Do you think St Louis should get another team in the future?

[Steve0x]

I don't think they should ever get another NFL team. They blew their second chance after they lost the Cards back in 1987. While both Baltimore and Houston did very well supporting the Ravens and the Texans after the Colts and the Oilers left.

[RaineV1]

St. Lious really supported the Rams for the most part, even during some really bad seasons. So sure.

[Steve0x]

I don't think the NFL should never go back to St Louis. St Louis is a baseball city. People in St Louis areas rather watch the Cards than the Rams. 

[cobrajet]

Leaning toward No

[Ravenslifer]

I don't think they should ever get another NFL team. They blew their second chance after they lost the Cards back in 1987. While both Baltimore and Houston did very well supporting the Ravens and the Texans after the Colts and the Oilers left.

 

Right now I'm leaning no.  The EJ dome had a capacity of 66,000.  From 2008-2015, that team couldn't average even 60,000 in attendance in any single season.  To put that in perspective, that puts them in the bottom 5 in attendance in every one of those seasons.  They can cry about tradition and fandom, but the bottom line is the NFL is a business - if a team feels they can make more money by relocating, then they have the right to do so.  You bring up these other moves, and I agree - the Ravens and the Texans have finished in the top 12 teams in the league in attendance in every season since 2006.  And that's in spite of having close competition in the form of Dallas and Washington right down the road from them, basically. The Texans also buck the idea that "the team needs to win to earn support" - they have finished .500 or worse in half of their seasons, have 3 playoff appearances and 1 playoff win in that time, but people still go to their games.  The Rams have legendary players in their St. Louis history and still couldn't get people to go to their games.

Edited January 25, 2016 by Ravenslifer

[Steve0x]

Right now I'm leaning no.  The EJ dome had a capacity of 66,000.  From 2008-2015, that team couldn't average even 60,000 in attendance in any single season.  To put that in perspective, that puts them in the bottom 5 in attendance in every one of those seasons.  They can cry about tradition and fandom, but the bottom line is the NFL is a business - if a team feels they can make more money by relocating, then they have the right to do so.  You bring up these other moves, and I agree - the Ravens and the Texans have finished in the top 12 teams in the league in attendance in every season since 2006.  And that's in spite of having close competition in the form of Dallas and Washington right down the road from them, basically. The Texans also buck the idea that "the team needs to win to earn support" - they have finished .500 or worse in half of their seasons, have 3 playoff appearances and 1 playoff win in that time, but people still go to their games.  The Rams have legendary players in their St. Louis history and still couldn't get people to go to their games.

 

 

Even the Colts? 

[Ravenslifer]

Even the Colts? 

 

I didn't have a problem with the Colts moving.  The problem was the manner in which they did so.  When Art Modell moved the Browns, he told the city of Cleveland the year before that he would strongly consider moving if stadium changes weren't made.  He was petty about it, but he was up front about it.  Robert Irsay went on national television and said "the Colts aren't leaving Baltimore".  Then he vanished in the night.  I could partially understand it because at the time the Maryland legistlature had pushed through a bill that would have allowed the city to take control of the team from Irsay the following season, so he was running short on time.  But there's a big difference in threatening to do something and then doing it vs. lying through your teeth to the public and going behind everyone's back.

[Steve0x]

This is what happens when Politics get involved. How did teams ask for a new stadium back in 20s or 30s? The Yankees didn't tell the mayor I'm moving the team if i don't get a new stadium. The Yankees built it without asking anyone build it for them.

[PolishRifle]

I don't think they should ever get another NFL team. They blew their second chance after they lost the Cards back in 1987. While both Baltimore and Houston did very well supporting the Ravens and the Texans after the Colts and the Oilers left.

 

I love the Ravens and I hope they stay in Baltimore, but I do feel like it has been very easy to be a Ravens fan. As much as I hate Cleveland, I do respect the Browns fanbase and their neverending support for that trainwreck of a franchise. Sometimes I wonder how well Baltimore would support a 2-14 Ravens team, that tries to find a good HC and franchise QB.

Edited January 25, 2016 by PolishRifle

[Steve0x]

Our fans did very well when Ravens went 5-11 season. They packed up the stadium every sunday. Unlike the Colts fans did during the late 70s though early 80s.  

