$13M in cap space &Tucker's Contract Negotiations

[Ravenseconbeast]

2 hours ago, Grapple Raven said:

 

Lol, on baby Easton, Berad.  I am so happy for Tucker and his family.  All joking aside, quite possibly this was a consideration, as having a child does change one's long-term perspective.

 

NICE!!! justin is with Ravens for another 4 amazing years!!!

[Guest]

Big signing.  Gets all the poison out and demonstrates willingness to reward key players.  Tucker certainly has been key.

[JoeyFlex5]

we got Tucker signed. I really hope we don't bite on the good guy, fan favorite, blue collar boy and pay a 2 down NT 3 down money. I love b will but we've had a great off-season and I'd hate to see us end it by overpaying a long term strapping contract 

[JO_75]

Would really love to see us get a deal done with Brandon Williams using the basis of what some of the players got in free agency this year compared to trying to re-sign him next year. The Franchise Tag won't be an option considering how costly a DL Tag is so getting a deal done before the season should be next on Ozzie's list.

[Ravenseconbeast]

12 hours ago, JO_75 said:

Would really love to see us get a deal done with Brandon Williams using the basis of what some of the players got in free agency this year compared to trying to re-sign him next year. The Franchise Tag won't be an option considering how costly a DL Tag is so getting a deal done before the season should be next on Ozzie's list.

I can see Brandon being open to negotiation.  Doesn't mean anything since he didn't ink his paper.   Brandon has plenty of time until his contract is over and so does the Ravens organization.   There is no need to press for contract renewal now.   

I don't see the harm with Ravens offering him something and Brandon's agent looking at the offer(if there is one) now though.   

Edited July 17, 2016 by Ravenseconbeast

[757RavensFan]

On 7/17/2016 at 1:39 PM, Ravenseconbeast said:

I can see Brandon being open to negotiation.  Doesn't mean anything since he didn't ink his paper.   Brandon has plenty of time until his contract is over and so does the Ravens organization.   There is no need to press for contract renewal now.   

I don't see the harm with Ravens offering him something and Brandon's agent looking at the offer(if there is one) now though.   

If you're the Ravens Front office, there's definitely a reason why they would like to sign him to a long term deal NOW.

If B. Will has a great season, it will cost the Ravens considerably more to re-sign him next year since he'll be a free agent. 

Edited July 18, 2016 by 757RavensFan

[rmcjacket23]

33 minutes ago, 757RavensFan said:

If you're the Ravens Front office, there's definitely a reason why they would like to sign him to a long term NOW.

If B. Will has a great season, it will cost the Ravens considerable more to re-sign him next year since he'll be a free agent. 

Yup... simple risk/reward.

Exact opposite could happen as well. If he gets injured or has a down year, his value probably decreases a bit.

I'll say this... if he ends up becoming more of a 3 down player who gets maybe 5-6 sacks (probably a stretch), the Ravens will have a BIG problem resigning him.

[JoeyFlex5]

14 minutes ago, rmcjacket23 said:

Yup... simple risk/reward.

Exact opposite could happen as well. If he gets injured or has a down year, his value probably decreases a bit.

I'll say this... if he ends up becoming more of a 3 down player who gets maybe 5-6 sacks (probably a stretch), the Ravens will have a BIG problem resigning him.

The ravens have more cap space than usual and those available funds don't appear to be slimming down any time soon, sizzle, doom, pitta, monroe, lewis, and possibly yanda will all be off the books 3 or 4 years from now, if Williams becomes a 3 down guy then they should have no problem opening their wallets... 

 

However, he is going to get 3 down money anyway, teams who struggle to stop the run will gladly pay a guy like him 3 down money. We don't value a 2down NT so much because we always stop the run effectively, we don't feel the pain of getting gashed up the middle, other teams know how frustrating that is, and will pay to fix it. 

 

If he brings us pass rush then give him market value, but I highly doubt he will progress to that kind of player, it's just beyond his skill set. That's why I hope we avoid it, because he's gonna get more than he is worth to us.

