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Chronology of 2015 Key Injuries...

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Or why getting back to playing like Ravens will be more difficult than many believe.

For the optimistic faithful who believe we are merely facing a spate of bad luck this post may not bring you joy, but be apprised near the end I will discuss a key injury recovery that could mean more games in the Win Column. (We are going to need those Wins.)

Crocket Gillmore  Gillmore went out                 week 13.   The Raven's lost his last game and were......4-8.

Justin Forsett......Justin didn't go out on IR until week 12.  The Raven's won his injury game and were 3-7.

Joe Flacco..........Joe didn't go out on IR until    week 12    The Raven's won his injury game and were 3-7.

Jeremy Zuttah.....Jeremy didn't go on IR until   week  11.  The Ravens' lost his injury game and were  2-7

Steve Smith.......Steve didn't go on IR  until      week  9.    The Raven's won his injury game and were 2-6.

Will Davis...........Davis didn't go on IR until       week  6.    The Raven's lost his injury game and were  2-3

 

Other IR situations I don't consider significant.  Campanaro, Perriman, Tyson, Thompson, Waller and a few others. Just didn't affect our season.

As you can plainly see by the significant IR instances above we had already established ourselves to be a losing team before the rash of injuries. What is very interesting is that we were a 3-7 team when Flacco went out and we were a 2-4 team coming home.  We were just as good.......or bad ......without Flacco and the bulk of our significant IR'd players. Actually, our percentage was a little better.

This reality is one of reasons I believe we are going to have a very disappointing season.  There's a lot more to it, but this suffices for brevity and comprehension purposes.

The outlier is Suggs.  Suggs went out in the week 1 loss.  There's no clear word on how his rehab is going.  If he comes back a Rehabbed monster...and I'm not discounting that he may, we could win a number of games on his presence, especially if Dumervils foot procedure restores him as well.  33 and 32 years, it would be a bit of a longshot.

Without Suggs return to accustomed form...we are gonna have a really good draft pick. But Lord, please let someone clear of mind make it. 

 

Edited by Danny D
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Also, you're leaving out Monroe who went out week 1 and didn't go on ir but was practically out for the season, we played most of the season with James hurst starting at LT.

 

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@Danny DThis all has some truth to it but it's not the full story. First and foremost your examples only support your argument, which they should but again there is a completely different story to the 2015 that you clearly missed. 

You completely glanced over Suggs injury in Week 1, only speaking on how important his return would be to the 2016 season. However you didn't at all mention how him going down in Week 1 took our best pass rusher and the centerpiece of our defense away from this team. So lets break down your post from a standpoint of the Ravens being able to win a number of games on Suggs' presence alone as you stated. 

Before Flacco went down the Ravens were 3-7 as you said. Well in 4 of those 7 losses the Ravens had 4th quarter lead with under 3 minutes to play. You don't think the loss of Suggs impacted the defenses inability to get off the field with a lead in those games? You yourself said a healthy Suggs in 2016 could win games on his presence alone, don't see why that wouldn't be true of the 2015 season as well. 

Next you failed to mention how players who were injured but wasn't required to go to IR effected this team. Jimmy Smith wasn't fully recovered from his foot injury and that clearly effect his abilities. He played much better in the final quarter of the season. No reason to think that won't continue now that he's said to be healthy. Wagner wasn't fully recovered, Monroe play only the first drive vs Denver and proceed to miss the next 3 games. People are wondering if Stanley is an upgrade over Monroe, he doesn't have to be, he has to be an upgrade over Hurst because that's who held down the LT position for most of 2015. 

Also you listed Perriman as not having an impact on the season. He's the guy and the only guy the Ravens had who could stretch the field last year. He never saw the field which made the passing game one dimensional.  We don't know how good or bad the kid would have been, but his speed alone would have made teams plan for it and that would have opened up the field more for the plethora of possession targets we had. Now you have not only Perriman if healthy but Wallace and Moore to add speed. How is that not a positive going into 2016?

Camp was expected to be the top returner and slot WR, how did his injury not impact the season? The Ravens had, Ross, Butler and Givens who weren't on the initial 53 catch more passes from Flacco then Camp who was expected to play a pretty big role on offense. Also judging by the amount of snaps he was starting to get before getting injured he was about to become a much bigger piece. Not to mention Marlon Brown's injury and overall poor play. He's no longer here. Even coming off a poor season i'd take Wallace's ability to stretch the field over Marlon Brown averaging over 8 yards a catch. 

