2017 first round Corner back

[BmoreBird22]

On 10/16/2016 at 10:13 PM, Darhk_Raven said:

I know a few people have been talking about Quincy Wilson.. I saw someone on a website has dropped him out of their top 10 CB list to #11 and they said he's a 2nd or 3rd pick with potential to be a 1st. He was originally higher. 

What website would that be?

[ravensnation5220]

1 hour ago, BmoreBird22 said:

He might not even be a top 5 CB in this class. It's loaded with corners.

Size speed combo will make him a top 20 pick. History has shown that to be true. A lot of great corners this year are either undersized or just cant handle the slot well (tankersly)

He can do both but hes lockdown outside

Edited October 19, 2016 by ravensnation5220

[BmoreBird22]

Just now, ravensnation5220 said:

Size speed combo will make him a top 20 pick. History has shown that to be true. A lot of great corners this year are either undersized or just cant handle the slot well (tankersly)

Just off the top of my head, King, Tabor, Wilson, Jones, Lewis, and Conley are going to be guys that could go before him.

[ravensnation5220]

22 minutes ago, BmoreBird22 said:

Just off the top of my head, King, Tabor, Wilson, Jones, Lewis, and Conley are going to be guys that could go before him.

Conley doesnt have much tape or experience. Jones is still very slim yet very physicla, and lewis is extremely small. Thats the knock i see against those guys. I mean last year we had like 4 or 5 go in the top 25. I think this years class is better but i still havent fallen in love with one guy just yet. Havent seen much of wilson. 

[BmoreBird22]

8 hours ago, ravensnation5220 said:

Conley doesnt have much tape or experience. Jones is still very slim yet very physicla, and lewis is extremely small. Thats the knock i see against those guys. I mean last year we had like 4 or 5 go in the top 25. I think this years class is better but i still havent fallen in love with one guy just yet. Havent seen much of wilson. 

Scouts are apparently raving about Conley. 

Just reporting what I'm seeing here and there.

[ravensnation5220]

3 hours ago, BmoreBird22 said:

Scouts are apparently raving about Conley. 

Just reporting what I'm seeing here and there.

True keep it up man. I love seeing new names. I saw him vs wisconsin he really showed up on tape and i didnt know him until after the game when you mentioned him here. Saw that q wilson has only allowed like 2 catches all year. Idk how i feel about his character though....i like tabors attitude more but neither of them really impress me. I mean someone asked tabor what he would do other than football and he said "i dont know" Noth that thats a huge deal but i like seeing prospects who do have a back up plan in life. I feel like ozzie does look at little things like that. Remember he follows these kids on twitter, so im trying to do the same thing ?

[BmoreBird22]

1 hour ago, ravensnation5220 said:

True keep it up man. I love seeing new names. I saw him vs wisconsin he really showed up on tape and i didnt know him until after the game when you mentioned him here. Saw that q wilson has only allowed like 2 catches all year. Idk how i feel about his character though....i like tabors attitude more but neither of them really impress me. I mean someone asked tabor what he would do other than football and he said "i dont know" Noth that thats a huge deal but i like seeing prospects who do have a back up plan in life. I feel like ozzie does look at little things like that. Remember he follows these kids on twitter, so im trying to do the same thing ?

What's up with Wilson's attitude? Matt Miller said scouts heavily lean Wilson due to no off the field issues, unlike Tabor. Although, the off the field, if Ozzie feels comfortable, may push him to the Ravens range.

[ravensnation5220]

1 minute ago, BmoreBird22 said:

What's up with Wilson's attitude? Matt Miller said scouts heavily lean Wilson due to no off the field issues, unlike Tabor. Although, the off the field, if Ozzie feels comfortable, may push him to the Ravens range.

Idk just the attitude and arrogance he has when i hear him speak. Nothing with off the feild. 

[BmoreBird22]

Just now, ravensnation5220 said:

Idk just the attitude and arrogance he has when i hear him speak. Nothing with off the feild. 

I don't know. I kinda want a corner to be a bit arrogant just because of the nature of the position. It'd be a little more concerning to me if he were like a quarterback or something.

[ravensnation5220]

1 minute ago, BmoreBird22 said:

I don't know. I kinda want a corner to be a bit arrogant just because of the nature of the position. It'd be a little more concerning to me if he were like a quarterback or something.

Well his play surely does speak for itself. I just didnt like the remarks he had for tennesee. Especially after how they completely chocked in the second half

[Cillmatic]

Never trust Florida DB's.

[jboy19]

10 minutes ago, Cillmatic said:

Never trust Florida DB's.