[rmcjacket23]

6 minutes ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

The ravens have more cap space than usual and those available funds don't appear to be slimming down any time soon, sizzle, doom, pitta, monroe, lewis, and possibly yanda will all be off the books 3 or 4 years from now, if Williams becomes a 3 down guy then they should have no problem opening their wallets... 

 

However, he is going to get 3 down money anyway, teams who struggle to stop the run will gladly pay a guy like him 3 down money. We don't value a 2down NT so much because we always stop the run effectively, we don't feel the pain of getting gashed up the middle, other teams know how frustrating that is, and will pay to fix it. 

 

If he brings us pass rush then give him market value, but I highly doubt he will progress to that kind of player, it's just beyond his skill set. That's why I hope we avoid it, because he's gonna get more than he is worth to us.

He's not getting 3 down player money based on what we've seen so far. He won't fit in any team playing a 4-3, so he's only available to about half the teams in the league at best.

The market for strictly run-stopping 3-4 NTs isn't particularly strong and never has been. He could MAYBE get Damon Harrison money, and I think that's probably on the high end of what he will get. Even teams looking to stop the run will be limited to 3-4 teams AND he isn't the kind of guy who will single handedly fix your run defense.

All of the other highly paid DTs in the league ALL offer some semblance of pass rushing ability, and had somewhat of a track record of doing so. People looking at Malik Jackson or Muhammad Wilkerson type deals are looking in the wrong place. Completely different players with completely different roles.

Edited July 18, 2016 by rmcjacket23

[rmw10]

1 minute ago, rmcjacket23 said:

He's not getting 3 down player money based on what we've seen so far. He won't fit in any team playing a 4-3, so he's only available to about half the teams in the league at best.

The market for strictly run-stopping 3-4 NTs isn't particularly strong and never has been. He could MAYBE get Damon Harrison money, and I think that's probably on the high end of what he will get. Even teams looking to stop the run will be limited to 3-4 teams AND he isn't the kind of guy who will single handedly fix your run defense.

All of the other highly paid DTs in the league ALL offer some semblance of pass rushing ability, and had somewhat of a track record of doing so. People looking at Malik Jackson or Muhammad Wilkerson type deals are looking in the wrong place. Completely different players with completely different roles.

I think Harrison's deal is around what he'll get.  I'd argue that Williams is a better pass rusher though.  While Williams doesn't have the sack numbers, he is good at pushing that pocket.  Even then though, his primarily value is as that anchor in the middle of the line, and I'd think his contract should stay in the Harrison range for that reason.

Much like the Tucker deal, I think we're in a very good spot as far as having the contract comparison for Williams.  Tucker had the Gostkowski contract from a year earlier, and Williams will have the Harrison contract from a year earlier.  It's certainly good to have a baseline.

[rmcjacket23]

17 minutes ago, rmw10 said:

I think Harrison's deal is around what he'll get.  I'd argue that Williams is a better pass rusher though.  While Williams doesn't have the sack numbers, he is good at pushing that pocket.  Even then though, his primarily value is as that anchor in the middle of the line, and I'd think his contract should stay in the Harrison range for that reason.

Much like the Tucker deal, I think we're in a very good spot as far as having the contract comparison for Williams.  Tucker had the Gostkowski contract from a year earlier, and Williams will have the Harrison contract from a year earlier.  It's certainly good to have a baseline.

Right. Harrison's deal, while large, still only has $24M guaranteed. Even if you get into the 5 year, $50M range for Williams, you're easily looking at probably less than $30M guaranteed, and could easily be in the $20-25M range.

Given our current and likely future cap situation, more than reasonable for both sides in my opinion.

[Purple_City39]

1 hour ago, 757RavensFan said:

If you're the Ravens Front office, there's definitely a reason why they would like to sign him to a long term deal NOW.

If B. Will has a great season, it will cost the Ravens considerably more to re-sign him next year since he'll be a free agent. 

