Campanaro vs Reynolds

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

Theres literally no value in the "QB in a pinch" part. Theres a reason he was asked to convert to WR, and its bc he absolutely doesnt have the skill set to play QB in the NFL. 

No one dresses 3 QBs on game day, so everyone deals with the fact that if both your QBs get hurt youre screwed for that game. Its not like Reynolds would be spurring a comeback anyways, so whats the point of risking injury. You take your lumps and sign someone during the week.

Get outta here with that stuff, haha. Theyre not building the roster and saying.... well in that one in a million chance both QBs go down, or all 4 of our RBs are injured - reynolds will be our savior! 

Hes only making the team if he can play WR or return kicks better than Camp and Clay.

 

I know I know... "the more you can do...." but part of that is being able to actually do it well; or what you have the ability to do having a probability of happening higher than .00000001%.

Edited July 12, 2016 by BOLDnPurPnBlacK

[K-Dog]

4 hours ago, BOLDnPurPnBlacK said:

Theres literally no value in the "QB in a pinch" part. Theres a reason he was asked to convert to WR, and its bc he absolutely doesnt have the skill set to play QB in the NFL. 

No one dresses 3 QBs on game day, so everyone deals with the fact that if both your QBs get hurt youre screwed for that game. Its not like Reynolds would be spurring a comeback anyways, so whats the point of risking injury. You take your lumps and sign someone during the week.

 

That said, there is often an "Emergency QB " on most ( all? ) teams.  If I am not mistaken.

I think either Mase or Bolden ( perhaps both ) I could be wrong, but I don't think that I am.

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

12 hours ago, K-Dog said:

That said, there is often an "Emergency QB " on most ( all? ) teams.  If I am not mistaken.

I think either Mase or Bolden ( perhaps both ) I could be wrong, but I don't think that I am.

Boldin was. Idk about Mason. Koch is currently. 

And i know thats the case  - my point was simply that its not going to be the reason Reynolds makes or doesnt make the team. We didnt target Boldin/Mason in FA bc they could play QB in a desperate situation, just like we arent going to keep Reynolds over Camp bc of that reason. If Reynolds makes it and Camp doesnt its bc he will have shown the same potential at WR if not more, Camps injuries are too much of a risk, or the combo of Reynolds return ability and WR play is more important to the team than Camps combo ability.

Its a cool thing to have in the pocket, but its not factoring into anyones decision.

[jazz1988]

18 hours ago, Tru11 said:

reynolds can play special teams , WR  and emergency QB and perhaps even emergency RB.

camp so far knows how to land on IR.

unless reynolds is terrible in every facet , he should make the roster.

 

 

Camp basically can do the same  but just a better route runner and faster. Camp injury last year wasn't really i.r worthy but due to Steve Smith getting hurt in the same game  as Camp and then The Ravens not pulling  the plug on Perriman sooner rather than later; Well lets just say it left  The Ravens in need of depth at the wide receiver position. Since depth was needed it forced them to put Camp on i.r even though his injury wouldnt have kept him out that long. I honestly think Camp and maybe even Waller got burnt  last year due to The Ravens being hesitant with putting Perriman on I.r until later on in the season last year.

It's understandable for The Ravens to be hesitant since Perriman is a first rounder which comes with high expectations but it's no telling how things would have panned out if they wasn't. Maybe Camp would have went on  and played great but it is what it is.

 

[rmw10]

5 minutes ago, jazz1988 said:

Camp basically can do the same  but just a better route runner and faster. Camp injury last year wasn't really i.r worthy but due to Steve Smith getting hurt in the same game  as Camp and then The Ravens not pulling  the plug on Perriman sooner rather than later; Well lets just say it left  The Ravens in need of depth at the wide receiver position. Since depth was needed it forced them to put Camp on i.r even though his injury wouldnt have kept him out that long. I honestly think Camp and maybe even Waller got burnt  last year due to The Ravens being hesitant with putting Perriman on I.r until later on in the season last year.