There is so much more i could breakdown but I don't want the post to be too long. But if you can't see that injuries really hampered this team last year then it's really not much to say imo. With better health and upgrades at key positions this team is so much better then last year. 

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9 hours ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

Also, you're leaving out Monroe who went out week 1 and didn't go on ir but was practically out for the season, we played most of the season with James hurst starting at LT.

 

Really?....

I have to tell you, with due respect, its these little "issues' that illustrate why Newsome is struggling so.  Usually, I don't go over detail that is not relevant to the situation.  Detail that doesn't add substance to the illustration. The omission of Monroe was intentional for a number of reasons.  For one, he has not returned and can't buttress our fractured team, like the other key IR players outlined. But Monroe is not coming back and although I did not agree with making him a Raven, to let him leave over a political position resulting in the Blind Side of our Offensive Line being "disappeared" was a monumental brain lapse, even if optimistic about a well intended rookie.

I remember how genuinely stunned Harbaugh was in 2013. He couldn't believe we were losing games. He/They really thought they'd improved our team. They bring in a guy the following year to run the offense and he demonstrates how effective he is, illustrating how important the right decision makers can be. I have another post coming you're really not going to like, to give you a taste its about offensive coordinators, statistics and confusion.

Essentially, the IR situation did not make us a bad team. We were one and the salient issue is what are we going to do about it?

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1 hour ago, Danny D said:

Really?....

I have to tell you, with due respect, its these little "issues' that illustrate why Newsome is struggling so.  Usually, I don't go over detail that is not relevant to the situation.  Detail that doesn't add substance to the illustration. The omission of Monroe was intentional for a number of reasons.  For one, he has not returned and can't buttress our fractured team, like the other key IR players outlined. But Monroe is not coming back and although I did not agree with making him a Raven, to let him leave over a political position resulting in the Blind Side of our Offensive Line being "disappeared" was a monumental brain lapse, even if optimistic about a well intended rookie.

I remember how genuinely stunned Harbaugh was in 2013. He couldn't believe we were losing games. He/They really thought they'd improved our team. They bring in a guy the following year to run the offense and he demonstrates how effective he is, illustrating how important the right decision makers can be. I have another post coming you're really not going to like, to give you a taste its about offensive coordinators, statistics and confusion.

Essentially, the IR situation did not make us a bad team. We were one and the salient issue is what are we going to do about it?

I'm not even gonna bite on some of this bait, however, I'll use actual football to tell you why I have every right to insult your football knowledge(or lack thereof).

 

Against the best defense we have seen in a very long time, and a OC who knows our defense better than any OC in the league(in week one of all times, with a whole preseason to prepare) we came out a little flat, with a new OC, and a newly inserted LT by the 2nd drive, and our team leader and defensive lynchpin going down very early, we almost won... The eventual SB champs, who dominated all year long, we should have been blown out based on the circumstances, but came one unfortunate midair end zone strip away from a win. 

 

Week 2, a shootout with one of the more high powered offenses in the league, our cb who is only week 2 into the season following his lisfranc, gives up a early TD, and we fall behind but shoot it out with them until.the very end where a questionable defensive hold takes away a game winning pick. 

 

Week 3, aj green has our number, but damn if we didn't give the Bengals a fit and win this game multiple times only to have a blown coverage and missed tackle lose it again for us twice in the late 4th.

 

Week 4, we win. 

 

Week 5, nothing here, we should never lose to the browns. 

 

Week 6, ugly game, this was the stretch where we legitimately looked bad. 

 

Week 7, we got seriously screwed by the refs endlessly, and again would have gotten a win in a very tough environment if our TE could have just jumped a split second later. 

 

Week 8, win 

 

Week 9, the league already said that we absolutely should have won this. Ref mistake confirmed, league owea us one official. And Jax is a seriously high powered offense. 

 

Week 10, win, but at a cost. I won't continue because we still stayed competitive even with our 4th qb but you cant judge a team without its an effectively. 

