[News] Late For Work 2/26: Ravens Shock Media, Details Of Kelechi Osemele Offer

[BR News]

Osemele decision will have MAJOR ripple effect. No Suggs hometown discount. No downside to Richardson.

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[WNC-Raven]

While I hope I am wrong, I have given up on the common sense approach when it comes to player contracts. Sure it makes sense for Flacco to want to work with us as soon as possible to allow OZ to build a strong team around him. It will be a looong couple of years for Joe with no open targets and no time to throw. Sure it makes sense for KO to want to return to the place that drafted him. The Ravens would be more patient with his transition to LT if that is what happens. A new team paying top LT $$ would add a lot of pressure to a player who has said in the past that he would prefer to stay at G. All of this makes sense on paper but as I have watched time and time again all that seems to matter is the money. I dont expect this time to be any different. Best news of the year would be if KO stays a Raven!

[bioLarzen]

KO's offer and the expected rework of Flacco's deal cannot possibly be connected: KO's offer has been made already, while the Flacco-talks haven't even begun. So, the possible extra cap space gained by the reworked Flacco-deal cannot be the base of the KO-offer. No sane GM would take such an extra cap-space for granted until the contract is signed and sealed.

TBH, I cannot comprehend how any kind of serious offer to KO could be possible - I mean one that would even make KO think about it seriously. Seriously baffling. If the offer was, indeed, anywhere close to competitive and KO accepts it - which is, although improbable, Ozzie cannot afford to disregard as a possibility - the Flacco deal will have to be redone, the "going on with Joe's current cap figure" will no longer be a bossible, let alone a viable option.

Well, I guess that's why I'm not the Ravens' GM and Ozzie is :)

[MKM3917]

KO's offer and the expected rework of Flacco's deal cannot possibly be connected: KO's offer has been made already, while the Flacco-talks haven't even begun. So, the possible extra cap space gained by the reworked Flacco-deal cannot be the base of the KO-offer. No sane GM would take such an extra cap-space for granted until the contract is signed and sealed.

TBH, I cannot comprehend how any kind of serious offer to KO could be possible - I mean one that would even make KO think about it seriously. Seriously baffling. If the offer was, indeed, anywhere close to competitive and KO accepts it - which is, although improbable, Ozzie cannot afford to disregard as a possibility - the Flacco deal will have to be redone, the "going on with Joe's current cap figure" will no longer be a bossible, let alone a viable option.

Well, I guess that's why I'm not the Ravens' GM and Ozzie is :)

Since it is before the new league year starts, they don't have to be under the cap yet, so a deal with KO could happen. If he agrees and the Flacco contract doesn't get extended or redone, they still would have time to make other cuts and adjustments before needing to be under the cap.

[bioLarzen]

  4 minutes ago, bioLarzen said:

KO's offer and the expected rework of Flacco's deal cannot possibly be connected: KO's offer has been made already, while the Flacco-talks haven't even begun. So, the possible extra cap space gained by the reworked Flacco-deal cannot be the base of the KO-offer. No sane GM would take such an extra cap-space for granted until the contract is signed and sealed.

TBH, I cannot comprehend how any kind of serious offer to KO could be possible - I mean one that would even make KO think about it seriously. Seriously baffling. If the offer was, indeed, anywhere close to competitive and KO accepts it - which is, although improbable, Ozzie cannot afford to disregard as a possibility - the Flacco deal will have to be redone, the "going on with Joe's current cap figure" will no longer be a bossible, let alone a viable option.

Well, I guess that's why I'm not the Ravens' GM and Ozzie is :)

Since it is before the new league year starts, they don't have to be under the cap yet, so a deal with KO could happen. If he agrees and the Flacco contract doesn't get extended or redone, they still would have time to make other cuts and adjustments before needing to be under the cap.

True, but as I recall, Ozzie doesn't go beyond the cap limit even this way if he can avoid that. And with Tucker currently at tag figure, the picture is even murkier.

Just imagine: if KO accepts the offer and the Flacco-/Tucker-talks break down, Ozzie will have a HUGE problem in his hands, which can only possibly be solved by getting rid of several key players...

[budman]

It might be fair to say to watch out for some BIG shocking moves if KO stays. I am only guessing but it might have to mean that some players that you thought might not be cut or traded, just might be that. Would they really entertain a Suggs trade? Will Forsett be here? I myself am getting ready for just about anything. Go Oz work some magic!

