2016 free agency

[PurpleCity5]

Got hope we keep K.O, we have the cap, just hoping the market will be kind to us.

[ravenz2752]

Hill is a much better player than kam.

There is a point when favoring a player from your own team hits a limit........

[Deflated Football]

Is there any realistic way that the Ravens can sign Alshon in the offseason? It just seems like the perfect fit. With SSS retiring, we desperately need more playmakers on offense and I'm assuming that Trestman stays so it seems ideal for him to recruit Alshon. Not only that, but we don't have to worry for a big time recieving threat for quite some time since he's only 25. I don't trust Ozzie at all in drafting a superstar WR. Flacco has shown that he's the man when he has a competent supporting cast. Imagine if he had Alshon, Breshad, Maxx, Gillmore, Boyle, Givens, etc, and what if we could even get someone like Hankerson for cheap? No more journeymen. No more tall WR's that play soft and have butterfingers. GET THE MAN SOME WEAPONS!

[Ravens2343]

Is there any realistic way that the Ravens can sign Alshon in the offseason? It just seems like the perfect fit. With SSS retiring, we desperately need more playmakers on offense and I'm assuming that Trestman stays so it seems ideal for him to recruit Alshon. Not only that, but we don't have to worry for a big time recieving threat for quite some time since he's only 25. I don't trust Ozzie at all in drafting a superstar WR. Flacco has shown that he's the man when he has a competent supporting cast. Imagine if he had Alshon, Breshad, Maxx, Gillmore, Boyle, Givens, etc, and what if we could even get someone like Hankerson for cheap? No more journeymen. No more tall WR's that play soft and have butterfingers. GET THE MAN SOME WEAPONS!

 

I think it is highly unlikely we could afford to sign Jeffery.  The Bears have a substantial amount of cap space compared to us and we will use most of our up resigning a few players and our draft pool.  We could definitely afford someone like Vincent Jackson or Pierre Garcon if they were to be cut, maybe even someone like Marvin Jones, Mohammed Sanu or Rueben Randle.  I think we will use one or two of our many picks to bring in some explosive guys and hope we can sign a veteran cut like Jackson or Garcon

[Cillmatic]

A depth chart of:

1. Marvin Jones

2. Garcon

3.Perriman

Would be great.

[January J]

Is there any realistic way that the Ravens can sign Alshon in the offseason? It just seems like the perfect fit. With SSS retiring, we desperately need more playmakers on offense and I'm assuming that Trestman stays so it seems ideal for him to recruit Alshon. Not only that, but we don't have to worry for a big time recieving threat for quite some time since he's only 25. I don't trust Ozzie at all in drafting a superstar WR. Flacco has shown that he's the man when he has a competent supporting cast. Imagine if he had Alshon, Breshad, Maxx, Gillmore, Boyle, Givens, etc, and what if we could even get someone like Hankerson for cheap? No more journeymen. No more tall WR's that play soft and have butterfingers. GET THE MAN SOME WEAPONS!

anything is possible. I think it kind of depends on if perriman returns this year and what he shows us. If he doesn't show much or doesn't even play at all due to injury and there's a big question mark looming this offseason at the position with SSS leaving, I think Ozzie will be pressured into getting a big name receiver. He's intriguing bc he's young, however I think the trestman connection is irrelevant. Those kind of things are a bit overrated. The only thing it helps with is knowing the players character a little better inside the locker room. But yes I think we can always find a way. It will take a lot , and it's not a typical Ozzie move, but I could see it. Let k.o and upshaw walk. Tell Webb to take another pay cut or walk. Restructure flacco. Dead money off the books. Possibly even cut pitta post June 1st. ( man that hurts to say that). Get rid of some of the other dead weight such as Marlon brown, a few other little moves and I think we could create the room. Then fill some of the holes via our high draft position. We're much more likely to sign a guy like Jackson or garçon like the previous poster said- but it could happen. A lot depends on perriman.

