[News] Eisenberg: Ravens' New Goal Is To Limit Disappointment To One Season

[4th&29]

Since it's hunting season on everyone in the Ravens organization, what about the conditioning and the medical staff? Last year it might have been an exception, but to have players drop like flies a second year in a row means we must probably be doing something wrong in that department too. How many players will be on IR after 16 games? We had 19 last year and we are on track to top that number.

[Ravenshine]

this is just one mans opinion. eisenburg is not harbaugh.

Ah...So Harbs is still playoff bound? You go get em Harbs!

[Amesr52]

PalmBayRaven.... I hear what you are saying and I also wanted to expect so much more out of Flacco this season. He has the tools and he is an 8 year veteran with a ton of post season success and experience. He is growing and I was hoping to see the best Flacco we have ever seen but I also had to remind myself... that this is Joe's 4th OC in 4 years! 4 new systems in 4 years. 4 new ways of doing things---- 4 new play books to learn. That has to slow development at some point. We have to expect a learning curve to some degree. Next... I remembered that we have a 36 your old # 1 WR and a rookie # 2.... and a bunch of unproven players behind them. A couple of injuries to our # 1 and #2 and all of a sudden we have a veteran QB in a new system with little help. No targets and a OL in front of him that is also learning a new system and had some difficulty protecting him early. Joe has took more of a beaten this season then I have ever seen him. IF we can get another year under Trestman, add a few legit weapons at WR.... give those young TE's a year to develop and lock up KO or add depth on that OL... I expect Joe to have a career year next season... this season seemed to be too much stacked against him (and he still may pass for record yardage)!

A realist perspective.  I agree with everything you said.  Look how much of a difference one year made for Gilmore,  he trained hard over the offseason and looks great this year.  Now we have the potential have 3 great TEs next season.  I think the problem is with the playcalling too.  We dont have the line to run a bunch of screens and wr screens.  Trestman has also always been known as an aggressive pass happy coordinator that we know is trying to become more balanced with his playcalling but thats gotta be hard to play calls in a different way than he is used too bc want to keep the same system kubiak ran.  We ran a lot of 2 TE formations last year and now we run a lot of 3 wr and 1 TE formations and try to run the zone scheme out of it.  Lining up with 2 TEs allows the line to cover more of the field and allows more holes to pick and run through.  I dont think Pees is to blame for the defense either.  I have seen him try just about everything there is to try on defense.  Nickle, man, rushing 6 or 7 guys, rushing 3 and having everyone else play zone.  You cant change personnel and personnel is the problem.  We have too many average players that cant hold up an entire NFL game.

[rmcjacket23]

Since it's hunting season on everyone in the Ravens organization, what about the conditioning and the medical staff? Last year it might have been an exception, but to have players drop like flies a second year in a row means we must probably be doing something wrong in that department too. How many players will be on IR after 16 games? We had 19 last year and we are on track to top that number.

Most of that falls on the players. I don't blame other people for something that is completely within my control, and neither should players or fans.

 

If you want to see better conditioning, I'd start by looking at what the players are doing from February through May/June. The Ravens conditioning coach is really only useful for about 2-3 months a year. After that, they're on their own...

[Moderator 3]

It sometimes takes YEARS for a team to get the right mix of players...

Quoted for truth. Take the Bengals as an example. They may be succeeding NOW, but look at how many years it has taken...years of drafting high, too.

[trevorsteadman]

I want someone to tell me what OTHER QB has had 4 different Coordinators in 4 years in the league.  What OTHER QB has won a Super Bowl without having the weapons around him to succeed...  Many have done much WORST with way MORE.  I am forever amazed at the number of people that just believe that you can take mediocre Linemen, and mediocre receivers and make any QB look good.  It just doesn't happen that way.  It sometimes takes YEARS for a team to get the right mix of players... 

