Joe Flacco: Tough Talk

[PurpleCity5]

29 minutes ago, Cillmatic said:

What bad choices has he made? I think the Browns are gonna give him more time.

Passing on Wentz, going after RGIII, slow and awful start to another rebuilding. Combined with poor on field decisions and the teams poor performance, its possible that he would be one and done. Not that I expect that they would fire him, I actually doubt they would but its possible if things continue this way. 

[jazz1988]

2 hours ago, Cillmatic said:

Joe's always been a guy who, during the regular season, needs some good players around him. I think this WR core is the worst we've had since 2013. O-lines been terrible too.

Don't every quarterback do?

[flynismo]

I hope you guys are watching this Saints game and seeing what an offense looks like where WRs are wide open every other play. And when I say wide open, I'm talking about no defender within 4 - 5 yards, if at all.

[flynismo]

2 hours ago, 52520Andrew said:

I guess many people have not seen Seattle play this season, by far the worst O-line in the NFL.

Luck is really doing well this year but struggled last year behind a bad O-line and if you look in Seattle, that line is killing a good offense otherwise. I do think Flacco has underperformed this year but I also don't think it is a coincidence that his best lines(2012 playoffs and 2014) have brought him the most success. We like to run the ball and take deep shots, it suits Flacco best here. You need a good O-line to do both effectively. 

The fact that Luck has been sacked more also has a ton to do with the fact that Flacco has been getting rid of the ball insanely fast this season; 2.4 seconds on average last I saw.

[Deflated Football]

16 minutes ago, flynismo said:

I hope you guys are watching this Saints game and seeing what an offense looks like where WRs are wide open every other play. And when I say wide open, I'm talking about no defender within 4 - 5 yards, if at all.

Flacco would overthrow them for a pick

[PurpleCity5]

26 minutes ago, jazz1988 said:

Don't every quarterback do?

I think what he means is that Joe isn't a guy like a Manning, Brees, or Brady who can work around obvious flaws around the offense. Nothing wrong with that because 90% of QBs can't. The Ravens simply expected him to be and put too much on him.

Edited October 30, 2016 by PurpleCity5

[flynismo]

4 minutes ago, Deflated Football said:

Flacco would overthrow them for a pick

Sure he would

[PurpleCity5]

23 minutes ago, flynismo said:

I hope you guys are watching this Saints game and seeing what an offense looks like where WRs are wide open every other play. And when I say wide open, I'm talking about no defender within 4 - 5 yards, if at all.

Looking at it right now. May not seem like it to some, but the Saints are completely ripping that defense to shreds. 

[flynismo]

5 minutes ago, PurpleCity5 said:

Looking at it right now. May not seem like it to some, but the Saints are completely ripping that defense to shreds. 

This is every week for the Saints, since the day Payton arrived there. And this is against a very good SEA defense no less. Nearly every single completion Brees has made has been essentially long handoffs. I've always been jealous of that system.

[Bltravens]

1 hour ago, flynismo said:

This is every week for the Saints, since the day Payton arrived there. And this is against a very good SEA defense no less. Nearly every single completion Brees has made has been essentially long handoffs. I've always been jealous of that system.

All the more impressive from that 2000 Ravens D that shut him out in the Super Bowl as the Giants OC.

[gtalk12]

I am watching closely, it seems that teams have some sort of game plan that allows WR's an opportunity to get WIDE OPEN.....for some odd reason all of Joes throws are Heavily contested by 1 defender our WR's can't seem to break loose from with the exception of Pitta.

[flynismo]

23 minutes ago, Bltravens said:

All the more impressive from that 2000 Ravens D that shut him out in the Super Bowl as the Giants OC.

No doubt. Nothing was going to stop that defense from greatness.

As a strange sidenote....I kinda miss Kerry Collins

[flynismo]

19 minutes ago, gtalk12 said:

I am watching closely, it seems that teams have some sort of game plan that allows WR's an opportunity to get WIDE OPEN.....for some odd reason all of Joes throws are Heavily contested by 1 defender our WR's can't seem to break loose from with the exception of Pitta.

Very true. It's the big mystery around here; why guys struggle so much getting separation, even established vets that we brought in. Mason was the only guy that ever seemed to get open with any consistency at all, and even he struggled a bit; mind boggling considering he's one of the best route runners of his generation.

[Militant X 1]

5 minutes ago, flynismo said:

Very true. It's the big mystery around here; why guys struggle so much getting separation, even established vets that we brought in. Mason was the only guy that ever seemed to get open with any consistency at all, and even he struggled a bit; mind boggling considering he's one of the best route runners of his generation.

Sooo, is it due to the quality of players we have, the lack of proper wide receiver coaching or an archaic offensive system? 

[flynismo]

9 minutes ago, Militant X 1 said:

Sooo, is it due to the quality of players we have, the lack of proper wide receiver coaching or an archaic offensive system? 

I honestly don't know, and don't even have a theory on it. I would have said WR coaching, but nothing seems any different since Engram came aboard. I don't think quality of players explains it completely either, because when you see how often and why other teams get guys wide open, you see that the system is the main reason for it in a lot of cases. So I'd go with the system we have in place as the primary reason, but I think that's a simplified answer. I just don't know.

I'd like to see the coaches address this to see what they say, what they think about it. Other than "we have to do a better job getting open..."  :/

Edited October 30, 2016 by flynismo

[Militant X 1]

3 minutes ago, flynismo said:

I honestly don't know, and don't even have a theory on it. I would have said WR coaching, but nothing seems any different since Engram came aboard. I don't think quality of players explains it completely either, because when you see how often and why other teams get guys wide open, you see that the system is the main reason for it in a lot of cases. So I'd go with the system we have in place as the primary reason, but I think that's a simplified answer. I just don't know.

