2016 Edge Rusher thread

[BmoreBird22]

6 minutes ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

@BmoreBird22 I'm guilty of that with a few prospects myself. I have flip flopped heavily on Ramsey and Floyd specifically, I also was quick on the ogbah bandwagon and have basically disregarded him since. But between stanley, buckner, bosa, treadwell, I have remained adamant and would be happy with any of them. Vh3 I was always weary of but I did like him very much, since he struggled it made me pause on him, I still don't know who I like between Him and alexander though. Its typical behavior though, people either follow trends or go against them 

And I'm not even saying that flip flopping isn't okay.

I got back and forth on Ramsey quite a bit. At this point, I really love him. I don't know if the Ravens will take him and I like Alexander more, but I really like him again after feeling unsure on him earlier in the year.

What I'm criticizing is people who see someone like Noah Spence get hyped up by a few people and the masses all follow after having never mentioned him before, but when some flaws come out and one or two people sour, the entire group does.

Flip flopping and re-evaluating is not the issue to me. Hey, it's part of the draft process. I just don't like seeing the mindless sheep behavior.

[PurpleCity5]

I've gone back on forth on Ramsey, particularly because of the stuff I haven't seen when watching him, I don't like considering things a skill of a prospect that you don't see on tape, it just seems wrong. 

 

I haven't soured on Stanley, I just have a lesser desire for a LT if K.O returns, that's how it is. 

 

I'm still a Hargreaves fan, I've mentioned plenty of times that he's starting to become very underrated. I honestly feel that way, I honestly think his struggles go back to two games in the end of the year that if happened at the start of the year, would not be so highlighted. I personally think his Alabama game is way overblown, while I will admit his Michigan game wasn't good at all. 

[JoeyFlex5]

I am fresh on Spence bandwagon, I recognized the name but hadn't done my homework yet, but since I saw him at the senior bowl looking like a one man wrecking crew I began to look him up and I honestly don't envision me souring on him unless he bombs the interview process which doesn't seem likely. He brings as much to the table in terms of immediate and long term impact than just about any player for this defense. The biggest thing is that he looks like a plug and play OLB for us who may need to refine his game a bit, but will immediately be a force and looks like the best possible heir to suggs' throne

[52520Andrew]

1 hour ago, GrimCoconut said:

Yeah, it happens a lot. Can't blame people who don't follow the draft that closely for it, though. I can't fault anyone for that. I personally still maintain the same guys I like at 6 that I liked before. Nobody's really FALLEN out of place for me. Some guys I like better than others, and some rose I didn't expect, but I still like the same guys. Spence really rose for me. I was impressed by him a lot. I know you're not as big on him, but I think he's got all the talent to be a good player, it's only his head I questioned. He may be better value in the second if he's there, honestly. His stock is one I admittedly have a hard time gauging. 

Even Nkemdiche?

 

I'll see myself out...

Edited January 30, 2016 by 52520Andrew

[GrimCoconut]

6 hours ago, 52520Andrew said:

Even Nkemdiche?

 

I'll see myself out...

Lol well played

[Boddiebroadus]

A 240+ Floyd is where I'm at. Dude is a beast. He doesn't get credit for how much he's improved in the run game. We all know he is probably the best pure pass rusher in this class. He can also play pass coverage and has a great motor. Every time someone mentions a new name on these boards I'll go watch some tape on them and I'll admit most of the time I'm impressed but then I go back to Floyds tape and he just shows me so much more. 

[Ravensfan23]

12 hours ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

I am fresh on Spence bandwagon, I recognized the name but hadn't done my homework yet, but since I saw him at the senior bowl looking like a one man wrecking crew I began to look him up and I honestly don't envision me souring on him unless he bombs the interview process which doesn't seem likely. He brings as much to the table in terms of immediate and long term impact than just about any player for this defense. The biggest thing is that he looks like a plug and play OLB for us who may need to refine his game a bit, but will immediately be a force and looks like the best possible heir to suggs' throne

I like Spence but I don't see him as plug and play. I think he'll definitely add instant impact as a speed rush specialist but I don't see him as a 3 down option day one like Mosley was. 

