The good bad and ugly Pre-Season 1

[trevorsteadman]

2 minutes ago, BOLDnPurPnBlacK said:

I actually dont see it that way at all. I think Price has a high percentage chance of making the team.

I see Smith, Wright, Powers, and Young as the only real locks. So, 2-3 spots up for grabs between Price, Arrington, Will Davis, Sam Brown, and Canady.

Out of those names Arrington is the only sure fire cut imo. But, at this point from what ive seen and from the reports coming out of camp I'd put Price ahead of the other 3. When Smith wasnt practicing, Price was the starter. Ultimately I think its Price and Davis who make it, Arrington's cut, and Canady/Brown are PS candidates.

That is my exact view on the roster right now. 

[rmcjacket23]

Just now, BOLDnPurPnBlacK said:

I actually dont see it that way at all. I think Price has a high percentage chance of making the team.

I see Smith, Wright, Powers, and Young as the only real locks. So, 2-3 spots up for grabs between Price, Arrington, Will Davis, Sam Brown, and Canady.

Out of those names Arrington is the only sure fire cut imo. But, at this point from what ive seen and from the reports coming out of camp I'd put Price ahead of the other 3. When Smith wasnt practicing, Price was the starter. Ultimately I think its Price and Davis who make it, Arrington's cut, and Canady/Brown are PS candidates.

Potentially. The only caveat being that its possible they even go with less than 6 "corners", because they know they have "safeties" who can also play coverage and even have corner experience.

I'm actually in the minority, but I think Arrington makes it. Just think the coaching staff is higher on him than fans are. I think they still like him as an exclusive slot corner, and they know they had to play him outside more than they would like last season.

I think he and Davis are the current front runners to make it, but Canady and Price have the opportunity to change that. 

[jimmypowder]

West looks like a player determined to fight for a starting job at running back . 

He sort of reminded me of Ray Rice's early years with great vision and explosiveness. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[rmw10]

8 minutes ago, rmcjacket23 said:

Potentially. The only caveat being that its possible they even go with less than 6 "corners", because they know they have "safeties" who can also play coverage and even have corner experience.

I'm actually in the minority, but I think Arrington makes it. Just think the coaching staff is higher on him than fans are. I think they still like him as an exclusive slot corner, and they know they had to play him outside more than they would like last season.

I think he and Davis are the current front runners to make it, but Canady and Price have the opportunity to change that. 

I think going with less than 6 true corners could be a reasonable possibility, especially with us likely having to go with 4 TEs and 4 RBs.  It's still early though so obviously things will likely change.

Regardless, I think you're looking at 4 locks in Smith, Wright, Powers, and Young.  After that, I think Sam Brown is a sure fire cut, destined for the PS.  That leaves Davis, Price, Canady, and Arrington.  I think Arrington is also a sure fire cut since we already have Powers and Young for the slot, and Arrington is just awful.  After that, it's a who knows situation.  I think Davis is the most likely to make it, but not a lock by any means.  If we keep 6, it's a toss up between Canady and Price. Price certainly has the edge since he's actually played, but Canady has drawn some good reviews and is a draft pick.  It'll be interesting to see how it plays out.  I'm not as enamored with Price as some are, but I think there are some good things there.

[rmcjacket23]

1 minute ago, rmw10 said:

I think going with less than 6 true corners could be a reasonable possibility, especially with us likely having to go with 4 TEs and 4 RBs.  It's still early though so obviously things will likely change.

Regardless, I think you're looking at 4 locks in Smith, Wright, Powers, and Young.  After that, I think Sam Brown is a sure fire cut, destined for the PS.  That leaves Davis, Price, Canady, and Arrington.  I think Arrington is also a sure fire cut since we already have Powers and Young for the slot, and Arrington is just awful.  After that, it's a who knows situation.  I think Davis is the most likely to make it, but not a lock by any means.  If we keep 6, it's a toss up between Canady and Price. Price certainly has the edge since he's actually played, but Canady has drawn some good reviews and is a draft pick.  It'll be interesting to see how it plays out.  I'm not as enamored with Price as some are, but I think there are some good things there.

