Left Guard

[DenverRaven]

13 hours ago, K-Dog said:

If Stanley was stinking it up at OTA's and minicamps this thread would not exist.
Monroe is gone in part because Stanley proved it was okay for him to move on. 

For sure. I'm betting that they had a few closed door meetings with Stanley to let him know what is expected, and instill the confidence he needs to be the guy at LT. He's gonna do fine. Dude is a great pass protector, he's humble, and I'm sure he has exuded enough confidence for Oz/Harbs to put Monroe on the street.

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

In the article on the home page about Stanley and handling the pressure, it discusses him being able to lean on the vets around him - and names Yanda and Zuttah first... but then also discusses having the team's "resident genius" right next to him on the line to help him with understanding protections and what not.

So, at least for now, that says Urschel is the 1st team LG.

[Edgar]

16 minutes ago, BOLDnPurPnBlacK said:

In the article on the home page about Stanley and handling the pressure, it discusses him being able to lean on the vets around him - and names Yanda and Zuttah first... but then also discusses having the team's "resident genius" right next to him on the line to help him with understanding protections and what not.

So, at least for now, that says Urschel is the 1st team LG.

What a tremendoucs draft pick Urschel is proving to be. Just to have a guy who can start at all three interior positions and hold his own. Well worth a fifth round selection.

[rmw10]

It sounds like Urschel is currently running with the 1st team, while Jensen is operating as the C on the 2nd team.

[LosT_in_TranSlatioN]

2 hours ago, rmw10 said:

It sounds like Urschel is currently running with the 1st team, while Jensen is operating as the C on the 2nd team.

NOOOOO! Ugh. I don't trust him to say the least. I think his depth is valuable. But not confident in his abilities as a starter

[OldToby]

Urschel looked like he was struggling at times last season. I don't know if he can consistently neutralize stronger linemen. I hope he's having a great off season, and proves me wrong. If he plays like last year though, flacco and the RBs are going to be in trouble and I see that screwing up Stanley's play as well.

  This is going to be an important year for the O line. We need a LG capable of holding his own weight and keeping pressure off Stanley, so Stanley can grow confident and mold into what we need him to become. If Urschel can be that guy, awesome, hoping that he can put that brain to use out on the field and help the oline. If for some reason Urschel can't hold his own, I'm confident in Jensen or Lewis taking over.

[GrimCoconut]

3 hours ago, LosT_in_TranSlatioN said:

NOOOOO! Ugh. I don't trust him to say the least. I think his depth is valuable. But not confident in his abilities as a starter

I don't understand your reticence. I don't think I ever heard you give me a valid reason why you dislike Urschel. It sounds like just some personal vendetta. The guy wasn't Matt Birk at center but he was good for a guy thrown in the fire and got better as the year wore on, showing improvement. 

Not sure what you want. He's not Alex Mack. 

[LosT_in_TranSlatioN]

11 minutes ago, GrimCoconut said:

I don't understand your reticence. I don't think I ever heard you give me a valid reason why you dislike Urschel. It sounds like just some personal vendetta. The guy wasn't Matt Birk at center but he was good for a guy thrown in the fire and got better as the year wore on, showing improvement. 

Not sure what you want. He's not Alex Mack. 

I just want better play. He needs to get stronger, he's already a limited athlete which is why I think guard or center is where he should be(there was someone I was discussing with it in person who wants him at RT for some reason). His technique needs improvement. Very least I will acknowledge good footwork. He showed steady improvement. I just don't think he's got talent in the long run to be a starter at guard. He's really freaking smart, but he has to get a lot stronger. Otherwise I will call it as it is. He's a great depth piece. One of the best. Can play there in a pinch and do a decent job. But not in the long term. I'd honestly rather have Jensen there. But there's a reason I don't coach in the NFL.

 

I don't expect Alex Mack. I think we are fine at center. Zuttah is a good one. But still. I don't like him at LG full time. 