 

I see a lot of Timmy Jernigan in Noah Spence. Obviously not in position but in style of play. As good as Timmy has been and as special as he can/will be his discipline is what keeps him from taking that next step. Not discipline in terms of penalties or recklessness but in terms of staying true to his role on any given play within the TEAM DEFENSE opposed to being an individual play maker. He was able to get away with that at FSU, but in the pros that hurts the defense more then help. 

I see this in Spence. Great speed as a rusher but I don't really see that speed to power conversion you look for from a 3 down OLB. Everything is speed speed speed with him. Even in run defense he uses his speed to kind of play keep away from the blocker in hopes of making the play. In the NFL that usually leads to an open run lane or lack of containment on the outside. 

Admittedly I didn't watch the senior bowl practices so I don't know if he's improved in that area since I've last seen him. But he'll definitely need to use his hands better and prove he can defeat blockers consistently in the run game before I could view him as Suggs heir. Really love him as a rush specialist learning behind Suggs though. I still see him as a high 2nd even though I know it's not the popular view on him.

[GrimCoconut]

16 minutes ago, Ravensfan23 said:

I like Spence but I don't see him as plug and play. I think he'll definitely add instant impact as a speed rush specialist but I don't see him as a 3 down option day one like Mosley was. 

 

I see a lot of Timmy Jernigan in Noah Spence. Obviously not in position but in style of play. As good as Timmy has been and as special as he can/will be his discipline is what keeps him from taking that next step. Not discipline in terms of penalties or recklessness but in terms of staying true to his role on any given play within the TEAM DEFENSE opposed to being an individual play maker. He was able to get away with that at FSU, but in the pros that hurts the defense more then help. 

I see this in Spence. Great speed as a rusher but I don't really see that speed to power conversion you look for from a 3 down OLB. Everything is speed speed speed with him. Even in run defense he uses his speed to kind of play keep away from the blocker in hopes of making the play. In the NFL that usually leads to an open run lane or lack of containment on the outside. 

Admittedly I didn't watch the senior bowl practices so I don't know if he's improved in that area since I've last seen him. But he'll definitely need to use his hands better and prove he can defeat blockers consistently in the run game before I could view him as Suggs heir. Really love him as a rush specialist learning behind Suggs though. I still see him as a high 2nd even though I know it's not the popular view on him.

Spence has a draft stock I find very hard to pin down. He's got top 10 talent but there's legitimate aspects of his game that make me say he shouldn't go there. The weak class helps his case imo. 

I think he could go anywhere from top 10 to early second. 

[JoeyFlex5]

50 minutes ago, Ravensfan23 said:

I like Spence but I don't see him as plug and play. I think he'll definitely add instant impact as a speed rush specialist but I don't see him as a 3 down option day one like Mosley was. 

 

I see a lot of Timmy Jernigan in Noah Spence. Obviously not in position but in style of play. As good as Timmy has been and as special as he can/will be his discipline is what keeps him from taking that next step. Not discipline in terms of penalties or recklessness but in terms of staying true to his role on any given play within the TEAM DEFENSE opposed to being an individual play maker. He was able to get away with that at FSU, but in the pros that hurts the defense more then help. 

I see this in Spence. Great speed as a rusher but I don't really see that speed to power conversion you look for from a 3 down OLB. Everything is speed speed speed with him. Even in run defense he uses his speed to kind of play keep away from the blocker in hopes of making the play. In the NFL that usually leads to an open run lane or lack of containment on the outside. 

Admittedly I didn't watch the senior bowl practices so I don't know if he's improved in that area since I've last seen him. But he'll definitely need to use his hands better and prove he can defeat blockers consistently in the run game before I could view him as Suggs heir. Really love him as a rush specialist learning behind Suggs though. I still see him as a high 2nd even though I know it's not the popular view on him.

all valid points and i acgree, but i dont think its a real lack of discipline, but more of a motor thing, the kid plays with a ridiculous motor, he will never be outhustled on the field thats for sure lol. 

 

and yeah he needs refinement but at the same time i feel like he shows a lot more promise than many of the more raw edge rushers coming out, for instance shane ray, i personally wasnt a fan because i didnt see much promise from him in terms of learning to play with more than just speed, and i still dont, i think hes a pure "bend" guy and if he doesnt bend the corner hes done for, and he doesnt seem to have the same level of tenacity of a guy like spence. with spence you can see that he has some ability, but he does play very excited and fast. i do see some very quick hands and he occasionally plays with a punch, if he feels himself being able to turn the corner he wont hesitate to get his hand up in the tackles chest hard and fast and assure that he bends on the play, hes also got a pretty good shoulder dip, i just think he shows a lot of promise even in his weak areas. 

