2017 DB Thread

[JoeyFlex5]

4 hours ago, Gruntled Ravens Fan said:

Why is Jalen Tabor not being looked at with our draft pick? Here's what Profootballfocus has to say about him. "The depth at cornerback bodes well for the Jets as they may dip into the pool multiple times, but they start with Tabor who has the size and playmaking ability that head coach Todd Bowles needs for his system. He’s had either an interception or a pass breakup on 26.5 percent of his targets, well above the national average, and he’s capable of playing tight man coverage or breaking on the ball quickly in “off” coverage. Tabor’s aggressive style can get him into trouble at times, but he may be the best playmaker in the loaded cornerback class." I don't really know much about him, but I still don't understand the dislike of him. 

I got that report of PFF's mock draft, here's the link if anyones interested. https://www.profootballfocus.com/draft-college-football-trubisky-bears-pff-2017-mock-draft/

Holds a lot, less feast more famine and he got lucky since qbs looked away from him so often and didn't see him get beat deep over and over. Was already a locker room problem. 

The film really doesn't lie about this kid, he is an extremely risky prospect. He is too prone to give up big chunks whether by guessing wrong on a route jump or by desperately and blatantly holding guys.

[JoeyFlex5]

3 hours ago, ravensnation5220 said:

I still don't understand how lattimore is the considered a top 10 pick and the best corner in the class. To me there's not enough experience, he hasn't even really played great receivers. They played Clemson but Mike Williams wasn't as involved in that game much. Clemson had a great game plan in that game and it kinda neutralized their corners so that tape is hard to study. But my point is clear. The best receiver he faced was dede westbrook who I don't think is that great anways

I still think he's extremely talented and I myself have him ranked in my top 10 but I have to question if we're getting ahead of ourselves. A prospect can rise and fall really quickly with any flaw. Last year deshaun watson was viewed as the top pick after he lost the national championship, he won it this year, yet some view him as the 3rd best qb in the draft. I feel like there's this major hype train going on with lattimore who's a 1 year starter....

You're judging the wrong stuff. His tape tells the whole story, his ability to know every little move the receiver is gonna make and mirror step for step is by far the tops in the class and that footwork is not something that any difference in competition can affect. The ball skills and press etc can be questioned for level of competition but his pure man coverage is unquestionable 

[ravensnation5220]

6 minutes ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

You're judging the wrong stuff. His tape tells the whole story, his ability to know every little move the receiver is gonna make and mirror step for step is by far the tops in the class and that footwork is not something that any difference in competition can affect. The ball skills and press etc can be questioned for level of competition but his pure man coverage is unquestionable 

So are you saying he's a sure thing as a prospect. I just don't see it. White and Jones have the same skill set for the most part and have the experience on top of that. I'm just not sure he really should be considered the top corner in the class. I guess it's really just preference, but there's others who have proven a lot more than lattimore has

[JoeyFlex5]

1 hour ago, ravensnation5220 said:

So are you saying he's a sure thing as a prospect. I just don't see it. White and Jones have the same skill set for the most part and have the experience on top of that. I'm just not sure he really should be considered the top corner in the class. I guess it's really just preference, but there's others who have proven a lot more than lattimore has

He's he most talented corner in the class, and has an incredibly refined skill set. there is no question about that imo. 

As far as work ethic and commitment goes? Who knows, that's something that gets highlighted over the course of a long career but it can also be completely whiffed on. Arthur brown looked like a super high iq player but couldn't pick up the playbook as a 3rd down specialist and then tyrann mathieu was gonna be a lazy pothead and now he's a premier player. It's a crap shoot as far as That goes. 

But talent and skill set? No, white and jones, who I am a huge fan of, are not in the same ball park.

[ravensnation5220]

Fabian Moreau CB ucla #10doesn't have much tape on him. Draftbreakdown doesn't have many videos of him and there's none on YouTube, but I did find him making plays on Takk McKinleys draftbreakdown videos. He looks very fluid and has great footwork. Only red flag is he had a lisfrank foot injury in 2015. He looked fine on tape though 

P.s. he's really really really good. As long as he perfoms at the combine and performs well then he should be a first rounder as long as he checks out medically. This CB class just got even crazier

Edited January 22 by ravensnation5220

[cfly]

Question do we fun more man or zone? I live in Iowa so I don't get to watch much games. Wondering what I should be looking for in a corner

Edited January 22 by cfly

[JoeyFlex5]

2 hours ago, cfly said:

Question do we fun more man or zone? I live in Iowa so I don't get to watch much games. Wondering what I should be looking for in a corner

a mix. jimmy smith mostly plays tight man, meanwhile our other corners play a lot of off zone or off-man. basically whether its zone or man our whole scheme aside from jimmy is based on top-down coverage. 

however, the chances are very good that we are done worrying about scheme and just getting the best corner we can, im sure pees would be ok having another tight-man corner to fall back on if jimmy gets hurt or just in general to let the pass rush get a ridiculous amount of coverage sacks.

