[News] Late For Work 10/12: Big Opportunity For Ravens' Playoff Positioning Before Bye

[BR News]

Would Marc Trestman still be employed IF …? Five players who could benefit most from Marty Mornhinweg. Does Justin Forsett signing with Lions affect Ravens’ salary cap? Power rankings: Ravens are average team.

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[budman]

I believe that even if the Ravens had won on Sunday, Trestman might still be our OC but either way he was gone during Bye week.

[whobilly]

Never good to have to go on the road and play desperate teams. Playoffs? PLAYOFFS???

[Ravenshine]

"And as bad as the Ravens have looked on offense, believe it or not, they are still in a strong position in the AFC race."

My second team Dallas Cowboys (grew up near Texas and so it's a family team as a little girl I was a Cowboy fan) is helping us this year. So any Cowboy haters reading this, there's reason to like them (a teeny weeny bit) this year at least...they are playing AFC North and so far beat Browns and Cincinnati. They play Steelers 11/13 so hoping they kick their butts. Then we play Dallas the following week...so...hope we beat them that week lol. But all the other matchups in our div they've been helping us by beating our rivals. Well, Cincinnati anyway (and later Steelers). Browns we don't seem to need help with they still haven't gotten their seasons back on track yet.

[stixfix69]

I still don't don't think Trestman would be around even if we won, as the offense has been awful over the first 5 weeks, and everyone knew it....Barley winning games, getting away from the run game, calling pass plays that are 4 yards short of the first down was wearing on Harbs, and of course us fans......And again, they always showed Joe after a series basically always sitting by himself with the tablet, so no interaction with Trestman on making in game adjustments....JMO

[January J]

Kind of silly to say games are a " must win" this early in the season..but with how our schedule shakes out, these 2 are pretty darn close. We had better ATLEAST split or were in major trouble.  If we can win both we will be in good shape.

[fluffy201]

I still don't don't think Trestman would be around even if we won, as the offense has been awful over the first 5 weeks, and everyone knew it....Barley winning games, getting away from the run game, calling pass plays that are 4 yards short of the first down was wearing on Harbs, and of course us fans......And again, they always showed Joe after a series basically always sitting by himself with the tablet, so no interaction with Trestman on making in game adjustments....JMO

Yea, well some one made mention of this earlier, but when will it be the time to where Joe starts taking responsibility. Usually a so called elite quarterback gets Offensive Coordinators head coaching jobs, not fired (yea yea......Kubiak). It seems Joe and Harbaugh have been in a trend to where it is everyone else fault, lets blame some one cause "this isn't working and it can't be me", I never hear Harbaugh take responsibility for bad clock management or stupid special teams play...........ever!. And if the play calling is bad, audible out of it Joe. I mean I am pretty sure he has been in the league for quite some time to where not every decision should be up to OC.

[billiejean]

Has Hardbaugh been asked or answered any questions about that fake field goal. Specifically the fact that he had Justin line up as if he was going to kick it with his left foot which really was a dead give away. There are not many left footed kickers in this league and I can guarantee that when a team is facing a left footed kicker everyone on the field goal unit knows it. Its not like it is a huge difference but there are minor changes players on the FG cover unit make when facing a left footed kicker. So it would be difficult to come to the conclusion that the way Tucker lined up would go unnoticed. Has Harbaugh explained why he thought this was a good idea? I mean I think the Trestman move was long overdue, but two questionable decisions by John over these last two weeks have really hurt this team. I am not saying that he should belfried but, he needs to be accountable. I know he said he didn't regret the play call, but I am interested in his decision making process in the design of that play. Thats all. Has he been asked about that or answered that question?

Edited October 12, 2016 by billiejean

[January J]

4 minutes ago, fluffy201 said:

Yea, well some one made mention of this earlier, but when will it be the time to where Joe starts taking responsibility. Usually a so called elite quarterback gets Offensive Coordinators head coaching jobs, not fired (yea yea......Kubiak). It seems Joe and Harbaugh have been in a trend to where it is everyone else fault, lets blame some one cause "this isn't working and it can't be me", I never hear Harbaugh take responsibility for bad clock management or stupid special teams play...........ever!. And if the play calling is bad, audible out of it Joe. I mean I am pretty sure he has been in the league for quite some time to where not every decision should be up to OC.