 

dont get me wrong im not calling him some perfect prospect, but he could be borderline perfect for us, considering how rarely we get to draft high and how badly we need a player just like him, who can bring some very explosive edge rush for us

[Ravensfan23]

7 minutes ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

all valid points and i acgree, but i dont think its a real lack of discipline, but more of a motor thing, the kid plays with a ridiculous motor, he will never be outhustled on the field thats for sure lol. 

 

and yeah he needs refinement but at the same time i feel like he shows a lot more promise than many of the more raw edge rushers coming out, for instance shane ray, i personally wasnt a fan because i didnt see much promise from him in terms of learning to play with more than just speed, and i still dont, i think hes a pure "bend" guy and if he doesnt bend the corner hes done for, and he doesnt seem to have the same level of tenacity of a guy like spence. with spence you can see that he has some ability, but he does play very excited and fast. i do see some very quick hands and he occasionally plays with a punch, if he feels himself being able to turn the corner he wont hesitate to get his hand up in the tackles chest hard and fast and assure that he bends on the play, hes also got a pretty good shoulder dip, i just think he shows a lot of promise even in his weak areas. 

 

dont get me wrong im not calling him some perfect prospect, but he could be borderline perfect for us, considering how rarely we get to draft high and how badly we need a player just like him, who can bring some very explosive edge rush for us

Oh don't get me wrong I love him as a prospect and agree with all you said. I'd love him at the top of the 2nd and wouldn't be made with him in the first honestly. Definitely see how his ability could fit this defense especially when you consider how a great pass rush can make an average defense look much better. I was just in disagreement with him being plug and play. His energy and intensity is great but you still must stay true to defensive assignments. Again I see a lot of Timmy in him, as in the things at made him so successful in college will need to be refined a bit for the pros but the kid certainly has a ton to work with and a year under Suggs and Doom would do wonders for him imo

[January J]

20 hours ago, RavensFanMania said:

Definitely does seem that way.  I'm an avid Ramsey supporter.  In order and for a couple weeks now I've been Tunsil, Bosa, Ramsey, Buckner, Treadwell.  I'm not on the Spence bandwagon.  Especially with the 6th pick.  Now maybe if he's available towards the middle of the 1st round, I could be up for that, but definitely NOT at six. 

I would much rather sure up the defense than the offense with our high picks this year.  However, I have Tunsil with the first pick, because he shouldn't be passed on if available.  We don't pick this high that often and he would be a great protector for Flacco.  I also still like Stanley. 

I'm pretty much in that same order.

im definitely guilty of flip flopping a bit ..and yeah il admit that a few of you have brought notice to certain prospects that got me to go check out their tape or whatever..but I've been pretty adamant from the beginning that I'm on the Ramsey train. Not only bc of just wanting him here but because I see it as a real possibility at 6 and see Ozzie really coveting his versatility and athletic ability. I converted over to treadwell and Buckner for a short while bc I got a little scared off by some of Ramsey's flaws and what not but I really think I was just overthinking it. He's a damn good prospect any way you look at it and he could easily go top 3. 

[JoeyFlex5]

.With Spence supposedly bombing interviews.. Would the ravens want to pursue him? And if so, how far into the first would you think they may be willing to trade up to get him? I really think he is one of the Best prospects we could land this year and if he begins to slides to the 20s, i would love to see us give a future 2nd or maybe our 2nd and 3rd this year to move up and grab him. It would be a real statement move and a good one I believe

Edited January 31, 2016 by JoeyFlex5

[ravensnation5220]

8 minutes ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

.With Spence supposedly bombing interviews.. Would the ravens want to pursue him? And if so, how far into the first would you think they may be willing to trade up to get him? I really think he is one of the Best prospects we could land this year and if he begins to slides to the 20s, i would love to see us give a future 2nd or maybe our 2nd and 3rd this year to move up and grab him. It would be a real statement move and a good one I believe

Is he really bombing his interviewst though? What ive heard is hes been saying allthe right things. What makes you think hes bombing them?

