Constructive Suggestions to Improve Now

[PurpleHorseman]

9 hours ago, GrimCoconut said:

First, I think we need to stop moving away from the run. You have to stay at it and keep trying even when it doesn't work because we saw yesterday that while the Jets didn't succeed early against our run defense, they eventually broke it and got yards. That's how it goes in the run game. You need to keep at it, and we frankly abandon it too much and too early. It needs to stop because it's putting too much pressure on the OL  and Joe Flacco and even the WR. Once the run game is gone, the defense can predict we're passing and it becomes easy. I think we need to throw more 2TE sets with Waller and Pitta to beat linebackers (although having Revis on Pitta didn't help) and have some sets where we have two RB in the backfield having both West and Allen back there where one's the receiving RB and the other is the runner. It'll give Joe a checkdown option (Allen), and give him the option to hand-off to a better runner in West (not as good of hands). 

Second, I think we need to go for more interior pressure through the A-gap. Our interior DL is our strength, and we aren't getting it done on the edges so go for the interior A gap using Brandon Williams to open the hole for a linebacker like Correa who gets washed out when touched. I'm not talking about a full-on blitz, but sending a LB up the middle would help. I think when Wright returns, he should be focused on using the sideline and put a safety on top of him to get the inside route should the WR motion inside because Wright can't defend the inside. 

I like it. However what would we do about outside containment? We look slow at the edge. The OLB's are slow getting there and getting no help from the Down lineman there. Do you think Judon has the speed to contain outside running plays? Do we have any defensive lineman with speed to help chase down outside runs and short throws?

On offense is Max eligible to return? Because boy can he block well. When Boyle returns the ravens could use a more effective blocking version of the 2 TE sets. This would allow more combo blocks. Which in turn can isolate and freeze huge sections of opponents defense. To make that work better it will require our RB's to be major receiving threats. To help keep defenses from loading the box. Which means more Dixon and Buck. And a WR that can win intermediate and deep.

And the TE's must make plays as well. The max protection will give the ravens options. It will help the struggling OL by allowing more combo blocks on run plays and protecting Joe. While keeping the defense off balance and guessing run or throw. The rush will not be able to tee off on Joe. It will be worried and guessing about their blitz being picked up or trying to contain the 2 TE's and a receiving RB. And that is before the defense thinks of containing the speedy WR's Wallace, Perriman and Moore. 2 multi threat TE's and a duel threat RB gives the offense many options on screen plays. If ravens can master and sell screen plays with detail, it would slow down the rush on Flacco quite effectively. 

[Halshayeji]

13 hours ago, Moderator 3 said:

But how? Many of them are from poor technique, but practices are so limited that there's little time to work on technique.  Should we take 30 minutes of practice time each day to focus on that? 

sure id appreciate that.

13 hours ago, GrimCoconut said:

 I think we need to throw more 2TE sets with Waller and Pitta to beat linebackers (although having Revis on Pitta didn't help)

That play crushed me. Revis was on Pitta so that leaves Mickey mouse and Donald Duck covering our best 2 WRs. Why would Joe even go there? We need to work on pre snap reads for 2 weeks till we pound the Steelers again.

13 hours ago, Tank 92 said:

The only chance we have is to fix the O line. If we don't get Stanley and Yanda back and keep them healthy we're done. And I think there has to be a better option at center. Zuttah has reached a new low and it is debilitating. 

Agreed. Iv often found myself the only person defending Zuttah but im off that bandwagon. He can dig his own grave or dig his way out of that funk.

12 hours ago, gtalk12 said:

I feel like a better play calling scheme to help adjust the fact Flacco has to throw the ball quicker and sticking to the run would go a long way. Open the playbook up...

Nothing we can really say about the defense, they are doing a great job in my opinion. Any fumble recovery or INT just drop straight down just in case lol

I feel that your absolutely right. Can we give joe a hot route on every passing play when the Oline is so inconsistent? To the D.... ugh. I still cant believe it lol

[flynismo]

We need to upgrade center in a major way. That one position is effecting the entire OL.

Besides center, I think that we have enough talent overall. If our OL is playing up to standards, this discussion is not even taking place.

So that means we need to use our tools better? Not necessarily. Our tools, in case anyone hasn't noticed, tend to break. Fix the OL, and heal up physically. It likely is not a coincidence that we were undefeated with Stanley in the lineup, and have not won a game without him.