[billiejean]

I feel like signing Osemele to big left tackle money is a huge gamble. Yea, he played there for four games last season but his play was average at best. The guys kick slides are stiff and look far from natural. He was also was susceptible to the inside move because he let defenders cross his face. It is possible with more time at the position that he will get better at these things, but it is big risk. I am just hoping he can live up to the contract (if he signs) and we don't have any buyers remorse like we do with Webb, Smith, and Monroe.

[WNC-Raven]

I think it would be best to prepare yourself for some BIG shocking moves even if KO leaves. We have a logjam at RB and safety so Forsett is not a definite and where does Webb fit in with so many other mediocre safetys on the roster already?

[757RavensFan]

I think KO's decision will come down to the signing bonus.  Based off what I've read,  there's probably a difference of max $2M p/year in what he can get on the open market vs our "aggressive deal".  The signing bonus and guaranteed money is what is going to make KO stay or go.  

[757RavensFan]

20 minutes ago, billiejean said:

I feel like signing Osemele to big left tackle money is a huge gamble. Yea, he played there for four games last season but his play was average at best. The guys kick slides are stiff and look far from natural. He was also was susceptible to the inside move because he let defenders cross his face. It is possible with more time at the position that he will get better at these things, but it is big risk. I am just hoping he can live up to the contract (if he signs) and we don't have any buyers remorse like we do with Webb, Smith, and Monroe.

Keep in mind that KO played LT vs four VERY good defenses, (Seahawks, Chiefs, Steelers, and Bengals).  For someone who trained the entire off-season and practiced during the season as a guard, he did a heck of a job at LT those 4 games.  I think an entire off-season dedicated towards playing LT will do wonders for KO.

Edited February 26, 2016 by 757RavensFan

[ellicottraven]

The word Sizzle and cut shouldn’t be uttered in the same sentence on any Ravens site period. He is the single most important player on our team.

[Space11jams]

I feel like signing Osemele to big left tackle money is a huge gamble. Yea, he played there for four games last season but his play was average at best. The guys kick slides are stiff and look far from natural. He was also was susceptible to the inside move because he let defenders cross his face. It is possible with more time at the position that he will get better at these things, but it is big risk. I am just hoping he can live up to the contract (if he signs) and we don't have any buyers remorse like we do with Webb, Smith, and Monroe.

Which Smith are your talking about?

[billiejean]

  25 minutes ago, billiejean said:

I feel like signing Osemele to big left tackle money is a huge gamble. Yea, he played there for four games last season but his play was average at best. The guys kick slides are stiff and look far from natural. He was also was susceptible to the inside move because he let defenders cross his face. It is possible with more time at the position that he will get better at these things, but it is big risk. I am just hoping he can live up to the contract (if he signs) and we don't have any buyers remorse like we do with Webb, Smith, and Monroe.

Which Smith are your talking about?

the only one who hasn't lived up to his contract so far... Jimmy

[fusuymada]

  20 minutes ago, billiejean said:

I feel like signing Osemele to big left tackle money is a huge gamble. Yea, he played there for four games last season but his play was average at best. The guys kick slides are stiff and look far from natural. He was also was susceptible to the inside move because he let defenders cross his face. It is possible with more time at the position that he will get better at these things, but it is big risk. I am just hoping he can live up to the contract (if he signs) and we don't have any buyers remorse like we do with Webb, Smith, and Monroe.

Keep in mind that KO played LT vs four VERY good defenses, (Seahawks, Chiefs, Steelers, and Bengals).  For someone who trained the entire off-season and practiced during the season as a guard, he did a heck of a job.  I think an entire off-season dedicating towards playing LT will do wonders for KO.

KO played tackle at Iowa as well so its not like it is a completely unfamiliar position so the strategy and techniques to play the position are not lost on him. If you go back and look at the tape, not only did he play well, he dominated and did so quite easily. He rarely struggled with some of the strongest pass rushers in the NFL. Clearly, the Ravens staff, who is trained to see exactly what I saw, made a choice based on that analysis and they know far more than me or 99% of the people who comment here. If Ozzie thinks he can do it based on his history and what he saw in those 4 games, then I think he can do it. In OZZIE I trust.