Could also depend on how we view our safeties. We know Weddle and Webb are going to be on the team, but outside of that, its a total guessing game. Kendrick Lewis figures to make it, and we've all just assumed that Elam and Brooks were probably competing for one spot. But what if we decide to keep all 5? Hard to imagine us going more than 10 secondary players on the 53 man, so if we decide to keep 5 safeties, that only leaves 5 corners, meaning Price/Davis/Canady and Arrington are competing for one spot.

[rmw10]

13 minutes ago, rmcjacket23 said:

Could also depend on how we view our safeties. We know Weddle and Webb are going to be on the team, but outside of that, its a total guessing game. Kendrick Lewis figures to make it, and we've all just assumed that Elam and Brooks were probably competing for one spot. But what if we decide to keep all 5? Hard to imagine us going more than 10 secondary players on the 53 man, so if we decide to keep 5 safeties, that only leaves 5 corners, meaning Price/Davis/Canady and Arrington are competing for one spot.

And Elam and Brooks both definitely got their chances covering the slot last night, too.

[BmoreBird22]

39 minutes ago, rmcjacket23 said:

I'm actually in the minority, but I think Arrington makes it. Just think the coaching staff is higher on him than fans are. I think they still like him as an exclusive slot corner, and they know they had to play him outside more than they would like last season.

See, I just can't get behind this when the FO goes out and grabs Powers (a slot corner) and drafts Tavon Young (a slot corner). I think signs point to him leaving.

[trevorsteadman]

1 minute ago, BmoreBird22 said:

See, I just can't get behind this when the FO goes out and grabs Powers (a slot corner) and drafts Tavon Young (a slot corner). I think signs point to him leaving.

Yep I don't think Arrington plays here this year. Somewhere else I can see but he has done nothing here to prove his worth. Sad too because I thought he was going to thrive here last season.

[trevorsteadman]

I can't stress how beautiful it was to watch Stanley keep that pocket completely clean with one of the best defensive line and linebackers in front of him. I hope he continues to play well. Very very impressive by our highest pick in a decade.

[rmcjacket23]

8 minutes ago, BmoreBird22 said:

See, I just can't get behind this when the FO goes out and grabs Powers (a slot corner) and drafts Tavon Young (a slot corner). I think signs point to him leaving.

True, though I'm not sure why they would wait this long then. Powers was signed in May, and Young was drafted in May. If they were that confident in their depth, I think they would have cut Arrington already.

I mean I think they know that its Arrington's last year here regardless, but Powers is also here on a one year contract as well and technically Arrington is under contract in 2017 as well.

 

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

22 minutes ago, rmw10 said:

I think going with less than 6 true corners could be a reasonable possibility, especially with us likely having to go with 4 TEs and 4 RBs.  It's still early though so obviously things will likely change.

Regardless, I think you're looking at 4 locks in Smith, Wright, Powers, and Young.  After that, I think Sam Brown is a sure fire cut, destined for the PS.  That leaves Davis, Price, Canady, and Arrington.  I think Arrington is also a sure fire cut since we already have Powers and Young for the slot, and Arrington is just awful.  After that, it's a who knows situation.  I think Davis is the most likely to make it, but not a lock by any means.  If we keep 6, it's a toss up between Canady and Price. Price certainly has the edge since he's actually played, but Canady has drawn some good reviews and is a draft pick.  It'll be interesting to see how it plays out.  I'm not as enamored with Price as some are, but I think there are some good things there.

I dont see any way we go with less than 6 corners, just because of the last 2 years. I get we have a safety that is really a corner, but he was a declining corner last we saw... and other than Brooks being in position to make an immediate tackle after allowing the completion, i have no faith in any other safety in coverage consistently (outside Weddle obviously).

With seeing how quickly depth at corner can be depleted, and having a lack of talent at the position can ruin an otherwise promising season (and potential SB berth in 2014) I just cant see the FO risking it by going light at the position, especially when there are 5, 6, maybe even 7 guys capable of contributing.