[Jacquouille]

16 hours ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

You're judging the wrong stuff. His tape tells the whole story, his ability to know every little move the receiver is gonna make and mirror step for step is by far the tops in the class and that footwork is not something that any difference in competition can affect. The ball skills and press etc can be questioned for level of competition but his pure man coverage is unquestionable 

Well what is scary is I don't think he knows. He just reacts so quickly, any separation the WR can get is suppressed in an instant.

[BmoreBird22]

9 hours ago, cfly said:

Question do we fun more man or zone? I live in Iowa so I don't get to watch much games. Wondering what I should be looking for in a corner

Pees is well known for his zone coverage schemes and that's the majority of what he'll use. 

Young preferred playing off generally while Wright and Smith prefer to show press. 

I would say the most common coverages from Pees were Tampa 2 and Cover 3, but he does use man. 

[JoeyFlex5]

9 hours ago, Jacquouille said:

Well what is scary is I don't think he knows. He just reacts so quickly, any separation the WR can get is suppressed in an instant.

Basically lol. His footwork at the line is amazing, I don't think I've ever seen a corner who prepares himself to run in any direction as well as he does. That's where he separates himself from guys like Quincy Wilson because Q takes big heavy backpedal steps when he's in tight or press coverage, lattimores feet are always chopping and ready to go, he never plants his feet to press so he's always ready to cover the wrs next move and never gets caught flat footed. 

[ravensnation5220]

Interesting to see who Marlon Humphreys comp is. I agree with what the scout said though. 

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2016/profiles/marlon-humphrey?id=2558067&id=2558067

 

[ravensnation5220]

21 hours ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

Basically lol. His footwork at the line is amazing, I don't think I've ever seen a corner who prepares himself to run in any direction as well as he does. That's where he separates himself from guys like Quincy Wilson because Q takes big heavy backpedal steps when he's in tight or press coverage, lattimores feet are always chopping and ready to go, he never plants his feet to press so he's always ready to cover the wrs next move and never gets caught flat footed. 

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2016/profiles/quincy-wilson?id=2557961&id=2557961

I was surprised by his draft grade but I agree with the overall assessment 

[Cillmatic]

On ‎1‎/‎22‎/‎2017 at 5:24 PM, JoeyFlex5 said:

Basically lol. His footwork at the line is amazing, I don't think I've ever seen a corner who prepares himself to run in any direction as well as he does. That's where he separates himself from guys like Quincy Wilson because Q takes big heavy backpedal steps when he's in tight or press coverage, lattimores feet are always chopping and ready to go, he never plants his feet to press so he's always ready to cover the wrs next move and never gets caught flat footed. 

Too injury prone and he can apparently only play press.

Edited January 24 by Cillmatic

[JoeyFlex5]

41 minutes ago, Cillmatic said:

Too injury prone and he can apparently only play press.

Wrong and wrong. 

He plays man coverage of all sorts. He was injured his first year, hasn't shown to he injury prone because of one year. 

Arent you a carl Lawson fan?

[Ravens8383]

Is there any hope that Maurice Canady can turn into a starter? 

 

 

[rmw10]

6 minutes ago, Ravens8383 said:

Is there any hope that Maurice Canady can turn into a starter? 

 

 

You can never really say for sure, but he was a burn victim quite often back in college.  Usually that doesn't bode well for an NFL future, but he could always get better.  He put together a solid display in his one preseason game, but I'm pretty sure that was something like 10 snaps total, and that's all we've seen from him on defense so far.

[Ravens8383]

13 minutes ago, rmw10 said:

You can never really say for sure, but he was a burn victim quite often back in college.  Usually that doesn't bode well for an NFL future, but he could always get better.  He put together a solid display in his one preseason game, but I'm pretty sure that was something like 10 snaps total, and that's all we've seen from him on defense so far.

I never really saw any of his college games other then the good plays he made. He has the size and the look of a CB lets hope he can put it together or maybe move him to SS of FS as a depth player. 

[rmw10]

12 minutes ago, Ravens8383 said:

I never really saw any of his college games other then the good plays he made. He has the size and the look of a CB lets hope he can put it together or maybe move him to SS of FS as a depth player. 

My thought when he was drafted is that he wouldn't have been drafted if he wasn't over 6 feet tall. If he's an average sized corner, he's undrafted and likely just a camp body. He's a project, which is never a bad thing to have. I'm not sure I see much more than a back end of the roster depth player though. 

