Week 13 Discussion (Other NFL Teams)

[beanfigger]

I think any call made that ends a drive with under two minutes left or the game, or potentially ends a drive or a game in that situation, should be reviewed. Ridiculous that everyone in the world sees what really happens and helplessly has to watch when things are blatantly called in favor of the incorrect team.

To this particular blown call Thursday night, who cares? Defend the Hail Mary and win anyway. No time to walk around with your heads down and lose focus. This wasn't a field goal attempt where you have limited ability to defend when things are done right. You were standing sixty yards downfield, and the QB threw the ball TO you. Knock it down.

[52520Andrew]

A lot of people saying to knock the ball down but that wasn't the problem. Rodgers got in front of everyone and was also taller than everyone so he was able to get the ball easily enough. They needed taller guys out there or to position themselves better on the play.

[Inqui]

I think any call made that ends a drive with under two minutes left or the game, or potentially ends a drive or a game in that situation, should be reviewed. Ridiculous that everyone in the world sees what really happens and helplessly has to watch when things are blatantly called in favor of the incorrect team.

That's a decent call. I'm definitely not opposed to seeing something done to improve the standards of officiating, but imo it has to be balanced by not bringing in too many stoppages. The games drag on enough as it is, and wasting another five minutes every time a flag is thrown would probably get me close to turning the game off and taking up Scrabble during the rugby offseason. But balancing it to only be relevant for vital moments isn't the worst idea.

[beanfigger]

A lot of people saying to knock the ball down but that wasn't the problem. Rodgers got in front of everyone and was also taller than everyone so he was able to get the ball easily enough. They needed taller guys out there or to position themselves better on the play.

Basically, they need to find a way to knock the ball down. Better position, taller guys, whatever. You had eight people standing there, and the QB threw the ball TO them, and they let someone else come down and catch it.

[Willbacker]

Isnt there supposed to be a replay booth somewhere In NY overseeing all this action. Concussions not being cited. Bad calls not being stopped. Its just pathetic.

[Cville-Raven]

I think any call made that ends a drive with under two minutes left or the game, or potentially ends a drive or a game in that situation, should be reviewed. Ridiculous that everyone in the world sees what really happens and helplessly has to watch when things are blatantly called in favor of the incorrect team.

To this particular blown call Thursday night, who cares? Defend the Hail Mary and win anyway. No time to walk around with your heads down and lose focus. This wasn't a field goal attempt where you have limited ability to defend when things are done right. You were standing sixty yards downfield, and the QB threw the ball TO you. Knock it down.

yeah those calls really should be reviewed

[BmoreBird22]

That's a decent call. I'm definitely not opposed to seeing something done to improve the standards of officiating, but imo it has to be balanced by not bringing in too many stoppages. The games drag on enough as it is, and wasting another five minutes every time a flag is thrown would probably get me close to turning the game off and taking up Scrabble during the rugby offseason. But balancing it to only be relevant for vital moments isn't the worst idea.

I don't think the games drag on and while most people thought that the replay for all turnovers or scoring plays would really slow down the game, the overall length of games has not been significantly changed. If the NFL adopted the same exact method for personal fouls as they do for turnovers (have NY look at it and only phone in if it's close), then I don't see how the games would be any longer but by maybe like 5 minutes. 

Again, you're talking about a penalty that is 15 yards and a free first down. That's significant in the outcome of most drives. I would be very curious to see how many drives end with a touchdown after a personal foul is called and how many teams pick up a first down after a personal foul is called against them. It is a very significant penalty. 

[52520Andrew]

Basically, they need to find a way to knock the ball down. Better position, taller guys, whatever. You had eight people standing there, and the QB threw the ball TO them, and they let someone else come down and catch it.

Correct me if I am wrong but I don't think a Lions defender touched the ball on that play. They were in terrible position on the play. That is what they needed to improve to even have a chance to knock the ball down, saying they should have knocked it down avoids the real problem on the play.

[beanfigger]

Correct me if I am wrong but I don't think a Lions defender touched the ball on that play. They were in terrible position on the play. That is what they needed to improve to even have a chance to knock the ball down, saying they should have knocked it down avoids the real problem on the play.

That's why I wrote what I wrote. I said they need to find a way, whether it be personnel, position on the ball, etc. maybe they could go the other route and rush more than three to keep the QB contained so he can't get out and have a running start to throw it that far, but they chose to instead drop everyone, so they need to be able to knock it down.

Seriously, it's the only time you can put all your defenders in one place and the QB will still be guaranteed to go there anyway. That play it highly advantage defense. Whatever they did wrong, it all means the same thing. They failed to knock it down. I'm not coaching them; those that are should handle the details and specifics, but I can guarantee what the goal of those coaches is to teach in that situation.

[52520Andrew]

That's why I wrote what I wrote. I said they need to find a way, whether it be personnel, position on the ball, etc. maybe they could go the other route and rush more than three to keep the QB contained so he can't get out and have a running start to throw it that far, but they chose to instead drop everyone, so they need to be able to knock it down.