I don't think the Ravens are worried about having to overpay him for a few reasons.

1. He's shown no real pass rush skills.  Pass rushers get the big money in the front 7, run stoppers don't.  

2. As a run stopper, he's unfortunately on a team that's consistently stopped the run since 96.  There's been no better run defending team in that time.  Baltimore won't struggle to find another run stopping DT.

3. Willie Henry and Carl Davis.  The former is supposed to be a pretty good interior pass rusher, the latter isn't bad at stopping the run at all.  Both are backups right now.  Honestly, I already expect one of them to replace B.Will on obvious passing situations as it is, so it won't be surprising to see one in his place next year.

At this point, I'm pretty sure they aren't even thinking about paying Williams this season.  If he plays out his mind then it'll be a positive for the team during the season and they let him walk (after giving an offer he will bypass for top dollar somewhere else).  If he has a down season then the team will still survive it during the year and the front office can retain him for cheaper.  Personally, I think he walks next year

[rmcjacket23]

4 minutes ago, Purple_City39 said:

I don't think the Ravens are worried about having to overpay him for a few reasons.

1. He's shown no real pass rush skills.  Pass rushers get the big money in the front 7, run stoppers don't.  

2. As a run stopper, he's unfortunately on a team that's consistently stopped the run since 96.  There's been no better run defending team in that time.  Baltimore won't struggle to find another run stopping DT.

3. Willie Henry and Carl Davis.  The former is supposed to be a pretty good interior pass rusher, the latter isn't bad at stopping the run at all.  Both are backups right now.  Honestly, I already expect one of them to replace B.Will on obvious passing situations as it is, so it won't be surprising to see one in his place next year.

At this point, I'm pretty sure they aren't even thinking about paying Williams this season.  If he plays out his mind then it'll be a positive for the team during the season and they let him walk (after giving an offer he will bypass for top dollar somewhere else).  If he has a down season then the team will still survive it during the year and the front office can retain him for cheaper.  Personally, I think he walks next year

1. Typically yes. However, as many of us have mentioned, Damon Harrison kind of set the bar there. He got a $9-10M per year deal as an exclusive run stopper. Not a huge price tag in today's market, but probably more than people were expecting.

2. Possibly not, but it also doesn't make sense to let a player go that you want to retain when you actually have the ability to retain him.

3. Neither one of those guys is a NT, which is what we would have to replace if we let Brandon go.

At the end of the day, there's really no point in having cap space if you aren't going to use it to retain your own good, young players. Its not like we are all of the sudden going to become a team that starts spending $10M a year on any individual players on the FA market, especially when we could just spend that on our own guys.

And from what I and everybody else is seeing, there's not much fear of not being able to retain our own guys in the near future if we want to, given that we don't have many of those guys to retain. Williams would probably be at the highest end of that group.

I'd expect an extension to occur before FA opens next offseason. Would not surprise me to see an in-season extension either.

Edited July 18, 2016 by rmcjacket23

[rmw10]

Yeah I see no reason not to sign Williams unless the price is astronomical.  If there's a deal that can be made, then absolutely, sign him.  There's no reason to let an ascending young player walk.  It's been awhile since we've paid one of our own (except Flacco), and if there is one to be paid, it's Williams.

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

Yea, i think the best point being made is that we've typically struggled to resign some of our own ascending players bc we've had a core of home grown star players under contract from Ray Lewis, Ed Reed, Suggs, Ngata, JJ, Yanda, Rice, Pitta, and Webb taking up a majority of the future cap.

Right now we're in a position where over the next 2-4 years almost every single big contract besides Flacco and Jimmy is coming off the books. You can always arrange the contract to fit under the cap now - it's the future years where its always been difficult for us. Now, in 2 or 3 years a lot of our book is opening up so we should be able to start retaining the next generation.

B Will is likely part of that. Just hope hes sensible about his value... bc as we've seen there will be some team with an enormous amount of cap space willing to throw it around... and we just cant compete with that.