Well you must not listen to his post game pressers or ravens wired. He took full responsibility on the poor decision during the game to his players and after the game to the media.

[Bat-mite]

Will be very curious to see if Marty can work with our weak O-line to get more out of them when starters are down. To me, that is the critical issue right now. Doesn't matter if you have good receivers when the QB is being chased/hit/sacked/hurried.

[Ravenshine]

Will be very curious to see if Marty can work with our weak O-line to get more out of them when starters are down. To me, that is the critical issue right now. Doesn't matter if you have good receivers when the QB is being chased/hit/sacked/hurried.

Yep, and here's a stat from last game (quoted from this article) to support this:

"Baltimore surrendered a league-worst 23 quarterback pressures on Sunday, per Pro Football Focus."

[eze17]

I hope that Mornhinweg can help find our "invisible man", Kamar Aiken. He had a decent season last year, and I was hoping he could use it as a launchpad to better things this year, but instead seems to have dropped entirely off the radar. Not sure how many snaps he has played, but I know he hasn't been targeted very much. Curious wether it is more Trestman under utilizing him, Joe not looking for him or if he simply can't break out of coverage.

Wondering if the Jets actually like Butler, or just want to pick his brain for info on the Raven's...

And I agree with the Bleacher Report: What is going on with our special teams? Harb's has got to be pulling his hair out. Our traditional strength under Harb's reign looks like a disaster, and unfortunately it's not just one player, but guys all across the board seem to have forgotten how to play special teams.

[whobilly]

Has Hardbaugh been asked or answered any questions about that fake field goal. Specifically the fact that he had Justin line up as if he was going to kick it with his left foot which really was a dead give away. There are not many left footed kickers in this league and I can guarantee that when a team is facing a left footed kicker everyone on the field goal unit knows it. Its not like it is a huge difference but there are minor changes players on the FG cover unit make when facing a left footed kicker. So it would be difficult to come to the conclusion that the way Tucker lined up would go unnoticed. Has Harbaugh explained why he thought this was a good idea? I mean I think the Trestman move was long overdue, but two questionable decisions by John over these last two weeks have really hurt this team. He needs to be accountable. I want to know the decision making process in the design of that play. Thats all. Has he been asked about that or answered that question?

I saw a right footed kicker line up from his left side for a field goal before. I was watching a 12 year old sandlot game.

[fluffy201]

  14 minutes ago, fluffy201 said:

Yea, well some one made mention of this earlier, but when will it be the time to where Joe starts taking responsibility. Usually a so called elite quarterback gets Offensive Coordinators head coaching jobs, not fired (yea yea......Kubiak). It seems Joe and Harbaugh have been in a trend to where it is everyone else fault, lets blame some one cause "this isn't working and it can't be me", I never hear Harbaugh take responsibility for bad clock management or stupid special teams play...........ever!. And if the play calling is bad, audible out of it Joe. I mean I am pretty sure he has been in the league for quite some time to where not every decision should be up to OC.

Well you must not listen to his post game pressers or ravens wired. He took full responsibility on the poor decision during the game to his players and after the game to the media.

All I am saying is this is a much deeper problem than one OC. By the end of this year people will be screaming. I can't believe there is an article regarding the Ravens and the playoffs. I predict 8-8 to 9-7 team at best. Schedule only gets harder after this and back to back home losses is an abomination.

[billiejean]

Will be very curious to see if Marty can work with our weak O-line to get more out of them when starters are down. To me, that is the critical issue right now. Doesn't matter if you have good receivers when the QB is being chased/hit/sacked/hurried.

