2016 Training Camp post/Updates

[BmoreBird22]

7 hours ago, BOLDnPurPnBlacK said:

And I don't think he's 6th on the depth chart - I think someone stated that. He's made hits on Juice and Buck in 11 on 11s which says he was running with the 1's or at worst 2's. Sounds so like he's getting reps with the 1s in sub packages and with the 2's. 

That was me and he's no higher than fourth. We know for a fact that Mosley, Orr, and KC are currently entrenched upon the top.

McClellan can also play inside and wont lose a spot because of his ST prowess.

The Ravens also just signed Kavell Conor and I don't think they would unless they thought he could compete.

Not a shocker to see him rotate in with the ones or twos (I'd imagine mostly twos since Juice will play on both and I doubt Forsett lost his job yet) since it is a wide open competition, but he's defintiely looking up.

[rmw10]

3 minutes ago, BmoreBird22 said:

That was me and he's no higher than fourth. We know for a fact that Mosley, Orr, and KC are currently entrenched upon the top.

McClellan can also play inside and wont lose a spot because of his ST prowess.

The Ravens also just signed Kavell Conor and I don't think they would unless they thought he could compete.

Not a shocker to see him rotate in with the ones or twos (I'd imagine mostly twos since Juice will play on both and I doubt Forsett lost his job yet) since it is a wide open competition, but he's defintiely looking up.

Plus, the number 3 or 4 defense or whatever will play against the number 1 offense, and vice versa.  1s don't strictly play against other 1s.

[lgcs27288]

"It's the most wonderful time of the year!" - Andy Williams 

[DomMcRaven]

3 hours ago, Danny D said:

Let's not forget Cincinnati had nothing to play for in week 17 either, but beat us with a rookie QB.  I don't know where those stats that we were 1 and 2 defensively in those weeks came from, but more proof statistics will lead you to Monroe type players.

http://espn.go.com/blog/afcnorth/post/_/id/87294/ravens-remarkably-finish-as-nfls-second-best-defense-in-second-half-of-season

Take it FWIW.

Edited August 1, 2016 by DomMcRaven

[JimmyBlack]

On 7/30/2016 at 5:19 PM, rmw10 said:

It doesn't sound like Keenan Reynolds is doing well at all, which could be a good thing for Campanaro.  Reynolds has apparently been dropping a ton of balls and very unimpressive on returns.

I really hope that both of them make the team this year, because it's nice to have depth at the slot receiver position.  Campanaro needs to prove that he is durable over the course of the whole season.  As for Reynolds, who knows when we might need him on a trick play or two?

[rmcjacket23]

12 hours ago, kjbmore said:

i take this with a HUGE pinch of salt - how did we have a good defense in the final few weeks?

when the seahawks and chiefs put 30+ on us, kept steelers in check and bengals scored 24, if thats good what does bad look like?

 

 

4 hours ago, Danny D said:

Let's not forget Cincinnati had nothing to play for in week 17 either, but beat us with a rookie QB.  I don't know where those stats that we were 1 and 2 defensively in those weeks came from, but more proof statistics will lead you to Monroe type players.

LOL, I already ripped into Danny D once for pulling points allowed off of ESPN and thinking it tells the whole story (or any story), but I guess I have to point this out again.

For the Seattle game (which I agree was a horrendous defensive performance), there were two turnovers we made in our own territory, including a fumble inside our own red zone. Its going to be really difficult for a defense to not give up TDs when a team only has to go 14 yards in order to score one.

For the KC game, we had a pick six and a fumble six, of which the defense could do nothing about because they weren't on the field. They also scored a 3rd TD when they started at our 24 yard line after a failed fake punt.

I'd strongly encourage anybody to go back and look at the last five games of the season. If you take into accounts points allowed that the defense had nothing to do with (mostly from turnovers), you're looking at a defense that was averaging around 20 ppg allowed, and that's against four playoff teams.

Yes, I'd say thats good. Its kind of impossible to think its not. 

[ravensnj]

The feel good story of Reynolds is subsiding. It appears he is having issues with his new position. It's a shame, but, he probably will be stashed on the practice squad to learn his new trait. I enjoy the creative mind set of the pick, but wished we had pulled the trigger on either ILB Scooby Wright or Tyler Matakevich. Both of whom were selected in the 7th round, by Pittsburgh and Cleveland....ugh!

[rossihunter2]

5 hours ago, Tank 92 said:

 

The potential issue is a player that is not using his head and knowing when it's appropriate to lay wood. If you're hitting a player out of bounds(Dixon), huge, costly and dumb mistake. And we know that many hits that were not flagged in previous years are now a routine 15 yard UR, or "defenseless player".  We need guys that are intelligent and can think quickly.  I'm not saying Onwuasor isn't capable of that, but there are some signs that there may be an issue. 

