Senior Bowl Thread 2016

[Cillmatic]

We need to meet with Spence and Miller.

Edited January 28, 2016 by Cillmatic

[GrimCoconut]

My boy Spence is killing it. Had him as a top 10 talent since I really started investigating his character issues. Needless to say I find them mostly a non-issue. Every report I read states he's cleaned up his act. He's arguably one of my favorite guys at #6 since he's an ideal fit here. I like his fit better than Bosa, not that Bosa is bad. I actually think his mistake could make him a truly dominant player. 

A person can treat tragedy in one of two ways, and he's certainly displayed the positive traits I look for in evaluating a prospect's recovery. I think some of the best players had to overcome adversity. It's an inherent part of this game. 

I have no reservations with taking him at #6 overall at this time 

Edited January 28, 2016 by GrimCoconut

[GrimCoconut]

1 hour ago, Drew P said:

The Samford guy looks like a project

Samford has really started to improve as a football school. 

[GrimCoconut]

7 hours ago, BmoreBird22 said:

I may be getting him mixed up with someone else, but I had major concerns about how DeVante Parker would play against press coverage since he saw off man like 65% of the time. I thought he only had a little hop step at the line to even attempt to beat press. I know Parker had a solid rookie season, but he also played across from Landry, so as teams give Parker more attention and really get up in his face, I'll be curious to see how far he's progressed. Just so crazy that Miller already has alleviated those types of concerns. 

 

Ozzie said he didn't want any more project types, but Miller isn't looking like a Tray Walker project. He's more like.... mmmm, a Breshad Perriman where the foundation is all there and he has a solid skill set, he just needs some polish and refinement in some of the finer areas. I'd definitely take a "flier"

I wouldn't scratch a guy off the list because he's changed positions, either. Edelman was a QB and changed to WR when he came to the NFL. Perhaps Miller is next? 

If memory serves me right, Anquan Boldin was also a QB, although his conversion admittedly came earlier than Miller's. 

[BmoreBird22]

3 minutes ago, GrimCoconut said:

I wouldn't scratch a guy off the list because he's changed positions, either. Edelman was a QB and changed to WR when he came to the NFL. Perhaps Miller is next? 

If memory serves me right, Anquan Boldin was also a QB, although his conversion admittedly came earlier than Miller's. 

Well, like I said before in my mock draft, Randal Cobb made the exact same switch and they were very similar style quarterbacks. I think he's definitely smart enough to do it

[GrimCoconut]

1 minute ago, BmoreBird22 said:

Well, like I said before in my mock draft, Randal Cobb made the exact same switch and they were very similar style quarterbacks. I think he's definitely smart enough to do it

Yeah. Besides, it's nice to have a WR with that quality. It means you can use them as an emergency back-up QB like we did when we had Boldin. 

[hn68wb4]

9 minutes ago, GrimCoconut said:

I wouldn't scratch a guy off the list because he's changed positions, either. Edelman was a QB and changed to WR when he came to the NFL. Perhaps Miller is next? 

If memory serves me right, Anquan Boldin was also a QB, although his conversion admittedly came earlier than Miller's. 

But I think we need to be a bit more careful only mentioning the successful conversions. Armanti Edwards didn't work out for example. Not saying I don't like Miller but I really don't like it comparisons and generalizations when it comes to his stuff.

Edited January 28, 2016 by hn68wb4

[GrimCoconut]

4 minutes ago, hn68wb4 said:

But I think we need to be a bit more careful only mentioning the successful conversions. Armanti Edwards didn't work out for example. Not saying I don't like Miller but I really don't like it comparisons and generalizations when it comes to his stuff.

It's certainly a valid argument. There's that guy last year, I think Nate Bell was his name or something? He was a college QB who switched to CB or TE. I seem to recall two college QB switching to TE and CB, although I can't recall who. 

It certainly doesn't always work, but if we're talking taking him in the fourth round then it may very well be worth it, depending.

[JoeyFlex5]

13 minutes ago, GrimCoconut said:

It's certainly a valid argument. There's that guy last year, I think Nate Bell was his name or something? He was a college QB who switched to CB or TE. I seem to recall two college QB switching to TE and CB, although I can't recall who. 

It certainly doesn't always work, but if we're talking taking him in the fourth round then it may very well be worth it, depending.

