NFL Officiating

[1/28/01]

Well, well, well...

It appears the Baltimore Ravens were on the right end of at least one "no call" by the officials that significantly altered a football game last night (possibly two, depending on camera angles)...

http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2015/12/1/9825602/ravens-browns-ending-block-kick-six-refs-blown-call

I'm not holding my breath for Ravens fans to demand for officials to be fired or for the outcome of the game to be changed (which several people advocated in the past), but I just wanted to make sure that people were aware that the perceived "NFL screwjob against the Ravens" wasn't in effect last night and we, too, are known for being on the beneficiary side of poor officiating.

It would be nice if we as fans actually OWNED what we say and how we feel, and apply it universally across the board, regardless of whether the call is beneficial to our team or detrimental to our team.

I mean I get the outrage when the officials make key mistakes (like the Jags game) that are perceived to dramatically alter the outcome of a game, but I noticed the outrage or even attention paid to the same mistakes when we are on the beneficiary side of the call doesn't seem to be as frequent.

What's the explanation for that?

Being somewhat blind in fandom of your team. Riveting thread, ha.

[757RavensFan]

So its just "eye for an eye" now? That's the place our fanbase wants to go?

 

Do we really want to be the fanbase that goes "call for call" across the board and tries to justify how we somehow deserved a call to go in our favor?

 

Don't you think the Browns can point to multiple calls or non-calls last night that went against them as well?

 

Pretty extreme response don't you think?  One person (Ravensdfan) made the comment and you're implying the entire fanbase feels the same way. Just b/c NO one posted their thoughts about it in the forum doesn't mean it wasn't expressed by some in our fanbase. You're smarter than that, well at least you make yourself seem that way. 

Edited December 1, 2015 by 757RavensFan

[rmcjacket23]

Pretty extreme response don't you think?  One person (Ravensdfan) made the comment and you're implying the entire fanbase feels the same way. Just b/c NO one posted their thoughts about it in the forum doesn't mean it wasn't expressed by some in our fanbase. You're smarter than that, well at least you make yourself seem that way. 

Well, two or three other people just posted this same response in other threads.

 

I have no doubt that the common explanation/justification for this play is "well the refs owed us one". I think you yourself are smart enough to see how that would be the common justification on these boards to something like this.

[52520Andrew]

Way to break down what the no call was about as opposed to taking shots at the fanbase.

Personally I don't care, hell give us the loss then to improve our draft position, but saying Levine was lined up in the neutral zone on the final play is not hard.

[1/28/01]

Pretty extreme response don't you think? One person (Ravensdfan) made the comment and you're implying the entire fanbase feels the same way. Just b/c NO one posted their thoughts about it in the forum doesn't mean it wasn't expressed by some in our fanbase. You're smarter than that, well at least you make yourself seem that way.

This is his MO. To make it seem like he is some otherworldly being that sees all from a different perspective. I don't think he understands what a fan is and that there is some level of delusion in every fan. I think it makes him feel better about himself.

[rmcjacket23]

Pretty extreme response don't you think?  One person (Ravensdfan) made the comment and you're implying the entire fanbase feels the same way. Just b/c NO one posted their thoughts about it in the forum doesn't mean it wasn't expressed by some in our fanbase. You're smarter than that, well at least you make yourself seem that way. 

Or maybe the better question is... why didn't fans express their opinion on the call? Is it because nobody knew about it until news sites started to tell them about it?

 

Or, is it possible that nobody expressed their opinion/justification for it because, as I alluded to earlier, its just more convenient to ignore the entire thing happened because the beneficiary of the no-call was the team we cheer for?

 

I mean I agree its far easier as a fan to be outraged by bad calls/no calls against us than it is to own the fact that we received direct benefit from bad calls/no calls a week later, but is that really the "right thing to do"?

[1/28/01]

Why are you, a fan also, expecting anything from a fanbase? Just live your life and WHO CARES WHAT OTHER FANS THINK. You act like it portrays you in a negative light if another Ravens fan goes off about something or whatever. Who cares, dude?

[rmcjacket23]

Way to break down what the no call was about as opposed to taking shots at the fanbase.

Personally I don't care, hell give us the loss then to improve our draft position, but saying Levine was lined up in the neutral zone on the final play is not hard.