[rmcjacket23]

anything is possible. I think it kind of depends on if perriman returns this year and what he shows us. If he doesn't show much or doesn't even play at all due to injury and there's a big question mark looming this offseason at the position with SSS leaving, I think Ozzie will be pressured into getting a big name receiver. He's intriguing bc he's young, however I think the trestman connection is irrelevant. Those kind of things are a bit overrated. The only thing it helps with is knowing the players character a little better inside the locker room. But yes I think we can always find a way. It will take a lot , and it's not a typical Ozzie move, but I could see it. Let k.o and upshaw walk. Tell Webb to take another pay cut or walk. Restructure flacco. Dead money off the books. Possibly even cut pitta post June 1st. ( man that hurts to say that). Get rid of some of the other dead weight such as Marlon brown, a few other little moves and I think we could create the room. Then fill some of the holes via our high draft position. We're much more likely to sign a guy like Jackson or garçon like the previous poster said- but it could happen. A lot depends on perriman.

Well, it depends on if the Bears want to keep him first and foremost, which they probably do. If that's the case, he likely never hits the market.

 

Also, keep in mind that cutting guys like Webb and Pitta create significant dead money, and cutting basically anybody creates dead money.

 

Cutting Webb and Pitta alone, pre-June 1, creates $12.6M in dead money from those two players alone. Sure, you could cut post-June 1, but all you're doing is kicking the can down the road. I doubt the FO is interested in carrying an over $4M dead money cap hit to 2017 for a guy like PItta who basically hadn't played football in 2.5 years by that point. Besides, if he retires, I don't believe the Ravens have that option anyway.

 

We probably won't have as much dead money as we do this season (nearly $22M), but I'd still guarantee we will be north of $10M in dead money when its all said and done, and probably closer to $15M. Cutting those two guys alone will probably make $20M a realistic number.

 

If you check out B-more Ravor's report on the Salary cap thread, when you factor in current contracts and add in tenders, draft picks, adjustments, etc., we're basically starting with projected slightly negative cap space.

 

So the only cap space we create will likely be based on the cuts/retirements/extensions we give. No idea how much the Flacco extension (if it even happens) will create, but my guess would be around $8-10M, and through cuts you might be able to free up another $5-10M or so. Extend a couple players, and you're probably looking at $10M to play with, give or take a bit.

 

That's not much.

[Tru11]

True, but neither of those two websites does in-depth studies on where the players line up specifically so I'll personally side with PFF. I've seen similar errors in the past such as with George Iloka, who was incorrectly listed as the SS last season. Also, Stewart is listed as an FS on NFL.com since that's his current position in Denver. Don't get me wrong, neither Will nor Stewart were exclusive to being solely one of the two. I've just went through our Tennessee game from last season as a refresher and there were numerous times when they were both 8+ yards off the LOS. There were also times when Hill was lined up in the box or moved down right before the snap, especially in situations when he was in man coverage against the slot WR/TE. However, he spent the majority of his snaps as an FS in either two-deep looks or alone in the deep middle. In fact, from the Titans' last drive before the half until the end of the game, Hill was the single-high safety in over 80% of the snaps, and Terrence Brooks accompanied him in most of the two-deep looks from thereon.

 

I understand what you're getting at, though that's debatable given that we're already getting a glimpse of Hill at SS and he doesn't seem more dominant than he was at FS. I do agree on the disguising. I agree once more that we're giving up separation on the sidelines and that a faster FS would help in those circumstances. Above average instincts can help make up for the deficiency in foot speed, but the latter at the position would obviously be a plus, especially in the role we're discussing.

 

Yeah i dont have PFF so you are most likely right.

makes sense since our CB core was messed up , so that both where playing deep more often then not.

 

depending on brooks development i think they could make a pretty good pair and might solve those big plays we have been letting up.

 

hope he grabs his chance now and show he is the future there.

 

if he is healthy ofcourse....

[Tru11]

Hill is a much better player than kam.

 

lmao no he aint.

 

please stop.

[January J]

Well, it depends on if the Bears want to keep him first and foremost, which they probably do. If that's the case, he likely never hits the market.

Also, keep in mind that cutting guys like Webb and Pitta create significant dead money, and cutting basically anybody creates dead money.