Much easier to hang on to the talent you have now who already knows what youre trying to do on defense than to scramble for help later on when injuries pile up. And its not like we have 3 guys at the top of the depth chart who are studs and absolute locks to start every game, play every down.

I think we not only need the depth, but need competent guys to push guys like Wright and Powers for snaps.

[rmw10]

4 minutes ago, BOLDnPurPnBlacK said:

I dont see any way we go with less than 6 corners, just because of the last 2 years. I get we have a safety that is really a corner, but he was a declining corner last we saw... and other than Brooks being in position to make an immediate tackle after allowing the completion, i have no faith in any other safety in coverage consistently (outside Weddle obviously).

With seeing how quickly depth at corner can be depleted, and having a lack of talent at the position can ruin an otherwise promising season (and potential SB berth in 2014) I just cant see the FO risking it by going light at the position, especially when there are 5, 6, maybe even 7 guys capable of contributing.

Much easier to hang on to the talent you have now who already knows what youre trying to do on defense than to scramble for help later on when injuries pile up. And its not like we have 3 guys at the top of the depth chart who are studs and absolute locks to start every game, play every down.

I think we not only need the depth, but need competent guys to push guys like Wright and Powers for snaps.

Oh I agree.  If it was up to me, I'm keeping 6.  I wouldn't be in the least bit surprised if we do go with 5 though since at least 3 of our safeties have and will take snaps there.  I think we'd like to have 6 though, especially since all of those safeties are pretty much slot guys.  We struggled mightily to find outside CBs last year.

[DenverRaven]

9 minutes ago, trevorsteadman said:

I can't stress how beautiful it was to watch Stanley keep that pocket completely clean with one of the best defensive line and linebackers in front of him. I hope he continues to play well. Very very impressive by our highest pick in a decade.

This can't be stated enough. Stanley looked incredibly polished for a rookie. It blew me away how solid he looked in all facets of the game.

[BmoreBird22]

7 minutes ago, rmcjacket23 said:

True, though I'm not sure why they would wait this long then. Powers was signed in May, and Young was drafted in May. If they were that confident in their depth, I think they would have cut Arrington already.

I mean I think they know that its Arrington's last year here regardless, but Powers is also here on a one year contract as well and technically Arrington is under contract in 2017 as well.

What do they gain by cutting him? You can have 90 on your roster, so why not have a body for the preseason? 

Plus, he saves literally nothing to cut when you bump up a 500K player (actually, lose a little cap space), so there's no real financial reason to do it.

Only reason to cut him sooner would be so he could find a team sooner as a courtesy move.

[eek]

1 hour ago, BOLDnPurPnBlacK said:

I actually dont see it that way at all. I think Price has a high percentage chance of making the team.

I see Smith, Wright, Powers, and Young as the only real locks. So, 2-3 spots up for grabs between Price, Arrington, Will Davis, Sam Brown, and Canady.

Out of those names Arrington is the only sure fire cut imo. But, at this point from what ive seen and from the reports coming out of camp I'd put Price ahead of the other 3. When Smith wasnt practicing, Price was the starter. Ultimately I think its Price and Davis who make it, Arrington's cut, and Canady/Brown are PS candidates.

which is funny to me because i thought Davis and Price out played Powers and Wright. Davis and Wright are the same size, but Davis plays taller which is betterm

[trevorsteadman]

7 minutes ago, eek said:

which is funny to me because i thought Davis and Price out played Powers and Wright. Davis and Wright are the same size, but Davis plays taller which is betterm

To be fair Carolina and most the NFC South teams have very tall receivers and you saw right away that both struggled against the bigger receivers. I think Wright plays well against most receivers if they don't tower him. He did do a good job however making sure to make the tackle when he lost a step on the receiver. Powers has struggled recently, all good coming out of early process then now he has struggled in training camps and struggled passing the conditioning test. Makes me wonder if he took a slip back.

