Joey Bosa

[balfan23]

10 hours ago, Inqui said:

If 19 of the 24 previous top five rookies have been given one of the things Bosa's after, I'd say it's a good bet Stanley has one of the terms and therefore this wouldn't be happening to us even if we'd taken Bosa.

Perhaps my comment would have been better stated if I said, "I'm glad our organization isn't foolish enough to put ourselves in this situation by playing games with our top pick" 

[D-Rey]

Sounds like the Chragers are trying to go against the norm like they usually do and Bosa wants a contract like any other top 5 pick would get. Not sure why everyone is jumping on Bosa when the Chargers have proven they are a terrible organization that really don't care about their players.

[52520Andrew]

20 hours ago, Inqui said:

If 19 of the 24 previous top five rookies have been given one of the things Bosa's after, I'd say it's a good bet Stanley has one of the terms and therefore this wouldn't be happening to us even if we'd taken Bosa.

I'd say there is a 19 in 24 chance you are right

Edited August 4, 2016 by 52520Andrew

[Inqui]

9 hours ago, balfan23 said:

Perhaps my comment would have been better stated if I said, "I'm glad our organization isn't foolish enough to put ourselves in this situation by playing games with our top pick" 

Ah yeah, it seems we're on the same page in that we were both saying the Ravens are a classier franchise than the Chargers. I wasn't sure if you were having a dig at the team or at Bosa. Like @ravensdan, I don't really get the anti-player hype when things like this pop up.

[JO_75]

PFT broke it down like this in terms of what happens if he doesn't sign.

- Bosa can holdout as long as the Tuesday after Week 10, meaning he can also sign at any point before that. 

- If he doesn't sign before that, he can not play at all in 2016.

- After the season, the Chargers RETAIN Exclusive Rights to him until the 2017 NFL Draft. At which, Bosa would re-enter the Draft but due to the Chargers holding his rights, he can not talk to any team leading up to the draft or even participate in the combine.

- In theory, a Elway/Eli situation could happen but again it's more up to the Chargers of whether they want to trade him. They can trade him at any point up until 30 days before the start of the regular season. With the regular season beginning on Sept 8th, they would have until next Tuesday August 9th to trade him really, really quick.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/08/04/bosa-impasse-continues/

[K-Dog]

16 minutes ago, JO_75 said:

PFT broke it down like this in terms of what happens if he doesn't sign.

- Bosa can holdout as long as the Tuesday after Week 10, meaning he can also sign at any point before that. 

- If he doesn't sign before that, he can not play at all in 2016.

- After the season, the Chargers RETAIN Exclusive Rights to him until the 2017 NFL Draft. At which, Bosa would re-enter the Draft but due to the Chargers holding his rights, he can not talk to any team leading up to the draft or even participate in the combine.

- In theory, a Elway/Eli situation could happen but again it's more up to the Chargers of whether they want to trade him. They can trade him at any point up until 30 days before the start of the regular season. With the regular season beginning on Sept 8th, they would have until next Tuesday August 9th to trade him really, really quick.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/08/04/bosa-impasse-continues/

Thanks for that.
Very informative.  

[Inqui]

31 minutes ago, JO_75 said:

PFT broke it down like this in terms of what happens if he doesn't sign.

- Bosa can holdout as long as the Tuesday after Week 10, meaning he can also sign at any point before that. 

- If he doesn't sign before that, he can not play at all in 2016.

- After the season, the Chargers RETAIN Exclusive Rights to him until the 2017 NFL Draft. At which, Bosa would re-enter the Draft but due to the Chargers holding his rights, he can not talk to any team leading up to the draft or even participate in the combine.

- In theory, a Elway/Eli situation could happen but again it's more up to the Chargers of whether they want to trade him. They can trade him at any point up until 30 days before the start of the regular season. With the regular season beginning on Sept 8th, they would have until next Tuesday August 9th to trade him really, really quick.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/08/04/bosa-impasse-continues/

So it looks like we're in for one hell of a game of chicken.

[JO_75]

1 hour ago, Inqui said:

So it looks like we're in for one hell of a game of chicken.