Cutting Webb and Pitta alone, pre-June 1, creates $12.6M in dead money from those two players alone. Sure, you could cut post-June 1, but all you're doing is kicking the can down the road. I doubt the FO is interested in carrying an over $4M dead money cap hit to 2017 for a guy like PItta who basically hadn't played football in 2.5 years by that point. Besides, if he retires, I don't believe the Ravens have that option anyway.

We probably won't have as much dead money as we do this season (nearly $22M), but I'd still guarantee we will be north of $10M in dead money when its all said and done, and probably closer to $15M. Cutting those two guys alone will probably make $20M a realistic number.

If you check out B-more Ravor's report on the Salary cap thread, when you factor in current contracts and add in tenders, draft picks, adjustments, etc., we're basically starting with projected slightly negative cap space.

So the only cap space we create will likely be based on the cuts/retirements/extensions we give. No idea how much the Flacco extension (if it even happens) will create, but my guess would be around $8-10M, and through cuts you might be able to free up another $5-10M or so. Extend a couple players, and you're probably looking at $10M to play with, give or take a bit.

That's not much.

I was thinking Alshon would have his choice of where to go as a FA- but the Bears could tag him I suppose. Yeah it's almost definitely not gonna happen. I just know that the pressure will be on Ozzie to bring in somebody if perriman doesn't show anything this year and if SSS does indeed retire. The cheap band aids are no longer working and fans won't be having it. I don't think he has to bring in some big name future HOF, but somebody with respectable production and vet experience is going to be a must. Edited October 23, 2015 by January J

[Ravens2343]

Well, it depends on if the Bears want to keep him first and foremost, which they probably do. If that's the case, he likely never hits the market.

 

Also, keep in mind that cutting guys like Webb and Pitta create significant dead money, and cutting basically anybody creates dead money.

 

Cutting Webb and Pitta alone, pre-June 1, creates $12.6M in dead money from those two players alone. Sure, you could cut post-June 1, but all you're doing is kicking the can down the road. I doubt the FO is interested in carrying an over $4M dead money cap hit to 2017 for a guy like PItta who basically hadn't played football in 2.5 years by that point. Besides, if he retires, I don't believe the Ravens have that option anyway.

 

We probably won't have as much dead money as we do this season (nearly $22M), but I'd still guarantee we will be north of $10M in dead money when its all said and done, and probably closer to $15M. Cutting those two guys alone will probably make $20M a realistic number.

 

If you check out B-more Ravor's report on the Salary cap thread, when you factor in current contracts and add in tenders, draft picks, adjustments, etc., we're basically starting with projected slightly negative cap space.

 

So the only cap space we create will likely be based on the cuts/retirements/extensions we give. No idea how much the Flacco extension (if it even happens) will create, but my guess would be around $8-10M, and through cuts you might be able to free up another $5-10M or so. Extend a couple players, and you're probably looking at $10M to play with, give or take a bit.

 

That's not much.

 

I really hope the FO addresses Pitta and Webb this offseason.  If Pitta is able to come back and play effectively then I think we have to renegotiate his contract and lower that cap hit and dead money, possibly by adding in performance bonuses that he can reach while we give him upfront money for "security".  Webb could be extended out for a lot less money then he is making now and it would lessen the burden of him going forward.  I doubt he gets cut this offseason unless he tanks the rest of the year, I would not be opposed to a 2-3 extension that pushes his big cap hit and dollars out a few more years and we keep him around for veteran depth and to help whatever young guys we bring in.  Just some thoughts but like you said I doubt we keep pilling up dead money, especially after Rice and Ngata are finally coming off the books

[Tru11]

I really hope the FO addresses Pitta and Webb this offseason.  If Pitta is able to come back and play effectively then I think we have to renegotiate his contract and lower that cap hit and dead money, possibly by adding in performance bonuses that he can reach while we give him upfront money for "security".  Webb could be extended out for a lot less money then he is making now and it would lessen the burden of him going forward.  I doubt he gets cut this offseason unless he tanks the rest of the year, I would not be opposed to a 2-3 extension that pushes his big cap hit and dollars out a few more years and we keep him around for veteran depth and to help whatever young guys we bring in.  Just some thoughts but like you said I doubt we keep pilling up dead money, especially after Rice and Ngata are finally coming off the books

 

no player is going to accept a contract with out any guaranteed money so you are pretty much guaranteed to pile up dead money at some point.