Totally agree with you here. When you have starting players missing it is the coaches responsibility to game plan knowing that these players will be gone. I feel like Trestman did a terrible job of this especially in the game where Hurst and Jensen were starting. So many five step drops. Joe was getting nailed. The defense needs to be kept honest. Running the ball is extremely important in these instances. And the flea flicker is a play that takes such a long time to develop. I think Joe took the hardest hit of the season on that play. I was really worried for him in that game. Hurst essentially is a turnstile. Hopefully we won't have to rely on his services in the future.

[griffrb]

Now the season begins! I don't expect to see a new offense, just a more defined commitment to the running and deep passing game. The oline must get healthy and in it's current state its easier to run downhill than pass protect. Flacco's mechanics suck and he's got rabbit ears now. WRs need to gain separation and make catches. Special teams have been acting very special lately. I'm giving the defense cudos! They're handling there business and I'm not mad at Mosley's fumble - He's making plays. Let's see how the next two weeks go! Go Ravens!

[stixfix69]

Firing also can rejuvenate players, it can make players have more confidence, as i know they were very frustrated coming up on so many 3rd down plays where the passes were 3 yards short of the sticks, and i do think the blocking schemes will have subtle changes.....Also think if Stanley is out, that Lewis LT, Urschel LG, Zuttah Center, Ducasse RG, and Yanda RT would be pretty solid....More zone blocking schemes, and just break out Kubiaks entire playbook including blocking schemes and use it.....

[sami]

Now the season begins! I don't expect to see a new offense, just a more defined commitment to the running and deep passing game. The oline must get healthy and in it's current state its easier to run downhill than pass protect. Flacco's mechanics suck and he's got rabbit ears now. WRs need to gain separation and make catches. Special teams have been acting very special lately. I'm giving the defense cudos! They're handling there business and I'm not mad at Mosley's fumble - He's making plays. Let's see how the next two weeks go! Go Ravens!

Flaccos mechanics is one thing Kubiak really stressed...FOOTWORK. It seems Trestman got completely away from that and was stressing more quick release. Flacco needs to get back to working on his footwork. Its not the whole answer but it would make him more accurate.

[fluffy201]

  29 minutes ago, billiejean said:

Has Hardbaugh been asked or answered any questions about that fake field goal. Specifically the fact that he had Justin line up as if he was going to kick it with his left foot which really was a dead give away. There are not many left footed kickers in this league and I can guarantee that when a team is facing a left footed kicker everyone on the field goal unit knows it. Its not like it is a huge difference but there are minor changes players on the FG cover unit make when facing a left footed kicker. So it would be difficult to come to the conclusion that the way Tucker lined up would go unnoticed. Has Harbaugh explained why he thought this was a good idea? I mean I think the Trestman move was long overdue, but two questionable decisions by John over these last two weeks have really hurt this team. He needs to be accountable. I want to know the decision making process in the design of that play. Thats all. Has he been asked about that or answered that question?

I saw a right footed kicker line up from his left side for a field goal before. I was watching a 12 year old sandlot game.

lol

[Minionhunter]

  18 minutes ago, griffrb said:

Now the season begins! I don't expect to see a new offense, just a more defined commitment to the running and deep passing game. The oline must get healthy and in it's current state its easier to run downhill than pass protect. Flacco's mechanics suck and he's got rabbit ears now. WRs need to gain separation and make catches. Special teams have been acting very special lately. I'm giving the defense cudos! They're handling there business and I'm not mad at Mosley's fumble - He's making plays. Let's see how the next two weeks go! Go Ravens!

Flaccos mechanics is one thing Kubiak really stressed...FOOTWORK. It seems Trestman got completely away from that and was stressing more quick release. Flacco needs to get back to working on his footwork. Its not the whole answer but it would make him more accurate.

I thought I was the only one who noticed this Sami. Excellent point. Gary and Rick hammered(!) how footwork connects to both reads and throwing. Testman lost that immediately on arrival last year and never fixed it. I hope they fix it now.

[Minionhunter]

Two weeks in a row now the team playing us has been awarded special teams player of the week.