Pretty much. The one thing that is interesting is that he can't talk to any team leading up to the 2017 Draft if he were to go unsigned through week 10. I'm sure teams would like to know why he held out all year and find out if it's worth drafting him and if he would hold out on them. Sad thing is, this isn't an Elway/Eli scenario where they refused to play for teams if they drafted them, it's just the Chargers being cheap.

[Purple_ICE 81]

Bosa seems like a hotdog to me, just sign your contract and play it out, he must think he is light years above JJ watts talent level or something. If I were the Chargers I'd be looking to trade him if possible.

 

Hopefully he comes in and fans out and turns into a bust...Jokes on you Bosa! Lol bad things happen to those who hold out...being out of shape, injury prone, and complete lack of playbook knowledge and overall flow of the next level. So glad we didn't get him.

Edited August 5, 2016 by Purple_ICE 81

[JO_75]

LOL at Joey Bosa's mother's response to her son's contract situation.

 

Cheryl Bosa left a Facebook comment on a feed regarding the matter on Sunday afternoon that was later source identified as authentic. It reads “It bums me out for him so much,” she wrote to a friend. “Wish we pulled an Eli Manning on draft day.”

[CognitiveCorvus]

On 8/3/2016 at 7:40 PM, ravensdan said:

Why not side with the player?  When teams negotiate their being shrewd but players are selfish?  No it's s business negotiation. 

 

So so why should he let the Chargers be an exception with a clear precedent set in these matters. ?

I get why people are jumping on the Chargers side, and whilst I agree that the players should still negotiate, if a team like the Chargers is doing the same thing with Bose that they have with every first round pick in recent memory (which is what is happening) then Bosa will need to simply accept these same terms, or request a trade if he's not happy with the Chargers offer.

Now don't get me wrong, in my opinion both sides are not handling this situation with much in the way of finesse, and there are points where you can side with San Diego and points where you can side with Bosa. Ultimately the Chargers haven't changed how they offer their contract, a new player, a rookie in many ways should accept this fact when entering an organisation who values you so highly. He will still be signging for a ton of money and he is getting the same deal 1st rounders before him have got. If he is truly not happy with the deal on the table and not happy with how the Chargers run things then he needs to request a trade and find a team willing to give him what he wants as I don't see the Bolts budging to be frank. They ar every much in the mindset "you get what everyone else gets" and can you not see why they are happy in that mindset.

As much as I agree that the player should negotiate, the team should also stick by their morales, all be it financially driven.

[ALPHA]

Chargers always play hardball in negotiations, thats why so many of their former stars become disgruntled. For what its worth I think we should consider trading next years first for his rights then give him the guarantees that he wants.

[Davesta]

I would trade our 2017 draft pick for bosa. I'm betting we won't have a top 10 pick again, and Ozzie and the Ravens front office is more respected than San diego's. That would be a dream come true since I wanted bosa to begin with. 

[JO_75]

3 hours ago, Davesta said:

I would trade our 2017 draft pick for bosa. I'm betting we won't have a top 10 pick again, and Ozzie and the Ravens front office is more respected than San diego's. That would be a dream come true since I wanted bosa to begin with. 

Whether it's us or someone else, I don't see why not some team does this. Yeah I'd be ecstatic if we did this but essentially if he ends up sitting out past week 10 he re-enters the Draft next year anyway. Why not give up a pick next year, give him the same money every other top 5 pick got and get yourself a hell of a pass rusher.

Also the only issue is will a team get something done before the end of Tuesday as that is the deadline set per the CBA of rookies being traded up until 30 days before the league year. 

Edited August 9, 2016 by JO_75

[JO_75]

The deadline to trade Bosa has come & gone. Chargers never considered trading him and they still haven't talked in 12 days.

[K-Dog]

2 hours ago, JO_75 said:

The deadline to trade Bosa has come & gone. Chargers never considered trading him and they still haven't talked in 12 days.

It's a game of chicken I guess.

[Purple Punishment]

In the words of Teddy KGB, Pay that man his munny

[52liveforever]

I say see if the Chargers will take a 2nd rounder.

[JO_75]

12 minutes ago, 52liveforever said:

I say see if the Chargers will take a 2nd rounder.