 

unless you plan on giving players 1 year deals with a sky high salary lol

[rmw10]

I really hope the FO addresses Pitta and Webb this offseason. If Pitta is able to come back and play effectively then I think we have to renegotiate his contract and lower that cap hit and dead money, possibly by adding in performance bonuses that he can reach while we give him upfront money for "security". Webb could be extended out for a lot less money then he is making now and it would lessen the burden of him going forward. I doubt he gets cut this offseason unless he tanks the rest of the year, I would not be opposed to a 2-3 extension that pushes his big cap hit and dollars out a few more years and we keep him around for veteran depth and to help whatever young guys we bring in. Just some thoughts but like you said I doubt we keep pilling up dead money, especially after Rice and Ngata are finally coming off the books

Renegotiating contracts just puts more guaranteed money on the books unless it's a straight pay cut. Dead money doesn't go away because that's money that has already been paid out.

[Winchester]

True, but neither of those two websites does in-depth studies on where the players line up specifically so I'll personally side with PFF. I've seen similar errors in the past such as with George Iloka, who was incorrectly listed as the SS last season. Also, Stewart is listed as an FS on NFL.com since that's his current position in Denver. Don't get me wrong, neither Will nor Stewart were exclusive to being solely one of the two. I've just went through our Tennessee game from last season as a refresher and there were numerous times when they were both 8+ yards off the LOS. There were also times when Hill was lined up in the box or moved down right before the snap, especially in situations when he was in man coverage against the slot WR/TE. However, he spent the majority of his snaps as an FS in either two-deep looks or alone in the deep middle. In fact, from the Titans' last drive before the half until the end of the game, Hill was the single-high safety in over 80% of the snaps, and Terrence Brooks accompanied him in most of the two-deep looks from thereon.

 

I understand what you're getting at, though that's debatable given that we're already getting a glimpse of Hill at SS and he doesn't seem more dominant than he was at FS. I do agree on the disguising. I agree once more that we're giving up separation on the sidelines and that a faster FS would help in those circumstances. Above average instincts can help make up for the deficiency in foot speed, but the latter at the position would obviously be a plus, especially in the role we're discussing.

Thank you so much my friend!! I do not diagnose Clips like that. However I know I saw Hill playing fs role numerous times and play it well. Members here and my friends disputed me when I said Hill could play FS. One dude played football for Maryland and attempted to say Will Hill was very slow. But this same dude said Elam was better than Will. So I doubt he watches the games!!lol

Anyways I think the ravens could be dominant again in a hurry of they traded for Chancellor and obtained a fast physical 3 down LB to partner with Mosley and take control of the middle of the field!! The ravens would be fronting safety's and ilbs that can run well, cover, tackle,play the ball and INTIMIDATE!! The key to the 2012 dominance in foxboro was 2 safetys that INTIMIDATE and LBs that could cover like safety's. Especially Ellerbe. The key to the SF defense was 2 ilbs that were fast physical and could run and cover as well as safety's. Obtaining Chancellor would present a challenge I'm sure. However finding a 3 down physical instinctful LB to partner with Mosley either through free agency or the draft should be a priority. Daryl Smith plays smart but he is a liability.

Well, it depends on if the Bears want to keep him first and foremost, which they probably do. If that's the case, he likely never hits the market.

 

Also, keep in mind that cutting guys like Webb and Pitta create significant dead money, and cutting basically anybody creates dead money.

 

Cutting Webb and Pitta alone, pre-June 1, creates $12.6M in dead money from those two players alone. Sure, you could cut post-June 1, but all you're doing is kicking the can down the road. I doubt the FO is interested in carrying an over $4M dead money cap hit to 2017 for a guy like PItta who basically hadn't played football in 2.5 years by that point. Besides, if he retires, I don't believe the Ravens have that option anyway.