Edited June 17, 2016 by LosT_in_TranSlatioN

[LosT_in_TranSlatioN]

I'm sorry Grim. If there are player the forum vastly overrates in my eyes, it's Urschel and Crockett. Urschel is really smart, but limited athletically. This makes him adequate, but only that. Unless he gets a lot stronger he's probably topped off. He's a very valuable depth piece. I think if there's a guy who could take the starting job at guard it's Jensen, but I do not trust him either. He has to earn it. I doubt it is going to be Alex Lewis. He has supposedly fared well, but next to a rookie LT, I would rather have a veteran at guard.  I hope I am wrong, but I think two rookies on the same side of the line is a recipe for disaster in the short term, hence the concern. Jensen, I'd have a little more hope, but would still be skeptical. Urschel.. Well limited athletically, not strong enough, good technical player but there are a lot of shortcomings. For an on the spot player he was decent, but overrated by many. He was very decent.  Not great, and the improvements were only slight. I feel as if he's hit his ceiling. Unless he becomes stronger. (As for Crockett I've been through this. Struggles with contested catches, soft not strong hands, not the best route runner. Good in the open field and as a blocker but honestly would not trust him if the game were on the line. Maxx I would. Strong hands). 

 

Urschel is valuable to the team. Not sure he's starting material. 

[allblackraven]

37 minutes ago, LosT_in_TranSlatioN said:

I'm sorry Grim. If there are player the forum vastly overrates in my eyes, it's Urschel and Crockett. Urschel is really smart, but limited athletically. This makes him adequate, but only that. Unless he gets a lot stronger he's probably topped off. He's a very valuable depth piece. I think if there's a guy who could take the starting job at guard it's Jensen, but I do not trust him either. He has to earn it. I doubt it is going to be Alex Lewis. He has supposedly fared well, but next to a rookie LT, I would rather have a veteran at guard.  I hope I am wrong, but I think two rookies on the same side of the line is a recipe for disaster in the short term, hence the concern. Jensen, I'd have a little more hope, but would still be skeptical. Urschel.. Well limited athletically, not strong enough, good technical player but there are a lot of shortcomings. For an on the spot player he was decent, but overrated by many. He was very decent.  Not great, and the improvements were only slight. I feel as if he's hit his ceiling. Unless he becomes stronger. (As for Crockett I've been through this. Struggles with contested catches, soft not strong hands, not the best route runner. Good in the open field and as a blocker but honestly would not trust him if the game were on the line. Maxx I would. Strong hands). 

 

Urschel is valuable to the team. Not sure he's starting material. 

How do you think Gillmore gets into open field other than good route running?

[LosT_in_TranSlatioN]

23 minutes ago, allblackraven said:

How do you think Gillmore gets into open field other than good route running?

Not the best doesn't equate to bad. He's just not good. Decent.  He wasn't even the second best TE on the roster in terms of route running. Boyle was better, and Maxx is too. Maxx wasn't better at the start of the year, but holy crap he improved immensely towards the end(something that's different between him and Urschel to stay on topic. Urschel's improvement was steady, Maxx was a lot better towards the end. Something I wish John would do/hope he does in the future).. I can name ten TEs in the NFL I'd take over Crockett. I can name 20 centers and guards I'd take over John. That's my thinking. I hope both of them prove me wrong, I'm not going to route against my team, Ive been a fan since the horrid Boller days, Ive been through a lot worse than what we are going through now, but I'm very doubtful. Now Maxx? I think Maxx is going to be great. I think Jensen has potential to be great. I just think that Crockett will never be more than a #2 TE(I mean. I'll argue towards the end of the year Maxx was a better TE. And if you ask me in limited time Jensen was better there too). 

 

Back on topic. I think Jensen is going to win the job. He's played better at LG when given the opportunity than Urschel was given. Urschel was servicable there. But Jensen was actually kind've good. I doubt his ability to keep it up an extended period of time, but Ricky Wagner proved me wrong his second season as well(and btw.. He came on again towards the end of last season. I think he's going to be fine). 

[LosT_in_TranSlatioN]

Oh.. And if you want me to. Twenty guards 

1. Yanda

2. Zack Martin

3. KO

4. TJ Lang

5.  Josh Sitton

6. Andrew Norwell

7. Trai Turner

8. Gabe Jackson

9. Alex Boone

10. John Greco

11. David DeCastro

12. La'el Collins(yes, he's already better)

13. Mike Iupati

14. Evan Mathis

15. Justin Pugh

16. Ramon Foster

17. Matt Slauson

18. Clint Bling

19. Kevin Zeither

20. Brandon Brooks

 

 

And that's off the top of my head.....

 

20 centers

1.  Travis Fredrick
2.   Nick Mangold
3.   Alex Mack
4.  Eric Wood
5.  Jason Kelce
6.   Maurkice Pouncey
7.   Mike Pouncey
8.  Rodney Hudson
9.  Ryan Kalil
10.   Max Unger
11.  Jeremy Zuttah
12.  Corey Linsley 
13.  Steven Wisniewski
14.  John Sullivan when healthy 
15.   Joe Berger was good though last year
16.  Ben Jones
17.  Weston Richburg
18.  Bryan Stork
19.  Mike Person
20. Jonathan Harrison(yes I know it's spelled differently.. Autocorrect on iPad for ya)

 

I hope that Urschel proves me wrong. But I'd honestly put Jensen above him in the guard catagory. I've never seen him lined up at center, but I can only hope Urschel is our future there. 