[JoeyFlex5]

14 minutes ago, ravensnation5220 said:

Is he really bombing his interviewst though? What ive heard is hes been saying allthe right things. What makes you think hes bombing them?

Supposedly was a key word there lol that was the initial report and Walter football posted it so obviously you can't just take it at face value, but I haven't heard anything refuting it yet

[ravensnation5220]

3 minutes ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

Supposedly was a key word there lol that was the initial report and Walter football posted it so obviously you can't just take it at face value, but I haven't heard anything refuting it yet

I watched the senior bowl and all the analysts said hes been honest and strait forward about it, they think his stock is rising and hes really showing his past is really just the past. Figures you got it from walter. I honestly dont read into walter much i feel its way off on a lot of things

[RaineV1]

35 minutes ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

.With Spence supposedly bombing interviews.. Would the ravens want to pursue him? And if so, how far into the first would you think they may be willing to trade up to get him? I really think he is one of the Best prospects we could land this year and if he begins to slides to the 20s, i would love to see us give a future 2nd or maybe our 2nd and 3rd this year to move up and grab him. It would be a real statement move and a good one I believe

The Ravens usual put a priority on getting guys with good character so I could see bad interviews scaring them off from a high potential player. Ozzie and co would grab him in the second without a thought, but a risk player in the top ten might be a stretch. Of course this is assuming that he is actually bombing the interviews.

Edited January 31, 2016 by RaineV1

[January J]

4 hours ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

.With Spence supposedly bombing interviews.. Would the ravens want to pursue him? And if so, how far into the first would you think they may be willing to trade up to get him? I really think he is one of the Best prospects we could land this year and if he begins to slides to the 20s, i would love to see us give a future 2nd or maybe our 2nd and 3rd this year to move up and grab him. It would be a real statement move and a good one I believe

 

3 hours ago, RaineV1 said:

The Ravens usual put a priority on getting guys with good character so I could see bad interviews scaring them off from a high potential player. Ozzie and co would grab him in the second without a thought, but a risk player in the top ten might be a stretch. Of course this is assuming that he is actually bombing the interviews.

That wouldn't stop Ozzie from grabbing him, he's takin chances on guys before and as long as it's not something outstanding or violent then it won't be a concern. Id say if he slips anywhere past 23 or 24 we will try to jump back in. If we did trade our 6th we would have plenty of ammo to do so..but I'd rather keep the 6th unless Tunsil, Bosa, Ramsey and Buckner are all gone. the question is if we jump back to say 15 should we just go ahead and take spence and not even mess around or wait and see if he falls? I guess it depends who else is there..If treadwell is there you gotta take him..but choosing between Alexander, Myles jack and spence would be a real dilemma for me.

[JoeyFlex5]

3 hours ago, January J said:

 

That wouldn't stop Ozzie from grabbing him, he's takin chances on guys before and as long as it's not something outstanding or violent then it won't be a concern. Id say if he slips anywhere past 23 or 24 we will try to jump back in. If we did trade our 6th we would have plenty of ammo to do so..but I'd rather keep the 6th unless Tunsil, Bosa, Ramsey and Buckner are all gone. the question is if we jump back to say 15 should we just go ahead and take spence and not even mess around or wait and see if he falls? I guess it depends who else is there..If treadwell is there you gotta take him..but choosing between Alexander, Myles jack and spence would be a real dilemma for me.

If we trade back to 15 I'm think it comes down to spence, or anyone who may have slipped through the cracks like vh3, alexander, robinson, stanley, or treadwell, guys who have a real shot to slide a bit. 

 

I don't see a guy like spence passing the chiefs or bengals, if we want him With a trade up I think we have to jump the bengals

[January J]

1 hour ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

If we twikl back to 15 I'm think it com es down to spence, or anyone who may have slipped through the cracks like vh3, alexander, robinson, stanley, or treadwell, guys who have a real shot to slide a bit. 

 

I don't see a guy like spence passing the chiefs or bengals, if we want him With a trade up I think we have to jump the bengals

Treadwell, Spence, or vh3 @ 15?  

By the time the draft gets here we Will have run through almost every single possible scenario. 

Edited February 1, 2016 by January J

[JoeyFlex5]

6 minutes ago, January J said:

Treadwell, Spence, or vh3 @ 15?  