How do we fix the OL? Well, unless we go out and bring more talent in, it isn't going to happen until Stanley and Yanda return, and then we can look into making some adjustments.

Edited October 25, 2016 by flynismo

[January J]

14 hours ago, Moderator 3 said:

But how? Many of them are from poor technique, but practices are so limited that there's little time to work on technique.  Should we take 30 minutes of practice time each day to focus on that? 

I actually think we should. Maybe even longer. An hour of practice focusing on strictly DISCIPLINE. That includes not jumping in the neutral zone, no false starts, not holding , taking better angles on receivers coming down the feild ( hence Webb getting caught leaning on the obj play) practice even more ball security ( on both  sides of the ball)  practice not roughing the passer and letting up if the ball Is out. ..practice not running into each other on crossing routes and what not.

I know this is stuff that's already done- but we need to focus on it more. Do your job.

And the coaches could use some practice of their own. Mainly on CLOCK MANAGEMENT. This issue has plagued us for years. The clock can kill you or save you. We need to stop being so careless with it, along with our timeouts. For crying out loud we wasted a timeout on Sunday in the first quarter right before a punt. I'm sure there was a reason for it, but it shouldn't have come to that. Even the announcers stated it was pretty silly to take a timeout before a punt.

We need to get more creative on blitzes..stop giving receivers so much cushion.

Joe desperately needs  to work on his footwork. Watching other qbs they are bouncing around and step up in the pocket. Joe seems flat footed and is moving backwards instead of stepping into his throws.  I'm sure alot has to do with the injury and lack of protection but he's had an issue throwing off his backfoot for years now. Its a bad habit and it needs to be corrected. 

We need to stop abandoning the run and stop making Joe throw the ball 35 + times.  I know I've said this in several other threads- but look at how many times we have won vs lost when Joe throws under 35 times. Its a drastic difference. Joe is not the type of qb to drop back and throw 45 times a game. He has the most attempts in the league for crying out loud. That could explain some if his struggles as well- its certainly not the recipe for success and the numbers will tell you that. 

Edited October 25, 2016 by January J

[rmcjacket23]

I'll focus on the OL, because I don't think there's a lot else that can be done RIGHT NOW or this season to fix some of the other issues we have, because its a combination of coaching and talent...

I agree with benching Zuttah. I've been an advocate for him some time now, but he's had a poor season and I don't see many scenarios where he's on this team next year. Given that, no reason to continue trotting him out there so he can keep stepping on Joe.

Your five best OLineman are clearly Stanley, Lewis, Yanda, Wagner and Jensen. Find a way to get those five on the field at the same time. Or really, just put Jensen in at center and see what happens. If he sucks, fine, Joe will continue to get killed and it will be status quo. If he's good or even adequate, you've found a Center for next year and hopefully longer. Center's a position you don't need to be great it... you just can't suck at it, and right now, Zuttah sucks at it.

Granted, injuries have prevented this from happening, but I'm personally expecting a health OL coming out of the bye. If the only guy injured is Yanda at that point, I think I'd rather see Urschel at RG and Jensen at C than Zuttah at C and Jensen at RG (even though Jensen has been good there)

Get your best offensive lineman on the field.

On defense, I pretty much just want health. I want Mosley and Dumervil back. I'm not sure I care that much if Suggs comes back or not to be honest. I think we lack talent at pass rusher, and I think getting some guys back so we can take more of a quantity over quality approach and rotating in fresh rushers throughout the game gives us a better chance. I don't think guys like Judon and ZaDarius can sustain a good pass rush playing like 70% of snaps.

Secondary pretty much is what it is and its not changing. Some more talented players there are needed, but not happening this year.