The article broke down the no call. Me doing it would be redundant.

 

I agree... its not supposed to be hard. What is hard is for fans to acknowledge it had a significant impact on the outcome of the game. It wasn't hard for many fans to call for job terminations, officiating reform, and reversal of outcomes of games when a similar procedural no-call was made a week prior.

[757RavensFan]

Well, two or three other people just posted this same response in other threads.

 

I have no doubt that the common explanation/justification for this play is "well the refs owed us one". I think you yourself are smart enough to see how that would be the common justification on these boards to something like this.

 

The Ravens fanbase's reaction to this is the same reaction that you would get from EVERY fanbase in the league, "the refs blew a call that allowed us to win, oh well we'll take it"!   And those other FANBASES who lost a game like we did vs Jax would react the same way our fanbase did.  Why are you acting as if Ravens fans are any different than the other fans in the league when it comes to a situation like this?

Edited December 1, 2015 by 757RavensFan

[1/28/01]

Or maybe the better question is... why didn't fans express their opinion on the call? Is it because nobody knew about it until news sites started to tell them about it?

Or, is it possible that nobody expressed their opinion/justification for it because, as I alluded to earlier, its just more convenient to ignore the entire thing happened because the beneficiary of the no-call was the team we cheer for?

I mean I agree its far easier as a fan to be outraged by bad calls/no calls against us than it is to own the fact that we received direct benefit from bad calls/no calls a week later, but is that really the "right thing to do"?

Why does it matter to you what is right or wrong for how a fan reacts or what he/she says?

[rmcjacket23]

Why are you, a fan also, expecting anything from a fanbase? Just live your life and WHO CARES WHAT OTHER FANS THINK. You act like it portrays you in a negative light if another Ravens fan goes off about something or whatever. Who cares, dude?

You do understand the gigantic level of irony of asking "who cares what other fans think" while posting on an internet forum that is specifically designed for people to see what other fans think correct?

 

The mere fact that people spend time out of their day to post even once on a forum like this is about as much proof as you need that they care about other fans think.

 

You, like me, quote and respond to other posters. By definition, that's caring what other fans think.

 

And yes, in many ways, as a fan of a certain team, what the fanbase thinks or even what a segment of the fanbase thinks reflects upon me as a fan, for obvious reasons.

[ravensdfan]

Nope, I'm saying when we demand a victory be reversed from a bad call, we should at the same demand voluntarily hand back a victory when the bad call benefits us. Surely you would agree that would be the "right thing to do" and would display integrity would it not?

 

You last paragraph nailed it right on the head... and its my entire point. Not everything should get called. But what make a fanbase look really, really, really, really bad is when we overreact to something like the officials not calling a procedural penalty on the Jags that cost our team a game, and then almost simultaneously not even acknowledge that a procedural penalty no call benefited us in a substantial way.

 

Neither call was blatant or obvious, despite the fact that the fanbase a week ago thought the call was so obvious, despite not even knowing that the Jags had made an error until somebody else pointed it out to them. And that was literally the end of the world. But this isn't?

 

I had no issue with the officiating last night whatsoever. I thought it was well officiated on both sides. But the overreaction that comes from fans demanding job terminations, outcome changes, etc. from calls that are very similar from both a procedural and impact standpoint shouldn't go unnoticed.

Cool. So when they award us the win versus Jax then we'll offer to give this one back. I must have missed where the NFL made such an offer after that game.

 

If the NFL is going to basically say "yep we made a mistake, human error, it happens, suck it up" then we should get to revel in this type of win even if they miss a call. You claim some double standard by this fanbase like it is JUST this fanbase when it comes from the NFL itself. When they actually reverse a game outcome because of the officiating mistakes, you can get back to us on that.

[rmcjacket23]

The Ravens fanbase's reaction to this is the same reaction that you would get from EVERY fanbase in the league, "the refs blew a call that allowed us to win, oh well we'll take it"!   And those other FANBASES who lost a game like we did vs Jax would react the same way our fanbase did.  Why are you acting as if Ravens fans are any different than the other fans in the league when it comes to a situation like this?

They're not. At no point in time did I give any indication that other fanbases handle this differently.

