The Rumor Mill

[Jaybirds]

1 minute ago, Edgar said:

I have significant doubt they draft him in either round but playing along hypothetically I would say that if they were to draft him they would obviously view each as a starter and would not agree with whatever consensus might exist.

Just the fact that we are meeting with him suggests they hold a different view. It might be as simple as doing proper research if he does drop.

Thank you.  That's all I'm trying to say:  they think higher of him than we do.  I'm curious why. 

[Jaybirds]

1 minute ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

Watch the tape and you'll find out lol. He brings pass rush from the 34DE spot and is a prototype there. He's a massive, very athletic, and extremely powerful man, he's nimble on his feet, good with his hands, great head on his shoulders, good football iq, great motor, work ethic, awareness, basically he's a nearly complete package who Will be a day 1 starter and we won't find a player who we need to rotate him with because he's too good to take off the field. He needs work because he lacks pass rush moves and his pad level is too high to consistently hold up in the run game, but with the right coach he could very easily be 2nd at his position only to jj watt. His ceiling is extremely high but his floor is the appealing part because he is just so good and physically dominant that you know he won't bust, even if he doesn't reach his full potential.

I agree with pretty much all of this.  But I wonder if pad level can be fixed.  6'7" might always be an issue. 

[JoeyFlex5]

1 minute ago, Jaybirds said:

I agree with pretty much all of this.  But I wonder if pad level can be fixed.  6'7" might always be an issue. 

That's always my concern with guys that big who don't have that naturally. Pad level simply can't be fixed for a guy who's 6'7", it's a mental block where you feel if you lean forward any more than you'll tip over. You either have that mental block or you dont, bosa clearly doesn't have that problem because he's 6'7" and uses a hard lean and falls over all the time, not that it's a bad thing it's just hard for guys that tall to get low. 

 

You have guys like Shawn oakman who offer nothing but sloppy brute force and will never amount to anything in the nfl, but Buckner brings MUCH more to the table and will still succeed even though he gets stood up at times.

[Jaybirds]

2 minutes ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

That's always my concern with guys that big who don't have that naturally. Pad level simply can't be fixed for a guy who's 6'7", it's a mental block where you feel if you lean forward any more than you'll tip over. You either have that mental block or you dont, bosa clearly doesn't have that problem because he's 6'7" and uses a hard lean and falls over all the time, not that it's a bad thing it's just hard for guys that tall to get low. 

 

You have guys like Shawn oakman who offer nothing but sloppy brute force and will never amount to anything in the nfl, but Buckner brings MUCH more to the table and will still succeed even though he gets stood up at times.

Okay, so Bosa is a good comparison?  Because he has that "swimming" move where he can detach himself even if he doesn't have leverage.  If Buckner can learn that as well as Bosa seems to... yeah, I'd like that. 

[Clmraven]

5 minutes ago, Jaybirds said:

Okay, so Bosa is a good comparison?  Because he has that "swimming" move where he can detach himself even if he doesn't have leverage.  If Buckner can learn that as well as Bosa seems to... yeah, I'd like that. 

I wouldn't say Bosa is a great comparison, because he is more of an edge guy, but Buckner does have a nice arm over rip move similar to Bosa and I've seen him use a spin move but that doesn't work to well as an interior pass rusher.

[Jaybirds]

Just now, Clmraven said:

I wouldn't say Bosa is a great comparison, because he is more of an edge guy, but Buckner does have a nice arm over rip move similar to Bosa and I've seen him use a spin move but that doesn't work to well as an interior pass rusher.

Just some way to shed blockers without needing leverage.  Preferably a technique that can be taught.  I doubt judo is legal, but there's gotta be some kind of twist/bend/deflect technique that would work.  And I want him to learn it. 

[JoeyFlex5]

8 minutes ago, Jaybirds said:

Okay, so Bosa is a good comparison?  Because he has that "swimming" move where he can detach himself even if he doesn't have leverage.  If Buckner can learn that as well as Bosa seems to... yeah, I'd like that. 