 

So with this awful team that had tons of starters on IR we were literally a few had Ref calls and ONE PLAY away from 8-2 by week 10. Im not a fan of what ifs, but in this case, you can play that game. We set an all time record for 1 possession finishes in a single season, there were only 2 or 3 games that didn't go down to the very last drive, and this is with a fat chunk of our team on the trainers table. 

 

But sure, Ozzie has put together a garbage team that can't compete, harbaugh has destroyed our fire by only playing choir boys, and we need better coffee, that's the problem, this trash heap team and staff, the injuries had nothing to do with it.

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2 hours ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

 

 

But sure, Ozzie has put together a garbage team that can't compete, harbaugh has destroyed our fire by only playing choir boys, and we need better coffee, that's the problem, this trash heap team and staff, the injuries had nothing to do with it.

Folks here want to debate, its just not even necessary.  It will all be revealed very soon now.  Your position is we were "so close" a bounce here and a call there and we were in the playoffs. I'll acknowledge there were some close losses, but better teams pull some of those close ones out. What is undeniable is our talent level has ebbed like the tide.......slowly, steadily, inexorably to the point where we can't pull those games out.

Let's just let the season unfold and vow to call it as it is in regard to Newsome's future.

"We review...
all the fears and anxiety
...which are so
inherently symptomatic...
...of a losing team.
The mind is a strange thing, men.
We must begin by asking it...
..."What is losing?"

Losing is a disease...
...as contagious as polio.
Losing is a disease...
...as contagious as syphilis.
Losing is a disease...
...as contagious as bubonic plague...
... attacking one...
... but infecting all.
Ah, but curable.

Now, I want you to imagine...
...you are on a ship at sea...
...on a vast...
...calm ocean...
...gently rocking.
Gently rocking.
Gently rocking.
Gently rocking."

In regard to the late edit.  I didn't call the team trash. I would not do that. I have called out players that cannot be Ravens.  That is an individual thing.  Regarding the staff, the reputation they are currently earning is all of their own accord.
 

Edited by Danny D
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36 minutes ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

Lol... Dude. You're losing it.

I was looking at some of his old posts because hindsight is 20/20 on evaluating moves (drafting Elam, trading for Monroe) and I stumbled across a post where he analyzed Bill Belicheck's appearance in the 2014 Div PO game and used that as a reason why the Ravens would win.

Patriots went on to win the Super Bowl.

Dude really has no idea what he's talking about.

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49 minutes ago, BmoreBird22 said:

Dude really has no idea what he's talking about.

You certainly have to hope that is the case....because if you're wrong, so is Newsome.

Edited by Danny D
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27 minutes ago, Danny D said:

You certainly have to hope that is the case....because if you're wrong, so is Newsome.

Oh, no, I'm not wrong if Newsome is wrong because he doesn't always make moves that I love or make the moves that I want, but one things is abundantly clear; you're here solely to troll.

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4 minutes ago, BmoreBird22 said:

Oh, no, I'm not wrong if Newsome is wrong because he doesn't always make moves that I love or make the moves that I want, but one things is abundantly clear; you're here solely to troll.

Baltimore....it be best if we don't respond to each other's posts.  I promise to keep my side of the bargain. This is my last response to you.

Difference of opinion and attempting to open the eyes of the faithful blind in regard to the long term best interests of the Baltimore Ravens is not trolling. Neither is accusing someone of trolling when refusing to acknowledge the merit of their position, even in the face of mounting evidence. It's not logical and continues the discord but it is not trolling.

Sometimes issues have to be settled on the field.  The Buffalo game will be a fantastic barometer of situation. It will be here in Baltimore and we will have all of our gladiators back.  It is a must win game, especially for those that believe we have had "bad luck".  It will be a game against the QB Newsome let go and against a defense that is well coached and well manned.  It will be epic.

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7 minutes ago, harfordravenfan said:

Hate for newsome is strong in this one

No, I just want him to leave gracefully, unfortunately gracefully was four years ago. 

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When im having a bad day...I just look for the OPs post to realize that I could have it way worse, living life so negatively has to be depressing.  I don't think I have ever seen you make a positive post.

I'll just say this, some of us on here are objective, negative, and wear purple shades. I feel I am objective. 