 

But there's frequently a lot of morality, "right thing to do" cards being played on here on a variety of topics, and this certainly doesn't fall under that category. A natural fanatic reaction to something doesn't mean the reaction is reasonable, intelligent, or justified.

[TuckerTime9]

Who cares honestly, it's two irrelevant teams playoff-wise and this game had no major implications other than the fact that now they get a better draft pick and we don't. 

[rmcjacket23]

Cool. So when they award us the win versus Jax then we'll offer to give this one back. I must have missed where the NFL made such an offer after that game.

 

If the NFL is going to basically say "yep we made a mistake, human error, it happens, suck it up" then we should get to revel in this type of win even if they miss a call. You claim some double standard by this fanbase like it is JUST this fanbase when it comes from the NFL itself. When they actually reverse a game outcome because of the officiating mistakes, you can get back to us on that.

They didn't make such an offer, nor would they. So why should fans ask for them to do so, which they did ask them to do? 

 

In similar fashion... we want the officials fired or suspended when they make a mistake like the Jags game, but we are fine with them keeping their job when they make a mistake like they did last night? Understand that we are discussing people's employment status at this point... not just a game.

[ravensdfan]

They're not. At no point in time did I give any indication that other fanbases handle this differently.

 

But there's frequently a lot of morality, "right thing to do" cards being played on here on a variety of topics, and this certainly doesn't fall under that category. A natural fanatic reaction to something doesn't mean the reaction is reasonable, intelligent, or justified.

Dude, this is a win between 2 teams that are not going anywhere this season. Not some Perry Mason episode where someone innocent is going to jail. Not everyone defending some dirty hit that ended the season/career of some player. There is no moral high ground here.

[757RavensFan]

They're not. At no point in time did I give any indication that other fanbases handle this differently.

 

But there's frequently a lot of morality, "right thing to do" cards being played on here on a variety of topics, and this certainly doesn't fall under that category. A natural fanatic reaction to something doesn't mean the reaction is reasonable, intelligent, or justified.

 

So if one forum member would have said "there was a penalty prior to the kick" are you saying you would not have created this post?  

 

Ok, here you go.  He was lined up in the neutral zone, should have been a 5 yard penalty and a re-kick.  

I also thought there was a block in the back during Hill's return that I was certain was going to be called but it wasn't.

 

Happy now??  

[January J]

Only difference is the call against us in the jaguar game (or non call) directly changed the outcome of the game. The non call in the Cleveland game didn't DIRECTLY change the winner of the game Because they would have still had to make the feild goal. Small difference I know, but important to note.

Edited December 1, 2015 by January J

[rmcjacket23]

Dude, this is a win between 2 teams that are not going anywhere this season. Not some Perry Mason episode where someone innocent is going to jail. Not everyone defending some dirty hit that ended the season/career of some player. There is no moral high ground here.

Precisely, and this exact same paragraph could apply to last weeks game vs the Jags. Many fans had no issue taking the moral high ground there, and had they not (which I agree they shouldn't have), I wouldn't have even brought this discussion up.

[1/28/01]

You do understand the gigantic level of irony of asking "who cares what other fans think" while posting on an internet forum that is specifically designed for people to see what other fans think correct?

The mere fact that people spend time out of their day to post even once on a forum like this is about as much proof as you need that they care about other fans think.

You, like me, quote and respond to other posters. By definition, that's caring what other fans think.

And yes, in many ways, as a fan of a certain team, what the fanbase thinks or even what a segment of the fanbase thinks reflects upon me as a fan, for obvious reasons.

Nice try. Cute, but not related. I (and most others) don't care how other fans react to calls, no calls, opinions about how they should act, what they should say, how it makes them/me look etc. Again, good try, though.

[Moderator 3]

Bump for merge.

[rmcjacket23]

So if one forum member would have said "there was a penalty prior to the kick" are you saying you would not have created this post?  

 

Ok, here you go.  He was lined up in the neutral zone, should have been a 5 yard penalty and a re-kick.  

I also thought there was a block in the back during Hill's return that I was certain was going to be called but it wasn't.

 

Happy now??  

Maybe, although last week there was about five different forums that were topic hijacked by poor officiating and how bad we get screwed out of a victory. I wouldn't have expected that response, but no response at all doesn't quite seem to be appropriate.