Edited June 17, 2016 by LosT_in_TranSlatioN

[757RavensFan]

4 hours ago, LosT_in_TranSlatioN said:

Oh.. And if you want me to. Twenty guards 

1. Yanda

2. Zack Martin

3. KO

4. TJ Lang

5.  Josh Sitton

6. Andrew Norwell

7. Trai Turner

8. Gabe Jackson

9. Alex Boone

10. John Greco

11. David DeCastro

12. La'el Collins(yes, he's already better)

13. Mike Iupati

14. Evan Mathis

15. Justin Pugh

16. Ramon Foster

17. Matt Slauson

18. Clint Bling

19. Kevin Zeither

20. Brandon Brooks

 

 

And that's off the top of my head.....

 

20 centers

1.  Travis Fredrick
2.   Nick Mangold
3.   Alex Mack
4.  Eric Wood
5.  Jason Kelce
6.   Maurkice Pouncey
7.   Mike Pouncey
8.  Rodney Hudson
9.  Ryan Kalil
10.   Max Unger
11.  Jeremy Zuttah
12.  Corey Linsley 
13.  Steven Wisniewski
14.  John Sullivan when healthy 
15.   Joe Berger was good though last year
16.  Ben Jones
17.  Weston Richburg
18.  Bryan Stork
19.  Mike Person
20. Jonathan Harrison(yes I know it's spelled differently.. Autocorrect on iPad for ya)

 

I hope that Urschel proves me wrong. But I'd honestly put Jensen above him in the guard catagory. I've never seen him lined up at center, but I can only hope Urschel is our future there.

 

How did you miss Urschel at center? That's where he played the last few games of last season after Zuttah went on IR.

Edited June 17, 2016 by 757RavensFan

[rmw10]

7 hours ago, LosT_in_TranSlatioN said:

I'm sorry Grim. If there are player the forum vastly overrates in my eyes, it's Urschel and Crockett. Urschel is really smart, but limited athletically. This makes him adequate, but only that. Unless he gets a lot stronger he's probably topped off. He's a very valuable depth piece. I think if there's a guy who could take the starting job at guard it's Jensen, but I do not trust him either. He has to earn it. I doubt it is going to be Alex Lewis. He has supposedly fared well, but next to a rookie LT, I would rather have a veteran at guard.  I hope I am wrong, but I think two rookies on the same side of the line is a recipe for disaster in the short term, hence the concern. Jensen, I'd have a little more hope, but would still be skeptical. Urschel.. Well limited athletically, not strong enough, good technical player but there are a lot of shortcomings. For an on the spot player he was decent, but overrated by many. He was very decent.  Not great, and the improvements were only slight. I feel as if he's hit his ceiling. Unless he becomes stronger. (As for Crockett I've been through this. Struggles with contested catches, soft not strong hands, not the best route runner. Good in the open field and as a blocker but honestly would not trust him if the game were on the line. Maxx I would. Strong hands). 

 

Urschel is valuable to the team. Not sure he's starting material. 

While I would agree that Urschel is overrated by many, I don't think that merits putting him down as a decent starter.  I certainly do not see him as this superstar young C like many do, but I think he could be an above average starter at G.

I will say, LiT, that you do have some irrational hate for random players lol.  I don't mean this to be harsh at all, but I think you're probably on the opposite end of the spectrum as the people that vastly overrate some guys.  In reality, the player, and Urschel in this case, is somewhere in between the varying opinions.

[jboy19]

I was hoping to see Alex Lewis step up at LG. Nothing against Urschel or Jensen, but I like Lewis's upside. I could also see him taking over for Wagner at RT if Wagner leaves next offseason. 

[LosT_in_TranSlatioN]

5 hours ago, 757RavensFan said:

How did you miss Urschel at center? That's where he played the last few games of last season after Zuttah went on IR.

Should have specified. Never seen Jensen lined up at a center. 

[LosT_in_TranSlatioN]

7 hours ago, rmw10 said:

While I would agree that Urschel is overrated by many, I don't think that merits putting him down as a decent starter.  I certainly do not see him as this superstar young C like many do, but I think he could be an above average starter at G.