Last year, even with Suggs, we weren't going to the playoffs, but I would bet we win 2-3 more games honestly.  We are used to having two of the best ever at their position, Ngata, Suggs, Rice, Joe, Boldin, JJ, we had some real playmakers that made an awesome group.  Its hard to be happy compared to where we used to be,,,but that's life.  We try to get better.  There is some things to be negative about, but to this extent....I think you need a snickers. 

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6 minutes ago, usmccharles said:

I don't think I have ever seen you make a positive post.

Last year, even with Suggs, we weren't going to the playoffs, but I would bet we win 2-3 more games honestly. ...I think you need a snickers. 

Agree that Suggs is the "outlier".  Games were close and a healthy Suggs could have resulted in "games". Which brings us right back to essence of it. If Suggs comes back to his Defensive Player of the Year form, he could make a huge impact. If he doesn't who is really there to pick up the slack? unless you're relying upon rookies and 2nd year no shows. You reference it all in your post.  However, being an 8-8 team is unacceptable to me and furthermore there was no reason for it to come to that had we made better decisions.  When I eat a snickers I want Harbaugh gone as well.  How long do they get to ride the early years gravy train?  Is this the last year?

I understand we cannot be the New England Patriots.  First of all they will do absolutely anything legal or illegal to win. We have demonstrated we won't do that. We made an issue out of marijuana, so we have ethics however misplaced. We don't have their QB.  Ours is fine with the right chemistry, but he's never going to read a defense the way the cheater does. So we are handicapped right off, but if our decision makers lay down on the job too we fall off the face of the NFL.  That is unacceptable.

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4 hours ago, Danny D said:

Agree that Suggs is the "outlier".  Games were close and a healthy Suggs could have resulted in "games". Which brings us right back to essence of it. If Suggs comes back to his Defensive Player of the Year form, he could make a huge impact. If he doesn't who is really there to pick up the slack? unless you're relying upon rookies and 2nd year no shows. You reference it all in your post.  However, being an 8-8 team is unacceptable to me and furthermore there was no reason for it to come to that had we made better decisions.  When I eat a snickers I want Harbaugh gone as well.  How long do they get to ride the early years gravy train?  Is this the last year?

I understand we cannot be the New England Patriots.  First of all they will do absolutely anything legal or illegal to win. We have demonstrated we won't do that. We made an issue out of marijuana, so we have ethics however misplaced. We don't have their QB.  Ours is fine with the right chemistry, but he's never going to read a defense the way the cheater does. So we are handicapped right off, but if our decision makers lay down on the job too we fall off the face of the NFL.  That is unacceptable.

Do you? Are you sure?

If you want a HC gone that has had one losing season, an 8-8 year and the rest are playoffs in 8 years, then you really need to step back into reality or sell me what your taking.  8-8 is not where I want to be either, but guess what....it happens.  Teams do actually lose.  We are considered one of the best run organizations in football, its mentioned all the time by reporters, commentators, etc...but they don't meet your standards. 

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1 hour ago, Danny D said:

Baltimore....it be best if we don't respond to each other's posts.  I promise to keep my side of the bargain. This is my last response to you.

Difference of opinion and attempting to open the eyes of the faithful blind in regard to the long term best interests of the Baltimore Ravens is not trolling. Neither is accusing someone of trolling when refusing to acknowledge the merit of their position, even in the face of mounting evidence. It's not logical and continues the discord but it is not trolling.

Sometimes issues have to be settled on the field.  The Buffalo game will be a fantastic barometer of situation. It will be here in Baltimore and we will have all of our gladiators back.  It is a must win game, especially for those that believe we have had "bad luck".  It will be a game against the QB Newsome let go and against a defense that is well coached and well manned.  It will be epic.

The issue is that you don't provide mounting evidence of anything. You're the Fox News of the forum, providing only one side to fit your narrative.

You provide long winded rhetoric with often incorrectly placed phrases and poor word choice. Hell, you once tried to use foreign languages as a way to sound intelligent before two people shredded you for using Google translate. 

I asked you once why Tunsil, on the field, was better than Stanley. Asked it three times. Got nothing.

You're here to stir the pot and nothing else.