Joe Haden's done well. Hargreaves hasn't been a huge disappointment. 

[Darhk_Raven]

16 hours ago, BmoreBird22 said:

What website would that be?

It was walterfootball.com. I don't always agree with their rankings, but it is weird that they would drop him in their recent rankings. 

[BmoreBird22]

33 minutes ago, Darhk_Raven said:

It was walterfootball.com. I don't always agree with their rankings, but it is weird that they would drop him in their recent rankings. 

I don't really trust them too much.

[Cillmatic]

1 hour ago, jboy19 said:

Joe Haden's done well. Hargreaves hasn't been a huge disappointment. 

Joe Haden has been getting progressively worse and has become a shell of his former self. Hargreaves has only played six games. Then there's Elam and Will Hill...

[Cillmatic]

37 minutes ago, BmoreBird22 said:

I don't really trust them too much.

They've guess our last three first round picks.

[ravensnation5220]

5 minutes ago, Cillmatic said:

They've guess our last three first round picks.

That could just be luck. Im sure theyve been wrong 3X in a row for other teams. I mean they still have deshone kizer as the top overall prospect....his team is 2-5 lol

Edited October 19, 2016 by ravensnation5220

[ravefan52]

3 hours ago, Cillmatic said:

Never trust Florida DB's.

Scout the player not the helmet

[BmoreBird22]

2 hours ago, Cillmatic said:

They've guess our last three first round picks.

Did they guess it in October or was it closer to April?

Just looked and they got it wrong this year and in 2014. They had Ebron/Tunsil.

Okay, I literally Googled "Walter Football 201X mock draft" and found the ones ahead of the draft and they had Ebron/Peters/Tunsil.

Edited October 19, 2016 by BmoreBird22

[BmoreBird22]

37 minutes ago, ravefan52 said:

Scout the player not the helmet

There are some scouts who do not like Juju Smith-Schuster because he goes to USC. It's a legit concern until a USC WR succeeds and justifies his draft position. Some schools systems just don't prepare them well. 

I also truly do not like Baylor offensive players and so far they're kinda just average players in the NFL.

[ravefan52]

15 minutes ago, BmoreBird22 said:

There are some scouts who do not like Juju Smith-Schuster because he goes to USC. It's a legit concern until a USC WR succeeds and justifies his draft position. Some schools systems just don't prepare them well. 

I also truly do not like Baylor offensive players and so far they're kinda just average players in the NFL.

Yeah I get a few of them. I hate most Boise State players. Some systems are just bad, but they can change over time so I give every prospect a chance.

[BmoreBird22]

27 minutes ago, ravefan52 said:

Yeah I get a few of them. I hate most Boise State players. Some systems are just bad, but they can change over time so I give every prospect a chance.

I think it's one of those where I'll need to see a few good ones out of USC or Baylor to change my tune.

A few bad ones out of Bama, for example, won't make a lick of difference to me.

[Cillmatic]

2 hours ago, BmoreBird22 said:

Did they guess it in October or was it closer to April?

Just looked and they got it wrong this year and in 2014. They had Ebron/Tunsil.

Okay, I literally Googled "Walter Football 201X mock draft" and found the ones ahead of the draft and they had Ebron/Peters/Tunsil.

They change projection every week. By the time the drafts were around the corner they correctly picked Mosely, Perriman and Stanley.

[BmoreBird22]

2 hours ago, Cillmatic said:

They change projection every week. By the time the drafts were around the corner they correctly picked Mosely, Perriman and Stanley.

What I Googled was literally the most recent ones that I could find.

[Cillmatic]

This Tre'davious White guy is pretty bad at tackling.

[JoeyFlex5]

On 10/17/2016 at 0:24 AM, ravensnation5220 said:

Hmmmm idk about white. He mirrors well but hes not as physical as id like him to be. Idk if he just doesnt like it or what but when your 180 and wanna play in the nfl you gotta show me some toughness. To me he doesnt. Not like jourdan lewis does. I agree with humphrey though its very shady with him. Although he did have a great game vs clemson which is a good sign. 

I think a physical corner is overrated these days, you want one corner to be physical and then you want the rest of your guys to be excellent mirror guys and with great ball skills, often good in zone coverage and route jumping. Its just the way of the NFL. Let a Jimmy Smith get physical with the #1, bracket a safety his way, and then go zone heavy elsewhere. It keeps the top wr in check if ran successfully and clogs throwing lanes elsewhere. 

Not to mention the increased use of crossing routes and bunch formations for "unintentional" pick routes, you don't want all your corners up right playing man because you'll just end up leaving everyone open on those crossing patterns when your dbs run into each other.