[rmcjacket23]

10 minutes ago, BOLDnPurPnBlacK said:

Yea, i think the best point being made is that we've typically struggled to resign some of our own ascending players bc we've had a core of home grown star players under contract from Ray Lewis, Ed Reed, Suggs, Ngata, JJ, Yanda, Rice, Pitta, and Webb taking up a majority of the future cap.

Right now we're in a position where over the next 2-4 years almost every single big contract besides Flacco and Jimmy is coming off the books. You can always arrange the contract to fit under the cap now - it's the future years where its always been difficult for us. Now, in 2 or 3 years a lot of our book is opening up so we should be able to start retaining the next generation.

B Will is likely part of that. Just hope hes sensible about his value... bc as we've seen there will be some team with an enormous amount of cap space willing to throw it around... and we just cant compete with that.

I'd put this simply... the players that we generally actually WANT to retain, we retain. There are guys that we make offers to at "our price" and hope that they resign (KO, Torrey, etc.) that we would like to keep but don't "have to have".

Players that we legitimately want to and feel we need to retain long term we almost always do. The "core" players in this franchises history have basically always signed a second contract with this team.

We will find out if Brandon Williams is one of those guys.

[JoeyFlex5]

2 hours ago, rmcjacket23 said:

He's not getting 3 down player money based on what we've seen so far. He won't fit in any team playing a 4-3, so he's only available to about half the teams in the league at best.

The market for strictly run-stopping 3-4 NTs isn't particularly strong and never has been. He could MAYBE get Damon Harrison money, and I think that's probably on the high end of what he will get. Even teams looking to stop the run will be limited to 3-4 teams AND he isn't the kind of guy who will single handedly fix your run defense.

All of the other highly paid DTs in the league ALL offer some semblance of pass rushing ability, and had somewhat of a track record of doing so. People looking at Malik Jackson or Muhammad Wilkerson type deals are looking in the wrong place. Completely different players with completely different roles.

i personally think that the harrison deal is steep for a run stuffer and space eater, and he will likely get a little bit more than harrison, and thats what i mean by 3 down money, not literally pass rush money but more money than you should be paying to a pure run defender, and i think thats where the problem lies. not that i think the ravens arent willing, and i definitely am a brandon williams fan and theres no arguing hes one of the best in the biz at what he does, but i look at a team like the skins who lost their NT after just 1 year and even with pot roast they were horrible against the run, taking a downgrade at the most important position against the run in a 34 is something they cant afford, they dont even have a stop gap for this year, sua cravens i think will be a world beater but he cant control the interior of the line, and preston smith could be special in multiple positions but hes not a NT, with what they have there now they could see themselves 32nd against the run, they also have cap space next year. 

 

if a deal isnt done this season, i sadly think williams will be headed off to washington

[RaineV1]

I think Williams' impact on passing downs is a bit understated. The top way QBs like to escape edge rushers is to step up into the pocket. That's kinda hard to do when a NT is pushing the center back. While he doesn't get sacks, he does make the job of the edge rushers quite a bit easier.

 

2 hours ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

However, he is going to get 3 down money anyway, teams who struggle to stop the run will gladly pay a guy like him 3 down money. We don't value a 2down NT so much because we always stop the run effectively, we don't feel the pain of getting gashed up the middle, other teams know how frustrating that is, and will pay to fix it.

http://www.baltimoreravens.com/team/history/all-time-rankings.html#defense

Quote

2013	11th (105.4)
2012	20th (122.8)

Before Williams, the Ravens actually were struggling against the run, giving up over a hundred yards a game. It went from 11th to 4th in 2014, likely thanks to Williams. And right now, I doubt we have anyone that could actually take his spot.

[JoeyFlex5]

2 minutes ago, RaineV1 said:

I think Williams' impact on passing downs is a bit understated. The top way QBs like to escape edge rushers is to step up into the pocket. That's kinda hard to do when a NT is pushing the center back. While he doesn't get sacks, he does make the job of the edge rushers quite a bit easier.