[Dilferian]

I didn't have a problem with the Colts moving.  The problem was the manner in which they did so.  When Art Modell moved the Browns, he told the city of Cleveland the year before that he would strongly consider moving if stadium changes weren't made.  He was petty about it, but he was up front about it.  Robert Irsay went on national television and said "the Colts aren't leaving Baltimore".  Then he vanished in the night.  I could partially understand it because at the time the Maryland legistlature had pushed through a bill that would have allowed the city to take control of the team from Irsay the following season, so he was running short on time.  But there's a big difference in threatening to do something and then doing it vs. lying through your teeth to the public and going behind everyone's back.

No he didn't. He told the city of Cleveland he did not want to be a part of the Gateway Project (the Indians spear heded the project Modell wasn't interested in splitting revenue, with baseball). He abruptly called a moratorium on talks when the voters approved a sin tax to build the Gateway Project.

 

Not to start a fight, but I lived there during that time. Modell urged the blocking of expansion into Baltimore and St. Louis, so the NFL went Jax & Carolina. He had his eye on Baltimore for himself the whole time, knowing the Gateway Project would pass. He was very shrewd.

 

Back to the original topic, I do think St. Louis should get another team. Stan Kroenke really had no interest in keeping the Rams there after he gained control of the franchise. In reading a bunch of articles on the matter, he wasn't keen on the Edward Jones Dome in the first place. I don't think anything the city of St. Louis was going to sway him, his vision of the Inglewood project was too salivating to him. I'm never going to a Wal Mart again, that guy screwed over a great fan base.

Edited January 26, 2016 by Dilferian

[Ravenslifer]

 

Back to the original topic, I do think St. Louis should get another team. Stan Kroenke really had no interest in keeping the Rams there after he gained control of the franchise. In reading a bunch of articles on the matter, he wasn't keen on the Edward Jones Dome in the first place. I don't think anything the city of St. Louis was going to sway him, his vision of the Inglewood project was too salivating to him. I'm never going to a Wal Mart again, that guy screwed over a great fan base.

 

My issue with a team in St. Louis is simple - over the last decade they've consistently been in the bottom 5 of the NFL in attendance, often bottom 3.  Whether it was the terrible team, poor stadium, whatever the reason, I'm pretty sure they were losing money there, or at least not as popular as you'd expect an NFL team to be - and as I stated earlier, the Houston Texans' attendance history, especially in their early years, proves winning has little to do with it.  Ultimately, the NFL is a money-making business - if a team feels they can be profitable in St. Louis, I'd support a move there.  But if Stan Kroenke feels LA is a better market for selling out his stadium, I have no problem with him wanting to move his team there - he's the one paying for the team, so if he thinks the LA market brings a better return on his investment, I think he's entitled to move.  Plus, I'd imagine, at least in the short-term when the Rams are rebuilding, being in LA will help draw some better free agent talent to help them.

[Steve0x]

No he didn't. He told the city of Cleveland he did not want to be a part of the Gateway Project (the Indians spear heded the project Modell wasn't interested in splitting revenue, with baseball). He abruptly called a moratorium on talks when the voters approved a sin tax to build the Gateway Project.

 

Not to start a fight, but I lived there during that time. Modell urged the blocking of expansion into Baltimore and St. Louis, so the NFL went Jax & Carolina. He had his eye on Baltimore for himself the whole time, knowing the Gateway Project would pass. He was very shrewd.

 

Back to the original topic, I do think St. Louis should get another team. Stan Kroenke really had no interest in keeping the Rams there after he gained control of the franchise. In reading a bunch of articles on the matter, he wasn't keen on the Edward Jones Dome in the first place. I don't think anything the city of St. Louis was going to sway him, his vision of the Inglewood project was too salivating to him. I'm never going to a Wal Mart again, that guy screwed over a great fan base.

 

 

According to Johnny Unitas. They interviewed him the day Modell moved his team to Baltimore. And Johnny said this... If the NFL would have awarded Baltimore an expansion team the Browns would still be in Cleveland. ​He's right you know, So it was Paul Taglubue fault for allowing that team to go to Jacksonville instead of Baltimore. 

[52520Andrew]

According to Johnny Unitas. They interviewed him the day Modell moved his team to Baltimore. And Johnny said this... If the NFL would have awarded Baltimore an expansion team the Browns would still be in Cleveland. ​He's right you know, So it was Paul Taglubue fault for allowing that team to go to Jacksonville instead of Baltimore. 

 

Maybe if you told Browns fans that they would understand that not every city gets an expansion team to replace them(heck the NFL had just gotten 2 expansion teams but decided to add another just for Cleveland) and gets to keep their team's history. Then again, if they haven't figured it out yet then odds are they aren't going to for a while.