[News] Eisenberg: Ravens' New Goal Is To Limit Disappointment To One Season

[axisofeeble]

Sorry but John Harbaugh might need to turn loose his old buddies from his special team up 95 north days. Castillo without Kubiak's genius is Castillo. Trestman needs three downs and a wider field,and everybody being able to be in motion. Pees needs two pass rushers or some blitz packages to cover for CBs that can't cover for 5 seconds every down. Coaches need to move on and John needs some help or one year will be 4 since Ravens played Ray Lewis,Ed Reed football.

[Puntit]

SSS is retiring or playing here. They aren't trading him if he decides not to retire. We have zero and I mean zero talent behind him at WR.

We would still have the same lack of talent next year when he retires. But if he's worth a pick to somebody at the trade deadline this year that's one more building block to work with next year. Again, nobody really cares what he does this year in the Ravens losing effort. 150 receiving yards is meaningless when the team still loses. We can lose with Aiken at least as effectively. And without Smith we get to see more of what, if anything, these other guys can do, and see if they ought to be Ravens going forward. Which right now is the best we can hope for -- finding another piece to build around.

[bucketonuts]

Also remember they traded away Ngata

Ngata left for more $$.

[salamander]

In this article there was not 1 reference to problems or poor decision making beyond pointing fingers at the players. Whether it be scheme, play calling, scouting, drafting, whatever, players are not 100% responsible for this 1-5 record. In fairness to the players (who certainly have a lot of shortcomings to fix), I think it is unfair to totally omit intentions to take a very serious look beyond the players. Any successful organization would focus the microscope upon themselves as well if they truly expect to be viable in the future. EVERYONE should be held accountable for decisions and actions which could have contributed to this team's predicament. I have faith in Bisciotti to internally do just that.

Edited October 20, 2015 by salamander

[Crusader]

25. Ravens

GM: Ozzie Newsome

Average position of 1st pick: 30.8

Total Picks: 42

Pro Bowlers: 1

Best Pick: LB C.J. Mosley %u2014 2014 1st round

Worst Pick: LB Sergio Kindle %u2014 2010 2nd round They can add a lot more to that list

[creigle]

We would still have the same lack of talent next year when he retires. But if he's worth a pick to somebody at the trade deadline this year that's one more building block to work with next year. Again, nobody really cares what he does this year in the Ravens losing effort. 150 receiving yards is meaningless when the team still loses. We can lose with Aiken at least as effectively. And without Smith we get to see more of what, if anything, these other guys can do, and see if they ought to be Ravens going forward. Which right now is the best we can hope for -- finding another piece to build around.

Knowing that he won't be playing next year, a team is not going to give more than a 6th (if that) rounder for him. No one will give up a 5th round or better pick for a player who will only play 10 games then retire. 

[ken_j]

Wanted to put out something though that you overlooked...

 

I put in bold the actual selection number of those players, as it matters significantly, since obviously historically, the better your draft pick is the better the player is likely to be.

 

If you'll notice, of the 15 players taken in the first round from 96-08, 8 of those players were taken with draft picks in the top 12 of the draft, with 7 of them coming in the top 10. Generally, speaking the most common method of obtaining a draft pick in the top 10 or even in the top half of the draft is by losing more football games than you win the previous season.

 

If I go ahead and lump 2008 in with the latter half of the group to separate the "Harbaugh era" from the other group, you'll see that the average draft position of the former group was roughly 16th, while the average draft position of the latter group is 25th, with only one first round pick inside the top 20 in the last 7 years.

 

If you'll notice, with the exceptions of legendary players like Ed and Reed (who don't really exist in football anymore and were drafted in some cases almost 20 years ago), the "elite" group of players drafted on that almost exclusively come from the top half of the draft.

 

Your Suggs, Ngata's, Boulware's, Jamal Lewis', etc. aren't that easily found in the back half of the first round in most cases.

 

So what does this all mean? Well, frankly, in my opinion, its a trade off. If you want stud first rounders every year, you either better trade up to get them (borderline impossible from the 20s) or you better start losing a lot of games. 

 

Win you win more, your draft picks generally get worse, and vice versa. There's a direct correlation that still exists today for this.

Good points. I just wonder how the Patriots and several other teams (like the Seahawks and Steelers) seem to get good players, not only in the bottom half of the first round but from the 2nd, 3rd and 4th rounds as well as from the Undrafted Free Agent pool?  I think the point about the apparent decline in the Ravens' talent evaluation (i.e., scouting) is a valid one.

Edited October 20, 2015 by ken_j

[BrooklynRavens]

im starting to think the coaching staff are giving the players to much respect....

treating them like they earned the ravens mantra

treating them like they were in the locker room with ray lewis ed reed chris mcalister and those boys....

i think its time to get on their asses like they are rookies.....

[Ravenshine]

Are you kidding me? Anything is possible. In football it's still mathematically possible.we'd have to win pretty much every game from here on out. Then the playoffs against some seriously talented teams. If any team could pull a monumental upset it's the Baltimore Ravens. In a way we already did in 2012, because no one in NFL I don't think predicted us getting past Denver. So it's a different group of players this time and odds are way less likely then back then, but I like that persons optimism anyway.