Edited October 25, 2016 by rmcjacket23

[Militant X 1]

Until the Ravens discover and realize "who" they are, meaning what "type" of team they really are; they'll remain mediocre.  When I watch them, they are not a 3-4 wide receiver, spread'em and shred'em or air it out type of offense to me but more of a ground and pound and PA style of offense.

a. Sure up that O-line with the best players on the field and stop all of this patch, plug and play stuff.

b. Pound the rock! (Sure, it's a passing league but that doesn't mean that you shouldn't or can't smash a team in their mouth)

c. Use more 2 TE's sets especially in the redzone

d. Scheme the offensive personnel properly (Wallace/Perriman are the deep threats, SSS, Aiken and the TE's are the underneath boys)

e. Work that Play Action (Scheming off the run, Joe is a killer in that PA)

Defensively....

a. Bring more pressure it burst pipes! (cut out all of this bend but don't break junk) Put the fear of this defense back into teams!

b. J Smith is a huge "pressing" CB not a man to man type.  Scheme off of that.

c. Unfortunately, Suggs/Dumervil are done!  Let the younger, stronger and faster LB's get in the mix and hunt!

d. Secondary?  My goodness!  We need more help there but who?

[Tank 92]

Bring Matt Elam in to replace Webb. 

[jboy19]

It's hard for me to single out some certain issues because I do feel like injuries are such a big factor in the lack of success, but if I had to name a few...

(1) If Ryan Jensen can play center, he must play center- I understand the position entails a lot of mental preparation, but at this point the team should make every effort to prep Jensen as the first team center, even if Yanda is not ready to start v the Steelers. I would personally rather have a Stanley-Lewis-Jensen-Urschel-Wagner line than have Zuttah in there going forward.

(2) Matt Elam should be activated, we've heard for two years in a row that Elam has improved over the past couple offseasons and I think that he has earned another shot at playing in this secondary, I was more encouraged with his rookie play (when he was lining up more at safety) than his sophomore year (when he was moved around and played a lot of slot corner) and want to see what he can do with some of Webb's snaps.

(3) More creative blitzing. The secondary is capable of performing well and we've seen encouraging things from Jimmy Smith, Weddle, Young and even Shareece Wright at times, but without a better pass rush, they are going to continue to have struggles. I understand that the D came up with 5 sacks against the Jets, but the pass rush as a whole was not very consistent. From my observations, Fitzpatrick had time when he needed it. 

(4) I think we need to figure out what the best roles for the younger players are- is Tavon a perimeter corner or a slot specialist? is Correa an off scrimmage LB or a Rush LB? Should ZDS be rushing more from the interior like McPhee did early on or is he being forced into a Courtney Upshaw mold that he doesn't fit? These questions should hopefully be answered by the end of the season, but the team isn't doing themselves any favors if they are putting young players in roles that they don't fit.

(5) There needs to be better adjustment in the second half offensively. From what I saw of the second half, I didn't see many adjustments from the offense even though I think they could have- I'm rarely the person to advocate running the ball when it's shown to not work, but when there's only 11 rushing plays as opposed to 45 passing plays and the QB is coming off an injury to his throwing shoulder- there's a problem. I get that the line was hobbled by injury, but it seems like the run was abandoned too early. 

The Ravens have a decent amount of weaknesses and there's issues that I think can be fixed by some key players coming back from injuries (Stanley, Yanda, Mosley are the most impactful injured players imo). The Ravens are on a bye week, but the Steelers are too, so this next game is going to be messy and the team is going to need to stay resilient because this is almost guaranteed to be a close game. 

[VermontRaven]

6 hours ago, PurpleHorseman said:

On offense is Max eligible to return?

Maxx isn't elgible to return now because we used our IR return designation on Elam.

 

[terrynjulia03]

On the defensive side with the pass rush, jboy touched on it. The problem is Pees doesn't know HOW to use players correctly. Everyone has said ZDS was playing like a new McPhee in practice, yet Pees uses him like Upshaw. I've advocated to use the younger guys and get them reps over Suggs and Doom, but thinking about it more he's just too incompetent to make it worthwhile. In the secondary, get Elam out there instead of Webb as soon as possible. 

The OL should wind up fixing itself. With the bye you assume Stanley and Yanda will be back. Do we need to slide Jensen in at C? I'd say yes just because I don't see any way shape or form Zuttah is on the team next year. Having our starters on the line and healthy will drastically change things. Than you can get back to pounding the ball and working PA. 

[AsianRice]

We seriously need Matt Birk type of center asap; it's done through trade or draft.  It should be the priority...

 

If Stanley and Yanda not back after the bye week, we are on the verge of losing 100mil QB......

[gtalk12]

Suggs is still the best pass rusher on our squad, he was well on his way to double digit sacks before the injury. I would not count him out even though I was a bit critical of him early in the forums

[pep_meister]

Will Hill, Weddle Tandem could easily be the best in the NFL. Will Hill knows the system so he could contribute right away, will add speed and a nastiness on the back end. I think that will improve the secondary greatly... Weddle, Hill, Jimmy Smith are some big time players.

