[News] Late For Work 11/13: Ravens' Quiet Change At Wide Receiver

[NNITRED]

"My guess is they are just trying to keep him relevant and ease all the fan scrutiny." Their making it worse! Its like poking a sore. We know Ozzie wasted a number one pick on a number two at best. I bet $100.00 Ozzie does not pick another receiver next year draft because what happens if next year Ozzie picks a receiver say at number two or latter and he tuns out a big time number one. Perriman's history. Ozzie looks bad. Ozzie can't do it.

It doesn't help that Perriman wasn't primary first round target. He was targeted for he second round but the Steelers snatched up  Bud Dupree and forced Ozzie's hand. Ozzie returned the favor with max Williams. I've said for ages that a bigtime receiver is not likely to land in Baltimore because Ozzie can't draft them and he has no intention of paying for one.  He just adding more duct tape than to properly address the need. Even if Perriman turns out to be a gem later on he's history at the end of his rookie contract.  Ozzie's value is more important than market value. 

[Ravenshine]

Are these ?'s you refer to the ones we see here?

Yes. Our WR situation has a big ? now...SSS out, new guys stepping up, older players not resigned. Sigh...tis the season of ?s for us it does appear. More so than other years anyway.

Edited November 13, 2015 by Ravenshine

[MikebRaven]

Yes. Our WR situation has a big ? now...SSS out, new guys stepping up, older players not resigned. Sigh...tis the season of ?s for us it does appear. More so than other years anyway.

It will get sorted out...it always does...then again there's always comes more questions too lol.

[NNITRED]

 

The entire conversation was about giving Givens a fair shot, I agree we need to STOP comparing him to Torrey.  Let him prove he can make a difference, and to refresh people's minds about why Torrey isn't here anymore...  Just sayin'.  Others were remorsing Torrey's departure...  not me, that's for sure.

 

P.S...  That one catch was the only chance we had at that point, and yes, would have won the game. 

 

 

 

Torrey isn't her because of money and no other reason. 11TDs, 571yds +21 FDs via pass interfernce and 0 fumbles is nothing to sneeze at and we have nothing (even with Sr.) to make up for it.  Ozzie refused to pay market value Smith.That's fine but he also refused to pull in a proven free agent  or move up in the draft to take what was sorely needed. OTOH he had no problem giving Jimmy Smith a $55million deal  ($20million more than Torrey's offer ) while was still injured , still under contract , and literally only one season of decent production where he wasn't  teetering between getting injured and getting smoked.  Sometimes Ozzie screws up. 

Edited November 13, 2015 by NNITRED

[rmcjacket23]

Torrey isn't her because of money and no other reason. 11TDs, 571yds +21 FDs via pass interfernce and 0 fumbles is nothing to sneeze at and we have nothing (even with Sr.) to make up for it.  Ozzie refused to pay market value Smith.That's fine but he also refused to pull in a proven free agent  or move up in the draft to take what was sorely needed. OTOH he had no problem giving Jimmy Smith a $55million deal  ($20million more than Torrey's offer ) while was still injured , still under contract , and literally only one season of decent production where he wasn't  teetering between getting injured and getting smoked.  Sometimes Ozzie screws up. 

Just to clear up a couple misconceptions...

 

1. Torrey is getting $22M guaranteed, Smith is getting $21M guaranteed. The other numbers in a contract don't really matter because they can be erased at any time. Its like people thinking Joe Flacco is making $120M... not even remotely close to it.

 

2. You're referencing unsustainable statistics, which is one of the reasons why we let him walk. He scored 11 TDs in 2014, yet he averaged about 6-7 TDs a year before that. In an offense where he was the #1 WR in 2013, he had more catches and more yardage, yet only scored 4 TDs. How does that happen?

 

Its because banking on things like TDs and pass interferences drawn (which is a laughable measurement to judge a player by, so its incredibly inconsistent) aren't sustainable measurements for WRs. They are what are known as outliers, and its why smart teams don't chase them.

 

Go look at many of the great WRs in this league, and you'll see highly fluctuating TD numbers. Look at Calvin Johnson... his probably best season as a Lion was one of his lowest TD totals of his career.

[The Greek]

givens will have a monster game sunday. just a feeling i have

[NNITRED]

Just to clear up a couple misconceptions...

 

1. Torrey is getting $22M guaranteed, Smith is getting $21M guaranteed. The other numbers in a contract don't really matter because they can be erased at any time. Its like people thinking Joe Flacco is making $120M... not even remotely close to it.

 

2. You're referencing unsustainable statistics, which is one of the reasons why we let him walk. He scored 11 TDs in 2014, yet he averaged about 6-7 TDs a year before that. In an offense where he was the #1 WR in 2013, he had more catches and more yardage, yet only scored 4 TDs. How does that happen?