 

http://www.baltimoreravens.com/team/history/all-time-rankings.html#defense

Before Williams, the Ravens actually were struggling against the run, giving up over a hundred yards a game. It went from 11th to 4th in 2014, likely thanks to Williams. And right now, I doubt we have anyone that could actually take his spot.

this is definitely true but its a balancing act, historically we have done a very good job building a strong and deep defensive line, and we have shown time and time again we arent afraid to let guys walk because money can be better spent elsewhere. if we can simply find a good stout and strong DT and have a rotation behind him, which we have always been able to do, then the drop off shouldnt be that big, our DL rotation will be stopping the run even with an average NT, we lack an explosive pass rush but even our depth guys can stop the run at a high level. id rather see the pass rush take a big leap while the run D takes a small step back, rather than keep our run D fully intact and still have no pass rush. 

 

until KC, BK, judon or ochi show that they can be nfl pass rushers, i will maintain that we have no business throwing the kind of money williams will demand on the market at run defenders. were just too stout against the run, losing williams would hurt that but we will be more than fine in that aspect i believe.

[rmw10]

Here's the cap breakdown.  Saves us about $1M on the cap this year since the franchise tag was a touch above $4.5M

 

Edited July 19, 2016 by rmw10

[Jacquouille]

15 hours ago, RaineV1 said:

Before Williams, the Ravens actually were struggling against the run, giving up over a hundred yards a game. It went from 11th to 4th in 2014, likely thanks to Williams. And right now, I doubt we have anyone that could actually take his spot.

I think, before we know it, Carl Davis will have reached Williams' level against the run, and is probably the better pass rusher between the two.

 

[Purple_City39]

17 hours ago, rmcjacket23 said:

1. Typically yes. However, as many of us have mentioned, Damon Harrison kind of set the bar there. He got a $9-10M per year deal as an exclusive run stopper. Not a huge price tag in today's market, but probably more than people were expecting.

2. Possibly not, but it also doesn't make sense to let a player go that you want to retain when you actually have the ability to retain him.

3. Neither one of those guys is a NT, which is what we would have to replace if we let Brandon go.

At the end of the day, there's really no point in having cap space if you aren't going to use it to retain your own good, young players. Its not like we are all of the sudden going to become a team that starts spending $10M a year on any individual players on the FA market, especially when we could just spend that on our own guys.

And from what I and everybody else is seeing, there's not much fear of not being able to retain our own guys in the near future if we want to, given that we don't have many of those guys to retain. Williams would probably be at the highest end of that group.

I'd expect an extension to occur before FA opens next offseason. Would not surprise me to see an in-season extension either.

1.  Not a huge price tag, but is it something Baltimore would be willing to do where the question comes in.  One team being willing to overpay a 2 down player doesn't mean the Ravens will

2.  It does when they also have to resign their RT and get a contract for a player like Aiken.  SSS is done after this season, Wallace is likely a 1 year stop gap unless he balls out, and Perriman is still an unknown.  Aiken is, sadly, the most reliable WR on the team right now and you definitely retain your QBs weapons and protection over a run stopper

3. It's not like we haven't seen Davis and Jernigan both play the nose position just last season.  That and we don't really run the 3-4 100% of the time anyway. 

I'm a huge fan of Brandon Williams and would love to see him stay.  Minus any carry over, we're looking to go into the next off season with about 5M in cap space (before any moves are made).  There are so many other players I could see that money going to before him.  Wagner, Aiken, another FA WR, possibly another CB, will Webb work out or will we need another safety, etc.  

I see Williams hitting the free agent market......unless he's willing to take 6-7M per year.  