 

We probably won't have as much dead money as we do this season (nearly $22M), but I'd still guarantee we will be north of $10M in dead money when its all said and done, and probably closer to $15M. Cutting those two guys alone will probably make $20M a realistic number.

 

If you check out B-more Ravor's report on the Salary cap thread, when you factor in current contracts and add in tenders, draft picks, adjustments, etc., we're basically starting with projected slightly negative cap space.

 

So the only cap space we create will likely be based on the cuts/retirements/extensions we give. No idea how much the Flacco extension (if it even happens) will create, but my guess would be around $8-10M, and through cuts you might be able to free up another $5-10M or so. Extend a couple players, and you're probably looking at $10M to play with, give or take a bit.

 

That's not much.

Why not trade for Alshon?? Or some other proven or clearly ascending receiving commodity?? It would give us leverage in contract negotiations and keep us out of a bidding war. I think a #2 or early round 3 is reasonable to acquire Alshon. I do not want to hear a #2 or #3 and we have to pay him is to expensive. Because it is not nearly as expensive as burning draft picks on busts at WR and money for useless aging or overrated #3 or #4 WRs on other teams.

As with the salary cap situation, Ozzie has it a hot mess!! To much guaranteed $$ on the books for old,injured and eratic players. My opinion, it is best to cut ties with these players and spread the cap hit out over a couple seasons so they can be competitive. Or else take the cap Hits this year and accept the team will suck for another year and have 2 years of early draft picks to go with a good amount of csp space. I know most fans do not want to hear another bad losing season. But it would be truly nieve to think they are going to fix all these holes in the draft. Especially the way Ozzie has drafted lately.

Ozzie's bad drafting and signings has led to other issues. He plays comp picks to a fault of a tunnel visioned senile man. And it handcuffs the organization's flexibility and strategy. He follows one strategy and has zero vision and intuition to adjust philosophies and strategies when the situation is favorable and beneficial to adjust his route and path of thinking. Ozzie learned bpa from belichick by his own admission. It led to some good players from 1996-2003. However as his stars aged and he failed to draft many or any marquee talent, it led him to panic,

get away from bpa and try to replace his stars exact position. However when trying to acquire elite talent for your teams foundation you accept a marquee player at any position. That is the payoff of bpa.

Yet another bad draft as ravens fans will have to watch WRs like Tyler Lockett and Steffon Diggs outperform the raven's round1 WR. As well as game changers at WR and other positions play in the pro bowl and outperform the ravens top2 selections YET AGAIN!! The excuses you all are making for Perriman and Fat Maxx like they are rookies will not last long. Then you will settle for the top 2 picks are busts or mediocre YET AGAIN!! Just a question out of curiosity. How many losing seasons before it is time to replace ozzie?. Since the championship they are below .500 and missed playoffs 2 out of 3.

[Deflated Football]

Thank you so much my friend!! I do not diagnose Clips like that. However I know I saw Hill playing fs role numerous times and play it well. Members here and my friends disputed me when I said Hill could play FS. One dude played football for Maryland and attempted to say Will Hill was very slow. But this same dude said Elam was better than Will. So I doubt he watches the games!!lol

Anyways I think the ravens could be dominant again in a hurry of they traded for Chancellor and obtained a fast physical 3 down LB to partner with Mosley and take control of the middle of the field!! The ravens would be fronting safety's and ilbs that can run well, cover, tackle,play the ball and INTIMIDATE!! The key to the 2012 dominance in foxboro was 2 safetys that INTIMIDATE and LBs that could cover like safety's. Especially Ellerbe. The key to the SF defense was 2 ilbs that were fast physical and could run and cover as well as safety's. Obtaining Chancellor would present a challenge I'm sure. However finding a 3 down physical instinctful LB to partner with Mosley either through free agency or the draft should be a priority. Daryl Smith plays smart but he is a liability.

Why not trade for Alshon?? Or some other proven or clearly ascending receiving commodity?? It would give us leverage in contract negotiations and keep us out of a bidding war. I think a #2 or early round 3 is reasonable to acquire Alshon. I do not want to hear a #2 or #3 and we have to pay him is to expensive. Because it is not nearly as expensive as burning draft picks on busts at WR and money for useless aging or overrated #3 or #4 WRs on other teams.