I'd like to see the coaches address this to see what they say, what they think about it. Other than "we have to do a better job getting open..."  :/

Sometimes there are simple and not complex answers to our issues. 

[kassaiscool]

I have been known to critic Flacco throughout his career and I believe its well deserved. If you actually look at his body of work. He is actually an average to below average QB. Take away that playoff run for the Super bowl and look what he has done. I want to blame the receivers, but when they do get open for a big play or something he under throws them. It all comes back to him. If you look at the big plays to Steve Smith since he has been here, its more of Steve Smith making a play happen then Joe making a great pass. He is into his 30's now and I can't really ask him to improve that much. At this point he is who he is. In a league where rookie QB's are coming in now and throwing for 4,000 yards, Joe hasn't hit that mark once in his career. I'm not trying to bash the guy, but I have always seen what people are angry about now.

[flynismo]

3 minutes ago, kassaiscool said:

He is actually an average to below average QB. Take away that playoff run for the Super bowl and look what he has done.

This is precisely why nobody takes the anti-Flacco guys seriously.

[flynismo]

6 minutes ago, Militant X 1 said:

Sometimes there are simple and not complex answers to our issues. 

I'd like to think so, but when we switched from Cam's system to Kubiak's...nothing changed as far as that goes.

[Militant X 1]

9 minutes ago, flynismo said:

I'd like to think so, but when we switched from Cam's system to Kubiak's...nothing changed as far as that goes.

So. there was a systems change but the same results of receivers not getting separation?  Ok, so lets system.

That leaves two things left: Coaching and Quality of Players

[flynismo]

Just now, Militant X 1 said:

So. there was a systems change but the same results of receivers not getting separation?  Ok, so lets system.

That leaves two things left: Coaching and Quality of Players

Same problem exists now that Engram is the WR coach and a new OC, so we can presumably scratch out the coaches as well. Leaves us with...players.

But I'm not satisfied with just laying it all on the players; although maybe I should think about that a bit more.

[Militant X 1]

15 hours ago, flynismo said:

Same problem exists now that Engram is the WR coach and a new OC, so we can presumably scratch out the coaches as well. Leaves us with...players.

But I'm not satisfied with just laying it all on the players; although maybe I should think about that a bit more.

Agreed!  If we coaches then that clearly leaves the quality of players.  

Maybe it is not to all be laid on them but of course they are a major part of it.  The players themselves even say that; "It doesn't matter what play has been called, WE have to go out there and execute it!"  It's not the system or the coaches that can't get 4th &1..it's the players!  It's not the system or the coaches throwing bad passes or dropping good passes..it's the players!  So forth and so on.  Enjoying our dialogue about this. 

Edited October 31, 2016 by Militant X 1
spelling

[Moderator 3]

I think getting open is a combination of route and body usage.  Mason was the best I ever saw (followed by Boldin) use his body to block out defenders and gain separation.  Even then, it's not like they got 10-15 yards open.  

[Bandwagon]

5 hours ago, PurpleCity5 said:

LOL, also, does Joe has anyone of Julio, T.Y or Marvin caliber here? 

no but we also have an inaccurate no brain QB though

[Militant X 1]

4 minutes ago, Moderator 3 said:

I think getting open is a combination of route and body usage.  Mason was the best I ever saw (followed by Boldin) use his body to block out defenders and gain separation.  Even then, it's not like they got 10-15 yards open.  

So again, is it a player issue?

[Moderator 3]

Just now, Militant X 1 said:

So again, is it a player issue?

Maybe, may be coaching.  I don't think many come out of college ready to beat NFL defenses.  I think they need to be coached up to reach their full potential.  

[kassaiscool]

49 minutes ago, flynismo said:

This is precisely why nobody takes the anti-Flacco guys seriously.

So anyone who analyzes Flacco is anti-Flacco? If I'm anti-Flacco you must be A Flacco defense team member. I'm basically saying if you look at his body of work I can find you over a dozen players who are better than him. who he gets paid more than. Why is it that he never gets to the pro bowl? Even when the starters selected don't go to the pro bowl. Why is it he is never even thought of for mvp consideration? Why is it that Joe hasn't even thrown over 4000 yards or more than 30 TDS in 9 seasons? And you want me to be the Anti Flacco guy? I'm giving you facts and your telling me I'm a hater.

Edited October 30, 2016 by kassaiscool

[Militant X 1]

2 minutes ago, Moderator 3 said:

Maybe, may be coaching.  I don't think many come out of college ready to beat NFL defenses.  I think they need to be coached up to reach their full potential.  

I agree completely with it being a little bit of both on the players and the coaching.

[JoeyFlex5]

4 hours ago, PurpleCity5 said:

Passing on Wentz, going after RGIII, slow and awful start to another rebuilding. Combined with poor on field decisions and the teams poor performance, its possible that he would be one and done. Not that I expect that they would fire him, I actually doubt they would but its possible if things continue this way. 

He didn't "pass" on wentz. He got a boatload of picks for it. Cleveland was much more than just a qb away from competing, they need a full overhaul. It may hurt for them seeing wentz playing well but it was likely the right move. There's a ton of talent coming out over the next 2 years and they have a lot of decent picks

[Moderator 3]

6 minutes ago, kassaiscool said:

So anyone who analyzes Flacco is anti-Flacco? If I'm anti-Flacco you must be A Flacco defense team member. I'm basically saying if you look at his body of work I can find you over a dozen players who are better than him. who he gets paid more than.

Analyzes?  Did you read the post?  There was no analysis in there.