It's understandable for The Ravens to be hesitant since Perriman is a first rounder which comes with high expectations but it's no telling how things would have panned out if they wasn't. Maybe Camp would have went on  and played great but it is what it is.

 

While that's true, it's the number on injuries that hurt him, not necessarily the severity.  If history is any indication and we left him on the active roster, it seems like there would have been a good chance that he got hurt again in some capacity.  While depth was a concern, I'd imagine there was also a sense of not being able to count on Camp.

[FastEddie]

19 hours ago, Tru11 said:

reynolds can play special teams , WR  and emergency QB and perhaps even emergency RB.

camp so far knows how to land on IR.

unless reynolds is terrible in every facet , he should make the roster.

 

 

I can get behind this. Reading through some other comments, considering all the positions Reynolds could address. That would be a huge benefit.

However I will mention that if his position is going to be tagged as WR, then I would want him to play it well. hands especially if he will be playing slot.

[ravefan52]

We'll probably go with Reynolds as Camp becomes a stud for some other team

[ellicottraven]

If Campanaro miraculously stays healthy which is about as unlikely as me making an NFL roster, I believe Reynolds will replace him, especially if he doesn't blow it in training camp. Having said that, I am just praying for a miracle where Camp plays healthy and Reynolds proves to be amazing and both are on the roster.

[Willbacker]

Of course a lot depends on certain situations. Health. How well they practice and perform in game situations. Camp has shown NFL abilities in the slot before and has played the position for a few yrs whereas Reynolds is just now converting to WR. If we're able to sign him to the practice squad I would do it. We gotta remember he was a 6th rd pick and every other team had a chance to snatch him.

Its Camp all the way for me............. A healthy Camp!!

[Tank 92]

I've been in Camp's camp  since his days at Wake. But if he can't stay on the field this year his days in Bmore may be numbered.  Until he's gone I'm sticking with my boy.

[Wildabeast88]

On July 12, 2016 at 3:04 PM, BOLDnPurPnBlacK said:

I tend to agree... but this is a different situation. We're not talking a guy whos played the situation his entire life, or at least 3 years against the 2nd highest level competition to the NFL; this is a player who is playing the position for the first time ever.

IMO, all the timing, understanding scheme, rapport and big picture stuff is useless until he has the requisite skill set to play the position. If he cant run a route properly, what use is it for him to understand how his route in combination with another manipulates a defense to create an opening. Or, what use is the timing with Joe on a curl route if 5 months from now when hes picking up the footwork to properly accelerate/decelerate is going to completely change that timing... likewise if he hasnt yet learned to be press coverage off the line; once he does that totally will change timing.

We're talking basics that this kid has never learned. Terrell Pryor is supposedly turning heads at Browns OTAs; and the biggest thing was that he spent so much time last year and over the summer on his own learning the nuances of the position. Now he can play freely and attempt to understand the offense, his role within it on each play, and work on getting open/timing. Until Reynolds has those very basic things down, to me the rest is kind of jumping the gun or even working backwards because

A) that work won't be efficient bc hes definitely not going to be comfortable or have the tools to properly get open, beat coverage, and will have to spend so much of his attention on little basic things that itll be very hard to grasp the bigger picture

B  ) the timing of everything will change once he has the basic tools to run routes efficiently with as few steps as possible and knows how to properly change gears and get in/out of breaks.

and C) i dont want to break his confidence. No sense in sending a pitcher to the majors if all he's got a fast ball with no movement. Sure he might be able to develop a change up or breaking ball, but chances are itll take much much longer in that ultra competitive and results driven environment, and theres a good chance you destroy the pitchers confidence by letting him get hit all over the place. Same concept here - until youve given or taught the guy tools to beat NFL coverage, no sense in over-exposing it to him where he can be successful.

Take a year giving him the tools, and then worry about timing and rapport.