Seriously, it's the only time you can put all your defenders in one place and the QB will still be guaranteed to go there anyway. That play it highly advantage defense. Whatever they did wrong, it all means the same thing. They failed to knock it down. I'm not coaching them; those that are should handle the details and specifics, but I can guarantee what the goal of those coaches is to teach in that situation.

Knocking the ball down is great and all but if you aren't in position, how are you supposed to knock the ball down? Rodgers lagged behind a bit being a TE and all and was able to cut in front and box everyone out with his frame. I'll say this again, them not being in position was the problem with the play so everyone saying to knock it down when a defender wasn't even in position to touch the ball seems a bit odd to me.

[Inqui]

I don't think the games drag on and while most people thought that the replay for all turnovers or scoring plays would really slow down the game, the overall length of games has not been significantly changed. If the NFL adopted the same exact method for personal fouls as they do for turnovers (have NY look at it and only phone in if it's close), then I don't see how the games would be any longer but by maybe like 5 minutes.

Again, you're talking about a penalty that is 15 yards and a free first down. That's significant in the outcome of most drives. I would be very curious to see how many drives end with a touchdown after a personal foul is called and how many teams pick up a first down after a personal foul is called against them. It is a very significant penalty.

I said I didn't mind the idea of the significant penalties being reviewed as beanfigger outlined. I just think it's a balancing act with not stretching the game out more than necessary. Atm a game takes three and a half hours, of which the game clock ticks for less than a third of that. Add in too many more stoppages and you're genuinely getting close to having a game that takes as long as a cricket game.

[BmoreBird22]

I said I didn't mind the idea of the significant penalties being reviewed as beanfigger outlined. I just think it's a balancing act with not stretching the game out more than necessary. Atm a game takes three and a half hours, of which the game clock ticks for less than a third of that. Add in too many more stoppages and you're genuinely getting close to having a game that takes as long as a cricket game.

I don't think I've seen a three and a half hour game. I recorded the Browns game and started the recording two minutes early and it was 3 hours and 24 minutes with about 20 minutes of pregame. When I recorded the Patriots-Broncos game, it was under three hours and 20 minutes, and that's with OT.

From what I just looked up, teams that commit a high number of 15 yard penalties are averaging maybe two per game. Now, most are probably obvious, like Doom's penalty. So, you maybe review, let's say, 16 per week since that's half of all called and one per game in a game that features probably a max of about four. Let's say that review takes 5 minutes. That Ravens Browns game just went from being three hours and two minutes to three hours and seven minutes. That's not a real biggie to me if it's preventing horrendous official mistakes like the one made in the Lions game

[Inqui]

I don't think I've seen a three and a half hour game. I recorded the Browns game and started the recording two minutes early and it was 3 hours and 24 minutes with about 20 minutes of pregame. When I recorded the Patriots-Broncos game, it was under three hours and 20 minutes, and that's with OT.

From what I just looked up, teams that commit a high number of 15 yard penalties are averaging maybe two per game. Now, most are probably obvious, like Doom's penalty. So, you maybe review, let's say, 16 per week since that's half of all called and one per game in a game that features probably a max of about four. Let's say that review takes 5 minutes. That Ravens Browns game just went from being three hours and two minutes to three hours and seven minutes. That's not a real biggie to me if it's preventing horrendous official mistakes like the one made in the Lions game

I haven't been paying attention this year, but last year I'd get up at 6am for the games and have to be at work by 10 so I was incredibly sensitive to how long they took. I don't think a game ever took less than three hours and if memory serves most were in the realm of three hours 15 minutes and three hours 20 minutes.

I know we're not going to see eye to eye on this, and I know this will be the case with a lot of other fans too because it's just personal preference, but I actually don't mind the occasional refereeing mistake (in the same way I don't mind the occasional mistake from Joe or Jimmy or anyone else) if it just keeps the game flowing. I'm already one of the fans passionate enough for the game to watch at 5am or 6am or whenever, but even I find myself swearing at the telecast and wondering why I bother at the sheer number of stoppages and commercial breaks. Too many more is only going to make me more likely to just get frustrated and switch off, but maybe I'm in the minority and more fans want to see the officials take longer to get every call right. If that's the case then the NFL obviously won't miss my business.

But like I said in the previous posts, that's all kind of a moot point since I agree with beanfigger's idea of reviewing drive-killing/-extending penalties late in the game. I'm not a fan of doing so earlier in the game, but that may or may not be just me.

[beanfigger]

Knocking the ball down is great and all but if you aren't in position, how are you supposed to knock the ball down? Rodgers lagged behind a bit being a TE and all and was able to cut in front and box everyone out with his frame. I'll say this again, them not being in position was the problem with the play so everyone saying to knock it down when a defender wasn't even in position to touch the ball seems a bit odd to me.

 

All I'm saying is that they SHOULD be in position to knock it down. There is no excuse for that. It isn't like the Packers created some kind of magic rope tie to hold them back. There were eight of them back there, and only five Packers running their way. Get in position and knock it down! That's all you are told to do, and it shouldn't be that hard to understand and execute for professional players. This is not Alabama vs D-III. They don't get a pass from me because they misplayed it.