And yeah, I'm sure it'd be good for you if no intelligent poster replied to your posts so you don't show a complete and utter lack of football knowledge.

Edited by BmoreBird22
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4 hours ago, usmccharles said:

Do you? Are you sure?

If you want a HC gone that has had one losing season, an 8-8 year and the rest are playoffs in 8 years, then you really need to step back into reality or sell me what your taking.  8-8 is not where I want to be either, but guess what....it happens.  Teams do actually lose.  We are considered one of the best run organizations in football, its mentioned all the time by reporters, commentators, etc...but they don't meet your standards. 

They let the other Harbaugh go and it had little to do with record.  Harbaughs Record, giving him credit for what is clearly Kubiak's influence, for the last three years is 20-26.  There was a period there where his Record and Playoff Record were football stats fodder. Not anymore. But he no longer coaches the type of players that carried him in those early years. There's other factors, but I'm not in arguing mode. We will have it decided for us in short order.

Will he increase his winning percentage?  I'm projecting not.

 

 

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2 hours ago, Danny D said:

Agree that Suggs is the "outlier".  Games were close and a healthy Suggs could have resulted in "games". Which brings us right back to essence of it. If Suggs comes back to his Defensive Player of the Year form, he could make a huge impact. If he doesn't who is really there to pick up the slack? unless you're relying upon rookies and 2nd year no shows. You reference it all in your post.  However, being an 8-8 team is unacceptable to me and furthermore there was no reason for it to come to that had we made better decisions.  When I eat a snickers I want Harbaugh gone as well.  How long do they get to ride the early years gravy train?  Is this the last year?

I understand we cannot be the New England Patriots.  First of all they will do absolutely anything legal or illegal to win. We have demonstrated we won't do that. We made an issue out of marijuana, so we have ethics however misplaced. We don't have their QB.  Ours is fine with the right chemistry, but he's never going to read a defense the way the cheater does. So we are handicapped right off, but if our decision makers lay down on the job too we fall off the face of the NFL.  That is unacceptable.

Yes - simply cannot underestimate the importance of those leaders on the field, like Suggs, who can get the team over the top in those close games that "better teams" pull out. I don't know that Suggs needs to return to DPOY levels, but he's got to be a disruptive force again, or it will be tough for us to generate the pass rush we need. 

Now ... on Harbaugh needing to go ... the "gravy train" derailed last year. Other than that ... 1 non-playoff entry in 7 years and winning at least 1 game in every post season and winning a championship? Coaches with that kind of resume require sustained down years before the organization begin to consider replacing them. Look around the league and who has that kind of resume to fall back on? You can name a handful at best. Seasons like last year need to prove to be a trend before the FO is going to even entertain dismissing Harbs.   

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2 hours ago, Danny D said:

They let the other Harbaugh go and it had little to do with record.  Harbaughs Record, giving him credit for what is clearly Kubiak's influence, for the last three years is 20-26.  There was a period there where his Record and Playoff Record were football stats fodder. Not anymore. But he no longer coaches the type of players that carried him in those early years. There's other factors, but I'm not in arguing mode. We will have it decided for us in short order.

Will he increase his winning percentage?  I'm projecting not.

 

 

 

Right ... it had to do with ownership's ego. How's that working out so far? 

All coaches that win (oddly enough) tend to have players that "carry" them. 

Hopefully, you're not hoping for his (and the teams) failure so you can say, "I told you so".

Finally - enough with the medical marijuana rant. Given Monroe's constant absence over the past 2 years, the team knew they had to move on - a decision which appears to be well supported by Monroe's retirement. The fact they didn't rally behind his cause means nothing. No organization is going to be inclined to join in with any player on any kind of activist movement. No reason to believe the Ravens would do something other than hold the NFL line. If this issue is to be addressed, it will be for the next CBA and any change that is advocated will be considered by ownership in a unified and anonymous manner behind closed doors ... because that's what successful operations do. 

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2 hours ago, Danny D said:

They let the other Harbaugh go and it had little to do with record.  Harbaughs Record, giving him credit for what is clearly Kubiak's influence, for the last three years is 20-26.  There was a period there where his Record and Playoff Record were football stats fodder. Not anymore. But he no longer coaches the type of players that carried him in those early years. There's other factors, but I'm not in arguing mode. We will have it decided for us in short order.