 

The only way to even think of saving the season is by trading for an O lineman EVEN if next week yanda, stanley, and wagner were 100% because we know that can change in a single play and it's back to a makeshift line.

 

Play the tight end that can get the most separation the fastest since flacco doesn't have any time. Which are Pitta and speed alone should have Waller as the other.

 

Thank god for Wallace. He has has been the most valuable addition to the team yet. 10+ catches speaks volumes. He has had pretty solid hands this year. Surprised more praise hasn't gone his way. He was going off before the line fell to shambles. imagine the top 2 being with aiken and stone wall jackson hands moore.

 

We need CJ Mosley and Suggs back to full force ASAP. With Mosley, Suggs, Judon, Orr supplementing Mosley, Williams, Jernigan, and Pierce we have a top 3 front 7 in the league. Will Hill on the back end with Weddle and Jimmy anchoring cb1 solidly, we are a solid 2nd corner from being a LEGIT top 3 defense.

Imagine if the defense wasn't on the field so much and were healthy? It sucks to be as snake bitten as we are but this team had HUGE potential before the crazy ammount of injuries.

Edited October 25, 2016 by pep_meister

[usmccharles]

Did we hire a new strength and conditioning coach? Health would really help this team. 

[redrum52]

Penalties, health and turnovers.  Off and def(not giving em back when we get em).

[Tru11]

get healthy

[GhostofGrbac]

18 minutes ago, pep_meister said:

Will Hill, Weddle Tandem could easily be the best in the NFL. Will Hill knows the system so he could contribute right away, will add speed and a nastiness on the back end. I think that will improve the secondary greatly... Weddle, Hill, Jimmy Smith are some big time players.

Hill was suspended for 10 weeks in March. His 4th suspension in 4 years. I doubt he ever plays in the NFL again. I know for a fact he'll never play for the Ravens again.

[gtalk12]

Will Hill was such a disappointment

[K-Dog]

3 hours ago, gtalk12 said:

Will Hill was such a disappointment

Very much so.

[pep_meister]

4 hours ago, GhostofGrbac said:

Hill was suspended for 10 weeks in March. His 4th suspension in 4 years. I doubt he ever plays in the NFL again. I know for a fact he'll never play for the Ravens again.

whats the risk? worst case it's his 5th time and he doesn't see the field again. he's paying the price clearly in his 10 game suspension. His previous 3 suspensions were for pot with the Giants, i can't recall if that was the reason for his 4th and if so who gives a flying crap about people smoking pot. I get that it's banned but he's paying the price. I don't know that it should black ball him from helping a roster who surely could use it.

[Tru11]

8 minutes ago, pep_meister said:

whats the risk? worst case it's his 5th time and he doesn't see the field again. he's paying the price clearly in his 10 game suspension. His previous 3 suspensions were for pot with the Giants, i can't recall if that was the reason for his 4th and if so who gives a flying crap about people smoking pot. I get that it's banned but he's paying the price. I don't know that it should black ball him from helping a roster who surely could use it.

risk is that he gets suspended again for a longer period.

 

[Rav'n Maniac]

19 minutes ago, pep_meister said:

whats the risk? worst case it's his 5th time and he doesn't see the field again. he's paying the price clearly in his 10 game suspension. His previous 3 suspensions were for pot with the Giants, i can't recall if that was the reason for his 4th and if so who gives a flying crap about people smoking pot. I get that it's banned but he's paying the price. I don't know that it should black ball him from helping a roster who surely could use it.

We cut him before he served his suspension. Even if we brought him back and immediately put him on the 53, he still has to serve a 10 game suspension.

[pep_meister]

1 minute ago, Rav'n Maniac said:

We cut him before he served his suspension. Even if we brought him back and immediately put him on the 53, he still has to serve a 10 game suspension.

gotcha. i didn't know it worked that way. and tbh will hill would be a rental until his next suspension as sad as it is. but a lot of players are on rosters for depth and to be used when they are serviceable. if he got suspended again he is expendable. same as if a starter got injured and someone came in.

[K-Dog]

Consequences of decisions. 
Hill was a risk from the get-go. The Ravens trusted him, and he let them down.
The most worthless player on any team is a suspended one. 