As with the salary cap situation, Ozzie has it a hot mess!! To much guaranteed $$ on the books for old,injured and eratic players. My opinion, it is best to cut ties with these players and spread the cap hit out over a couple seasons so they can be competitive. Or else take the cap Hits this year and accept the team will suck for another year and have 2 years of early draft picks to go with a good amount of csp space. I know most fans do not want to hear another bad losing season. But it would be truly nieve to think they are going to fix all these holes in the draft. Especially the way Ozzie has drafted lately.

Ozzie's bad drafting and signings has led to other issues. He plays comp picks to a fault of a tunnel visioned senile man. And it handcuffs the organization's flexibility and strategy. He follows one strategy and has zero vision and intuition to adjust philosophies and strategies when the situation is favorable and beneficial to adjust his route and path of thinking. Ozzie learned bpa from belichick by his own admission. It led to some good players from 1996-2003. However as his stars aged and he failed to draft many or any marquee talent, it led him to panic,

get away from bpa and try to replace his stars exact position. However when trying to acquire elite talent for your teams foundation you accept a marquee player at any position. That is the payoff of bpa.

Yet another bad draft as ravens fans will have to watch WRs like Tyler Lockett and Steffon Diggs outperform the raven's round1 WR. As well as game changers at WR and other positions play in the pro bowl and outperform the ravens top2 selections YET AGAIN!! The excuses you all are making for Perriman and Fat Maxx like they are rookies will not last long. Then you will settle for the top 2 picks are busts or mediocre YET AGAIN!! Just a question out of curiosity. How many losing seasons before it is time to replace ozzie?. Since the championship they are below .500 and missed playoffs 2 out of 3.

What if Alshon decides to sign elsewhere in the offseason though? We would only have him for the remainder of this lost season and be without a couple of high draft picks. I really want Alshon, but it'd be better just to wait till the offseason to try and get him because if we traded for him, there's no guarantee whatsoever that he'll re-sign. 

[Cillmatic]

In response to the guy asking why we don't trade for Alshon.

1. Seasons already over

2. We don't know where the pick we'll have to give them will be

3. He's injury prone

4. He's expensive

[rmcjacket23]

Thank you so much my friend!! I do not diagnose Clips like that. However I know I saw Hill playing fs role numerous times and play it well. Members here and my friends disputed me when I said Hill could play FS. One dude played football for Maryland and attempted to say Will Hill was very slow. But this same dude said Elam was better than Will. So I doubt he watches the games!!lol

Anyways I think the ravens could be dominant again in a hurry of they traded for Chancellor and obtained a fast physical 3 down LB to partner with Mosley and take control of the middle of the field!! The ravens would be fronting safety's and ilbs that can run well, cover, tackle,play the ball and INTIMIDATE!! The key to the 2012 dominance in foxboro was 2 safetys that INTIMIDATE and LBs that could cover like safety's. Especially Ellerbe. The key to the SF defense was 2 ilbs that were fast physical and could run and cover as well as safety's. Obtaining Chancellor would present a challenge I'm sure. However finding a 3 down physical instinctful LB to partner with Mosley either through free agency or the draft should be a priority. Daryl Smith plays smart but he is a liability.

Why not trade for Alshon?? Or some other proven or clearly ascending receiving commodity?? It would give us leverage in contract negotiations and keep us out of a bidding war. I think a #2 or early round 3 is reasonable to acquire Alshon. I do not want to hear a #2 or #3 and we have to pay him is to expensive. Because it is not nearly as expensive as burning draft picks on busts at WR and money for useless aging or overrated #3 or #4 WRs on other teams.

As with the salary cap situation, Ozzie has it a hot mess!! To much guaranteed $$ on the books for old,injured and eratic players. My opinion, it is best to cut ties with these players and spread the cap hit out over a couple seasons so they can be competitive. Or else take the cap Hits this year and accept the team will suck for another year and have 2 years of early draft picks to go with a good amount of csp space. I know most fans do not want to hear another bad losing season. But it would be truly nieve to think they are going to fix all these holes in the draft. Especially the way Ozzie has drafted lately.