 

Its because banking on things like TDs and pass interferences drawn (which is a laughable measurement to judge a player by, so its incredibly inconsistent) aren't sustainable measurements for WRs. They are what are known as outliers, and its why smart teams don't chase them.

 

Go look at many of the great WRs in this league, and you'll see highly fluctuating TD numbers. Look at Calvin Johnson... his probably best season as a Lion was one of his lowest TD totals of his career.

That's with the 49ers. Smith was offered $35million/19gntd from the Ravens. What #22 got was great in guaranteed money and contract value.  That also doesn't change the fact that jimmy Smith was extended when the measurables pointed against. Rosenhaus threatened the Ravens with the free market and won. Again J.Smith wasn't even cleared to practice when this took place. So far (including the last game) WOs have been torching Smith. Torrey has a 4 year body of work to measure him by. Stats   like the PI yardage are part of the total package. Smith had six teams trying pull him in during free agency with Boldin's helping to seal the deal.  I would guess that they weren't all less than smart. Paying Top 5 money to an injured DB with only single season of decent production isn't very smart by any stretch- but Ozzie chased it.

 

Edited November 13, 2015 by NNITRED

[rmcjacket23]

That's with the 49ers. Smith was offered $35million/19gntd from the Ravens. What #22 got was great in guaranteed money and contract value.  That also doesn't change the fact that jimmy Smith was extended when the measurables pointed against. Rosenhaus threatened the Ravens with the free market and won. Again J.Smith wasn't even cleared to practice when this took place. So far (including the last game) WOs have been torching Smith. Torrey has a 4 year body of work to measure him by. Stats   like the PI yardage are part of the total package. Smith had six teams trying pull him in during free agency with Boldin's helping to seal the deal.  I would guess that they weren't all less than smart. Paying Top 5 money to an injured DB with only single season of decent production isn't very smart by any stretch- but Ozzie chased it.

 

Sure, but its still all hindsight at this point. Corners like Jimmy get contracts he did (which isn't even that substantial by CB standards) because corners like Jimmy are incredibly hard to find and are exponentially more valuable. Low supply + high demand = high price tag.

 

For the most part, the exact opposite applies for WRs, particularly one's with Torrey's skills and how limited they are. Torrey does have a four year body of work, and its filled with ups and downs and a largely unimpressive fourth year with this team, though people like to reference the unsustainable TD and PI numbers as reference for some reason I still haven't figured out, since we know how unsustainable they are and how much they fluctuate. Fans like to pretend like drawing PI penalties is somehow a special skill set that warrants other teams to pay him more to do that, but I'd be stunned if any team in the league paid him more money because he may draw penalties. That's largely preventable, as we see by his fluctuations this year.

 

I'm not arguing that other teams don't know what they're doing when they offer these guys these contracts, because generally they do. However, that doesn't mean that they get these values right nor does it mean that a bunch of teams can't whiff on these perceived values, which you see annually in this league.

 

From this team alone, I have no idea how Dannell Ellerbe gets $14M guaranteed from the Dolphins, but he did, and they weren't the only suitor for him. Two years later, he's demoted, benched, cut, and shipped to New Orleans for about half the price... and that all happened within two seasons.

 

I don't blame Ozzie for perceiving to "overpay" for a corner with an injury history. The risk of NOT doing so, as we pretty much see, given the lack of depth we have at the position in the last two years, is greater than the risk of "overpaying". 

 

If you think things can't be worse in our secondary, bench Jimmy for one of the garbage guys we got riding the pine right now and see what happens.

[leroy31]

It doesn't help that Perriman wasn't primary first round target. He was targeted for he second round but the Steelers snatched up  Bud Dupree and forced Ozzie's hand. Ozzie returned the favor with max Williams. I've said for ages that a bigtime receiver is not likely to land in Baltimore because Ozzie can't draft them and he has no intention of paying for one.  He just adding more duct tape than to properly address the need. Even if Perriman turns out to be a gem later on he's history at the end of his rookie contract.  Ozzie's value is more important than market value. 

Breshad will probably be better than Phillip Dorsett who was draft a few spots later, but NFL analysts projected Breshad earlier than where the Ravens drafted him how was he a 2nd rounder?

[NNITRED]

Breshad will probably be better than Phillip Dorsett who was draft a few spots later, but NFL analysts projected Breshad earlier than where the Ravens drafted him how was he a 2nd rounder?

Projected First rounders siting at the tables after the first round is nothing  new. The Ravens wanted Bud Dupree and had no intentions of going for a WO in the first round. They certainly weren't going to take a TE and RB in first. Perriman was Plan B. i'm not saying the kid won't turn out to be a killer. He simply wasn't the first choice.  