[The Greek]

the excitement/drama slowly begins

[Bat-mite]

1 minute ago, The Greek said:

the excitement/drama slowly begins

And we have to get through six months of it before anyone takes the field.  <sigh>

[budman]

41 minutes ago, billiejean said:

I feel like signing Osemele to big left tackle money is a huge gamble. Yea, he played there for four games last season but his play was average at best. The guys kick slides are stiff and look far from natural. He was also was susceptible to the inside move because he let defenders cross his face. It is possible with more time at the position that he will get better at these things, but it is big risk. I am just hoping he can live up to the contract (if he signs) and we don't have any buyers remorse like we do with Webb, Smith, and Monroe.

He did only play 4 games at Lt but he did play there in college. It was expected for him  to play "just average". Just imagine how he will be with all mini and training camp and practices. He will be a beast there as he was at guard IMO. Either way I just don't see keeping him a gamble.

[billiejean]

1 hour ago, fusuymada said:

1 hour ago, 757RavensFan said:

  32 minutes ago, billiejean said:

I feel like signing Osemele to big left tackle money is a huge gamble. Yea, he played there for four games last season but his play was average at best. The guys kick slides are stiff and look far from natural. He was also was susceptible to the inside move because he let defenders cross his face. It is possible with more time at the position that he will get better at these things, but it is big risk. I am just hoping he can live up to the contract (if he signs) and we don't have any buyers remorse like we do with Webb, Smith, and Monroe.

Keep in mind that KO played LT vs four VERY good defenses, (Seahawks, Chiefs, Steelers, and Bengals).  For someone who trained the entire off-season and practiced during the season as a guard, he did a heck of a job.  I think an entire off-season dedicating towards playing LT will do wonders for KO.

KO played tackle at Iowa as well so its not like it is a completely unfamiliar position so the strategy and techniques to play the position are not lost on him. If you go back and look at the tape, not only did he play well, he dominated and did so quite easily. He rarely struggled with some of the strongest pass rushers in the NFL. Clearly, the Ravens staff, who is trained to see exactly what I saw, made a choice based on that analysis and they know far more than me or 99% of the people who comment here. If Ozzie thinks he can do it based on his history and what he saw in those 4 games, then I think he can do it. In OZZIE I trust.

Easily is quite a stretch, but he did dominate at times, especially in the run game.

The vine in the article below is an example of KO letting James Harrison cross his face on an inside move.  He almost gave up the sack.  Im not saying that this is what happens every time someone crosses his face, but I did see it on multiple occasions (certainly something that can be fixed though)

http://www.baltimoreravens.com/news/article-1/Late-For-Work-1228-Snoop-Dogg--Internet-React-To-Ravens-Shocking-Upset-Over-Steelers/35ce4a92-8753-49ad-906e-39b51720f3b2

The second gif in the article below shows his somewhat mechanical, stiff movements in the kick slide.  In his defense he blocked his guy.  It just didn't look as smooth (almost forced) as most left tackles in the league.  To be fair, i just realized that this clip is from the first game that he played at left tackle.  I did take a look at some tape from the Cincy game and he really did improve this aspect of his game (still a bit stiff but its not as if he couldn't get the job done).  Im sure the guy will be working on his footwork all offseason and will come back much improved.

http://www.baltimoreravens.com/news/article-1/What-You-Missed-vs-Seahawks/3eb1346a-4b4e-499a-bd68-a10804e808ef

Edited February 26, 2016 by billiejean

[billiejean]

41 minutes ago, budman said:

1 hour ago, billiejean said:

I feel like signing Osemele to big left tackle money is a huge gamble. Yea, he played there for four games last season but his play was average at best. The guys kick slides are stiff and look far from natural. He was also was susceptible to the inside move because he let defenders cross his face. It is possible with more time at the position that he will get better at these things, but it is big risk. I am just hoping he can live up to the contract (if he signs) and we don't have any buyers remorse like we do with Webb, Smith, and Monroe.

He did only play 4 games at Lt but he did play there in college. It was expected for him  to play "just average". Just imagine how he will be with all mini and training camp and practices. He will be a beast there as he was at guard IMO. Either way I just don't see keeping him a gamble.

Well nobody thought that signing Webb was a gamble either. Really anytime you sign a player to a long term deal with a lot of guaranteed money, it is a gamble. But it is especially so if a guy you're giving left tackle money to has only played four games at left tackle in his entire career. And yes he did play there in college but the speed of the game is much higher in the NFL especially at the pass rusher position. Im not saying the guy can't do it. Its just that it is a bit of a risk. What he does have going for him though that has nothing to do with his physicality is that he is extremely intelligent, not Urchel intelligent, but smart enough to know what he's got to do to be successful.