As a college QB even in Navy's system the QB still understands the concepts of the route tree and the breaking of the routes he just was on the other end of the situation. So in my opinion the understanding of all the concepts is there he is not just learning the idea of it. It is the usage and repetition that will need some work but he is an amazing athlete and I believe he will be fine. Also Reynolds gets the edge due to his durability taking a beating running the ball at Navy. 

 

[Deflated Football]

3 hours ago, Tank 92 said:

I've been in Camp's camp  since his days at Wake. But if he can't stay on the field this year his days in Bmore may be numbered.  Until he's gone I'm sticking with my boy.

That's what I'm doing also, but I'm not getting my hopes up

[52liveforever]

I think if Reynolds proves durable he gets the job. 

[Somerset Ravens]

I think the job goes to Camp and Reynolds goes to the practice squad if Camp can stay healthy. I do realize that is a major IF.

[trevorsteadman]

Why not keep both? I mean we are already keeping 3 speedsters (Wallace, Perriman, Moore) and 2 possession receivers (Aiken, Smith Sr.). If slot receiver is really important in the system I can see a scenario where both are on the 53 man roster week 1. Sure both probably won't return balls but if one has a significant role in the offense, that one would probably be Campanaro in this situation you probably don't want him out there risking injuries on kicks. 

Add in Perriman and Smith Sr. are still questionable at coming back. If you really value what Campanaro can do for the offense in the slot and you are worried about him getting injured you can keep Reynolds. 7 wide receivers is not that much more than what the Ravens have usually carried. That just means that the Ravens would likely not keep Terrance West as a 4th running back.

I hear the argument that Reynolds is an unproven late round draft pick and that him switching positions will take a little bit of time... But what if other teams had a higher grade on draft day than we did but we were the first to take the risk of him not playing in the NFL for a couple seasons because of his duties to the United States Navy?

All something to consider. I also like if Reynolds catches on then a couple trick plays can open up the field like what Edelman and Sanu have done in the past. Something Reynolds has is incredible vision and that is because he was a quarterback. Seeing the field and how to get open is key to being a wide receiver in today's NFL. But I don't see the argument that having two slot receivers/returners wastes a roster spot. If the offense has a slot receiver on 70% of snaps it is worth it. Especially when Steve Smith is on his final tour. Having the chance of losing one puts us back a step post Steve Smith Sr.

[Ravensfan23]

Not sure why it's a foregone conclusion that both won't be kept. I actually think that despite both being label as slot WRs, that they are two different guys and both could have a place on this team. 

It's really too early to say what Reynolds will be as a WR but with his body type I could definitely see him developing more strength at the WR position and if he can really develop as a WR i could see him as more then just a slot WR. Many of us hate the name and it's difficult to type but I can easily see Reynolds develop into a tough, physical, hard noise Hines Ward type. Not saying he's Ward but I can certain see him used both inside and out similar to how Ward was used. Wouldn't go as far to say Steve Smith, maybe in his early years, but after the ACL injury Steve just came back way more explosive imo. 

Camp is more of a quick twitch finesse type guy. The Wes Welker comparison is very accurate imo. I think Camp has a lot more short area quickness then Reynolds and while he's feisty I don't think he's physical enough to be a possession type guy who can also win consistently outside. However Camp clearly has his role in this offense carved out, he just has to be healthy enough to fulfill it. 

If both guys remain healthy I think the Ravens keep 7. 

[PerpetuallyBored74]

Campanaro is just a wasted roster spot. I'd rather have another player at any other position as long as that player is decent enough, even as a backup/ST, and doesn't have an injury history like Camp's. Only reason to keep him is if there is an open spot which I doubt there will be. At least I hope we've improved our depth that there won't be an open spot. Shame, because I actually like Camp, a lot. Wish he could stay healthy.