[iluvpurple]

Has Hardbaugh been asked or answered any questions about that fake field goal. Specifically the fact that he had Justin line up as if he was going to kick it with his left foot which really was a dead give away. There are not many left footed kickers in this league and I can guarantee that when a team is facing a left footed kicker everyone on the field goal unit knows it. Its not like it is a huge difference but there are minor changes players on the FG cover unit make when facing a left footed kicker. So it would be difficult to come to the conclusion that the way Tucker lined up would go unnoticed. Has Harbaugh explained why he thought this was a good idea? I mean I think the Trestman move was long overdue, but two questionable decisions by John over these last two weeks have really hurt this team. I am not saying that he should belfried but, he needs to be accountable. I know he said he didn't regret the play call, but I am interested in his decision making process in the design of that play. Thats all. Has he been asked about that or answered that question?

Well, if it had worked, everyone would be praising the play, it just didn't work out..... I personally have no problem with trying a few potential "trick plays", sometimes they work, sometimes they don't, but I would also prefer we have more points on the board when trying these types of plays ??

[Minionhunter]

I hope that Mornhinweg can help find our "invisible man", Kamar Aiken. He had a decent season last year, and I was hoping he could use it as a launchpad to better things this year, but instead seems to have dropped entirely off the radar. Not sure how many snaps he has played, but I know he hasn't been targeted very much. Curious wether it is more Trestman under utilizing him, Joe not looking for him or if he simply can't break out of coverage.

Wondering if the Jets actually like Butler, or just want to pick his brain for info on the Raven's...

And I agree with the Bleacher Report: What is going on with our special teams? Harb's has got to be pulling his hair out. Our traditional strength under Harb's reign looks like a disaster, and unfortunately it's not just one player, but guys all across the board seem to have forgotten how to play special teams.

The Jets likely see Butler as an opportunity (desperate or not) because they need a possession receiver now that Decker is getting surgery to end his season.

OTOH The Bucs just didn't want the Ravens to pick up Butler so they called him up last week and then cut him again. I said this last week, petty moves rarely benefit a team, just look at the Browns and T. West....

[Minionhunter]

  52 minutes ago, billiejean said:

Has Hardbaugh been asked or answered any questions about that fake field goal. Specifically the fact that he had Justin line up as if he was going to kick it with his left foot which really was a dead give away. There are not many left footed kickers in this league and I can guarantee that when a team is facing a left footed kicker everyone on the field goal unit knows it. Its not like it is a huge difference but there are minor changes players on the FG cover unit make when facing a left footed kicker. So it would be difficult to come to the conclusion that the way Tucker lined up would go unnoticed. Has Harbaugh explained why he thought this was a good idea? I mean I think the Trestman move was long overdue, but two questionable decisions by John over these last two weeks have really hurt this team. I am not saying that he should belfried but, he needs to be accountable. I know he said he didn't regret the play call, but I am interested in his decision making process in the design of that play. Thats all. Has he been asked about that or answered that question?

Well, if it had worked, everyone would be praising the play, it just didn't work out..... I personally have no problem with trying a few potential "trick plays", sometimes they work, sometimes they don't, but I would also prefer we have more points on the board when trying these types of plays ??

I'm with you. I like the aggressiveness of Harbaugh. I love it really, more coaches need to do it. I also am with you on that I don't think it was the time, however I'm not the one watching my OC abandon the only thing that was working on offense. He may have been thinking he needed to do something to spark the team and the fake field goal was it. The Skins said they didn't notice tucker lined up left, so he might have caught them sleeping too. Also it was nearly executed to give us the TD, just slightly under thrown. The defender had it hit him in the back of the helmet, it wasn't like he was playing it perfectly.

The bigger question IMHO was what was going on right before the half?