[BrooklynRavens]

not to mention we've had some bad luck over the years

ray rice dead money situation

injury plague

not that good of a drafting positions

and a couple of high draft picks that havent seen the field

(Arthur Brown and Sergio Kindle)

loosing corey graham hurt us deeply....

i hated the fact that harbaugh said we are a blitzing team...i by no means have any problem with it but i dont like when you write in stone.... things change and you have to adjust against other teams strengths and weaknesses

[fusuymada]

Just curious. Anyone hear anything about Pitta? He was able to be placed on the active squad yesterday. With our passing corps, anyone is welcome and a healthy Pitta would be very welcome at this point in time. Same with Brent Urban, he is due back after the bye week. At this point any help is welcome. Besides, we need to find out about these guys for next year. If neither is going to be able to play, we need to cut ties and move on.

[rmcjacket23]

Good points. I just wonder how the Patriots and several other teams (like the Seahawks and Steelers) seem to get good players, not only in the bottom half of the first round but from the 2nd, 3rd and 4th rounds as well as from the Undrafted Free Agent pool?  I think the point about the apparent decline in the Ravens' talent evaluation (i.e., scouting) is a valid one.

They do get some solid players in those rounds consistently, just like we do. We get guys like Osemele and Brandon Williams in those rounds, among others.

 

Those teams, like us, whiff on 1st round and later round picks annually as well. Those misses are ONLY magnified when you are losing, because there's nothing to complain about when you are winning. The draft picks and lack of success from them were being questioned in Pittsburgh as recently as a year or two ago also.

[b93333]

No question it is time to consider the draft and next season. They need to trim the roster without creating a ton of dead money... like they were facing the last two years. They need to start drafting smart... what was a Ravens trademark until a few years ago. Anyone know how Rice and Pitta count next season towards dead money?

[bucketonuts]

Wanted to put out something though that you overlooked...

 

I put in bold the actual selection number of those players, as it matters significantly, since obviously historically, the better your draft pick is the better the player is likely to be.

 

If you'll notice, of the 15 players taken in the first round from 96-08, 8 of those players were taken with draft picks in the top 12 of the draft, with 7 of them coming in the top 10. Generally, speaking the most common method of obtaining a draft pick in the top 10 or even in the top half of the draft is by losing more football games than you win the previous season.

 

If I go ahead and lump 2008 in with the latter half of the group to separate the "Harbaugh era" from the other group, you'll see that the average draft position of the former group was roughly 16th, while the average draft position of the latter group is 25th, with only one first round pick inside the top 20 in the last 7 years.

 

If you'll notice, with the exceptions of legendary players like Ed and Reed (who don't really exist in football anymore and were drafted in some cases almost 20 years ago), the "elite" group of players drafted on that almost exclusively come from the top half of the draft.

 

Your Suggs, Ngata's, Boulware's, Jamal Lewis', etc. aren't that easily found in the back half of the first round in most cases.

 

So what does this all mean? Well, frankly, in my opinion, its a trade off. If you want stud first rounders every year, you either better trade up to get them (borderline impossible from the 20s) or you better start losing a lot of games. 

 

Win you win more, your draft picks generally get worse, and vice versa. There's a direct correlation that still exists today for this.

Excellent points. Very well put. I was just pointing out that our first picks in the last 7 years have done little to nothing for this team (except for Mosely). Our first picks, the most costly and most important, whether it be 1st or 2nd round, in the last seven years have been awful (previous exception noted). Only three first picks in the last seven years are even playing.

[January J]

@steelcityraven - I think after the 5th loss they had to reevaluate their mission statement. Up until the last loss it seemed Harbs wanted to fight to stay in playoff contention. I see him/them saying here that's no longer the goal today. The goal is to get as many wins this year as possible but to do it with a level head and realistic expectation of the remainder of year. So in a way they are admitting playoffs look to be out of the picture, but the season itself is one to keep playing each game to win, and then next year renew playoff mission.

this is just one mans opinion. eisenburg is not harbaugh.

[The Mom Gene]

Benching Joe... Trading Steve... and some of the other "Fire Sale" stuff here is insane... It really is. And as a Mom (as my handle implies) it's sounding like folks want to punish our players, and our coaches, for poor performance.  When in our case injuries, and "situations" have deterred us all along the way, beginning in the preseason.  Who knew that Perriman and Pitta were going to go down again....  no one did.

 

We all need to calm down and trust in the GREAT organization that we know we have. They have ALWAYS come through... Let's let them do it for us again.

[b93333]

One question has been answered this year. It is now clear that Flacco needs a decent supporting cast to win games. Somehow the thought existed out there that he could simply "make everybody around him better". I don't know how many times I read that one... but I doubt we will see it again any time soon.

[Drew P]

Like someone tweeted last week they are a ground and pound team in an arena league

[rmcjacket23]

Like someone tweeted last week they are a ground and pound team in an arena league

The Seahawks say hello...

