Welcome to Baltimore, Tavon Young and Chris Moore, Round 4

[ellicottraven]

1 hour ago, elemento said:

 

So what ? It's just an opinion from someone that watches and likes football like everyone else here. You don't need to say amen to everything that the FO does just to get "likes" in the forum. I liked all the picks from the Ravens draft, except for those 2. Personal opinion, nothing else. 

I don't even know why some fellows get so defensive when people criticize one or two choices from the draft seriously. And those guys that watch tape and scout for living though it was a good idea to spend a 1st round pick on Matt Elam. So?  It means nothing other than the fact that people can make mistakes, even smart/hard-working ones. 

 

 

First of all I don't remember getting too many likes in the forum and second of all I wasn't criticizing you or for that matter being defensive ( about what btw) about a decision that wasn't mine to make! Thirdly, it seems from your response that you are the one being defensive and feeling attacked. I didn't attack you personally but just made a statement of fact regarding our front office and scouts.

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

1 hour ago, elemento said:

 

So what ? It's just an opinion from someone that watches and likes football like everyone else here. You don't need to say amen to everything that the FO does just to get "likes" in the forum. I liked all the picks from the Ravens draft, except for those 2. Personal opinion, nothing else. 

I don't even know why some fellows get so defensive when people criticize one or two choices from the draft seriously. And those guys that watch tape and scout for living though it was a good idea to spend a 1st round pick on Matt Elam. So?  It means nothing other than the fact that people can make mistakes, even smart/hard-working ones. 

 

 

No one here is posting for likes... including ellicottraven. Don't see where you even got that from; and its not blindly backing the FO considering his first statement was directed toward the national and local media, who a good majority are applauding the draft, especially the 4th round.

Tavon plays much bigger than his size indicates and weve had serious trouble in the past with covering small, shifty slot receivers like Edelman. If his only contribution this year is to rotate in and cover guys like that, and hes able to do it then its a great pick imo. Bc that could be the difference between beating a team like the Patriots and not. He's aggressive, attacks the ball, and has very good ball skils. For a 4th round pick theres a lot of upside - and what more can you really ask for at that point?

Short corner can excel anywhere especially in press man coverage... and Tavon is extremely physical and plays much bigger than his size.

I know everyone wants big corners.... but I'm sure you'll be surprised as to how many good, shorter corners there are in the NFL. All of the following are 5'9"-5'10.5" -  Revis, Vontae Davis, Chris Harris jr., Joe Haden, Bradley Roby, Malcolm Butler, Ronald Darby, Brandon Flowers, Brent Grimes, DeAngelo Hall, Kareem Jackson, Janoris Jenkins, Pacman Jones, Jonathan Joseph, Captain Munnerlyn,  Terrance Newman, and Alterraun Verner,

Chris Harris, Flowers, Grimes, Hall, Munnerlyn and I believe Verner are all 5'9". Stupid to write corners off bc of their size.

[JoeyFlex5]

@bold thank you! Big corners are so overrated. Bigger guys almost always have stiff hips, slow take off, they struggle to run full speed with their head turned, and they have a harder time turning around to play the ball at high speed. You have Patrick Peterson and Richard Sherman who are the exception and not the norm, and even those guys are vastly overrated in coverage. The best cover guys are 5'10"

 

 

[usmccharles]

10 minutes ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

@bold thank you! Big corners are so overrated. Bigger guys almost always have stiff hips, slow take off, they struggle to run full speed with their head turned, and they have a harder time turning around to play the ball at high speed. You have Patrick Peterson and Richard Sherman who are the exception and not the norm, and even those guys are vastly overrated in coverage. The best cover guys are 5'10"

And honestly, the way offenses are going, big WRs are being overrated imo. 

[rmw10]

9 minutes ago, usmccharles said:

And honestly, the way offenses are going, big WRs are being overrated imo. 

Yep. Explosion is key. Some guys are lucky enough to have both explosion and size, and that's where the strong desire for big WRs comes from, I believe. 

[usmccharles]

1 minute ago, rmw10 said:

Yep. Explosion is key. Some guys are lucky enough to have both explosion and size, and that's where the strong desire for big WRs comes from, I believe. 

Agreed.  The big WR definitely looks the part, but doesn't mean anything

[baltimorefan328]

I'll preface this by saying I haven't watched any full game tape or done extensive analysis, but I'm starting to like this Moore pick moore and moore the more I read about him.  Can't speak to the reliability of the source, but here is a pretty in depth breakdown of him: http://nfldraftreport.sportsblog.com/posts/11513382/cincinnati-s-chris-moore-catching-lots-of-attention-at-the-senior-bowl.html.

There are three main reasons I like him from watching a little bit of him: He catches the ball with his hands; he high points the ball; and he makes catches in the red zone, something the offense could use desperately. He seemed to play best against his best competition. I'm not saying he is a day 1 stud, but he seems to have all the skills to become something more than just a deep threat #4 WR.

[elemento]

10 hours ago, ellicottraven said:

First of all I don't remember getting too many likes in the forum and second of all I wasn't criticizing you or for that matter being defensive ( about what btw) about a decision that wasn't mine to make! Thirdly, it seems from your response that you are the one being defensive and feeling attacked. I didn't attack you personally but just made a statement of fact regarding our front office and scouts.

Fair enough Ravens fellow. No reason to argue here. 

I'm not as high as some of you guys about both picks. It's a matter of agreeing to disagree. Said that, I hope that both of them prove me wrong. 