[fusuymada]

I watched Mornhenwegs work as OC with other teams and I think all these pundits and bandwagon fans who are blaming Ozzie, Harbaugh, Flacco, our receivers, etc... will be surprised with what Marty does compared to what Trestman did and some will have to eat their words. It is amazing how so many who know so little are so eager to tell people who have been successful in this business how to do their jobs. I guess those who can't do, criticize those who actually get and keep the jobs doing it. Isnt (sniff, sniff) that right (sniff, sniff) Vinnie (sniff, sniff) Cerrato.

[billiejean]

  1 hour ago, billiejean said:

Has Hardbaugh been asked or answered any questions about that fake field goal. Specifically the fact that he had Justin line up as if he was going to kick it with his left foot which really was a dead give away. There are not many left footed kickers in this league and I can guarantee that when a team is facing a left footed kicker everyone on the field goal unit knows it. Its not like it is a huge difference but there are minor changes players on the FG cover unit make when facing a left footed kicker. So it would be difficult to come to the conclusion that the way Tucker lined up would go unnoticed. Has Harbaugh explained why he thought this was a good idea? I mean I think the Trestman move was long overdue, but two questionable decisions by John over these last two weeks have really hurt this team. I am not saying that he should belfried but, he needs to be accountable. I know he said he didn't regret the play call, but I am interested in his decision making process in the design of that play. Thats all. Has he been asked about that or answered that question?

Well, if it had worked, everyone would be praising the play, it just didn't work out..... I personally have no problem with trying a few potential "trick plays", sometimes they work, sometimes they don't, but I would also prefer we have more points on the board when trying these types of plays ??

So my problem is not with the trick play, it is with the design of the play. When a right footed kicker lines up as if he is going to kick with with his left foot the element of surprise is lost. The special teams is going to know that something is up. Soi also would like to hear Harbaughs reasoning for the design. There may be something that I am missing that could possibly justify the play design although I am not sure what that would be. Thats all, but I don't have a problem with trick plays now and then.

[TheConquerorWorm]

  40 minutes ago, iluvpurple said:

  1 hour ago, billiejean said:

Has Hardbaugh been asked or answered any questions about that fake field goal. Specifically the fact that he had Justin line up as if he was going to kick it with his left foot which really was a dead give away. There are not many left footed kickers in this league and I can guarantee that when a team is facing a left footed kicker everyone on the field goal unit knows it. Its not like it is a huge difference but there are minor changes players on the FG cover unit make when facing a left footed kicker. So it would be difficult to come to the conclusion that the way Tucker lined up would go unnoticed. Has Harbaugh explained why he thought this was a good idea? I mean I think the Trestman move was long overdue, but two questionable decisions by John over these last two weeks have really hurt this team. I am not saying that he should belfried but, he needs to be accountable. I know he said he didn't regret the play call, but I am interested in his decision making process in the design of that play. Thats all. Has he been asked about that or answered that question?

Well, if it had worked, everyone would be praising the play, it just didn't work out..... I personally have no problem with trying a few potential "trick plays", sometimes they work, sometimes they don't, but I would also prefer we have more points on the board when trying these types of plays ??

So my problem is not with the trick play, it is with the design of the play. When a right footed kicker lines up as if he is going to kick with with his left foot the element of surprise is lost. The special teams is going to know that something is up. Soi also would like to hear Harbaughs reasoning for the design. There may be something that I am missing that could possibly justify the play design although I am not sure what that would be. Thats all, but I don't have a problem with trick plays now and then.

He already commented. They did this in practice and none of our defensive players noticed - "If it can fool our guys, then it can definitely fool a team that's never played against Tucker." or something along those lines. Bottom line - the Skins defense did not see it coming, Gilmore was wide open. His stumbled allowed the defense to catch back up. The reason Tucker lined up left is so he'd be in a better position to throw the ball right handed to the right side (where Gilmore lines up).