[PalmBayRaven]

To be honest Mom Gene I expected so much more from Flacco this year! He is an 8year Veteran not a rookie. Nothing wrong with expecting him to elevate the talent around him because that is what Elite Quarterbacks do so I am pretty sure we can put an end to Flacco being Elite debate.He's NOT! Flacco punishes the fans with his stupid interceptions so I think he is fair game to be criticized for poor performances.

[EliteRavens]

Hopefully now the bandwagon fans are off lol

[SmashMouth7]

I don't see why people love Harbaugh so much, you think he went on a run but what really happened was our good team finally got a QB, which was our weak spot. We could have done that with just Ozzie and no head coach.

[steelcityraven]

PalmBayRaven.... I hear what you are saying and I also wanted to expect so much more out of Flacco this season. He has the tools and he is an 8 year veteran with a ton of post season success and experience. He is growing and I was hoping to see the best Flacco we have ever seen but I also had to remind myself... that this is Joe's 4th OC in 4 years! 4 new systems in 4 years. 4 new ways of doing things---- 4 new play books to learn. That has to slow development at some point. We have to expect a learning curve to some degree. Next... I remembered that we have a 36 your old # 1 WR and a rookie # 2.... and a bunch of unproven players behind them. A couple of injuries to our # 1 and #2 and all of a sudden we have a veteran QB in a new system with little help. No targets and a OL in front of him that is also learning a new system and had some difficulty protecting him early. Joe has took more of a beaten this season then I have ever seen him. IF we can get another year under Trestman, add a few legit weapons at WR.... give those young TE's a year to develop and lock up KO or add depth on that OL... I expect Joe to have a career year next season... this season seemed to be too much stacked against him (and he still may pass for record yardage)!

[steelcityraven]

My biggest criticism of Flacco is that he needs to learn to manage the pocket better and manipulate pressure better. He still panics like no other starter when they get to him. Hope he works on that through the off-season.... and watch out next year!

[Amesr52]

This is the same problem we had the year after the superbowl when we didnt make the playoffs. We weren't 1-5 but we were a decent team. We had let Boldin go and only relied on Torrey Smith to be our main guy. Torrey had his best statistical season then but Flacco was still stuck trying to force passes to everyone else that couldn't gain seperation which led to his high interception total. We have a bunch of young TEs that are showing potential. We have a very solid Defensive interior and MLB corps. We just need to get a more instinctive free safety cause Will Hill has been good. Lewis and our CB2 have been the problems with the big plays. We will most likely go all defense in next years early rds of the draft. Draft OLB or CB 1st rd cb/safety 2nd rd maybe guard 3rd rd then best player available after that.

[Amesr52]

If Perriman cant make it on the field this season and make an impact I cant see us finishing .500, but if he does play I can see him being the 1 or 2 big plays we need in a close to pull out some of these close wins. I wont beat up Flacco and say hes the problem. You dont know if the line is going to hold up for him or not every week. past couple weeks the line has been better but they havent given Flacco enough time to see his open wrs.

[The Mom Gene]

To be honest Mom Gene I expected so much more from Flacco this year! He is an 8year Veteran not a rookie. Nothing wrong with expecting him to elevate the talent around him because that is what Elite Quarterbacks do so I am pretty sure we can put an end to Flacco being Elite debate.He's NOT! Flacco punishes the fans with his stupid interceptions so I think he is fair game to be criticized for poor performances.

 

I want someone to tell me what OTHER QB has had 4 different Coordinators in 4 years in the league.  What OTHER QB has won a Super Bowl without having the weapons around him to succeed...  Many have done much WORST with way MORE.  I am forever amazed at the number of people that just believe that you can take mediocre Linemen, and mediocre receivers and make any QB look good.  It just doesn't happen that way.  It sometimes takes YEARS for a team to get the right mix of players... 

[Fastynart]

Another bonehead move by Harbaugh, cutting Melvin. The kid was undrafted, stepped into a starting role, and played well until Tom Brady torched him in the playoffs. If the worst thing your can say about a guy is the Tom Brady beat him, then you could say the same about a lot of corners. Knee jerk Harbaugh cuts Melvin without him having any time to get established, but he keeps that awful Elam because the Ravens made the stupid choice of drafting him on the first round. Give me Melvin instead of Elam any day of the week.

[cbrook1862]

why do I have a feeling it's going to take 2or 3 seasons of the defense playing like this before Pees is fired

[rmcjacket23]

Another bonehead move by Harbaugh, cutting Melvin. The kid was undrafted, stepped into a starting role, and played well until Tom Brady torched him in the playoffs. If the worst thing your can say about a guy is the Tom Brady beat him, then you could say the same about a lot of corners. Knee jerk Harbaugh cuts Melvin without him having any time to get established, but he keeps that awful Elam because the Ravens made the stupid choice of drafting him on the first round. Give me Melvin instead of Elam any day of the week.

He also was terrible against Cincinnati earlier this season...