By the time the draft gets here we Will have run through almost every single possible scenario. 

just the possibility of a player falling through the cracks, which clearly will be what we are hoping for if we trade back to 15 lol

[Winchester]

1 hour ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

If we trade back to 15 I'm think it comes down to spence, or anyone who may have slipped through the cracks like vh3, alexander, robinson, stanley, or treadwell, guys who have a real shot to slide a bit. 

 

I don't see a guy like spence passing the chiefs or bengals, if we want him With a trade up I think we have to jump the bengals

 

I skimmed through a couple ofBuckners games. I see a very good NFL player but nothing special dominant. Did I miss anything skimming through?? So far I did not see unusual explosion,twitch,power or speed. I did see great flexibility for his size and very savvy. But beyond that why the crush??

[JoeyFlex5]

7 minutes ago, Winchester said:

 

I skimmed through a couple ofBuckners games. I see a very good NFL player but nothing special dominant. Did I miss anything skimming through?? So far I did not see unusual explosion,twitch,power or speed. I did see great flexibility for his size and very savvy. But beyond that why the crush??

versatile, high floor and high ceiling, nobody his size should have a first step as fast as his, its really something special, great length which we could desperately use in our front as most of our linemen are meatballs, and he plays with exceptional power and good footwork and violent and refined hands and arms. i like how well he engages multiple blockers and then drags them laterally to keep the play in front of him, and then i love how decisively and violently he is able to transition from that lateral play into a penetrating move. also hes a high motor, high character guy, and plays with a real swagger, he brings great energy but also is a true team player, he follows assignments and plays disciplined and knows how to "stay home" for the benefit of the team.

 

i remember when you used to rant and rave about drafting an alpha male, well i think buckner is absolutely someone who belongs in that category.

[Winchester]

1 hour ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

versatile, high floor and high ceiling, nobody his size should have a first step as fast as his, its really something special, great length which we could desperately use in our front as most of our linemen are meatballs, and he plays with exceptional power and good footwork and violent and refined hands and arms. i like how well he engages multiple blockers and then drags them laterally to keep the play in front of him, and then i love how decisively and violently he is able to transition from that lateral play into a penetrating move. also hes a high motor, high character guy, and plays with a real swagger, he brings great energy but also is a true team player, he follows assignments and plays disciplined and knows how to "stay home" for the benefit of the team.

 

i remember when you used to rant and rave about drafting an alpha male, well i think buckner is absolutely someone who belongs in that category.

 

I just skimmed through but I did not see the burst off the snap,closing speed and just flashed power. I did see awesome flexibility to bend trim and flatten for a 290lb player. And he plays with unordinary savvy. From what I heard from you and my uncle I expected to see a bigger stronger version of Chandler Jones who is 6'5 270 with very good but not great twitch.However is very flexible and knows how to use that flexibility simultaneously with long arms to fight off double teams and knife to create gaps then twist and bend and flatten to the football. I expected to see that and a little of jj watt twitch and power in a 6'7 295 lb player that has enough speed and athleticism to drop in coverage. But so far I did not see the twitch burst or speed to drop in coverage occasionally. He is very savvy in getting to the runner!! Would be nice if he is all you and my uncle say and ravens got him.a jj watt 2.0

[JoeyFlex5]

You just mentioned buckner drooping in coverage, why would that be part of the evaluation lol... 

 

And yeah I love his ability to get skinny and knife through blockers, that's all part of it. The comparison I see is the easy one, Calais campbell, but I also think he has a jj watt type of ceiling if he has a great work ethic because I think all of his physical tools are superior to campbell

[harfordravenfan]

55 minutes ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

You just mentioned buckner drooping in coverage, why would that be part of the evaluation lol... 

 

And yeah I love his ability to get skinny and knife through blockers, that's all part of it. The comparison I see is the easy one, Calais campbell, but I also think he has a jj watt type of ceiling if he has a great work ethic because I think all of his physical tools are superior to campbell

The "dropping into coverage" part made me lol (my girl asked what I was looking at). Said it in another thread but...Sizzle, Buckner, Williams, jerrigan, doom would be ridiculous

[Ravensfan23]

11 hours ago, Winchester said:

 

I skimmed through a couple ofBuckners games. I see a very good NFL player but nothing special dominant. Did I miss anything skimming through?? So far I did not see unusual explosion,twitch,power or speed. I did see great flexibility for his size and very savvy. But beyond that why the crush??