[Jacquouille]

21 minutes ago, trevorsteadman said:

I can't stress how beautiful it was to watch Stanley keep that pocket completely clean with one of the best defensive line and linebackers in front of him. I hope he continues to play well. Very very impressive by our highest pick in a decade.

All in all it feels so good to see a lot of rookies contributing, compared to last year's projects (that are starting to pay now btw)

[eek]

30 minutes ago, trevorsteadman said:

To be fair Carolina and most the NFC South teams have very tall receivers and you saw right away that both struggled against the bigger receivers. I think Wright plays well against most receivers if they don't tower him. He did do a good job however making sure to make the tackle when he lost a step on the receiver. Powers has struggled recently, all good coming out of early process then now he has struggled in training camps and struggled passing the conditioning test. Makes me wonder if he took a slip back.

AFC North has some big WR too

[BmoreBird22]

14 minutes ago, eek said:

AFC North has some big WR too

Just AJ Green, really

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

5 minutes ago, BmoreBird22 said:

Just AJ Green, really

Theres also Boyd who should see a lot of reps, Josh Gordon, Sammie Coates who may start, Terrelle Pryor who's listed as a starter right now... all 6'2" and up.

But not many established guys... all up-and-comers and Gordon.

[January J]

Good:

West, mallet, Dixon, Z. Smith, carter, judon ,henry,  Stanley, will Davis, Elam( nothing spectacular but he made the game sealing tackle on 4th down, just nice to see him actually wrapping guys up) brooks, butler, boyle, ( waller was decent, along with Johnson)

 

 Bad:

Shareece Wright, Sheldon price , Reynolds( muffed punt wasn't his fault but he didn't look very comfortable and I'd almost venture to say he would've dropped it anyway..looked really nervous)  whoever that kicker was, urschel and zuttah both made a couple of bad snaps... Can't think of anything else off top...need to re-watch. 

ugly:

Clay (unacceptable, almost cost us the game. if you can't catch a punt when that's really all your good for anyway..your done. id venture to say that one mistake gets him cut ...not that he had a good chance in the first place.) That's really about it..no stupid penalties or bonehead mistakes.. Nobody got burnt on any deep routes and everybody showed good discipline for the most part. 

Overall a very good showing against last years NFC champs- esp considering we were missing almost every single one of our stud's on both sides of the ball. A few things we need to clean up but overall there's alot to be optimistic and excited about.

[BmoreBird22]

19 minutes ago, BOLDnPurPnBlacK said:

Theres also Boyd who should see a lot of reps, Josh Gordon, Sammie Coates who may start, Terrelle Pryor who's listed as a starter right now... all 6'2" and up.

But not many established guys... all up-and-comers and Gordon.

6'2" isn't really some huge height advantage. They will see two receivers as tall as what Carolina had in Green and Pryor, with Green being the true threat.

[January J]

2 hours ago, rmcjacket23 said:

Could also depend on how we view our safeties. We know Weddle and Webb are going to be on the team, but outside of that, its a total guessing game. Kendrick Lewis figures to make it, and we've all just assumed that Elam and Brooks were probably competing for one spot. But what if we decide to keep all 5? Hard to imagine us going more than 10 secondary players on the 53 man, so if we decide to keep 5 safeties, that only leaves 5 corners, meaning Price/Davis/Canady and Arrington are competing for one spot.

if that was the case then i think its almost a no brainer you keep Davis. Im also not so sure about arrington getting cut either though. The coaches know we didn't utilize his strengths last season. 

I think this  year we actually go against the norm and cut a few draft picks. We did it last year with myers and the year its almost inevitable. Ofcourse we will try to PS them but its not likely they don't get snatched. As far as arrington - trade bait perhaps?

[rmw10]

1 minute ago, January J said:

if that was the case then i think its almost a no brainer you keep Davis. Im also not so sure about arrington getting cut either though. The coaches know we didn't utilize his strengths last season. 