[ALSKAN RAVEN FAN]

Hate to say it but Camp seems to have a "glass body" sure he has shown some play making flashes  but he always seems to end up hurt.

Reynolds has a definite advantage just because all of Camp's injuries. I would hate to see a precious roster slot taken by someone who cant stay on the field.

[Mad Puppy]

On 7/16/2016 at 6:31 AM, PerpetuallyBored74 said:

Campanaro is just a wasted roster spot. I'd rather have another player at any other position as long as that player is decent enough, even as a backup/ST, and doesn't have an injury history like Camp's. Only reason to keep him is if there is an open spot which I doubt there will be. At least I hope we've improved our depth that there won't be an open spot. Shame, because I actually like Camp, a lot. Wish he could stay healthy.

Totally agree with this sentiment. Campanaro has been unavailable far too much. He is really an example of the inability of this team to develop WR's.

[RaineV1]

7 hours ago, Mad Puppy said:

Totally agree with this sentiment. Campanaro has been unavailable far too much. He is really an example of the inability of this team to develop WR's.

Camp isn't an example of us not developing WRs. When he's healthy he's a play maker and showed flashes in our offense. It's not the team's fault that he can't stay healthy and has never finished a season.

[Daft Classic]

On 7/12/2016 at 5:17 PM, BOLDnPurPnBlacK said:

Theres literally no value in the "QB in a pinch" part. Theres a reason he was asked to convert to WR, and its bc he absolutely doesnt have the skill set to play QB in the NFL. 

No one dresses 3 QBs on game day, so everyone deals with the fact that if both your QBs get hurt youre screwed for that game. Its not like Reynolds would be spurring a comeback anyways, so whats the point of risking injury. You take your lumps and sign someone during the week.

Get outta here with that stuff, haha. Theyre not building the roster and saying.... well in that one in a million chance both QBs go down, or all 4 of our RBs are injured - reynolds will be our savior! 

Hes only making the team if he can play WR or return kicks better than Camp and Clay.

 

I know I know... "the more you can do...." but part of that is being able to actually do it well; or what you have the ability to do having a probability of happening higher than .00000001%.

"Emergency QB" may not be a deciding factor, but Reynolds having QB experience can be hugely valuable. His trick play ability will be insane. Not to mention running spurt wildcat plays with Reynolds at the helm. Is he handing off? Is he running it? Is he passing it? No way to know seeing as he can do it all

 

Also, my hype would explode if we did an end around to Reynolds and he launches a 50 yard bomb to Perriman streaking wide open

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

On 7/13/2016 at 8:14 PM, Wildabeast88 said:

As a college QB even in Navy's system the QB still understands the concepts of the route tree and the breaking of the routes he just was on the other end of the situation. So in my opinion the understanding of all the concepts is there he is not just learning the idea of it. It is the usage and repetition that will need some work but he is an amazing athlete and I believe he will be fine. Also Reynolds gets the edge due to his durability taking a beating running the ball at Navy. 

 

Thats fine and all... but we see every year WR's that have played the position their entire lives and were great in college in spread offenses, or even pro style offenses struggle at the technical aspects of the NFL game. And theyve been working on it their entire lives. Let alone receivers coming from an option offense whose main duties are to block.

Now, we're talking about a QB in an option offense whose never played WR. Just bc hes seens a WR run a route before doesnt mean he can do it.

Trust me, I like the kid and I have faith he'll eventually contribute. All im saying is that if Camp is healthy we know he can contribute. Im not cutting a guy who we've seen first hand make plays against NFL competition, for a guy who might develop into a playmaker at some point with enough repetition. You let a healthy camp go and hes gone forever.

Reynolds can go on the PS or IR, learn the craft, and you still own him for 3 years. More technical work and repetition isnt going to hurt the kid. IMO finding a way to keep both in the program is the best case scenario if Camp can stay healthy through TC. Obviously if hes injured again throughout hes gone and this isnt a discussion. But chances are we cant keep both on the roster - the numbers just arent there. And in that event, Camp is more ready to get on the field and contribute now, Reynolds will only benefit from more technical work, and its a scenario where we can keep both.