And a quick add........I think many are hypersensitive to the possibility of TC injuries.  Given last years bad fortune this is totally understandable.

as far as im aware, Harbs isnt an idiot - onwuasor was really being that reckless or dangerous something would have been said or he would have been sent from the practice field or he would have been sent packing by Ozzie - the fact that none of those things appear to have happened leads me to believe that the hits were fine which would suggest they are the kind of hits i want more of as a ravens fan

[Tiznut]

6 minutes ago, rossihunter2 said:

as far as im aware, Harbs isnt an idiot - onwuasor was really being that reckless or dangerous something would have been said or he would have been sent from the practice field or he would have been sent packing by Ozzie - the fact that none of those things appear to have happened leads me to believe that the hits were fine which would suggest they are the kind of hits i want more of as a ravens fan

Yeah I'm in this camp. If it was malicious as the way some have typed then it would have been addressed.  

[BmoreBird22]

17 minutes ago, Tiznut said:

Yeah I'm in this camp. If it was malicious as the way some have typed then it would have been addressed.  

We don't know if it was or wasn't. 

And old little bit of advice I received in management was praise in public, discipline in private 

[rossihunter2]

4 minutes ago, BmoreBird22 said:

We don't know if it was or wasn't. 

And old little bit of advice I received in management was praise in public, discipline in private 

that is a very person specific piece of advice - for some (especially in sport) the opposite is sometimes more helpful

Edited August 1, 2016 by rossihunter2

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

6 hours ago, rmw10 said:

I won't quote the book, but I don't think the issue is the overall physicality as much as it is the recklessness and poor decisions.  It sounds like 2 of the 3 would have been 15 yard personal fouls in a real game, and that's where the problem lies.  If he's laying out good, clean plays then I have absolutely no problem with it.  The issue is that it sounds like it's more than that.  Hits out of bounds, hitting high, etc.  It's hard for us to say of course since we aren't there seeing these plays, but from what I've seen on Twitter, it sounds like they've been a bit over the line.

But see, i feel like people are adding in these details.

I heard the Dixon hit was "shoved down while going out of bounds..." and now its turned into a late hit out of bounds warranting a 15 yard penalty.

High hit? Havent heard that. If someones verified that, ok then I agree that he shouldnt be trying to do that, while ultimately some of that will happen just in trying to play hard.

From what ive heard, the Dixon one sounds like its the only one where theres any question whatsoever.... and even then the details are fuzzy. Sounds like ppl are attributing more to it bc he hurt his knee.

Otherwise, Buck Allen is actually the one that started the skirmish with Onwuasor... and it was during a blocking drill. Juice got hit while running the ball in a goal line situation. The UDFA DT got hit during a ST drill, he was holding a dummy and Pat hit the dummy so hard it knocked the guy over. Where were the dangerous hits and penalties?

Thats all im saying - seems like people are adding in details that arent even being reported.

[rmw10]

Just now, BOLDnPurPnBlacK said:

But see, i feel like people are adding in these details.

I heard the Dixon hit was "shoved down while going out of bounds..." and now its turned into a late hit out of bounds warranting a 15 yard penalty.

High hit? Havent heard that. If someones verified that, ok then I agree that he shouldnt be trying to do that, while ultimately some of that will happen just in trying to play hard.

From what ive heard, the Dixon one sounds like its the only one where theres any question whatsoever.... and even then the details are fuzzy. Sounds like ppl are attributing more to it bc he hurt his knee.

Otherwise, Buck Allen is actually the one that started the skirmish with Onwuasor... and it was during a blocking drill. Juice got hit while running the ball in a goal line situation. The UDFA DT got hit during a ST drill, he was holding a dummy and Pat hit the dummy so hard it knocked the guy over. Where were the dangerous hits and penalties?

Thats all im saying - seems like people are adding in details that arent even being reported.

Check Zrebiec's Twitter in particular (should be in the tweets and replies) and some other guys as well.  The Dixon shove was deemed unnecessary by multiple people for sure, and the fight with Juice was said to have been started because it was a high hit.

Again, I appreciate the aggressiveness, but I highly doubt there are professional football players getting upset because they were hit hard.  I think it's kind of silly to assume that guys are whining because of that.  Tempers aren't flaring for no reason.

FYI, I don't think anyone has even cared about him running over the DT.  That's not really a play in question here, it doesn't seem.

Regardless, we don't know what happened.  I've maintained my stance all along that I don't mind aggressiveness unless it comes with recklessness.  It sounds like there might be a small case of that.  I'm not calling for his head or anything, but from all indications, it does sound like he needs to play a bit smarter.

 

[Moderator 3]

Anyone going tonight?  Would love to see your impressions afterwards.