No I'd say bosa is a horrible comparison because he has the natural lean to play OLB for a 34 team, Buckner doesn't have that and likely never will. One is a pure DL while the other is an edge rusher and DT hybrid. Bosa is also much more refined and has a more consistent push upfield when he engages, he has better bend around the edge, and his hand work is out of this world compared to any college edge player in recent memory. Buckner has good hands but they need work because they're inconsistent and sometimes when you wanna see him make a move he opts to bullrush instead and ends up getting stood up, that's just much less of an issue with bosa became even when he opts for the plain old bullrush it's more consistent because he has that lean

[trevorsteadman]

21 minutes ago, Ravens4Real said:

There's not point in drafting a QB, who in no way should be the second overall pick to begin with, to a team that has no other weapons at this point. You can't throw a rookie into the fire while trying to throw to a bunch of career backups. It's set up for another dumpster fire.

The Browns aren't going anywhere fast. That's solely because they have missed on so many high QB picks. Like I said, I think Hue Jackson is going to bring some sort of sane decision making to the Browns. They will sign a stop gap QB, whoever that may be, and then draft Ramsey or Tunsil, which ever one is there. 

And I agree. If I was a Browns fan I would be advocating away from a quarterback. But the NFL is either about money or championships. The Browns are no where close to a championship. So I could see them taking a big name like Goff or Wentz just to hope he turns out decent and to sell jerseys. I'm not denying if they do or don't and I agree with you that they SHOULD take anybody else. But you are talking about the Cleveland Browns. The Browns have little cap space for how much talent is on the team and it is disgusting and that is why they are trading away players to stockpile picks. It will take a couple years to get the cap in order for them along with decent players at least. 

[OldToby]

Jake Lampman(WR) out of Ferris State just had his pro day. Never heard of him until today. Weighed in at 200lbs, 5-11 1/4. Ran a 4.47 40, a 37 inch vertical, the 3 cone drill in 6.76, and benched a whopping 27 reps! https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kYmPcognRw4

[cushrinada1986]

On 2/12/2016 at 11:51 PM, PurpleCity5 said:

This isn't a rumor but I can imagine us being very high on Darian Thompson. He just seems like a classic Ozzie curve-ball. Last year after saying we were not picking a WR, we go out in pick one in the 1st round. In 2014, a season after trading up in the 2013 Draft of the 2nd round for ILB, Arthur Brown, we draft another ILB named C.J Mosley in the 1st round of the 2014. A lot of people assume that because Webb is making the switch to FS, that we won't simply draft one, I wouldn't be surprised if Thompson is our guy in the 2nd round at all, he can be amazing in the next level. 

I can see us taking a safety but maybe not him. What about Miles Killbrew? Solid tackler, can lay the wood in the open field and can play in the box as a possible extra LB. Could be a solid back up behind Weddle until its his time to take over. Alot of drafts have him going 3-4 rounds so maybe an option after we get a pass rusher and CB.

[Clmraven]

3 minutes ago, cushrinada1986 said:

I can see us taking a safety but maybe not him. What about Miles Killbrew? Solid tackler, can lay the wood in the open field and can play in the box as a possible extra LB. Could be a solid back up behind Weddle until its his time to take over. Alot of drafts have him going 3-4 rounds so maybe an option after we get a pass rusher and CB.

I'm not sure Killibrew is right for us, he can put up some highlight hits but he's inconsistent from what I've seen, he'll lay the wood one play and then let a guy run right over him the next, and he doesn't wrap up too well from what I've seen he throws his shoulder which leads to broken tackles.

 

[RavensFanMania]

19 minutes ago, cushrinada1986 said:

I can see us taking a safety but maybe not him. What about Miles Killbrew? Solid tackler, can lay the wood in the open field and can play in the box as a possible extra LB. Could be a solid back up behind Weddle until its his time to take over. Alot of drafts have him going 3-4 rounds so maybe an option after we get a pass rusher and CB.

I'd rather have Cash Mills or Davis then Killebrew, but I definitely can see them taking a safety.

[allblackraven]

2 hours ago, GrimCoconut said:

Not sure where I heard it. I thought someone posted it here in this forum somewhere. I know I read it somewhere though. Anyway, maybe we think he'll make a great OLB. Who knows. 

Teams wanted to see whether he's capable of setting the edge and perhaps rush the passer from there, so he did plenty of OLB stuff at the Senior Bowl.

He is a little bit of a mystery to me in terms of where he should go. His tape is not inferior to Mosley's and when you account for other players perceived to be in that same, middle first round range this year, you could argue that the intangibles are placing him right at the top of the second tier. If the team needs a linebacker, nothing wrong with Ragland at 10-15.