[rmcjacket23]

7 minutes ago, Purple_City39 said:

1.  Not a huge price tag, but is it something Baltimore would be willing to do where the question comes in.  One team being willing to overpay a 2 down player doesn't mean the Ravens will

2.  It does when they also have to resign their RT and get a contract for a player like Aiken.  SSS is done after this season, Wallace is likely a 1 year stop gap unless he balls out, and Perriman is still an unknown.  Aiken is, sadly, the most reliable WR on the team right now and you definitely retain your QBs weapons and protection over a run stopper

3. It's not like we haven't seen Davis and Jernigan both play the nose position just last season.  That and we don't really run the 3-4 100% of the time anyway. 

I'm a huge fan of Brandon Williams and would love to see him stay.  Minus any carry over, we're looking to go into the next off season with about 5M in cap space (before any moves are made).  There are so many other players I could see that money going to before him.  Wagner, Aiken, another FA WR, possibly another CB, will Webb work out or will we need another safety, etc.  

I see Williams hitting the free agent market......unless he's willing to take 6-7M per year.  

1. Well you can't really "overpay" a player these days, because their value is precisely whatever somebody is willing to pay them. Somebody may decide to pay him more than we are willing to pay him, but that's not really overpaying.

2. RTs don't require large contracts. Lane Johnson is technically a RT now who is making a little over $11M on average, but he's also the LT of the future on that team, so his deal should be a bit bigger. Outside of him, the highest paid RTs average around $6M a year.

The secondary issue here is that we are ASSUMING that we will even want to retain either Wagner or Aiken. This is a very big year for both of them. Wagner was pretty average last season coming off an injury. He will need to play better in order to get a contract in that range. 

Aiken is a huge wildcard for me. If he outperforms Steve Smith for playing time, then he will earn a decent contract. If he stays as the #3 or #4 option, we either resign him for cheap or let him go. Far from a given that he earns a respectable deal at this point.

3. True, but when they play the nose, its in nickel or dime packages where their responsibilities are completely different. 

4. Not sure where you got your cap breakdown from. Our top 51 in 2017, as of this moment, is $154.5M.  The 2017 cap figures to be AT LEAST $160M, and many projections I've seen put it at the $165M range. So realistically, you're looking at probably $10M in space BEFORE any cap rollover, which will probably easily be $5M or more.

Before cuts, I'd expect us to have at least $12-15M in cap space. That alone is enough to retain any two of the three among Aiken/Wagner/Williams, and there's plenty of cuts that could be made to free up space.

[JoeyFlex5]

38 minutes ago, Jacquouille said:

I think, before we know it, Carl Davis will have reached Williams' level against the run, and is probably the better pass rusher between the two.

 

I wouldn't bet on it. Davis was a first round talent that fell to the 3rd due to rumored laziness and horrible character. He was in better shape as a rookie than he ever was in college so that's encouraging, but some folks are just lazy at heart and until he proves his work ethic I don't think you should expect him to match what a supreme character guy like Williams developed into. 

 

However, Carl Davis does have the potential to be the ideal NT in today's league, powerful enough to anchor, has the quickness to sidestep and blow past guys on occasion, slim enough to squeeze in gaps, has reach to play on the ball in the pocket, and a surprising athlete. He has a very long way to go before he can be that guy though...

[757RavensFan]

6 minutes ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

I wouldn't bet on it. Davis was a first round talent that fell to the 3rd due to rumored laziness and horrible character. He was in better shape as a rookie than he ever was in college so that's encouraging, but some folks are just lazy at heart and until he proves his work ethic I don't think you should expect him to match what a supreme character guy like Williams developed into. 

 

However, Carl Davis does have the potential to be the ideal NT in today's league, powerful enough to anchor, has the quickness to sidestep and blow past guys on occasion, slim enough to squeeze in gaps, has reach to play on the ball in the pocket, and a surprising athlete. He has a very long way to go before he can be that guy though...

I saw a tweet that Davis was ready for camp after a successful off-season surgery.  Anyone know what type of procedure he had?

[Jacquouille]

37 minutes ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

I wouldn't bet on it. Davis was a first round talent that fell to the 3rd due to rumored laziness and horrible character. He was in better shape as a rookie than he ever was in college so that's encouraging, but some folks are just lazy at heart and until he proves his work ethic I don't think you should expect him to match what a supreme character guy like Williams developed into. 

