Jeremy Zuttah

[The Raven]

1 minute ago, Rav'n Maniac said:

Just curious what you think of Jensen's play at center?

His pass blocking leaves a little to be desired -- his footwork is often sloppy -- but his run blocking is head and shoulders above Zuttah. With experience he'd do better in pass protection.

[rmcjacket23]

12 minutes ago, The Raven said:

Eh, he's at center, though, where you rarely face quality pass rushers, especially in the AFC north where the Browns and Steelers have had hefty DTs that don't rush the passer well from the A gap.

And even if his pass blocking record is good, his run blocking leaves a crap ton to be desired.

By the way, Mike Preston today suggested benching Zuttah. I know most people don't like him because his realism makes people uncomfortable, but he's got a good football mind and has covered this team for a little over two decades. Preston was once a linemen, too, way back in his day.

Well its not so much that his "realism" bothers people, its more that a lot of times he doesn't actually seem to watch the football game. His analysis is typically just regurgitating what people on 105.7 overreact to, or just makes obvious statements.

I read his columns often, mostly for the amusement. Even the one you are referencing, the "six steps to fix the run game" is a laugher, primarily because he doesn't actually give six steps or solutions. He just makes six points. 

If you're going to present steps for a solution, then you should actually present steps. It starts off well enough by saying to bench Zuttah and give West more carries. Fine, I can live with that.

Then, step 3 says we should attack the perimeter more, which is counter-intuitive to what West is good at. Step 4 and 5 are purely observations, in that our left side is young and they'll experience "growing pains", and we don't have a good blocking TE available. Neither of these things are steps or solutions... they're identifying problems, not presenting solutions.

#6 isn't even relevant, where he says Trestman and Castillo may or may not be on the same page.

That article alone is a great example of why people hate Preston's work. He's all over the place, and attempts to get away with presenting "six steps to a solution", while only actually presenting two actual steps.

Edited September 20, 2016 by rmcjacket23

[Rav'n Maniac]

7 minutes ago, The Raven said:

His pass blocking leaves a little to be desired -- his footwork is often sloppy -- but his run blocking is head and shoulders above Zuttah. With experience he'd do better in pass protection.

I thought the same thing while watching him during preseason. One play stuck in my mind were he seemed to cross his feet and lost his footing while being pushed back, ending up on the ground.

[The Raven]

13 minutes ago, rmcjacket23 said:

Well its not so much that his "realism" bothers people, its more that a lot of times he doesn't actually seem to watch the football game. His analysis is typically just regurgitating what people on 105.7 overreact to, or just makes obvious statements.

I read his columns often, mostly for the amusement. Even the one you are referencing, the "six steps to fix the run game" is a laugher, primarily because he doesn't actually give six steps or solutions. He just makes six points. 

If you're going to present steps for a solution, then you should actually present steps. It starts off well enough by saying to bench Zuttah and give West more carries. Fine, I can live with that.

Then, step 3 says we should attack the perimeter more, which is counter-intuitive to what West is good at. Step 4 and 5 are purely observations, in that our left side is young and they'll experience "growing pains", and we don't have a good blocking TE available. Neither of these things are steps or solutions... they're identifying problems, not presenting solutions.

#6 isn't even relevant, where he says Trestman and Castillo may or may not be on the same page.

That article alone is a great example of why people hate Preston's work. He's all over the place, and attempts to get away with presenting "six steps to a solution", while only actually presenting two actual steps.

Just FYI -- At big papers like the Sun, editors write the headlines, not the writer. Note that in the body of the column he doesn't call it six steps; he says "here are the problems I see with the running game and possible ways to fix it." And editors frequently go for catchy headlines like that one. That's probably why it seems weird. Blame BuzzFeed and Huffington Post for that craze. I work in the industry and these things irk me to no end.

I would argue that attacking the perimeter is the right thing to do. Wagner and Stanley are doing better than Lewis and Zuttah. I say run to where your line can block, not where you think your back can run. No sense running up the middle if there isn't a hole there......... That's just stupid.

Number 6 is absolutely relevant if he's identifying problems with the run game, too, as he writes in the actual body of the column.

Edited September 20, 2016 by The Raven

[Filmstudy]

22 hours ago, Maryland said:

I don't see why everyone is talking about Urschel or Jensen as the magical solution to Zuttah. Are we forgetting how badly Jensen was getting pushed back on some plays in preseason? He's probably not going to be much better than Zuttah, if he's better at all. Urschel is probably seen as a backup guard and 3rd-string center behind Jensen, looking at the preseason snaps. 