[ravensdan]

5 hours ago, GrimCoconut said:

Didn't teams work Ragland out at edge defender? Maybe we think he can play edge. I'm not big on the idea but I recall it floating around.

I didn't see it myself but heard reports he tried it out and was a complete disaster there. He's not an edge rusher. 

[GrimCoconut]

4 minutes ago, ravensdan said:

I didn't see it myself but heard reports he tried it out and was a complete disaster there. He's not an edge rusher. 

I didn't see it either, but I'm not surprised. I don't see him as a pass rusher from the edge, honestly. I'll be disappointed if we take him in the 1st or 2nd. Which means I'll be disappointed if we take him since I doubt he's there in the 3rd. 

[52520Andrew]

I wouldn't mind him as much in the second but I don't see the fit with Mosely already here. Either way I think he goes in the first. 

[Inqui]

6 hours ago, Jaybirds said:

Well... the latter if any.  But I don't think I have to speculate.  It seems pretty clear they're interested!  I'd like to know why. 

Okay, mental excercise. 
*  Tunsil, Ramsey, and Jack are surely in their top six. 
*  Let's pretend they don't like Bosa's character. 
*  Zeke is bad value that early unless you're Dallas. 
*  They're not fond of Buckner and Stanley.  Strange, but possible. 
*  Their grading system is fairly similar to NFL.com's. 

That is a ton of "what if", especially on Buckner.   But if ALL of that happens to be true, then their top six could maybe possibly be Tunsil, Ramsey, Jack, VH3, and two of Floyd, Robinson, and Ragland. 

If it were me:  I'd take VH3 all day, assuming Tunsil, Ramsey, and Jack won't make it to us. 
If I had to guess what they're thinking:  their 4-6 is some order of VH3, Floyd, and Ragland.  Maybe Buckner instead of Floyd.  Seems more likely. 

This is unlikely.  If I'm betting Ragland vs the field, I'm taking the field.  But this is the only thing that explains the time they're spending on this guy. 

Edit:  yeah, the more I think about it the more it seems to make sense.  If I had to guess, I'd say their top six is some order of Tunsil, Ramsey, Jack, VH3, Bosa, and Ragland.  Buckner might be ahead of one of those guys, but I don't think so. 

I don't think the 90 Ragland visits are worth reading too much into. I think we're just doing due diligence on as many prospects as we can and it has literally nothing to do with our six-man board.

You never know what'll happen on draft day. If the Rams come at us with a 2016 1st, 2017 1st and Aaron Donald for #6, there's no world in which we turn them down. But who do we take with the 2016 1st? You don't want to make a detailed six-man shortlist only to find yourself high and dry if you trade out of that range. Or if he falls to us in the 2nd or 3rd, we have to be aware of what we're getting into or decide if he fell for a reason and roll with someone else. So it pays for us to be in the loop for as many prospects as possible.

Personally I don't think the Ragland visits are really worth reading into. There's possibly something going on either way, but there are all kinds of reasons we'd openly be looking at him that much.

[Inqui]

56 minutes ago, 52520Andrew said:

I wouldn't mind him as much in the second but I don't see the fit with Mosely already here. Either way I think he goes in the first. 

As a prospect I think Ragland compares to basically every Alabama LB that's ever been picked in the 1st. He's a decent enough prospect, and you have 50+ years of tape showing how these guys fare in the pros. He's not a bad player to have on your side, but we already have one. I can see him going in the 1st for sure. He's that steady kind of prospect GMs seem to like - and he fills a pretty big need for sides like Green Bay or Oakland.

[Dewy101]

6 hours ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

That's always my concern with guys that big who don't have that naturally. Pad level simply can't be fixed for a guy who's 6'7", it's a mental block where you feel if you lean forward any more than you'll tip over. You either have that mental block or you dont, bosa clearly doesn't have that problem because he's 6'7" and uses a hard lean and falls over all the time, not that it's a bad thing it's just hard for guys that tall to get low. 

 

You have guys like Shawn oakman who offer nothing but sloppy brute force and will never amount to anything in the nfl, but Buckner brings MUCH more to the table and will still succeed even though he gets stood up at times.