I agree with this for the most part. I wouldn't touch him in the top 10. I think the talent is certainly there but he's inconsistent and doesn't really play with much technique from the 3 games I watched (MSU,OSU,ORE St). He seems to be able to overpower lesser OL but doesn't know how to use secondary moves to win against better talent. Saw him literally blown off the ball far too much for my liking and overall just looks like an young player who hasn't learned how to use his body yet. I could definitely see a place on the Ravens defense for him and in 2-3 years he could be a really good player once he learns how to use his body. But I think he's gonna get abused against NFL talent early in his career and hopefully he's with a good enough DC that can develop him.

[Jacquouille]

2 hours ago, harfordravenfan said:

The "dropping into coverage" part made me lol (my girl asked what I was looking at). Said it in another thread but...Sizzle, Buckner, Williams, jerrigan, doom would be ridiculous

My thoughts also, having 3 guys upfront who need to be double teamed on every snap is a nightmare for any OC. You bring Doom, ZDS and Sizzle, that's as dominant as it gets.

 

1 hour ago, Ravensfan23 said:

 I think the talent is certainly there but he's inconsistent and doesn't really play with much technique from the 3 games I watched (MSU,OSU,ORE St). He seems to be able to overpower lesser OL but doesn't know how to use secondary moves to win against better talent. Saw him literally blown off the ball far too much for my liking and overall just looks like an young player who hasn't learned how to use his body yet. 

Apparently you and I saw the MSU game very differently. I saw him abusing Conklin (1st round talent, btw) on every play where he was single teamed (don't know if the word exists), and occasionally made some damages when double teamed. Being taken out of a play when you are double teamed or triple teamed is actually a good thing imo, and that's what happened in this game. 

A guy like Mosley would love to have Buckner in the team.

[JoeyFlex5]

9 minutes ago, Jacquouille said:

My thoughts also, having 3 guys upfront who need to be double teamed on every snap is a nightmare for any OC. You bring Doom, ZDS and Sizzle, that's as dominant as it gets.

 

Apparently you and I saw the MSU game very differently. I saw him abusing Conklin (1st round talent, btw) on every play where he was single teamed (don't know if the word exists), and occasionally made some damages when double teamed. Being taken out of a play when you are double teamed or triple teamed is actually a good thing imo, and that's what happened in this game. 

A guy like Mosley would love to have Buckner in the team.

I saw him anchoring well on double teams. He laterally pushed the direction of the line pretty well and on occasion got pushed off the ball but it's to be expected. In the rare occasion he was singled up on conklin, who is by all means a first round NFL tackle, he made absolute lightwork of him, that's exactly what you're looking for from a DT prospect, hold your ground against double teams and dominate in single matchup. I feel like some people expect perfection from every prospect and won't consider them if they don't see that

[Jacquouille]

22 minutes ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

 In the rare occasion he was singled up on conklin, who is by all means a first round NFL tackle, he made absolute lightwork of him, that's exactly what you're looking for from a DT prospect, hold your ground against double teams and dominate in single matchup. I feel like some people expect perfection from every prospect and won't consider them if they don't see that

My opinion basically  in all honesty, I don't understand how not to appreciate the MSU game. It was asolute dominance over a 1st round talent.

[Winchester]

23 minutes ago, JoeyFlex5 said:

I saw him anchoring well on double teams. He laterally pushed the direction of the line pretty well and on occasion got pushed off the ball but it's to be expected. In the rare occasion he was singled up on conklin, who is by all means a first round NFL tackle, he made absolute lightwork of him, that's exactly what you're looking for from a DT prospect, hold your ground against double teams and dominate in single matchup. I feel like some people expect perfection from every prospect and won't consider them if they don't see that

I only skimmed through it and I do not call that dominating Conklin. If he were the star of the defense and that is all he performed it wouldn't change the outcome of a playoff game or disrupt the offense very much. And in my opinion Conklin is very overrated and will be very mediocre in the NFL if that. However if ravens get Buckner it would be cool if you are correct.  But It looks as if Calais Cambell is his limit. Which isn't bad but also not a real game changer like Atkins  Donald  Watt or any game changing defensive player. But it does look as if he will be drafted top10 or better.