Jensen looked bad in game 2, but recovered to play near perfect ball in the last 2 preseason games.  I'm not saying that's enough of a reason for him to replace Zuttah after Jeremy's game improved to OK (a C as I score it) vs. the Browns.

I am concerned with the number of missed blocks.  Centers never accumulate many, which is one of the reasons why I need separate grading scales by position.  He's led the team in missed blocks in each of the first 2 weeks (7 each game) and the reasons are varied (misses in L2, pushed into backfield on runs, failing to make screen blocks, failing to get to a block in time, etc.).

[Cawtious]

6 hours ago, Filmstudy said:

 

I am concerned with the number of missed blocks.  Centers never accumulate many, which is one of the reasons why I need separate grading scales by position.  He's led the team in missed blocks in each of the first 2 weeks (7 each game) and the reasons are varied (misses in L2, pushed into backfield on runs, failing to make screen blocks, failing to get to a block in time, etc.).

This is what I saw in the game last week.  He was late on his pulls to block on a couple of runs to the left.  He also ran right past a defender to take on the OLB while the defender he passed on slipped through to make the tackle.  Not sure if that was a blown assignment, but it looked like indecisiveness.  Jeremy doesn't seem to get out to the second level as well as Jensen does.  Jensen, at times, overruns his initial blocks because he is quick to move up field.  He attacks and drives defenders off the ball well, and finishes blocks with attitude (ergo the skirmishes after the echo of the whistle).  I think when he, Urschel, and KO were in last year they had very good chemistry.  Even KO gave Jensen props last year on Twitter for his efforts.  We need that nasty on the line.

[JoeyFlex5]

He's been ok with us. He also had ko and yanda bookending him. And started in kubiaks system which suited him very well. But he doesn't have an elite guard tandem anymore and the offense doesn't quite suit him and now his lack of strength is apparent, and worst of all he has had mental lapses left and right. 

If the mental lapses dont stop then we have a problem. 

Ethan pocic for ravens first rounder 2017!!!

[rmcjacket23]

16 hours ago, The Raven said:

Just FYI -- At big papers like the Sun, editors write the headlines, not the writer. Note that in the body of the column he doesn't call it six steps; he says "here are the problems I see with the running game and possible ways to fix it." And editors frequently go for catchy headlines like that one. That's probably why it seems weird. Blame BuzzFeed and Huffington Post for that craze. I work in the industry and these things irk me to no end.

I would argue that attacking the perimeter is the right thing to do. Wagner and Stanley are doing better than Lewis and Zuttah. I say run to where your line can block, not where you think your back can run. No sense running up the middle if there isn't a hole there......... That's just stupid.

Number 6 is absolutely relevant if he's identifying problems with the run game, too, as he writes in the actual body of the column.

1. Attacking the perimeter is good in theory, except it requires quality Guard play to do as well. Guards don't just block for interior runs, so if you're going to attack the perimeter to Wagner and Stanley's side, you're going to need good blocking from the entire line to do it, including Lewis and Zuttah. 

My issue is that doesn't even remotely fit what West's skill set is, so those two "solutions" would seem to clash.

2. #6 is a cop out for me. He's just basically guessing that there's issues between the two, despite no proof of that. He's never been a fan of Castillo and I don't think he's thrilled with Trestman being here, so pretty easy for him to just guess that they are conflicting. Blaming coaches for obvious player mistakes never looks good in my eyes.

[The Raven]

7 hours ago, rmcjacket23 said:

1. Attacking the perimeter is good in theory, except it requires quality Guard play to do as well. Guards don't just block for interior runs, so if you're going to attack the perimeter to Wagner and Stanley's side, you're going to need good blocking from the entire line to do it, including Lewis and Zuttah. 

My issue is that doesn't even remotely fit what West's skill set is, so those two "solutions" would seem to clash.

2. #6 is a cop out for me. He's just basically guessing that there's issues between the two, despite no proof of that. He's never been a fan of Castillo and I don't think he's thrilled with Trestman being here, so pretty easy for him to just guess that they are conflicting. Blaming coaches for obvious player mistakes never looks good in my eyes.

Well gee, I didn't know that.  C'mon man... I appreciate your insight but don't be so condescending. Like damn, your posts make ME look like a down to earth and nice person. That's hard to do. You know I played guard, once.