Edited February 26, 2016 by billiejean

[BigUgly]

KO did well at LT for 4 games...but those games were not against teams with elite edge rushers.  If he can play LT at top-5 Guard money, that would be a bargain, though.  At least he won't get bull-rushed and chucked into Flack's knee like Hurst, or be lazing away on the trainer's table like Monroe.

[trevorsteadman]

Osemele has past injuries as well.. But he has higher upside and more versatility than Monroe. I don't know why people are confused about this I saw this coming a mile away. Osemele is a huge part of our offense... Him and Yanda are by far the best guard tandem in the league. I know people are saying Urschel can step in for him and stuff and yes he could but that would mean Monroe would have to stay healthy. There was a report saying Osemele wasn't dedicated to football enough.... I think that was bull, and on the flip side Urschel out of everybody in the NFL I could see retire tomorrow to avoid head injuries because of his math career and education. Let's say Osemele walked and Urschel got hurt or retired where would our guards be then? Not in a good situation....

Also I love the Trent Richardson signing. He went high in the draft for a reason. He has the physical attributes and he can play.. He just needs more focus and dedication to football. I wouldn't be surprised if he ended up having a huge role in our offense next season and revive his career. High upside there and hopefully that one year out of football helped him focus back on the game.

[bioLarzen]

"ESPN's Jeremy Fowler reports the "buzz" at the Combine is free agent G/T Kelechi Osemele is "looking at" $10 million-plus per year." (rotoworld.com)

That's no lunch money...

[bioLarzen]

19 hours ago, billiejean said:

19 hours ago, Space11jams said:

  1 hour ago, billiejean said:

I feel like signing Osemele to big left tackle money is a huge gamble. Yea, he played there for four games last season but his play was average at best. The guys kick slides are stiff and look far from natural. He was also was susceptible to the inside move because he let defenders cross his face. It is possible with more time at the position that he will get better at these things, but it is big risk. I am just hoping he can live up to the contract (if he signs) and we don't have any buyers remorse like we do with Webb, Smith, and Monroe.

Which Smith are your talking about?

the only one who hasn't lived up to his contract so far... Jimmy

Pardon me? Jimmy is steadily developing into one of the best corners in the league...

[budman]

25 minutes ago, billiejean said:

Well nobody thought that signing Web was a gamble either. Really anytime you sign a player to a long term deal with a lot of guaranteed money it is a gamble. But it is especially so if a guy your giving left tackle money to has only played four games at left tackle in his entire career. And yes he did play there in college but the speed of the game is much higher in the NFL especially at the pass rusher position. Im not saying the guy can't do it. Its just that it is a bit of a risk. What he does have going for him though that has nothing to do with his physicality is that he is extremely intelligent, not Urchel intelligent, but smart enough to know what he's got to do to be successful.

With that logic, then every player is a gamble right? Which is actually very true. There are no crystal balls.

[Halshayeji]

  42 minutes ago, MKM3917 said:

  46 minutes ago, bioLarzen said:

KO's offer and the expected rework of Flacco's deal cannot possibly be connected: KO's offer has been made already, while the Flacco-talks haven't even begun. So, the possible extra cap space gained by the reworked Flacco-deal cannot be the base of the KO-offer. No sane GM would take such an extra cap-space for granted until the contract is signed and sealed.

TBH, I cannot comprehend how any kind of serious offer to KO could be possible - I mean one that would even make KO think about it seriously. Seriously baffling. If the offer was, indeed, anywhere close to competitive and KO accepts it - which is, although improbable, Ozzie cannot afford to disregard as a possibility - the Flacco deal will have to be redone, the "going on with Joe's current cap figure" will no longer be a bossible, let alone a viable option.

Well, I guess that's why I'm not the Ravens' GM and Ozzie is :)

Since it is before the new league year starts, they don't have to be under the cap yet, so a deal with KO could happen. If he agrees and the Flacco contract doesn't get extended or redone, they still would have time to make other cuts and adjustments before needing to be under the cap.

True, but as I recall, Ozzie doesn't go beyond the cap limit even this way if he can avoid that. And with Tucker currently at tag figure, the picture is even murkier.

Just imagine: if KO accepts the offer and the Flacco-/Tucker-talks break down, Ozzie will have a HUGE problem in his hands, which can only possibly be solved by getting rid of several key players...