Edited November 13, 2015 by NNITRED

[OzzieBisciotti]

Breshard Perriman sucks- plain and simple- because he's like Webb and Jimmy Smith- more on the hospital bed than the playing field. We know what we had in Torrey, we STILL have no idea what Perriman is capable of because he's limping around all the time. This was a bad pick regardless because we're only going to have him (at best) for 3 years out of a 4 year contract- great going Kevin Anderson, I mean Ozzie Smith!

[billiejean]

The entire conversation was about giving Givens a fair shot, I agree we need to STOP comparing him to Torrey.  Let him prove he can make a difference, and to refresh people's minds about why Torrey isn't here anymore...  Just sayin'.  Others were remorsing Torrey's departure...  not me, that's for sure.

 

P.S...  That one catch was the only chance we had at that point, and yes, would have won the game. 

i am "remorsing" torrey's departure

[RavensBaltimore]

look at any of his highlight tapes he catches the ball 95 percent of the time with his hands.  women lie, men lie, numbers don't lie 

Highlight tapes are cherry picked plays, and cherry picked information has about the same amount of credibility as a lie. Do you really think GMs and scouts evaluate players through highlight tapes? Of course they don't. Otherwise, every decent college player would be a first round talent, and every mediocre NFL player would be a pro bowler.

[Halshayeji]

Breshard Perriman sucks- plain and simple- because he's like Webb and Jimmy Smith- more on the hospital bed than the playing field. We know what we had in Torrey, we STILL have no idea what Perriman is capable of because he's limping around all the time. This was a bad pick regardless because we're only going to have him (at best) for 3 years out of a 4 year contract- great going Kevin Anderson, I mean Ozzie Smith!

Perriman is a first rounder and the Ravens have an option to keep Perriman for a 5th year. So worst case scenario the guy got hurt and missed the year. Why are we calling him a bust before you see him play a down?

Edited November 14, 2015 by Halshayeji

[WordProphet]

Is Perriman going to play at all this year??? I mean why is this thing about Perriman so hush, hush, is Ozzie and Harbaugh scared to say something about it???

[Crusader]

One of these receivers playing tomorrow is about to put Perriman on the bench as second or third string with brown and elam. The other busts.

[whobilly]

It would take a lot more than our Practice Squad receiving corps to push a first round pick to the bench. He's pretty much doing that on his own anyway.

[Ravenshine]

It will get sorted out...it always does...then again there's always comes more questions too lol.

Yes, I know it's not that I'm worried, or even upset. I've kept the faith all along. So, it's more like...you know, that Tom Petty song The Waiting is the Hardest Part? Yeah...like that.

Waiting for this team to prove the doubters wrong. Words are no use it's actions (as in they speak louder). And mainly the so-called professional sports journalists and so-called NFL sites lol, the latter of which is just a propaganda machine for a few 'select' football franchises (and don't forget to buy their merchandise wink wink) and the former of which whom are masquerading as legit journalists but are actually glorified cyber bullies and spin doctors for the 'elite' few teams. No wonder they raise the question is Joe Flacco elite? It's so they can put doubt on it and in people's minds. And they did this even right after he and Ravens won Super Bowl. It's too bad 2013 and beyond we had to go through so many personel changes because this justified the journals points and gave them fodder, and it's like we've climbed our way back into fighting trim and then this year all the injuries happen.

I'm not frustrated tho, I enjoy keeping the faith and waiting for the day those doubters have to eat crow (not Ravens lol).

Edited November 14, 2015 by Ravenshine

[January J]

Yes, I know it's not that I'm worried, or even upset. I've kept the faith all along. So, it's more like...you know, that Tom Petty song The Waiting is the Hardest Part? Yeah...like that.

Waiting for this team to prove the doubters wrong. Words are no use it's actions (as in they speak louder). And mainly the so-called professional sports journalists and so-called NFL sites lol, the latter of which is just a propaganda machine for a few 'select' football franchises (and don't forget to buy their merchandise wink wink) and the former of which whom are masquerading as legit journalists but are actually glorified cyber bullies and spin doctors for the 'elite' few teams. No wonder they raise the question is Joe Flacco elite? It's so they can put doubt on it and in people's minds. And they did this even right after he and Ravens won Super Bowl. It's too bad 2013 and beyond we had to go through so many personel changes because this justified the journals points and gave them fodder, and it's like we've climbed our way back into fighting trim and then this year all the injuries happen.

I'm not frustrated tho, I enjoy keeping the faith and waiting for the day those doubters have to eat crow (not Ravens lol).

couldn't agree more. you are very well spoken.

[Ravenshine]

couldn't agree more. you are very well spoken.

Thank you!