Nick Marshall

[RaineV1]

34 minutes ago, GrimCoconut said:

My boy Spence is killing it. Had him as a top 10 talent since I really started investigating his character issues. Needless to say I find them mostly a non-issue. Every report I read states he's cleaned up his act. He's arguably one of my favorite guys at #6 since he's an ideal fit here. I like his fit better than Bosa, not that Bosa is bad. I actually think his mistake could make him a truly dominant player. 

A person can treat tragedy in one of two ways, and he's certainly displayed the positive traits I look for in evaluating a prospect's recovery. I think some of the best players had to overcome adversity. It's an inherent part of this game. 

I have no reservations with taking him at #6 overall at this time 

Originally I thought of Spence as a guy to move up for from the early second round to get, but with how he's playing I actually wouldn't mind at all taking him at 6. He could be the best 3-4 OLB in this draft.

[GrimCoconut]

4 minutes ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

Nick Marshall

That's it! Thanks. I knew it was someone like that. 

[GrimCoconut]

1 minute ago, RaineV1 said:

Originally I thought of Spence as a guy to move up for from the early second round to get, but with how he's playing I actually wouldn't mind at all taking him at 6. He could be the best 3-4 OLB in this draft.

Yep. I see the same thing in him. He's really come around in my eyes as a guy at 6. I used to think that was crazy but he's probably the best in this class as a 3-4 OLB from day one. 

[JoeyFlex5]

Noah Spence has become khalil Mack and I fully agree with it lol. 

 

I'd take him at 6th in a heartbeat. Its now between spence, ramsey, and buckner for me.

[GrimCoconut]

1 minute ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

Noah Spence has become khalil Mack and I fully agree with it lol. 

 

I'd take him at 6th in a heartbeat. Its now between spence, ramsey, and buckner for me.

I agree, although I think it's between him, Ramsey, Bosa, and Jack. I think a few of those guys will be decided for us. 

[BmoreBird22]

So, I haven't watched much, if any at all, of Spence and from what I've read, he will not be an early contributor against the run because he lacks functional strength and can't really convert speed to power well. 

 

I've also heard while he's a really good pass rusher, his lack of counter moves is something to monitor.

 

Thoughts? 

[allblackraven]

I hope the fact that Ravens aren't meeting Spence openly at the Senior Bowl means throwing a smoke screen. We didn't have the opportunity to draft a pass rusher like that since Suggs.

Of course, that's if he makes it to #6.

[Drew P]

11 minutes ago, allblackraven said:

I hope the fact that Ravens aren't meeting Spence openly at the Senior Bowl means throwing a smoke screen. We didn't have the opportunity to draft a pass rusher like that since Suggs.

Of course, that's if he makes it to #6.

Is this guy worthy of a top ten pick? He's a drug addict off the field. On the field he is a one trick pony basically DOOM 2.0. I dont think the Ravens can gamble on this guy at #6 they need an immediate impact on early downs type of player. Hopefully they dont visit the top ten ever again im my life so they got to make the most of it.

[allblackraven]

14 minutes ago, BmoreBird22 said:

So, I haven't watched much, if any at all, of Spence and from what I've read, he will not be an early contributor against the run because he lacks functional strength and can't really convert speed to power well. 

 

I've also heard while he's a really good pass rusher, his lack of counter moves is something to monitor.

 

Thoughts? 

What I'm seeing is a guy that rarely stays locked in a block, regardless of whether he's blocked by tackle or TE. He mostly disengages using good hand placement and speed rather than power and will almost always continue with the play, whether pressuring QB, going after RB or chasing wide to the line. He's never idle.

As far as run support, he'll be better than Dumervil in that department right off the bat.

He probably needs to get little stronger for NFL but that shouldn't be a problem.

[hn68wb4]

1 hour ago, GrimCoconut said:

It's certainly a valid argument. There's that guy last year, I think Nate Bell was his name or something? He was a college QB who switched to CB or TE. I seem to recall two college QB switching to TE and CB, although I can't recall who. 

It certainly doesn't always work, but if we're talking taking him in the fourth round then it may very well be worth it, depending.

Blake Bell from Oklahoma moved to TE and, as already stated, Marshall switched (back to) CB

 

Yeah I agree that a 4th is fair, especially when we are likely to have 4 picks in the 4th. Worth the risk but I think if he has a good combine and senior bowl then he could make it up into the second on potential. He absolutely lit up the VTech game.

[Cillmatic]

Video of Noah Spence sacking Gus Bradley: 

 

[GrimCoconut]

1 hour ago, BmoreBird22 said:

So, I haven't watched much, if any at all, of Spence and from what I've read, he will not be an early contributor against the run because he lacks functional strength and can't really convert speed to power well. 