I am glad someone shares this thinking with me. If people would just think about this it isn't that hard. What team has Forsett started for in this league before us? None he was a back up his entire career until the Ray Rice incident. Even in that case I believe Taliaferro was getting a lot of starting snaps before him. Kamar Aiken... Been on several practice squads and now is our STARTING receiver. Not a role receiver, a starter. He was our #1 guy with Steve Smith out. Marlon Brown.... Undrafted and only had a good year which was 700 yards during our other bad year. Tight ends? We have a guy from last year's draft that has shown flashes but still is young. We have Maxx Williams who has yet to make an impact who many thought would be rookie of the year. You can blame it on Flacco all you want but getting rid of him would put the franchise in the worst position of all. Every coach that he has had said he was elite. Look at Kubiak who now has Peyton Manning. Who has done better so far in Kubiak's offense? Flacco. Who had more weapons? Denver. They have two elite wide receivers in Demaryius Thomas and Emmanuel Sanders. Steve Smith is the only weapon Flacco has. Steve Smith is 36 years old with 4 broken ribs from crying out loud and he was the only person who got open more than 2 or 3 times against San Francisco. Flacco hasn't put up big stats because he does not have anyone around him. You can jump on the anti Joe Flacco band wagon, but I'm not falling for that. It is easy to see he has no one and I don't understand why people cannot see that. Watch the tape to see receivers failing to get separation. Steve Smith is still playing like he is 25 and he is the only person on the Raven's offense that is moving the ball for us. Forsett has done okay but the run game has been off and on all year which is because of the offensive line's inability in certain situations to move the defensive line in front of them. Kubiak said the only reason he has a job right now as a head coach is because of Flacco and I believe that.

[Ravenshine]

I want someone to tell me what OTHER QB has had 4 different Coordinators in 4 years in the league.  What OTHER QB has won a Super Bowl without having the weapons around him to succeed...  Many have done much WORST with way MORE.  I am forever amazed at the number of people that just believe that you can take mediocre Linemen, and mediocre receivers and make any QB look good.  It just doesn't happen that way.  It sometimes takes YEARS for a team to get the right mix of players...

Not to mention Flaccos been getting blitzed a lot more these days, pockets not getting protected like it used to.

[Amesr52]

I don't see why people love Harbaugh so much, you think he went on a run but what really happened was our good team finally got a QB, which was our weak spot. We could have done that with just Ozzie and no head coach.

With personalities like Ed Reed, Ray Lewis, Haloti Nghata, Bernard Pollard, Terrel Suggs.  IF you dont have a really great head coach to keep those personalities in line it can destroy a team just as much as help a team.  Those guys are great and they expect everyone to be as great as they were which is a hard thing for other players to know that they would never be in the spotlight like those guys.  Head coach keeps everyone on the same page aiming for the same goals.  Harbs is not a bad coach.  We have just been good for so long that its starting to get to our team.  There is a lot of pressure on the players because this has been a winning organization since the beginning.  A lot is expected from the management and the players. How many of our best coaches and management have left for new jobs elsewhere because of performance here.  Marvin Lewis, Rex Ryan for example.  We lost our head of college scouting director a few years ago and some of our scouts went on to better positions on other teams.  When you lose a lot of your great scouts and great coaches and have to replace them it makes it hard to get the same results and I think we are seeing the effects of that now.  There will be a lot of pressure on the scouts and coaches this offseason to scout the right players for the draft and bring in the right players from free agency.

[bucketonuts]

PalmBayRaven.... I hear what you are saying and I also wanted to expect so much more out of Flacco this season. He has the tools and he is an 8 year veteran with a ton of post season success and experience. He is growing and I was hoping to see the best Flacco we have ever seen but I also had to remind myself... that this is Joe's 4th OC in 4 years! 4 new systems in 4 years. 4 new ways of doing things---- 4 new play books to learn. That has to slow development at some point. We have to expect a learning curve to some degree. Next... I remembered that we have a 36 your old # 1 WR and a rookie # 2.... and a bunch of unproven players behind them. A couple of injuries to our # 1 and #2 and all of a sudden we have a veteran QB in a new system with little help. No targets and a OL in front of him that is also learning a new system and had some difficulty protecting him early. Joe has took more of a beaten this season then I have ever seen him. IF we can get another year under Trestman, add a few legit weapons at WR.... give those young TE's a year to develop and lock up KO or add depth on that OL... I expect Joe to have a career year next season... this season seemed to be too much stacked against him (and he still may pass for record yardage)!