[trevorsteadman]

This is the biggest thing the Ravens can fix and it will fix some of their offensive struggles. I get your down a lot of your starters on O-line and others (Zuttah) have no been playing well. And I get West had like 1 yard a carry on 10 carries.... But this is exactly why I was hesitant about Trestman coming here. I know he is gone now but his offense still remains. I remember watching a Bears-Lions I believe game on Thanksgiving like 3 years ago when he was in charge of the Bears.

The Bears went down two touchdowns really fast. They panicked. They stopped running the ball. This is the issue with teams going down like us on Sunday. We abandoned the run. The Bears totally ignored their best player in Forte that day. Our best friend the last couple games has been West. I know he got dinged and hurt and Taliaferro returning taking carries didn't help (especially when West starting lighting it up when he said he needed to play more for a rhythm). 

We abandon the run. Especially with injured Flacco with an injured o-line who has been underperforming all year and your best weapon in Steve Smith is out. What is the common theme behind all our touchdowns this season? We ran the ball effectively those drives. This shouldn't of gone away in the 3rd and 4th quarter. This is how decent teams lose. This is why the Baltimore Ravens went to the playoffs in 2014 under Kubiak. We had less talent that year and we are performing worse this year. Run the ball.

[omar586]

bring back the ZBS, if anyone saw Denver game, we sure miss Kubiack.

[CorvusMagnus]

Three positive things I saw on the last game that I think need to continue:

-Continue to build Correa and Judon by using them in a specialized manner, adding more diversity to their responsibilities as you go. Using Correa as a run stopper, Judon as a pass rusher in tandem worked well, and it helps both of them develop as two way players.

-Emphasize stop routes for Perriman, Wallace and Flacco. Ironically the play everyone criticizes him and Flacco for in the Jets game is a sign of things to come. Corners have to turn their hips early with Perriman or eat dust, if he comes back to the ball and Flacco hits him in stride, he's got positive yards and a chance at YAC.

-More Dixon on short passing routes a la Ray Rice. While I love me some Terrence West his catching limitations mean that he often has to stop and be floated the pass in order to secure the ball. Dixon can take the ball in stride, and once you get that kid in space, good things can happen.

Edited October 26, 2016 by CorvusMagnus

[ravensdfan]

13 hours ago, Militant X 1 said:

Until the Ravens discover and realize "who" they are, meaning what "type" of team they really are; they'll remain mediocre.  When I watch them, they are not a 3-4 wide receiver, spread'em and shred'em or air it out type of offense to me but more of a ground and pound and PA style of offense.

a. Sure up that O-line with the best players on the field and stop all of this patch, plug and play stuff.

b. Pound the rock! (Sure, it's a passing league but that doesn't mean that you shouldn't or can't smash a team in their mouth)

c. Use more 2 TE's sets especially in the redzone

d. Scheme the offensive personnel properly (Wallace/Perriman are the deep threats, SSS, Aiken and the TE's are the underneath boys)

e. Work that Play Action (Scheming off the run, Joe is a killer in that PA)

Defensively....

a. Bring more pressure it burst pipes! (cut out all of this bend but don't break junk) Put the fear of this defense back into teams!

b. J Smith is a huge "pressing" CB not a man to man type.  Scheme off of that.

c. Unfortunately, Suggs/Dumervil are done!  Let the younger, stronger and faster LB's get in the mix and hunt!

d. Secondary?  My goodness!  We need more help there but who?

I agree with all of this but unless you already have that defense in place, and a DC capable of bringing creative blitz packages and disguised blitzes etc, you can't pound the rock and play smash mouth football. . You also need an O line that can get some push for those runs, which ours cannot. Of course, our O line can't pass protect either. Usually an O line is at least decent in one area. It's a snowball effect really. Our drafts just have not produced talent where we need it. Partly to blame is that "best over need" philosophy that we used for too many years, relying on aged vets,other teams' cast offs and UDFAs to fill our areas of need. Not helping either is that those "best" we've chosen over need haven't turned out to be the best in recent drafts.

Edited October 26, 2016 by ravensdfan

[usmccharles]

I think we are not using the TEs near enough.  Pitta and Crockett out there together could be a huge improvement for the middle of the field. 

[MTRavensFan]

I would love to see more Crockett.