If you have a big physical corner already then you're good and you should start looking for explosive and instinctive guys with great zone awareness.

 

[RaineV1]

52 minutes ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

I think a physical corner is overrated these days, you want one corner to be physical and then you want the rest of your guys to be excellent mirror guys and with great ball skills, often good in zone coverage and route jumping. Its just the way of the NFL. Let a Jimmy Smith get physical with the #1, bracket a safety his way, and then go zone heavy elsewhere. It keeps the top wr in check if ran successfully and clogs throwing lanes elsewhere. 

Not to mention the increased use of crossing routes and bunch formations for "unintentional" pick routes, you don't want all your corners up right playing man because you'll just end up leaving everyone open on those crossing patterns when your dbs run into each other.

If you have a big physical corner already then you're good and you should start looking for explosive and instinctive guys with great zone awareness.

 

I think it depends on your defense's system. Seattle has loved having large, physical corners on both sides. Denver's corners are fairly physical too.

[ravensnation5220]

1 hour ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

I think a physical corner is overrated these days, you want one corner to be physical and then you want the rest of your guys to be excellent mirror guys and with great ball skills, often good in zone coverage and route jumping. Its just the way of the NFL. Let a Jimmy Smith get physical with the #1, bracket a safety his way, and then go zone heavy elsewhere. It keeps the top wr in check if ran successfully and clogs throwing lanes elsewhere. 

Not to mention the increased use of crossing routes and bunch formations for "unintentional" pick routes, you don't want all your corners up right playing man because you'll just end up leaving everyone open on those crossing patterns when your dbs run into each other.

If you have a big physical corner already then you're good and you should start looking for explosive and instinctive guys with great zone awareness.

 

I see what your saying but to me white is more of a nickle back. We already have a nickle to develop in young who i think will pan out well. We really need a guy who can come in and be a #2 and eventually take over jimmy for the #1. I think jimmys foot problem really stunted his growth as a prospect and ultimately his ceiling. Its also going to shorten his career and how long hes able to stay productive. I agree on your assesment of finding guys with great ball skills but if you want a guy who can play well in zone and has those ball skills who can also come in and support vs the run and is a trusted tackler than i think king would be the better choice over white. Not to mention a lot of nfl teams top 2 recievers are typically 6-2 or bigger. Some even go 3 or 4 deep at that size. I just view white as a very good slot corner at the next level. 

[JoeyFlex5]

1 hour ago, RaineV1 said:

I think it depends on your defense's system. Seattle has loved having large, physical corners on both sides. Denver's corners are fairly physical too.

They had advantages that most teams don't have though so it works for them. If we had an elite pass rush or a clear cut top safety tandem like Denver or seattle, respectively, then we could do that.

Seattle runs almost purely zone with bump and run so it's not like they were just sticking like glue to receivers keeping them hemmed up at the line and their safeties and linebackers all played a huge part in their pass defenses, and Denver can get away with that risky play because their front seven combined with wade Phillips scheming is hell for a qb. Chris Harris is my favorite cb in the league because he's diverse, so he does a fair bit of the kind of stuff I'm talking about, he just also happens to be able to press fairly well.

I get what you're saying though, I just think our personnel is far from being able to do that and were better off with guys who can stick to receivers downfield and jump routes, constant press coverage is very risky with no pass rush.

[JoeyFlex5]

34 minutes ago, ravensnation5220 said:

I see what your saying but to me white is more of a nickle back. We already have a nickle to develop in young who i think will pan out well. We really need a guy who can come in and be a #2 and eventually take over jimmy for the #1. I think jimmys foot problem really stunted his growth as a prospect and ultimately his ceiling. Its also going to shorten his career and how long hes able to stay productive. I agree on your assesment of finding guys with great ball skills but if you want a guy who can play well in zone and has those ball skills who can also come in and support vs the run and is a trusted tackler than i think king would be the better choice over white. Not to mention a lot of nfl teams top 2 recievers are typically 6-2 or bigger. Some even go 3 or 4 deep at that size. I just view white as a very good slot corner at the next level. 

I'm not sure white is a nickel corner. A lot of successful outside cbs are 5'10" and thags because the lower center of gravity allows them to stick better and also recover quicker. My favorite example is pat pete, hell of a corner and athlete but he's big and tall and often gets caught on double moves and comeback routes because he's got a slower cut than guys that are 2-3 inches shorter. 

I won't argue about king though. I'm torn between the 2 I just happen to think he excels more as a safety than a corner, though I think he's a great fit at either spot.