To be fair, Flacco did throw two perfect passes to receivers in the end zone who didn't catch them this weekend. True, the stupid interceptions hurt. He admitted it but he never said anything about his teamates dropping his passes.

[MTRavensFan]

To be fair, Flacco did throw two perfect passes to receivers in the end zone who didn't catch them this weekend. True, the stupid interceptions hurt. He admitted it but he never said anything about his teamates dropping his passes.

Joe never does.

He NEVER throws a teammate under the bus. Owns it all.

[trevorsteadman]

Not to mention Flaccos been getting blitzed a lot more these days, pockets not getting protected like it used to.

Which leads to him throwing off his back foot to get rid of the ball which leads to interceptions. Yes the second interception he threw was awful but he had just as many good plays as he did bad with no weapons. 

[Amesr52]

Quoted for truth. Take the Bengals as an example. They may be succeeding NOW, but look at how many years it has taken...years of drafting high, too.

The Ravens went 3 or 4 years of being one or two plays away from going to the superbowl before actually making it to the superbowl.

[trevorsteadman]

A quarterback I compare Flacco to a lot is Phillip Rivers. He is also one of the most underrated quarterbacks throughout the year. He is always dealing with a bad offensive line or bad receivers the last couple years. Keenan Allen has finally woke up and they are doing better and he has Antonio Gates. This year he is doing better somehow even though their offensive line got destroyed with injuries again. But like last year when their offense had no speed it struggled. Both are underrated with what they do. 

[Ravenshine]

Which leads to him throwing off his back foot to get rid of the ball which leads to interceptions. Yes the second interception he threw was awful but he had just as many good plays as he did bad with no weapons.

Yes, and those good plays get lost in the scuffle of a difficult season start. But what a beautiful TD he made last week. Still makes me smile how that play went. That was his call on the play after he saw the formation unfold in mid play.

[Amesr52]

Another bonehead move by Harbaugh, cutting Melvin. The kid was undrafted, stepped into a starting role, and played well until Tom Brady torched him in the playoffs. If the worst thing your can say about a guy is the Tom Brady beat him, then you could say the same about a lot of corners. Knee jerk Harbaugh cuts Melvin without him having any time to get established, but he keeps that awful Elam because the Ravens made the stupid choice of drafting him on the first round. Give me Melvin instead of Elam any day of the week.

Probably wasnt even Harbs decision.  Probably was left up to the front office (Eric DeCosta, Ozzie Newsome)  for why they let him walk.  And could have been a lot more behind the scenes.  But they did give him many chances to play and I liked his aggressiveness but he always seemed to give a big play or 2 and NFL teams will cut and trade players so fast for that.

[Amesr52]

A quarterback I compare Flacco to a lot is Phillip Rivers. He is also one of the most underrated quarterbacks throughout the year. He is always dealing with a bad offensive line or bad receivers the last couple years. Keenan Allen has finally woke up and they are doing better and he has Antonio Gates. This year he is doing better somehow even though their offensive line got destroyed with injuries again. But like last year when their offense had no speed it struggled. Both are underrated with what they do. 

Agreed.

[stixfix69]

I'm fine with how the young players are progressing, obviously not happy with the losses piling up, but have to look at the silver lining, and that's the young front 7 is getting great experience and will be so much better by years end...I feel we can salvage a 7-9 type season. Not to shabby considering the injuries we have been hit with, and we have been in every game, so the guys are competing....Some of the asst coaches play calling have been suspect....JMO......

[BrooklynRavens]

what if minnesota didnt draft steffon diggs in the 4th round....

his presence alone would be more valueable than tray walker

[NCMan]

Not to mention Flaccos been getting blitzed a lot more these days, pockets not getting protected like it used to.