I think some players on this squad are as good as gone. It's just a matter of when they are released. When it comes to KOs contract. I don't expect to see a huge cap hit this year because of the nice signing bonus he'll earn.

Iv bee saying for months that we indeed have a lot more flexibility this year than we did in the past 3. Oh and I got torched by some for stating what I believed was the obvious. We will have more next year. I see the light in the tunnel and expect nothing less than another run at the super bowl.

[billiejean]

18 hours ago, bioLarzen said:

19 hours ago, billiejean said:

  1 hour ago, Space11jams said:

  1 hour ago, billiejean said:

I feel like signing Osemele to big left tackle money is a huge gamble. Yea, he played there for four games last season but his play was average at best. The guys kick slides are stiff and look far from natural. He was also was susceptible to the inside move because he let defenders cross his face. It is possible with more time at the position that he will get better at these things, but it is big risk. I am just hoping he can live up to the contract (if he signs) and we don't have any buyers remorse like we do with Webb, Smith, and Monroe.

Which Smith are your talking about?

the only one who hasn't lived up to his contract so far... Jimmy

Pardon me? Jimmy is steadily developing into one of the best corners in the league...

hey, I hope you're right and he does become one of the best corners. It is just that last year he regressed which isn't a good thing. Surely he was hampered by an injury but he regressed none the less. His injury history is also pretty concerning. Hopefully he has an injury free offseason and comes back better than ever.

[merryjman]

2 hours ago, bioLarzen said:

KO's offer and the expected rework of Flacco's deal cannot possibly be connected: KO's offer has been made already, while the Flacco-talks haven't even begun. So, the possible extra cap space gained by the reworked Flacco-deal cannot be the base of the KO-offer. No sane GM would take such an extra cap-space for granted until the contract is signed and sealed.

TBH, I cannot comprehend how any kind of serious offer to KO could be possible - I mean one that would even make KO think about it seriously. Seriously baffling. If the offer was, indeed, anywhere close to competitive and KO accepts it - which is, although improbable, Ozzie cannot afford to disregard as a possibility - the Flacco deal will have to be redone, the "going on with Joe's current cap figure" will no longer be a bossible, let alone a viable option.

Well, I guess that's why I'm not the Ravens' GM and Ozzie is

I think that this offer to KO is definitely connected to the Flacco negotiations. They're essentially telling Linta that he's being held to his comment in 2013 that Flacco's was essentially a 3-year contract, because if KO accepts their offer they will not be able to pay Flacco at his current cap hit. Which is smart, because Flacco is not worth a $29M cap hit. So it's a way to insert some leverage into a place where they had very little - the only leverage they really had before is that Joe's injury  status is a big question mark. And it makes Ozzie's remark (that they're going to make moves regardless of Flacco's status) truthful; i.e. Ozzie is putting his money where his mouth is.

Plus, if the Flacco negotiations fail, it would be better to know that before the draft. It's not like Ozzie would be afraid of losing Flacco - he won a super bowl with Dilfer, after all.

Besides which, KO is a monster and the Ravens would be fools to let him go without at least an offer. And I think what Harbaugh said about it is good: the Ravens have a certain atmosphere and mentality that KO is a part of and buys into, and if he's willing to stay in that environment for a little less money - like Yanda did - that's a win.

Edited February 26, 2016 by merryjman

[harfordravenfan]

29 minutes ago, bioLarzen said:

"ESPN's Jeremy Fowler reports the "buzz" at the Combine is free agent G/T Kelechi Osemele is "looking at" $10 million-plus per year." (rotoworld.com)

That's no lunch money...

Seems high, what's that in terms of guard/tackle deals? Seems like at least top 10 Lt money (but just a guess)

[RavensDieHard21]

With the carryover cap, you can certainly tell which teams are not doing well lol or at least haven't inked a franchise QB to their big deal. I mean come on the Jags have $32 million and Tennessee has $20 million, which is just crazy when they will more likely than not just use it to over pay a small batch of players in free agency.

[rmcjacket23]

Just now, RavensDieHard21 said:

With the carryover cap, you can certainly tell which teams are not doing well lol or at least haven't inked a franchise QB to their big deal. I mean come on the Jags have $32 million and Tennessee has $20 million, which is just crazy when they will more likely than not just use it to over pay a small batch of players in free agency.

There are numerous teams who also don't spend to the cap limit. Jacksonville is one of them. There are many teams that annually carry $20-30M in cap space over because their owner would rather be more profitable than spend it.