I think this  year we actually go against the norm and cut a few draft picks. We did it last year with myers and the year its almost inevitable. Ofcourse we will try to PS them but its not likely they don't get snatched. As far as arrington - trade bait perhaps?

They didn't use Arrington in the slot, but they also added two slot CBs because it's clear they have 0 trust in him.  He has 0 trade value and was honestly probably the worst player on the field last night.  His career is dwindling by the day.  I'd be absolutely shocked if he ended up on the roster.

[ravensdfan]

11 hours ago, Sizzlebshu said:

Its pre-season and the Panthers ran up tempo no huddle. This is no different than the Eagles game last yr

 

You'll understand if that statement does not make it better right? Really don't want anything "just like last year".

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

27 minutes ago, ravensdfan said:

You'll understand if that statement does not make it better right? Really don't want anything "just like last year".

the point is, the eagles destroyed us and were equally bad last year. 

The result really had no bearing in the end on the level of the teams... its just darn near impossible in pre-season running base defense, without tape to study and without scheming to defend up-tempo, no huddle offense especially with a dual threat QB. Thats incredibly easy to pick apart for an offense.

Not to mention 4 of our 5 best players in the front 7 didnt play which obviously effected our ability to generate pressure without blitzing... exacerbating the issue even further.

Wouldnt use last night as any indication of how the secondary or defense as a whole will look.

 

The only relevant info to gather from last night is looking at 1on1 matchups... looking at skill sets you can project into the regular season, looking at individual discipline and technique.

 

Edited August 12, 2016 by BOLDnPurPnBlacK

[rossihunter2]

I know it's all a bit late but this is what I saw last night from the positions I was watching...

RBs: as has been said a lot on this forum, I thought Buck looked a step slower than dixon and west but a couple of his runs look like they got blown by the blocking in front of him (to be fair it has to be said that west turned two of those types of plays into a 7 yard gain and a 3rd down conversion so by all means bad blocking is not a great excuse), Dixon looked promising but not sure about him in pass protection as to be expected from a rookie

TEs: I know Waller led the way with his catches but he wasn't as flashy as I thought he'd be but he was a matchup nightmare, albeit against 2nd and 3rd string linebackers - the thing there is that he needs to catch those things that for instance land on his chest like last night because of the part of the field he's working in he cannot afford to bobble or drop - i remember him hands catching one pass which was promising though. From what I saw, when Maxx was on the field he looked a class above the backups which bodes well. He and Boyle (and i wasnt watching them closely to be fair) looked like they were used sparingly and they looked really smooth and classy.

CBs: jimmy got beaten too easily by tedd ginn in the back of the end zone and still looks too far behind where I'd like him to be - hopefully he's still just getting rid of the nargles from his injury after getting the metal out of his foot. wright did not look as good as id hoped either, he got boxed out to easily for the touchdown and seemed to be a bit lost in his zone a couple of times. tavon looked great on special teams in coverage (a little bit like waller last year which ironically makes waller a little more expendable), sheldon price gave away that pi but he did look like a threat on the ball - i know this team emphasises not giving up the big play but if we want turnovers we have to make plays on the ball so seeing him and will davis getting really close to the ball and getting their hands in was really encouraging, arrington was disappointing as well - he seems to me like a step down from jerraud powers even though both struggled

 

that's just what i thought

[FerrariFan87]

The Good: The Running Backs - West shined, Buck looked elusive/quick, Dixon looked powerful with some shimmy. All had a nose for the end zone.

The Bad: Wide Receivers and Tight Ends - Everyone looked kind of lethargic. Too many drops. Not a lot of openings.

The Ugly: Caelin Clay - Muffed punt, dropped pass. Bye bye.

[Mjsmooth1428]

Zachery Orr Looked Good. If he can start I like the option of having Correa be more of an Pass Rushing in his first year with us.

[Maryland]

I'm not too worried about Wright after this last game; I don't put much stock in it.

I think he'll be the same player as last year: usually pretty good as an outside corner, but has an absolutely terrible game here and there.