[Tank 92]

Here's a good read on Patrick.

http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/ravens/bal-ravens-patrick-onwuasor-aka-peanut-mixing-it-up-20160731-story.html

[rmw10]

1 minute ago, Tank 92 said:

Here's a good read on Patrick.

http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/ravens/bal-ravens-patrick-onwuasor-aka-peanut-mixing-it-up-20160731-story.html

This is a good article that probably illustrates that while there is aggressiveness, it needs to be controlled.  If Billick got that impression off of one practice, then I'm sure other players aren't just getting angry with Onwuasor for no reason.

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

4 hours ago, Tank 92 said:

I do too, but hate the dumb 15 yarders. They can easily, on their own, cost a win.  It's fairly obvious that the league is moving towards a "kinder, gentler" NFL and it seems many of the refs are throwing flags even on what we know as hard, clean and legal hits. DBs and LBs need to be smarter than ever to prevent the flags and that starts at practices.

Again, hate to keep going back to this - but where was it reported that hes costing 15 yard penalties.

I read he pushed Dixon down, "as he was going out of bounds" not hit while he was out of bounds. Its cloudy at best. I feel like the only reason theres any issue is he got hurt.

I dont understand why we're even debating the fine details of these incidents. An UDFA is playing 150% and going all out to make this team in any way he can. Hes getting guys mad at him in blocking drills. He stuffing a Juice run on the goal line in red zone drills. Hes laying the wedge out in a PR/KR drill. He's chasing down every single play until the whistle blows....

No where has it said hes struck someone in the head, hit helmet to helmet, hit after the whistle or off the field... Instead of praising the effort, it sounds like hes becoming a black sheep among the fan base bc he might hurt some of the other young veteran players feelings or something.

I want a guy thats gonna hit over the middle and be an enforcer. So be it if he gets a 15 yarder here and there. He makes guys think twice about coming again and it leads to dropped balls and missed opportunities. Many times taking one of those 15 yarders can save a team way more than that. Obviously you dont try to do it, and im not advocating doing anything purposefully against the rules...

But i also dont get the fan base attributing dirty play and penalties to this guy when nothing of the sort has been reported or mentioned. If anything, from the media that was in attendance, I read it as they really liked his physical play... he "clobbered" Juice, Buck took offense and tried to fight him, he "flattened" a guy on ST. Not he clobbered Juice in a non-contact drill and Juice was rightfully ticked off.

I dont get worrying about injuries either - my gosh this team gets injured if you breath on them anymore. Its about time someone starts playing like their life depended on it. You typically dont get hurt when youre initiating contact, or are prepared for it and brace the contact. Its the guys who think they arent going to get hit and then accidental contact theyre not ready for injures them. Hope this keeps everyone on their toes and ready.

 

[Tank 92]

Just now, BOLDnPurPnBlacK said:

Again, hate to keep going back to this - but where was it reported that hes costing 15 yard penalties.

I read he pushed Dixon down, "as he was going out of bounds" not hit while he was out of bounds. Its cloudy at best. I feel like the only reason theres any issue is he got hurt.

I dont understand why we're even debating the fine details of these incidents. An UDFA is playing 150% and going all out to make this team in any way he can. Hes getting guys mad at him in blocking drills. He stuffing a Juice run on the goal line in red zone drills. Hes laying the wedge out in a PR/KR drill. He's chasing down every single play until the whistle blows....

No where has it said hes struck someone in the head, hit helmet to helmet, hit after the whistle or off the field... Instead of praising the effort, it sounds like hes becoming a black sheep among the fan base bc he might hurt some of the other young veteran players feelings or something.

I want a guy thats gonna hit over the middle and be an enforcer. So be it if he gets a 15 yarder here and there. He makes guys think twice about coming again and it leads to dropped balls and missed opportunities. Many times taking one of those 15 yarders can save a team way more than that. Obviously you dont try to do it, and im not advocating doing anything purposefully against the rules...

But i also dont get the fan base attributing dirty play and penalties to this guy when nothing of the sort has been reported or mentioned. If anything, from the media that was in attendance, I read it as they really liked his physical play... he "clobbered" Juice, Buck took offense and tried to fight him, he "flattened" a guy on ST. Not he clobbered Juice in a non-contact drill and Juice was rightfully ticked off.

I dont get worrying about injuries either - my gosh this team gets injured if you breath on them anymore. Its about time someone starts playing like their life depended on it. You typically dont get hurt when youre initiating contact, or are prepared for it and brace the contact. Its the guys who think they arent going to get hit and then accidental contact theyre not ready for injures them. Hope this keeps everyone on their toes and ready.

 

I'm not drawing any conclusions yet and that's why I said there may be a potential issue. But I have to say if your pushing a team mate down not wearing pads at a non contact practice while going out of bounds, well, I have to say that's a pretty dumb move.

