tabor

27. Budda Baker

28. Adoree Jackson

29. Takk McKinley

30. Forrest Lamp

31. Obi Melifonwu

32. Zach Cunningham

 

In consideration: Jabrill Peppers, Ryan Ramcyzk, David Djoku, Jarrad Davis, Cooper Kupp, Tanoh Kpassagnon, Taco Charlton, TJ Watt, Dan Feeney, Gareon Conley, Tre White, Jourdan Lewis, Desmond King, Evan Engram, Cordrea Tankersley, Zay Jones, Alvin Kamara, Ryan Anderson

[January J]

16 hours ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

Ravens specific, putting stock in that DV and the animal abuse since those 2 things haunt us. Although with the Elam situation I wonder if we have taken tim Williams off the board as well

Gotcha. IMO he will still be on our board top 25 but if he's there at 16 another team would likely give up more to  up and take him. Would be the perfect opportunity to get a nice haul by trading back. Esp if 2 teams want him and get in a bidding war. Best case scenario I think is coming away with a extra 2nd and 4th. 

[Sami84]

I for one have TJ watt over Tim Williams and Charles Harris. Charles Harris is my ELAM/PERRIMAN 2017 draft no, no.

 

Derek Barnett, TJ Watt, Solomon Thomas, Taco Charlton for DL pass rush

Tabor, Jones at CB

 

I think we'd make a huge mistake not taking TJ Watt