Will he increase his winning percentage?  I'm projecting not.

 

 

Yea and basically everyone considers that a mistake, look at them now.  You really do love to manipulate numbers to fit your argument.  Basically like me saying, lets not count any of his losses, hes undefeated.   I am definitely not arguing with you as you are extremely negative and its pointless to try to explain to someone that they should be objective.  Pretty sure there is about 25 franchises or so that would love to be in our situation.  I feel sorry for you, your not a glass half empty kind of guy, pretty sure your glass has a leak

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3 hours ago, BmoreBird22 said:

The issue is that you don't provide mounting evidence of anything. You're the Fox News of the forum, providing only one side to fit your narrative.

You provide long winded rhetoric with often incorrectly placed phrases and poor word choice. Hell, you once tried to use foreign languages as a way to sound intelligent before two people shredded you for using Google translate. 

I asked you once why Tunsil, on the field, was better than Stanley. Asked it three times. Got nothing.

You're here to stir the pot and nothing else.

And yeah, I'm sure it'd be good for you if no intelligent poster replied to your posts so you don't show a complete and utter lack of football knowledge.

Well.. Thanks for not making me type this lol

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2 hours ago, Danny D said:

They let the other Harbaugh go and it had little to do with record.  Harbaughs Record, giving him credit for what is clearly Kubiak's influence, for the last three years is 20-26.  There was a period there where his Record and Playoff Record were football stats fodder. Not anymore. But he no longer coaches the type of players that carried him in those early years. There's other factors, but I'm not in arguing mode. We will have it decided for us in short order.

Will he increase his winning percentage?  I'm projecting not.

Do you know who chooses the coordinators for a team? I'll give you a hint; might just be the one you're downing

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36 minutes ago, BmoreBird22 said:

Do you know who chooses the coordinators for a team? I'll give you a hint; might just be the one you're downing

Not to mention there are articles like this one, where Kubes talks so highly about what he learned from Harbs. 

Quote

“After being a head coach for so long in this league, I got to sit in the back of that room instead of being the guy up front in the meetings, and it gave me a chance to watch John Harbaugh handle situations,” Kubiak said. “You sit there and say to yourself, ‘You know I like that idea, and if I’m a head coach again, I’d probably do this the same way.’ I learned watching him each and every day.”

 

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3 hours ago, balfan23 said:

Right ... it had to do with ownership's ego. How's that working out so far? 

Not well...but as an example that record isn't everything and can be misleading as to a coach's ability. They tossed Jim because he's a loose wire and can't be civil.  His brother looks to have a Napoleon complex with a twist.

All coaches that win (oddly enough) tend to have players that "carry" them. 

Look no further than M&T Bank Stadium. We get to see the genuine John Harbaugh this year. We'll see what he's got.

Hopefully, you're not hoping for his (and the teams) failure so you can say, "I told you so".

I'm hoping Newsome and Harbaugh prove me wrong and that I have to eat serious crow. Would much rather be on the edge of my seat screaming in jubilation over a win than to say I told you so.  Unfortunately, its going to be the latter.

Finally - enough with the medical marijuana rant. Given Monroe's constant absence over the past 2 years, the team knew they had to move on - a decision which appears to be well supported by Monroe's retirement. The fact they didn't rally behind his cause means nothing.

This move is the one that confirms how confused, out of touch and incapable of understanding recent lessons we are.  This is the exact same move of 2013 and Newsome and DeCosta are just as unaware.  They created this mess before and are wading into it again with blinders on.  We do not need leadership that is this oblivious.  The cheating New England Patriots would never do something so unprofessional. They don't roll like this.  For you to say, "I don't want to hear how the Marijuana Issue indicates we have a problem" is nothing but cover for incompetence.  You mean to tell us that it was a better idea to eat more Monroe Dead Money than to keep him as an Insurance Policy?, especially with Osemele missing and a Rookie slated to start at the key position? The rookie didn't need direction from a veteran?  It was more important to those authoritarians to make a statement about Marijuana, even in application to the team, than it was to provide depth for Flacco and Forsett coming off injuries.

They purged our veterans again to rely upon rookies because they know better. We'll see what they know.

 

Edited by Danny D
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