 

I've also heard while he's a really good pass rusher, his lack of counter moves is something to monitor.

 

Thoughts? 

 

42 minutes ago, Drew P said:

Is this guy worthy of a top ten pick? He's a drug addict off the field. On the field he is a one trick pony basically DOOM 2.0. I dont think the Ravens can gamble on this guy at #6 they need an immediate impact on early downs type of player. Hopefully they dont visit the top ten ever again im my life so they got to make the most of it.

I think people expect far too much at times from a prospect, even a top 10 pick. Nobody ever really comes out of college as a perfect prospect. How often does that happen? He's no liability against the run but he's not his strongest attribute. 

Suggs wasn't a great run defender nor was he strong in coverage and still isn't the best coverage guy but he is good. Spence will have to get better in every way, just like practically every prospect. I can find faults in every prospect. 

[Cillmatic]

Since his move, Spence has been on a program with his Coaching staff which entails constant drug testing.

[BmoreBird22]

38 minutes ago, GrimCoconut said:

 

I think people expect far too much at times from a prospect, even a top 10 pick. Nobody ever really comes out of college as a perfect prospect. How often does that happen? He's no liability against the run but he's not his strongest attribute. 

Suggs wasn't a great run defender nor was he strong in coverage and still isn't the best coverage guy but he is good. Spence will have to get better in every way, just like practically every prospect. I can find faults in every prospect. 

Well, when I heard someone call him this year's Khalil Mack, I think it raised some valid questions

[BmoreBird22]

Also, a note on Spence, apparently Urban Meyer campaigned for him to be reinstated and to be given a second chance. I really respect Urban Meyer, so I trust him 

[BmoreBird22]

Miller has shown incredibly refined footwork and he's apparently shooting for a 4.28 40 yard dash. He should kill the 40 and the cone drills/shuttle drills. 

 

However, one thing to remember about these SENIOR Bowl practices is that many of the top receivers in the country (Treadwell, Coleman, Boyd, Fuller) and corners (Hargreaves, Ramsey, Alexander, Fuller, Apple) are not there to compare him against or to cover him.

 

I'm extremely excited for how well he's doing, but he's still going to have to show a way to show up against the top corners in the nation and prove he can play against the best.

[Dubs]

Adding to the QB gone WR route I remember Matt Jones making the transition and his big showing was him at the Senior Bowl. he made some preside catches in the red zone I remember and then he blew up the combine and went in the first...I think he was one pick before we took Mark Clayton, I was so happy at the time. Anyway he did not transition well to say the least, not that that means anything for Braxton Miller...but i would be cautious and at this point could not do the second round like some people are touting

[Baltimore RAYvens]

7 hours ago, GrimCoconut said:

It's certainly a valid argument. There's that guy last year, I think Nate Bell was his name or something? He was a college QB who switched to CB or TE. I seem to recall two college QB switching to TE and CB, although I can't recall who. 

It certainly doesn't always work, but if we're talking taking him in the fourth round then it may very well be worth it, depending.

Blake Bell made the switch to TE. Marshall went to CB

[JoeyFlex5]

6 hours ago, Drew P said:

Is this guy worthy of a top ten pick? He's a drug addict off the field. On the field he is a one trick pony basically DOOM 2.0. I dont think the Ravens can gamble on this guy at #6 they need an immediate impact on early downs type of player. Hopefully they dont visit the top ten ever again im my life so they got to make the most of it.

drug addict is quite the overstatement for a kid who is nearly 2 years removed from his dismissal and has made great strides since then to mature as a person, he got busted twice taking a party drug, he was a college kid making bad decisions, he paid the price, and has paid his dues the long and hard way and has not given anybody a reason to call him a "drug addict". 

 

also i dont see doom 2.0, he is much more talented than that and plays with a much more desirable skillset. he is the best 3-4olb in this class and i dont think anyone else is close, and its a pretty widely shared sentiment.

[JoeKnows]

6 hours ago, Cillmatic said:

Video of Noah Spence sacking Gus Bradley: 

 

How do you post tweets like that?

[Wildabeast88]

21 hours ago, hn68wb4 said:

Apparently Rankins has been dominant. I loved him on tape and I thought he was fantastic against the run, wasn't this high on him though. I almost put him in one of my previous mocks but I didn't think we needed another run stopping dlineman so I went with a pass rusher, maybe Rankins will turn out to be a lot better rushing the passer than I originally thought.

He was Amazing yesterday beat one lineman he was in the backfield before the dude was out of his stance