I will say, LiT, that you do have some irrational hate for random players lol.  I don't mean this to be harsh at all, but I think you're probably on the opposite end of the spectrum as the people that vastly overrate some guys.  In reality, the player, and Urschel in this case, is somewhere in between the varying opinions.

Don't hate them. I'm not calling for them to be cut. I think Crockett is better than a lot of TEs in the league, but I've seen people claim he's top 10 or 15 when he's not. I'm happy we've got him, but I see him more along the lines of a very good #2 TE. 

 

Ive repeatedly said Urschel is valuable. Just as a backup or plug starter. He's very decent but I don't see his ceiling as anything higher. It's the misconceptions I hate. Not the players. They make the team better but they're far from godsends

[GrimCoconut]

8 hours ago, rmw10 said:

While I would agree that Urschel is overrated by many, I don't think that merits putting him down as a decent starter.  I certainly do not see him as this superstar young C like many do, but I think he could be an above average starter at G.

I will say, LiT, that you do have some irrational hate for random players lol.  I don't mean this to be harsh at all, but I think you're probably on the opposite end of the spectrum as the people that vastly overrate some guys.  In reality, the player, and Urschel in this case, is somewhere in between the varying opinions.

 

1 hour ago, LosT_in_TranSlatioN said:

Don't hate them. I'm not calling for them to be cut. I think Crockett is better than a lot of TEs in the league, but I've seen people claim he's top 10 or 15 when he's not. I'm happy we've got him, but I see him more along the lines of a very good #2 TE. 

 

Ive repeatedly said Urschel is valuable. Just as a backup or plug starter. He's very decent but I don't see his ceiling as anything higher. It's the misconceptions I hate. Not the players. They make the team better but they're far from godsends

The thing you have to like about Urschel is he is an ascending talent, and that's always something I love to see. You can see he is getting better and better. I don't see him taking steps back, he just continues to go forward and is becoming a better player. That's what I look for in evaluating players. A good example is Brandon Williams, who also constantly improved every year he was here and now look at him. I'm not sure Urschel is some killer at center, but you can see the talent to become a top-10 player. It is certainly there that he could become that guy, although saying he will is tough to swallow. 

As for Gillmore, who would you put above him? I mean, Heath Miller retired. Dennis Pitta is getting up there and we have no idea if he will ever be the same guy and even then he wasn't exactly the best TE in the league when he was playing. There are plenty of other TEs, but a lot of them at JAG, blocking specialists, or made of glass. Granted, Gillmore has injury issues as well, but your statement that he isn't a top-15 TE is a bit hard to agree with. I don't think I can say he is top-10, that seems a bit high, but he could arguably be top-15. 

[Willbacker]

Imo Jensen will end up being the starter at LG. They just looking at him at C cuz Urschel having multiple bad snaps last year. If Zuttah go down with injury maybe they'd slide Jensen over to C and bring Urschel in as LG. Jensen played lights out at the end of the season.

[The Raven]

I liked Urschel a lot at RG, but not so much at center. At guard, he was fast and physical. At center, he looked a lot less physical. I believe in him at LG. I love Jensen, but I want to see what Urschel can do there.

[harfordravenfan]

19 hours ago, LosT_in_TranSlatioN said:

Not the best doesn't equate to bad. He's just not good. Decent.  He wasn't even the second best TE on the roster in terms of route running. Boyle was better, and Maxx is too. Maxx wasn't better at the start of the year, but holy crap he improved immensely towards the end(something that's different between him and Urschel to stay on topic. Urschel's improvement was steady, Maxx was a lot better towards the end. Something I wish John would do/hope he does in the future).. I can name ten TEs in the NFL I'd take over Crockett. I can name 20 centers and guards I'd take over John. That's my thinking. I hope both of them prove me wrong, I'm not going to route against my team, Ive been a fan since the horrid Boller days, Ive been through a lot worse than what we are going through now, but I'm very doubtful. Now Maxx? I think Maxx is going to be great. I think Jensen has potential to be great. I just think that Crockett will never be more than a #2 TE(I mean. I'll argue towards the end of the year Maxx was a better TE. And if you ask me in limited time Jensen was better there too). 

 

Back on topic. I think Jensen is going to win the job. He's played better at LG when given the opportunity than Urschel was given. Urschel was servicable there. But Jensen was actually kind've good. I doubt his ability to keep it up an extended period of time, but Ricky Wagner proved me wrong his second season as well(and btw.. He came on again towards the end of last season. I think he's going to be fine). 