That brute force of Oakmans might be nothing in the NFL considering he never does leg day haha

Edited March 21, 2016 by Dewy101

[JO_75]

Word around SD is they are "falling in love" with LB Myles Jack. They had 7 reprensitives at UCLA's Pro Day and even had their DB Coach try Jack out as a Safety. So if Ramsey indeed goes to Tennessee, Wentz to Cleveland and Jack to San Diego meaning Tunsil would most likely fall to us at 6. Cowboys are set at Tackle, Jaguars brought in Beachum and invested money at RT with Jeremy Parnell. 

http://www.boltsfromtheblue.com/2016/3/17/11243754/myles-jack-what-if-the-san-diego-chargers-drafted-him

[GrimCoconut]

If we draft Tunsil, I am buying his jersey and having the biggest smile for a week. I rarely buy rookie jerseys. Last time I did was CJ Mosley then Jimmy Smith before him. 

[Sizzlebshu]

Depending om the rg3 deal, im npt sure if he will be there at 6.

[Inqui]

8 minutes ago, GrimCoconut said:

If we draft Tunsil, I am buying his jersey and having the biggest smile for a week. I rarely buy rookie jerseys. Last time I did was CJ Mosley then Jimmy Smith before him. 

Scratch that, I'm getting his rookie jersey and an Ole Miss 78 one. I'd probably do the same for Ramsey and maybe Stanley (depends on how broke I get before the start of the season...), but there hasn't been anyone I considered doing that for since OBJ.

But like I say, if he inexplicably gets past the Chargers (and if that happened I'd probably pay more money to watch Philip Rivers' reaction than I would on any Ravens merchandise), I think the Cowboys will hold an auction for that pick. And if that auction doesn't meet its reserve, I still can't see him getting past the Jags - I don't see the Beachum signing putting them off as they'd just make Beachum a one-year rental in that case.

[allblackraven]

1 minute ago, Sizzlebshu said:

Depending om the rg3 deal, im npt sure if he will be there at 6.

If RGIII signs with Browns, I don't see them drafting QB in the first round and if Titans don't take Tunsil, Browns will.

[GrimCoconut]

I don't think RG3 takes the Browns out of taking a QB. He's not exactly fire in a bottle and I've read that it doesn't mean they're out of taking a QB early. 

[KBoum]

1 hour ago, GrimCoconut said:

If we draft Tunsil, I am buying his jersey and having the biggest smile for a week. I rarely buy rookie jerseys. Last time I did was CJ Mosley then Jimmy Smith before him. 

I remember the Jimmy Smith draft. I was in my parents baseman during that week end. It was friday night around 10h20-10h30. I wanted him so bad to fall to the Ravens. Could have been a top 10 pick. Same with Mosley I was sure the Steelers were picking him and they got Shazier. Steelers had Dick lebeau Ohio state alum they went with the player they knew more

[ALPHA]

1 hour ago, KBoum said:

I remember the Jimmy Smith draft. I was in my parents baseman during that week end. It was friday night around 10h20-10h30. I wanted him so bad to fall to the Ravens. Could have been a top 10 pick. Same with Mosley I was sure the Steelers were picking him and they got Shazier. Steelers had Dick lebeau Ohio state alum they went with the player they knew more

Jimmy is decent but we would have been better off with Wilkerson

[allblackraven]

1 hour ago, GrimCoconut said:

I don't think RG3 takes the Browns out of taking a QB. He's not exactly fire in a bottle and I've read that it doesn't mean they're out of taking a QB early. 

2nd seems early enough, plus they pick top level talent at other position. Obviously, if they really like QB other than Goff/Wentz. They might even get their guy in 3rd, if it is Cook or someone else.

[JoeyFlex5]

While we're talking about past drafts.. Does anyone think maybe we could have been better off if we took HHCD? Maybe we could have even beaten the pats in the playoffs? And maybe we could be looking at ragland this year as a trade back option instead and our secondary would not have turned into such a disaster? I love Mosley but I can't help but think what if...

[GrimCoconut]

3 minutes ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

While we're talking about past drafts.. Does anyone think maybe we could have been better off if we took HHCD? Maybe we could have even beaten the pats in the playoffs? And maybe we could be looking at ragland this year as a trade back option instead and our secondary would not have turned into such a disaster? I love Mosley but I can't help but think what if...

I have certainly thought this. I love Mosley but I think Clinton-Dix was perhaps a bigger need. I have to say I was wrong on Clinton-Dix. I didn't like him that much in college and thought he was good but a bit overhyped, but he's blown my opinion really out of the water and he's been a great player.