Good thing our guard play is a lot better than our center play, then, isn't it? Even the rookie is doing better than Zuttah.

Number six is not a cop out, but whatever.

As a former offensive linemen, I agree with his points. They make perfect sense regardless of your petty gripes with the headline and calling relevant things irrelevant. 

Edited September 21, 2016 by The Raven

[ALPHA]

We had a chance to upgrade when Wisniewski was a free agent this offseason, he hit the market at a bad time and signed with the Eagles for 1.5M.

[Cillmatic]

$1,000,000 says this guy isn't here next year. He's the WORST starting center I've seen since You Know Who.

[PurpleCity5]

Outside of two bad penalties, he actually had a solid game, it was Jensen and Hurst who were the weak links yesterday. 

[rmw10]

Just now, PurpleCity5 said:

Outside of two bad penalties, he actually had a solid game, it was Jensen and Hurst who were the weak links yesterday. 

He really struggled in the first half, but I thought he turned it around in the second.  You could actually see some fire and tenacity in him.

[PurpleCity5]

2 minutes ago, rmw10 said:

He really struggled in the first half, but I thought he turned it around in the second.  You could actually see some fire and tenacity in him.

Agreed, he was pretty underwhelming in the 1st half but turned it up in the 2nd completely. I'll also note that his fumble recovery was great effort and toughness by him. 

[The Raven]

Definitely his best performance that I can remember. He even got a couple of pancakes. That's rare for him.

[Moderator 3]

1 hour ago, PurpleCity5 said:

Outside of two bad penalties, he actually had a solid game, it was Jensen and Hurst who were the weak links yesterday. 

Other than that "couldn't snap the ball worth a damn" thing.

[rmcjacket23]

Zuttah got a 81.5 from PFF yesterday... third highest offensive grade on the team behind Yanda and Juice.

Edited October 3, 2016 by rmcjacket23

[Cawtious]

He deserved that grade from PFF.  He played a much better game yesterday. 

[52liveforever]

10 hours ago, Moderator 3 said:

Other than that "couldn't snap the ball worth a damn" thing.

I thought we couldn't use profanity? 

[52liveforever]

11 hours ago, PurpleCity5 said:

Outside of two bad penalties, he actually had a solid game, it was Jensen and Hurst who were the weak links yesterday. 

agreed. We don't have a better center on staff. However, Stanley and Lewis clearly the best we are going to do on the left side. They improve every game. We need them back out there. I'm hoping Lewis was sitting to give him an extra week to recover and not because they think Jensen should be the starter.

[MTRavensFan]

I think you're right about Lewis. He was available if somebody else went down, I think they were just being cautious. 

[52liveforever]

3 minutes ago, MTRavensFan said:

I think you're right about Lewis. He was available if somebody else went down, I think they were just being cautious. 

Hopefully. If Stanley can't go Sunday I'd like to see Lewis at left tackle over Hurst.

[MTRavensFan]

3 minutes ago, 52liveforever said:

Hopefully. If Stanley can't go Sunday I'd like to see Lewis at left tackle over Hurst.

I agree.

Lewis is my favorite dark horse from this year's draft. Love a great redemption story, really rooting for the kid.

[PurpleCity5]

2 hours ago, 52liveforever said:

agreed. We don't have a better center on staff. However, Stanley and Lewis clearly the best we are going to do on the left side. They improve every game. We need them back out there. I'm hoping Lewis was sitting to give him an extra week to recover and not because they think Jensen should be the starter.

I take back what I said about putting Jensen in. I think I got a good look even if he was at guard. He's always been a solid run blocking, but goodness, he was totally awful in pass blocking. He got ripped to shreds there and it seems like Zuttah is the best option at this point. 

[RavensFanMania]

8 hours ago, PurpleCity5 said:

I take back what I said about putting Jensen in. I think I got a good look even if he was at guard. He's always been a solid run blocking, but goodness, he was totally awful in pass blocking. He got ripped to shreds there and it seems like Zuttah is the best option at this point. 

Jensen has never played a game as bad as he did against the Raiders.  I think having Hurst at LT was a major contributor.   I'd still like to see him at center, but zuttah did have a decent game

[Rav'n Maniac]

14 hours ago, MTRavensFan said:

I think you're right about Lewis. He was available if somebody else went down, I think they were just being cautious. 

Actually, he played some snaps on the punt unit during the OAK game.

[Edgar]

Zuttah is pretty fresh off surgery and a torn pectoral. Perhaps he us getting closer to 100 each week.