Edited December 5, 2015 by beanfigger

[BmoreBird22]

I haven't been paying attention this year, but last year I'd get up at 6am for the games and have to be at work by 10 so I was incredibly sensitive to how long they took. I don't think a game ever took less than three hours and if memory serves most were in the realm of three hours 15 minutes and three hours 20 minutes.

I know we're not going to see eye to eye on this, and I know this will be the case with a lot of other fans too because it's just personal preference, but I actually don't mind the occasional refereeing mistake (in the same way I don't mind the occasional mistake from Joe or Jimmy or anyone else) if it just keeps the game flowing. I'm already one of the fans passionate enough for the game to watch at 5am or 6am or whenever, but even I find myself swearing at the telecast and wondering why I bother at the sheer number of stoppages and commercial breaks. Too many more is only going to make me more likely to just get frustrated and switch off, but maybe I'm in the minority and more fans want to see the officials take longer to get every call right. If that's the case then the NFL obviously won't miss my business.

But like I said in the previous posts, that's all kind of a moot point since I agree with beanfigger's idea of reviewing drive-killing/-extending penalties late in the game. I'm not a fan of doing so earlier in the game, but that may or may not be just me.

I get bothered quite a bit by stoppages too, but it's when they'll score a touchdown, then go to commercial break, kick off, go to commercial break, come back and have an injury, then there's another commercial. That's a string of like 15 minutes of commercials when I saw like a minute of football. I wish those would be eliminated

[Inqui]

I get bothered quite a bit by stoppages too, but it's when they'll score a touchdown, then go to commercial break, kick off, go to commercial break, come back and have an injury, then there's another commercial. That's a string of like 15 minutes of commercials when I saw like a minute of football. I wish those would be eliminated

Those breaks are the worst. I actually can't think of any other sports that would try to get away with stoppages like that.

[BmoreBird22]

Those breaks are the worst. I actually can't think of any other sports that would try to get away with stoppages like that.

And I think that's the real issue. The NFL is only out for money and commercial revenue is massive. Sad thing is, it won't change.

[Moderator 3]

And I think that's the real issue. The NFL is only out for money and commercial revenue is massive. Sad thing is, it won't change.

Of course not. The ads pay for the TV contracts that pay the player salaries.

[52520Andrew]

All I'm saying is that they SHOULD be in position to knock it down. There is no excuse for that. It isn't like the Packers created some kind of magic rope tie to hold them back. There were eight of them back there, and only five Packers running their way. Get in position and knock it down! That's all you are told to do, and it shouldn't be that hard to understand and execute for professional players. This is not Alabama vs D-III. They don't get a pass from me because they misplayed it.

Yeah them not being in position is what killed them there. They let Rodgers cut in front of them all those guys. My point is that knocking it down didn't come into play because they aren't in position which is a complete failure on their part.

I will say the whole lagging behind part and cutting in front of everyone at the end may be an interesting strategy to try, worked for Jaelen Strong against USC as well.

[BmoreBird22]

Of course not. The ads pay for the TV contracts that pay the player salaries.

Not like the NFL could probably live comfortably on the revenue from merchandise sales and ticket sales while cutting back on commercials a little.

[Moderator 3]

Not like the NFL could probably live comfortably on the revenue from merchandise sales and ticket sales while cutting back on commercials a little.

They could, but the players' salary budget/cap is directly tied to TV revenue.

[BmoreBird22]

They could, but the players' salary budget/cap is directly tied to TV revenue.

What I'm saying is that they could probably make do without and the players could certainly get paid more in other ways. The NFL could expand it so that owners could use a portion of their own revenue, Goodell could cut his salary back, or any other radical idea like this.

 

There are a lot of ways that the NFL could move things along and still keep a... "reasonable" salary cap, but as long as fans are watching, they're just gonna keep making their money.

[Pats]

I cant wait for the vikings game, I think they will beat seattle. Kansas vs oakland and st louis vs arizona are interesting games too.

[Moderator 3]

Or they could make the games pay-per-view and cut the commercials. :-(

Seriously, putting up with ads is the price we pay for "free" TV.

[BmoreBird22]

Or they could make the games pay-per-view and cut the commercials. :-(

Seriously, putting up with ads is the price we pay for "free" TV.

I go out to eat anyway and my mom has NFL Sunday Ticket, so if they made it pay per view, I'm still gonna be watching the game. 

And I completely understand having commercials and that's not the real issue to me. The real issue for me is them scoring a touchdown-commercial-kickoff-commercial and short blips of football followed by long commercial like that. I would much rather them just play a full drive and then go to commercial. 

[Moderator 3]

Try sitting in the stadium, especially in less than optimal weather, through that crap.

[ratedr]

What a horrendous call on an OBVIOUS fumble by the Seahawks.

[allblackraven]

Cardinals without Ellington, as well.

[arnie_uk]

OBJ with an amazing one handed grab there

[52520Andrew]

Cutler doing his best Matt Schaub impression(although it isn't too out of character for him)