Can't do anything now... so basically it's either he signs between now and Week 10 of the regular season or he re-enters the Draft next year.

[52liveforever]

15 minutes ago, JO_75 said:

Can't do anything now... so basically it's either he signs between now and Week 10 of the regular season or he re-enters the Draft next year.

What time was the deadline? know it was today.

[usmccharles]

5 hours ago, Purple Punishment said:

In the words of Teddy KGB, Pay that man his munny

I approve this reference.. . 

 

Check check check 

[Militant X 1]

On 7/29/2016 at 11:13 PM, ravensdan said:

I don't get the anti player sentiment in these negotiations.  He certainly has a right to try to get the best deal he can. This is about off set language. I don't understand why this. Contract situation would make someone not want him as a raven?

It's a "business".  And, his services are being "paid for".  Absolutely nothing wrong with negotiating the price!

[JO_75]

Adam Schefter provided an interesting history of Holdouts with the Chargers... pretty much confirms how bad ownership is. Jammer held out 50 days and the lowest holdout is 7 which was Merriman. Bosa by the day gets closer to Rivers & LT's holdout length.

 

Adam Schefter

 As a rookie, LaDainian Tomlinson held out 30 days, Quentin Jammer 50, Philip Rivers 25, Shawne Merriman 7. Joey Bosa holdout now at 16 days

[Inqui]

1 hour ago, JO_75 said:

Adam Schefter provided an interesting history of Holdouts with the Chargers... pretty much confirms how bad ownership is. Jammer held out 50 days and the lowest holdout is 7 which was Merriman. Bosa by the day gets closer to Rivers & LT's holdout length.

 

Adam Schefter

 As a rookie, LaDainian Tomlinson held out 30 days, Quentin Jammer 50, Philip Rivers 25, Shawne Merriman 7. Joey Bosa holdout now at 16 days

Yeah, I dunno why everyone's beating up on the player for wanting what everyone else in his position gets. The Chargers are getting exactly what they deserve.

[BmoreBird22]

I don't blame the Chargers in this situation at all. They have a precedent and it doesn't really matter if 19 of the 24 previous top five picks have had this (who is it 24 and not 25?) because the Chargers have a precedent that they've set and I wouldn't expect them to change that just because a rookie was picked high. He's still got to prove himself on the field, something he has yet to do.

He's also really losing very valuable time to get up to speed, learn the playbook, and get adjusted to the NFL. I understand he's a top three pick, but there's a large difference between playing against a college RT and playing against a six year vet at LT. 

I also think the anger toward the Chargers is misplaced. If I'm Bosa, I'm mad at the NFLPA and at the CBA, not the Chargers. The NFLPA is the one who agreed in negotiations to a slotted system that basically set the rookie contracts. I'm not saying that's a bad thing because the old rookie deals were insane and not worth it. I understand Bosa is trying to exercise what little power he has in negotiations, but someone answer me something about the signing bonus. The Chargers want it split up in two years? Is that voidable at all or is there any way that he doesn't receive it all if he agrees to it in two payments?

The Chargers not paying him if he's cut or goes to another team makes sense, but if he's not going to lose money, I don't understand that on Bosa's end. Fowler Jr. got $15M for his signing bonus. If Bosa takes that in two payments, that's still $7.5M on top of maybe another 500K for his base salary, so he'd be making around $8M in his rookie season, a life changing amount. What difference does it truly make if he's getting $15.5M in year one or $8M? That to me is ridiculous.

Also, I think it's silly to point out the other high picks that held out for the Chargers because as far as I know, those players were drafted before the new CBA and could actually negotiate their entire salary and signing bonus. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the Chargers haven't had a holdout of this magnitude since 2011 (five drafts) when the new CBA went into effect. Is this correct? That points to this being a totally new and unique issue for the Chargers since the new CBA was signed.

Edited August 15, 2016 by BmoreBird22

[BmoreBird22]

3 hours ago, JO_75 said:

Adam Schefter provided an interesting history of Holdouts with the Chargers... pretty much confirms how bad ownership is. Jammer held out 50 days and the lowest holdout is 7 which was Merriman. Bosa by the day gets closer to Rivers & LT's holdout length.