Edited January 25 by rmw10

[JoeyFlex5]

I could actually see canady developing over time. He lacked fundamentals but certainly has a lot of tools and has the ability to play the ball really well, he just needs to guess less and play more disciplined. His problems are e very coachable

[rmw10]

6 minutes ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

I could actually see canady developing over time. He lacked fundamentals but certainly has a lot of tools and has the ability to play the ball really well, he just needs to guess less and play more disciplined. His problems are e very coachable

He certainly has a good physical skill set, but I'm not sure about the mental. He looked like he was scared of getting beat at any moment. As you said, that's coachable, but it's also hard to get out of that mindset. 

[Drew P]

10 hours ago, Ravens8383 said:

Is there any hope that Maurice Canady can turn into a starter? 

 

 

Maybe on another team that will coach him up. He does have Elamitis he tends to trip on the turf monster too often to ever cover anyone effectively

[DomMcRaven]

4 hours ago, Drew P said:

Maybe on another team that will coach him up. He does have Elamitis he tends to trip on the turf monster too often to ever cover anyone effectively

I need to see this word being used more often. Perfect wording right here.

[Dwayne Watts]

I love what I'm hearing about both cb Cameron Sutton and cb Rasul Douglas

[JoeyFlex5]

Anyone here watched film on budda baker? The boy is a BEAST! How is he being mocked in the 3rd round everywhere? It's rumored he ran a 4.35 at UWs practice and he plays like it, and he plays with intensity and instinct. Makes plays against the run and pass. Dude is a bonafide 2nd round talent at worst

[ravensnation5220]

5 minutes ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

Anyone here watched film on budda baker? The boy is a BEAST! How is he being mocked in the 3rd round everywhere? It's rumored he ran a 4.35 at UWs practice and he plays like it, and he plays with intensity and instinct. Makes plays against the run and pass. Dude is a bonafide 2nd round talent at worst

Ya I just recently watched him. I think his speed is off the charts. He'd be a great single high safety and can play slot too. I love his speed but his length and overall size will have him fall. He's the 3rd best safety though in my book. A+ character and a hard competitor 

[JoeyFlex5]

50 minutes ago, ravensnation5220 said:

Ya I just recently watched him. I think his speed is off the charts. He'd be a great single high safety and can play slot too. I love his speed but his length and overall size will have him fall. He's the 3rd best safety though in my book. A+ character and a hard competitor 

i dont put a ton of stock into size for a FS. on short passes they have the advantage of coming downhill to the ball and on deep passes they have the advantage of being closer to the landing point, for a true single high safety who can read and jump routes size shouldnt matter. ed reed was 5'11", earl thomas is 5'10". i find length to be really overrated for safeties.

[ravensnation5220]

Just now, JoeyFlex5 said:

i dont put a ton of stock into size for a FS. on short passes they have the advantage of coming downhill to the ball and on deep passes they have the advantage of being closer to the landing point, for a true single high safety who can read and jump routes size shouldnt matter. ed reed was 5'11", earl thomas is 5'10". i find length to be really overrated for safeties.

Well this kid is lucky to be 5-9 with 30 inch arms lol. I'm worried he'd get outjumped on a ball to aj green lol. But I know what you mean. His film speaks for itself kid is a baller. I know this is the DB thread but what do you think of Haason Reddick, I mentioned him on the senior bowl thread 

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2016/profiles/haason-reddick?id=2557887&id=2557887

[Edgar]

Wilson seems to be the popular pick of late for us at 16.  I don't like him at 16...awful tackle form in general and doesn't appear very interested in being invested vs. the run.

 

He does a better job than many pro corners at getting his head around and finding the ball. 16 seems a bit rich for him.

[RaineV1]

21 minutes ago, Edgar said:

Wilson seems to be the popular pick of late for us at 16.  I don't like him at 16...awful tackle form in general and doesn't appear very interested in being invested vs. the run.

 

He does a better job than many pro corners at getting his head around and finding the ball. 16 seems a bit rich for him.

Agreed. The only corners I'd want at 16 are Lattimore or Sidney Jones.

[January J]

12 hours ago, Edgar said:

Wilson seems to be the popular pick of late for us at 16.  I don't like him at 16...awful tackle form in general and doesn't appear very interested in being invested vs. the run.

 

He does a better job than many pro corners at getting his head around and finding the ball. 16 seems a bit rich for him.

I don't mind him at 16. Not my favorite but I think its a safe move. And him being able to get his head around and find the ball is my favorite trait any corner can have. I get so frustrated BC it seems likeso many corners struggle with that- ESP ours.