[Ravenshine]

  43 minutes ago, iluvpurple said:

  1 hour ago, billiejean said:

Has Hardbaugh been asked or answered any questions about that fake field goal. Specifically the fact that he had Justin line up as if he was going to kick it with his left foot which really was a dead give away. There are not many left footed kickers in this league and I can guarantee that when a team is facing a left footed kicker everyone on the field goal unit knows it. Its not like it is a huge difference but there are minor changes players on the FG cover unit make when facing a left footed kicker. So it would be difficult to come to the conclusion that the way Tucker lined up would go unnoticed. Has Harbaugh explained why he thought this was a good idea? I mean I think the Trestman move was long overdue, but two questionable decisions by John over these last two weeks have really hurt this team. I am not saying that he should belfried but, he needs to be accountable. I know he said he didn't regret the play call, but I am interested in his decision making process in the design of that play. Thats all. Has he been asked about that or answered that question?

Well, if it had worked, everyone would be praising the play, it just didn't work out..... I personally have no problem with trying a few potential "trick plays", sometimes they work, sometimes they don't, but I would also prefer we have more points on the board when trying these types of plays ??

I'm with you. I like the aggressiveness of Harbaugh. I love it really, more coaches need to do it. I also am with you on that I don't think it was the time, however I'm not the one watching my OC abandon the only thing that was working on offense. He may have been thinking he needed to do something to spark the team and the fake field goal was it. The Skins said they didn't notice tucker lined up left, so he might have caught them sleeping too. Also it was nearly executed to give us the TD, just slightly under thrown. The defender had it hit him in the back of the helmet, it wasn't like he was playing it perfectly.

The bigger question IMHO was what was going on right before the half?

Steve Smith and Wagner got injured, ...four of the five offensive linemen were at positions they didn’t play just a week ago. It was a momentum changer that didn't help us at all and got the Skins pumped to rush our QB all rest of game.

[RavensBaltimore]

  1 hour ago, griffrb said:

Now the season begins! I don't expect to see a new offense, just a more defined commitment to the running and deep passing game. The oline must get healthy and in it's current state its easier to run downhill than pass protect. Flacco's mechanics suck and he's got rabbit ears now. WRs need to gain separation and make catches. Special teams have been acting very special lately. I'm giving the defense cudos! They're handling there business and I'm not mad at Mosley's fumble - He's making plays. Let's see how the next two weeks go! Go Ravens!

Flaccos mechanics is one thing Kubiak really stressed...FOOTWORK. It seems Trestman got completely away from that and was stressing more quick release. Flacco needs to get back to working on his footwork. Its not the whole answer but it would make him more accurate.

A QBs footwork is never going to be good when he constantly has pressure in his face. I don't see how he could be more accurate. He's completing almost 2/3 of his passes despite having no time to throw and wrs that can't get open or catch.

[TheConquerorWorm]

  1 hour ago, griffrb said:

Now the season begins! I don't expect to see a new offense, just a more defined commitment to the running and deep passing game. The oline must get healthy and in it's current state its easier to run downhill than pass protect. Flacco's mechanics suck and he's got rabbit ears now. WRs need to gain separation and make catches. Special teams have been acting very special lately. I'm giving the defense cudos! They're handling there business and I'm not mad at Mosley's fumble - He's making plays. Let's see how the next two weeks go! Go Ravens!

Flaccos mechanics is one thing Kubiak really stressed...FOOTWORK. It seems Trestman got completely away from that and was stressing more quick release. Flacco needs to get back to working on his footwork. Its not the whole answer but it would make him more accurate.

That's not exactly true. Kubiak's unique west coast system stresses that the QB make a read and throw on each step. It's a system specific technique and leans more to the "dink & dunk" throwing to the TE. That footwork does not really apply to anybody else's system. That's what Kubiak was stressing to Flacco. And I think it goes against everything we want to see - downfield throws. That system works but it doesn't allow for the play to develop, it doesn't look for the deep ball, etc.

Flacco is a tall, in-the-pocket QB - he has to have time to set his feet. With the porous O-line, that's not happening which is why you see so many over/under thrown balls. When he's square & set - he throws darts like the ball that hit Aiken in the numbers or that beautiful rainbow that Perriman dropped.