[rossihunter2]

3 minutes ago, Tank 92 said:

I'm not drawing any conclusions yet and that's why I said there may be a potential issue. But I have to say if your pushing a team mate down not wearing pads at a non contact practice while going out of bounds, well, I have to say that's a pretty dumb move.

i can't help thinking though that out of this situation owuasor is a winner - he's shown something (good or bad or questionable or neither) that has got the fanbase debating and talking about him seriously

[allblackraven]

I can't wait to see this guy come pre season games. We now know he's physical but considering he's WR converted to DB in college, making lot of interceptions, I'm guessing there's much more to him than just being a reckless hitter.

[Jacquouille]

15 minutes ago, allblackraven said:

I can't wait to see this guy come pre season games. We now know he's physical but considering he's WR converted to DB in college, making lot of interceptions, I'm guessing there's much more to him than just being a reckless hitter.

My exact mindset.

[rmw10]

17 minutes ago, allblackraven said:

I can't wait to see this guy come pre season games. We now know he's physical but considering he's WR converted to DB in college, making lot of interceptions, I'm guessing there's much more to him than just being a reckless hitter.

He seems like a guy that could excel at ST.  However, that's not knowing how well he understands gap containment.  His physique screams like a guy that can run down the field and lay the wood, though.

[allblackraven]

18 minutes ago, rmw10 said:

He seems like a guy that could excel at ST.  However, that's not knowing how well he understands gap containment.  His physique screams like a guy that can run down the field and lay the wood, though.

Yep, he couldn't be with the better team if his ticket to the roster is going to be special teams.

[Tiznut]

2 hours ago, BmoreBird22 said:

We don't know if it was or wasn't. 

And old little bit of advice I received in management was praise in public, discipline in private 

That's great but also is the advice of believe half of what you see and none of what you hear. No one here has seen, let alone shown me why I should be in the camp of "off with his head"

[Tiznut]

1 hour ago, Tank 92 said:

Here's a good read on Patrick.

http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/ravens/bal-ravens-patrick-onwuasor-aka-peanut-mixing-it-up-20160731-story.html

What is funny is it says juice to exception to what MIGHT be considered a high hit. 

So I'm not going to fault a guy when even the description of the hit doesn't guarantee it being questionable. 

[Stevin]

according to reports Mallett looks pretty bad. i never liked him.
anybody tell Ozzi a good news -  Nick Foles is free agent!

[January J]

On 7/31/2016 at 4:27 PM, Tiznut said:

First it doesn't say 3 different players got upset. Second if they did but the hits were clean it's their problem not his.  Only person that was said to got made was juice. So if you could misread that then I'm gonna go ahead and dismiss your attempt to say that the hits were bad to begin with. 

Not in that particular quote but yes, there has been 3 instances where his teammates got upset with him. Not sure why your so pressed on voguing for the guy but whatever. He your relative or somethin? I'm just looking out for our teams best interest and obviously several others share a small concern.

 

[January J]

27 minutes ago, Tiznut said:

That's great but also is the advice of believe half of what you see and none of what you hear. No one here has seen, let alone shown me why I should be in the camp of "off with his head"

No one is saying off with the guys head. Heck I'd like a guy like that on our team with that kind of fire...we just need to air on the side of caution due to our recent plague of injuries. You also haven't seen if he did or didn't do anything dirty either so really we both are just speculating off of hearsay. But once you hear more than 3 different predicaments its  safe to say where there's smoke theres fire. These  were all veterans mind you that took issue with him- not just some rookies or udfas that don't know how things are done.

2 hours ago, Tank 92 said:

I'm not drawing any conclusions yet and that's why I said there may be a potential issue. But I have to say if your pushing a team mate down not wearing pads at a non contact practice while going out of bounds, well, I have to say that's a pretty dumb move.

My thoughts exactly.

Edited August 1, 2016 by January J

[Tiznut]

10 minutes ago, January J said:

Not in that particular quote but yes, there has been 3 instances where his teammates got upset with him. Not sure why your so pressed on voguing for the guy but whatever. He your relative or somethin? I'm just looking out for our teams best interest and obviously several others share a small concern.

 

And again it's you using the link to back up your opinion then when pointed out that it doesn't say what you claim it did you now have another excuse. I get it you don't like the guys you haven't heard of but until you post video or coaches expressing concern you have no leg to stand on.  

[rmw10]

Never thought we'd have this much support for a UDFA named Patrick Onwuasor, but here we are.  I feel like the extremes are being argued when no one is saying that he needs to be cut or anything.  Most feel that based on what's been said , that maybe he needs to chill a little bit.  No one is saying to chop his head off or feed him to the sharks.