 

However, Carl Davis does have the potential to be the ideal NT in today's league, powerful enough to anchor, has the quickness to sidestep and blow past guys on occasion, slim enough to squeeze in gaps, has reach to play on the ball in the pocket, and a surprising athlete. He has a very long way to go before he can be that guy though...

I read that he came to minicamp in awesome shape, some were saying he was the player who benefit the most from the offseason. I think we have the guys in Harbs and Cullen to push him and motivate him. He will surely not be as driven as Williams, but if I had to judge, I'd say he's doing good so far.

If he's not the guy, I also want to remind that Jernigan was supposed to be a better NT coming out of college. So we might want to try it also, could turn out like:

 

Henry Jernigan Urban

Pass rush Wise, that would be terrific btw.

[JoeyFlex5]

36 minutes ago, 757RavensFan said:

I saw a tweet that Davis was ready for camp after a successful off-season surgery.  Anyone know what type of procedure he had?

I haven't even heard about him being down.. Strange. Must not be a big deal.

[rmw10]

2 minutes ago, Jacquouille said:

I read that he came to minicamp in awesome shape, some were saying he was the player who benefit the most from the offseason. I think we have the guys in Harbs and Cullen to push him and motivate him. He will surely not be as driven as Williams, but if I had to judge, I'd say he's doing good so far.

If he's not the guy, I also want to remind that Jernigan was supposed to be a better NT coming out of college. So we might want to try it also, could turn out like:

 

Henry Jernigan Urban

Pass rush Wise, that would be terrific btw.

You don't want Jernigan at NT in a 3-4.  His best asset is as a pass rusher.  A nose tackles job is to eat blockers and make life for guys like Jernigan and other pass rushers easier.

[JoeyFlex5]

2 minutes ago, Jacquouille said:

I read that he came to minicamp in awesome shape, some were saying he was the player who benefit the most from the offseason. I think we have the guys in Harbs and Cullen to push him and motivate him. He will surely not be as driven as Williams, but if I had to judge, I'd say he's doing good so far.

If he's not the guy, I also want to remind that Jernigan was supposed to be a better NT coming out of college. So we might want to try it also, could turn out like:

 

Henry Jernigan Urban

Pass rush Wise, that would be terrific btw.

If Davis just proves all his critics wrong nobody would be more thrilled than me, I was a big Davis fan in the draft and when we were approaching the clock in the 2nd round I wanted either Williams or davis, and we ended up with both. I've just learned to temper my expectations more than most I guess lol. 

 

As for jernigan, I just don't see him as a NFL NT, at least not a full time one. I think he's far too quick and agile and he is a bully with his strength but he isn't the stout "clog 2 lanes and keep 3 interior blockers on their heels" type of NT you look for in a 34. He's always struck me as more of a 3 down 43DT

[BmoreBird22]

20 hours ago, rmcjacket23 said:

He's not getting 3 down player money based on what we've seen so far. He won't fit in any team playing a 4-3, so he's only available to about half the teams in the league at best.

The market for strictly run-stopping 3-4 NTs isn't particularly strong and never has been. He could MAYBE get Damon Harrison money, and I think that's probably on the high end of what he will get. Even teams looking to stop the run will be limited to 3-4 teams AND he isn't the kind of guy who will single handedly fix your run defense.

I'd disagree that he's only limited to 3-4 teams. I do think he has more value in a 3-4, but 4-3 defenses still use a nose/1T and Brandon can be ideal in that role.

He generates enough of a pocket push to not allow players to step up and his sheer strength and girth are more often than not going to draw a double team. 

That's going to be invaluable to a team that wants to a team that wants to free it's 3T up one on one instead of having to fight double teams. 

Plus, Harrison is probably even more one dimensional than Brandon just signed with a 4-3 team. 

I am in agreement, though, that he won't break the bank.