 

Adam Schefter

 As a rookie, LaDainian Tomlinson held out 30 days, Quentin Jammer 50, Philip Rivers 25, Shawne Merriman 7. Joey Bosa holdout now at 16 days

 

1 hour ago, Inqui said:

Yeah, I dunno why everyone's beating up on the player for wanting what everyone else in his position gets. The Chargers are getting exactly what they deserve.

It's a totally different situation. Those players were drafted before the new CBA went into effect when rookies could negotiate their entire salary and signing bonus. 

Since 2011, the Chargers, to my knowledge, haven't had a holdout like this with the new CBA that slotted rookie pay scale.

[Willbacker]

8 minutes ago, BmoreBird22 said:

 

It's a totally different situation. Those players were drafted before the new CBA went into effect when rookies could negotiate their entire salary and signing bonus. 

Since 2011, the Chargers, to my knowledge, haven't had a holdout like this with the new CBA that slotted rookie pay scale.

This may be a dumb question but has anybody held out since the new cba? I just don't get why this signing is not happening.

[BmoreBird22]

2 minutes ago, Willbacker said:

This may be a dumb question but has anybody held out since the new cba? I just don't get why this signing is not happening.

I'm sure someone has (especially a first rounder), but I don't think any have reached the lengths that Bosa has. I'll do some Google searches and see if I can find anything.

Edit: Actually, this may be a first.

Edited August 15, 2016 by BmoreBird22

[ravensdan]

12 hours ago, BmoreBird22 said:

I don't blame the Chargers in this situation at all. They have a precedent and it doesn't really matter if 19 of the 24 previous top five picks have had this (who is it 24 and not 25?) because the Chargers have a precedent that they've set and I wouldn't expect them to change that just because a rookie was picked high. He's still got to prove himself on the field, something he has yet to do.

He's also really losing very valuable time to get up to speed, learn the playbook, and get adjusted to the NFL. I understand he's a top three pick, but there's a large difference between playing against a college RT and playing against a six year vet at LT. 

I also think the anger toward the Chargers is misplaced. If I'm Bosa, I'm mad at the NFLPA and at the CBA, not the Chargers. The NFLPA is the one who agreed in negotiations to a slotted system that basically set the rookie contracts. I'm not saying that's a bad thing because the old rookie deals were insane and not worth it. I understand Bosa is trying to exercise what little power he has in negotiations, but someone answer me something about the signing bonus. The Chargers want it split up in two years? Is that voidable at all or is there any way that he doesn't receive it all if he agrees to it in two payments?

The Chargers not paying him if he's cut or goes to another team makes sense, but if he's not going to lose money, I don't understand that on Bosa's end. Fowler Jr. got $15M for his signing bonus. If Bosa takes that in two payments, that's still $7.5M on top of maybe another 500K for his base salary, so he'd be making around $8M in his rookie season, a life changing amount. What difference does it truly make if he's getting $15.5M in year one or $8M? That to me is ridiculous.

Also, I think it's silly to point out the other high picks that held out for the Chargers because as far as I know, those players were drafted before the new CBA and could actually negotiate their entire salary and signing bonus. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the Chargers haven't had a holdout of this magnitude since 2011 (five drafts) when the new CBA went into effect. Is this correct? That points to this being a totally new and unique issue for the Chargers since the new CBA was signed.

I was listening to Andrew Brandt on the matter and the biggest sticking point is the chargers are trying to hold back over half the bonus which is the most unreasonable part. If they were to lessen that percentage bosa likely would take it. Fact is that's a lot of money that's being invested and earning more for one side. 

[BmoreBird22]

Just now, ravensdan said:

I was listening to Andrew Brandt on the matter and the biggest sticking point is the chargers are trying to hold back over half the bonus which is the most unreasonable part. If they were to lessen that percentage bosa likely would take it. Fact is that's a lot of money that's being invested and earning more for one side. 

Okay, so we'll say the slotted bonus is at $15M (it's like $15.3M). 

Are they trying to give him like $10M or are they trying to do it like $5M this year and $10M next year?