You cant tell me a 7th round, option QB has a grasp on route concepts and all the other nuances of the position when most pro style WRs coming out of college dont have it down. The guy ran the ball more than twice as much as he threw it. Thats not a complex passing offense that even scratches the surface of whats expected of an NFL WR for one thing.... and even if it did, seeing it from the QB side isnt the same as actually doing it.

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

44 minutes ago, Daft Classic said:

"Emergency QB" may not be a deciding factor, but Reynolds having QB experience can be hugely valuable. His trick play ability will be insane. Not to mention running spurt wildcat plays with Reynolds at the helm. Is he handing off? Is he running it? Is he passing it? No way to know seeing as he can do it all

 

Also, my hype would explode if we did an end around to Reynolds and he launches a 50 yard bomb to Perriman streaking wide open

Yea its a great luxury... but again - that only matters if the competition between him and Camp is dead even. IF all things else are equal, sure, you take the guy who can do more. But, if Camp is at all better than him at the WR position hes making the team over him unless they need Reynolds to be the primary returner and he beats Camp out there.

But, my point is that stuff only comes in to play after the fact - ones hes made the team... or if the decision is an absolute dead lock.

I was simply refuting the comments that that stuff gives Reynolds the edge over Camp. Again, that only gives him an edge if their play on the field is equal, which at this point theres no way to know that.

[757RavensFan]

1 hour ago, Daft Classic said:

"Emergency QB" may not be a deciding factor, but Reynolds having QB experience can be hugely valuable. His trick play ability will be insane. Not to mention running spurt wildcat plays with Reynolds at the helm. Is he handing off? Is he running it? Is he passing it? No way to know seeing as he can do it all

 

Also, my hype would explode if we did an end around to Reynolds and he launches a 50 yard bomb to Perriman streaking wide open

Cam Cameron, is that you?

[Daft Classic]

10 minutes ago, 757RavensFan said:

Cam Cameron, is that you?

Laugh all you want, but when done well, it's one of my favorite plays in all of football. Nothing hypes up the home crowd/demoralizes the other team like the WR fooling the D and dropping bombs besides maybe the punter doing it. 

[ravensnj]

Clay before both of these guys on kick returns.

[rmw10]

6 minutes ago, ravensnj said:

Clay before both of these guys on kick returns.

Hard part for Clay is that he doesn't have too much to offer at WR.

[K-Dog]

7 minutes ago, rmw10 said:

Hard part for Clay is that he doesn't have too much to offer at WR.

Which is why I don't envy Ozzie.

Just with Camp, Reynolds and Clay, you can say all three are good and roster worthy. One is better at this, the other is better at that. I don't want to loose this guy for this reason  I don't want to loose that guy for that reason. 

 

Not a bad problem to have but likely frustrating.  Some good players who are currently RAVENS,  will be on some other team in September 

[ravensnj]

3 hours ago, K-Dog said:

Which is why I don't envy Ozzie.

Just with Camp, Reynolds and Clay, you can say all three are good and roster worthy. One is better at this, the other is better at that. I don't want to loose this guy for this reason  I don't want to loose that guy for that reason. 

 

Not a bad problem to have but likely frustrating.  Some good players who are currently RAVENS,  will be on some other team in September 

How true

[Ravensfan23]

16 hours ago, RaineV1 said:

Camp isn't an example of us not developing WRs. When he's healthy he's a play maker and showed flashes in our offense. It's not the team's fault that he can't stay healthy and has never finished a season.

Agreed. Camp is an example of the team finally drafting a really good WR in the later rounds but injuries not allowing this guy to make good on the selection. Because Camp has shown enough from the slot, in practice and limited action, the Ravens went after a guy like Reynolds for insurance.