[808Blackbirds]

Anyone know why Kenny Lawler Fell to the 7th round?

[elemento]

29 minutes ago, 808Blackbirds said:

Anyone know why Kenny Lawler Fell to the 7th round?

I was surprised too. I thought the Rams would take him in the 4th or 5th to pair with Goff

I was more surprised about Scooby Wright. This dude looks like a stud on tape, despite his average measurables (small and average athleticism). Reminds me Chris Borland a bit. 

[JoeyFlex5]

10 hours ago, elemento said:

I was surprised too. I thought the Rams would take him in the 4th or 5th to pair with Goff

I was more surprised about Scooby Wright. This dude looks like a stud on tape, despite his average measurables (small and average athleticism). Reminds me Chris Borland a bit. 

Scooby doesn't just have average measurables, he doesn't have the minimum athleticism required in the NFL. He's extremely stiff, slow, and musclebound, with very short arms, slow takeoff, and takes bad angles. In college he is often caught chasing down guys from behind and barely making the tackle because he was too slow to meet them at the point of attack and he made the wrong angle, he will get roasted in the NFL like that.

[FreckleNate]

Very excited about the Young pick, the man plays like a Raven and I love it. And as a University of Cincinnati student I am very very excited to see what Chris Moore can do as a Ravens!

[JoeyFlex5]

Scouting reports on moore says he runs solid routes... But I don't see it. Maybe it's just how they used him? One thing I did notice is that he can climb the ladder and catch a contested ball better than any wr we have ever drafted. I'm excited about his potential

[Edgar]

I don't really get the torrey comp.

[RaineV1]

1 hour ago, Edgar said:

I don't really get the torrey comp.

Because a lot of the knocks on him have been the same ones on Torrey. That his speed is straight line rather than being able to have sudden cuts, his hands are iffy, and his route running is suspect. He was also used similar to the way Torrey was used, and he's about the same size. The real difference between the two that I can see is that Moore is more aggressive is going after the ball.

[JoeyFlex5]

1 hour ago, Edgar said:

I don't really get the torrey comp.

Any deep specialist or burner that goes to the ravens will get a torrey comparison. That is the comparison.

[allblackraven]

1 minute ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

Any deep specialist or burner that goes to the ravens will get a torrey comparison. That is the comparison.

But Moore isn't exactly the burner like Torrey. He does it different.

[JoeyFlex5]

28 minutes ago, allblackraven said:

But Moore isn't exactly the burner like Torrey. He does it different.

He's a deep specialist not a burner. I was subtly referring to the perriman-torrey comps last year even though those are way off base as well.

[allblackraven]

8 minutes ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

He's a deep specialist not a burner. I was subtly referring to the perriman-torrey comps last year even though those are way off base as well.

[sflegend89]

Moore is intriguing, not as fast as Torrey but he makes contested catches better and tracks the ball better than Torrey did coming out. I also think Moore plays faster than his 4.5 time in games, one of the big reasons that the 40 is the most overrated stat in prospect scouting, you have to watch the game tape to truly assess speed. I think he'll end up being kind of what Markus Wheeton is to the Squeelers, it will take Moore a few years to catch on but he'll end up being a #3 guy who can make some plays intermediate-deep.

[ludy51]

6 hours ago, allblackraven said:

No joke ever goes over my head. I would catch it.

[usmccharles]

13 minutes ago, ludy51 said:

No joke ever goes over my head. I would catch it.

Guardians of the Galaxy?

[Edgar]

8 hours ago, RaineV1 said:

Because a lot of the knocks on him have been the same ones on Torrey. That his speed is straight line rather than being able to have sudden cuts, his hands are iffy, and his route running is suspect. He was also used similar to the way Torrey was used, and he's about the same size. The real difference between the two that I can see is that Moore is more aggressive is going after the ball.

I'd hate to think DeCosta compared him to Torrey on the basis of his negatives.

I don't see them as even the same body type.Moores speed is somewhat deceptive...a bit of a long striding speed.  Moore, at least in college is used more underneath and across the middle.  he can box guys out and as you said, will go up and get it...I don't know but I think he might offer a lot more than torrey ultimately.

 

[ludy51]

35 minutes ago, usmccharles said:

Guardians of the Galaxy?

yup

[usmccharles]

Just now, ludy51 said:

yup

Batista was awesome in that. 

[berad]

10 hours ago, Edgar said:

I don't really get the torrey comp.

DeCosta brushes on the Torrey comparison and other positives for Moore (and basically the rest of the late round prospects) in this interview

 

Around 4:15 is the Moore segment

[Edgar]

Moore will have to show he can beat press man. Didn't see it at Cincinnati.

[Edgar]

20 minutes ago, berad said:

DeCosta brushes on the Torrey comparison and other positives for Moore (and basically the rest of the late round prospects) in this interview

 

Around 4:15 is the Moore segment

Thanks for posting this.

[Static]

Tavon Young has my favorite tape out of all the prospects.

[arnie_uk]

On 03/05/2016 at 0:12 AM, ellicottraven said:

Well most of the guys that watch tape and scout for a living seem to think otherwise. If that isn't enough for you, the venerable Ravens front office thought he wouldn't have lasted through the end of the round. The main reason they took him when they took him.

The same people that thought Upshaw would be a top pass rusher? Everyone gets picks wrong and everyone is entitled to their opinion on this board.