[52520Andrew]

The article broke down the no call. Me doing it would be redundant.

 

I agree... its not supposed to be hard. What is hard is for fans to acknowledge it had a significant impact on the outcome of the game. It wasn't hard for many fans to call for job terminations, officiating reform, and reversal of outcomes of games when a similar procedural no-call was made a week prior.

 

Yeah it should but at the same time, I shouldn't have to go into the link to find out what the no call even is. Maybe it is just me but I like having the general info available in the opening post with the link available for more in depth reading.

 

Yeah, I will say the refs did not seem as bad last night but if they missed a call then they missed a call. What I am curious about is how often people may be a bit offsides on field goal attempts and the like and how often that is called, especially at the end of the game.

 

This really isn't about this game or the Jags game but just a thought. I think something that may be contributing to the decline in officiating these days may be the media and fans over analyzing every single call and the fact that replay can make guys look really dumb. It should not be an excuse but I am sure it makes an already difficult job even harder with the added pressure to not look stupid.

[arnie_uk]

Maybe, although last week there was about five different forums that were topic hijacked by poor officiating and how bad we get screwed out of a victory. I wouldn't have expected that response, but no response at all doesn't quite seem to be appropriate.

there's a whole other thread on bad officiating from all around the league.

Go into the other teams section and go through each week of game threads and youll see lots of members complaining about bad officiating all the time.

Get off your high horse mate.

Edited December 1, 2015 by arnie_uk

[arnie_uk]

Levine adjusted his stance to avoid offsides but places hand in nuetral zone.

Funny thing is,

1, the line we used was illegal, you can't overload one side like that.

2.Levine jumped early

3. Will Hill stepped out of bounds

there's two people from the 2 most recent pages of the brown's thread mentioning it.

[Moderator 3]

From Twitter: NFL says Ravens were not offside on blocked field goal.

So, apparently the pictures flying around that seem to show a neutral zone infraction were taken AFTER the Center moved the ball. There was no infraction. According to Dean Blandino: "On FG block last night the ball was spotted on the 33 1/2-yard line. Video/pics going around have line drawn through 33."

The refs actually got the "no call" right.

[Willbacker]

Ive listened to the opening drive and the afternoon blitz all day and heard not one thing about an offside with several Browns callers not mentioning this at all. So yes there is a major diffrence between this game and the Jag game

[The Mom Gene]

Ive listened to the opening drive and the afternoon blitz all day and heard not one thing about an offside with several Browns callers not mentioning this at all. So yes there is a major diffrence between this game and the Jag game

 

I actually had a P*t's fan call me out this morning on FB.  I mean really???  The guy is going to call me out and make a reference to the refs???  After he spent the entire day yesterday whining about the refs in the Broncos/P*ts game

[arnie_uk]

Well, well, well...

It appears the Baltimore Ravens were on the right end of at least one "no call" by the officials that significantly altered a football game last night (possibly two, depending on camera angles)...

http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2015/12/1/9825602/ravens-browns-ending-block-kick-six-refs-blown-call

I'm not holding my breath for Ravens fans to demand for officials to be fired or for the outcome of the game to be changed (which several people advocated in the past), but I just wanted to make sure that people were aware that the perceived "NFL screwjob against the Ravens" wasn't in effect last night and we, too, are known for being on the beneficiary side of poor officiating.

It would be nice if we as fans actually OWNED what we say and how we feel, and apply it universally across the board, regardless of whether the call is beneficial to our team or detrimental to our team.

I mean I get the outrage when the officials make key mistakes (like the Jags game) that are perceived to dramatically alter the outcome of a game, but I noticed the outrage or even attention paid to the same mistakes when we are on the beneficiary side of the call doesn't seem to be as frequent.

What's the explanation for that?

just popping in to say LOL. Don't think there is much better than a "know it all" getting shown to be incorrect on these boards

[Willbacker]

I actually had a P*t's fan call me out this morning on FB.  I mean really???  The guy is going to call me out and make a reference to the refs???  After he spent the entire day yesterday whining about the refs in the Broncos/P*ts game

 

lol especially after all the breaks the Pats have received over the years. I'm starting to smell desperation.