Got both Maxx and Jensen on my mock team so I pretty much agree with everything 

[harfordravenfan]

4 hours ago, GrimCoconut said:

 

The thing you have to like about Urschel is he is an ascending talent, and that's always something I love to see. You can see he is getting better and better. I don't see him taking steps back, he just continues to go forward and is becoming a better player. That's what I look for in evaluating players. A good example is Brandon Williams, who also constantly improved every year he was here and now look at him. I'm not sure Urschel is some killer at center, but you can see the talent to become a top-10 player. It is certainly there that he could become that guy, although saying he will is tough to swallow. 

As for Gillmore, who would you put above him? I mean, Heath Miller retired. Dennis Pitta is getting up there and we have no idea if he will ever be the same guy and even then he wasn't exactly the best TE in the league when he was playing. There are plenty of other TEs, but a lot of them at JAG, blocking specialists, or made of glass. Granted, Gillmore has injury issues as well, but your statement that he isn't a top-15 TE is a bit hard to agree with. I don't think I can say he is top-10, that seems a bit high, but he could arguably be top-15. 

Granted it was bleacher report but here's how they had our te's listed for last year

Gilmore 12th

Maxx.     13th

Boyle.      36th

Watson.   48th 

[ALPHA]

Urschel looked good to me in limited snaps, but then again so did Geno Gradkowski so it still remains to be seen what kind of center he can be, is he a backup or a starter?

[trevorsteadman]

44 minutes ago, harfordravenfan said:

Granted it was bleacher report but here's how they had our te's listed for last year

Gilmore 12th

Maxx.     13th

Boyle.      36th

Watson.   48th 

Insane to think that Watson was probably a top 5 tight end last season when you talk about production. A bunch of young guys with talent for sure.

[LosT_in_TranSlatioN]

1 hour ago, harfordravenfan said:

Got both Maxx and Jensen on my mock team so I pretty much agree with everything 

You took Maxx from me so I hate you

[Winchester]

By weeks16-17 Urschel was playing very well at center once he adjusted to the snap. Harbs repeatedly talked how impressed he was with Urschels physicality. And Urschel put on about 10-12lbs of muscle this offseason but his play weight remains about 318 which means he leaned out as well. I like Urschel at center and he is an ascending talent. I'm confident he will be a top10 center by playoff time once he completes his aclimation there. Urschel was already a pretty strong player and now he tacked on 10-12lbs of muscle!! Urschel is an extremely hard worker in the gym and practice. If he plays center all year I would bet money with odds he is top10 by playoff time. Jensen I would bet on being a top10 guard by playoff time. He is quite a specimen. He is naturally country strong and as athletic as some left tackles. He looked more impressive than Yanda in the steeler and Cincy games. And graded VERY well in those games. Actually Urschel and Jensen are very strong and athletic specimens. And work very fanatically on their techniques. Wagner tacked on muscle and leaned out as well. If he returns to top form he could be even better than 2014. If Ron Stanley works on tacking on muscle as hard as his teammates and gets even a little stronger he should be one of the better tackles by playoff times. Thus the oline should be very dominant by playoff time fronting Stanley Jensen Urschel Yanda Wagner. Jensen and Urschels best football is in front of them. Urschel and Jensen are stronger more athletic specimens than most of those top guards and centers listed in this thread. The only guard outside the top 6 in that list I would take in front of Jensen at guard is Collins. And Urschel will be a top 10 center at least by playoff time.

[harfordravenfan]

1 hour ago, trevorsteadman said:

Insane to think that Watson was probably a top 5 tight end last season when you talk about production. A bunch of young guys with talent for sure.

After seeing Watson that low, only reason I kept reading was curiosity but oddly enough Gilmore was between top 10-15 like guys above was saying 

[harfordravenfan]

44 minutes ago, LosT_in_TranSlatioN said:

You took Maxx from me so I hate you

Don't hate the player lost

We'll call it a rookie mistake. ?

[harfordravenfan]

2 hours ago, ALPHA said:

Urschel looked good to me in limited snaps, but then again so did Geno Gradkowski so it still remains to be seen what kind of center he can be, is he a backup or a starter?

Zuttah is taking 1st team reps but I do think urschel can develop into a quality center 

[52liveforever]

Personally I don't get why everyone is in such s hurry to rush Zuttah out of his spot. He's the best we have had since Birk. Urschel is NOT a center. He's a. Exceptional guard that I think can be a starter, but he just did not look good at center.