QB's get blitzed all the time. Nothing new or different w/Flacco. The real difference is that the good QB's make you pay for blitzing them. Guess that shoots that excuse down, as well as all the other excuses some fans keep making for his play. 

[ravensrock007]

At some point, our "currency" has to have some value or weight. Bragging rights not to be worst team in NFL, doesn't get you very far. i love my Ravens, but I certainly don't want to see a few guys kill themselves while others are kind of hoehum. Got to weigh everything and at some point, next season becomes a focus. Just a matter of when , and how fast can we maximize our leverage now,...to build tomorrow.

[stixfix69]

I just don't see the mid range passing game, would love to see more slant routes, or seam routes to make teams pay for all out blitzes....

[EddiOK]

Where's Juan Castillo when you need a really good scapegoat?

[Ravenshine]

QB's get blitzed all the time. Nothing new or different w/Flacco. The real difference is that the good QB's make you pay for blitzing them. Guess that shoots that excuse down, as well as all the other excuses some fans keep making for his play.

There's lots of factors at play this year. He's proven he can sneak out of the pocket. Remember miracle at mile high? I don't make excuses for Flacco. I simply point out the positives because I see us fortunate to have him. I have lots of reasons and plays I could point to, I just did one.

[EddiOK]

One silver lining is that when the off-season comes, and Joe's contract needs to be re-worked, he can't claim this year as a reason to get more $$.

[Ravensfolyfe]

Regroup keep at it.

[The Greek]

new england will cut melvin within a month. he is a below avg. cb

[baru643]

I am okay with the plan laid out in this article, but we should let some of the 2nd tier players see the field and evaluate them. This doesn't require us to tank the rest of the season, we can still try to be competitive and work through seeing what we have on the roster talent wise.

The biggest needs are CBs, DBs, and someone that wants to be a NFL receiver (either someone steps up or we look at a trade later on). I am a realist and know its nearly impossible to compete for the SB every year, lets just get these issue addressed and bring back the Raven swagger! Go Ravens!

[Flamengo1265]

Well in Fantasy Football I'm gonna keep drafting QB's who are playing the Ravens. This defense has proven that it can't cover anybody, doesn't create turnovers, can't rush on pass plays and gives up at least 1 or 2 big pass plays every week. Carson's probably gonna go over 400 yds. this week.

[BillyD]

There's lots of factors at play this year. He's proven he can sneak out of the pocket. Remember miracle at mile high? I don't make excuses for Flacco. I simply point out the positives because I see us fortunate to have him. I have lots of reasons and plays I could point to, I just did one.

True.  And it's not like he has a bunch of weapons that are working with him when the blitz comes.  Most of the time Joe is on his own and might have SSS or Forsett read the blitz and adjust.  I'm not sure the other receivers and the young TEs are able to do that.  Now that might be coaching, it might be experience, it might be a combination of the two along with other factors.  Not to mention for the 4th season in a row Joe and the gang are in a new system with a new OC. Is he perfect?  "Elite?"  I don't know.  But he's my QB, and I'm happy to have him. 

[PalmBayRaven]

I want someone to tell me what OTHER QB has had 4 different Coordinators in 4 years in the league.  What OTHER QB has won a Super Bowl without having the weapons around him to succeed...  Many have done much WORST with way MORE.  I am forever amazed at the number of people that just believe that you can take mediocre Linemen, and mediocre receivers and make any QB look good.  It just doesn't happen that way.  It sometimes takes YEARS for a team to get the right mix of players... 

It is true he has had 4 Coordinators in 4 years but this is the 2nd year in the same system. Explain to me why he has regressed with his mechanics? Throwing off his back foot, lobbing the ball and not seeing the field? We did have Torrey and Anquan, Jacoby, Pitta and Dickson for our Super Bowl run and we had good lineman too for that run- McKinney at LT, Yanda, Osemele, Birk, none of whom were mediocre lineman.