Ozzie's bad drafting and signings has led to other issues. He plays comp picks to a fault of a tunnel visioned senile man. And it handcuffs the organization's flexibility and strategy. He follows one strategy and has zero vision and intuition to adjust philosophies and strategies when the situation is favorable and beneficial to adjust his route and path of thinking. Ozzie learned bpa from belichick by his own admission. It led to some good players from 1996-2003. However as his stars aged and he failed to draft many or any marquee talent, it led him to panic,

get away from bpa and try to replace his stars exact position. However when trying to acquire elite talent for your teams foundation you accept a marquee player at any position. That is the payoff of bpa.

Yet another bad draft as ravens fans will have to watch WRs like Tyler Lockett and Steffon Diggs outperform the raven's round1 WR. As well as game changers at WR and other positions play in the pro bowl and outperform the ravens top2 selections YET AGAIN!! The excuses you all are making for Perriman and Fat Maxx like they are rookies will not last long. Then you will settle for the top 2 picks are busts or mediocre YET AGAIN!! Just a question out of curiosity. How many losing seasons before it is time to replace ozzie?. Since the championship they are below .500 and missed playoffs 2 out of 3.

1. My guess would be that the Bears could ask for a #1 pick and get it if they really wanted to trade him.

 

2. I still see no reason why the Bears would want to trade him. Remember, it requires two parties to agree to a trade, not one.

[rmcjacket23]

I really hope the FO addresses Pitta and Webb this offseason.  If Pitta is able to come back and play effectively then I think we have to renegotiate his contract and lower that cap hit and dead money, possibly by adding in performance bonuses that he can reach while we give him upfront money for "security".  Webb could be extended out for a lot less money then he is making now and it would lessen the burden of him going forward.  I doubt he gets cut this offseason unless he tanks the rest of the year, I would not be opposed to a 2-3 extension that pushes his big cap hit and dollars out a few more years and we keep him around for veteran depth and to help whatever young guys we bring in.  Just some thoughts but like you said I doubt we keep pilling up dead money, especially after Rice and Ngata are finally coming off the books

Couple problems I have with this...

 

1. Assuming you can restructure Pitta is difficult, because he has to have an incentive to do that as well. He still has three years left on the deal after this season, and he himself will make only $5M next season, so its not his problem what the Ravens cap number is, because a lot of that has to do with the signing bonus we gave him two years ago. Asking him to take a paycut from $5M is reasonable, but again, he has to want to do that, which I doubt.

 

Additionally, he really isn't all that concerned about being outright released, because the Ravens save less than $1M against the cap by releasing him. Frankly, the only real options are he retires or he plays for the Ravens as far as I see.

 

2. For Webb, I don't see an extension as realistic. We already got him to take a paycut once and he's scheduled to make $8M last season. We could threaten a paycut again, but my guess is if that happens he will decline and we will have to decide whether he's worth it or not. He still has two years left after this season, and frankly, extending his contract isn't wise given his injury history and lack of dependability.

 

He's much more likely to be released than extended in my eyes.

[Tru11]

Couple problems I have with this...

 

1. Assuming you can restructure Pitta is difficult, because he has to have an incentive to do that as well. He still has three years left on the deal after this season, and he himself will make only $5M next season, so its not his problem what the Ravens cap number is, because a lot of that has to do with the signing bonus we gave him two years ago. Asking him to take a paycut from $5M is reasonable, but again, he has to want to do that, which I doubt.

 

Additionally, he really isn't all that concerned about being outright released, because the Ravens save less than $1M against the cap by releasing him. Frankly, the only real options are he retires or he plays for the Ravens as far as I see.

 

2. For Webb, I don't see an extension as realistic. We already got him to take a paycut once and he's scheduled to make $8M last season. We could threaten a paycut again, but my guess is if that happens he will decline and we will have to decide whether he's worth it or not. He still has two years left after this season, and frankly, extending his contract isn't wise given his injury history and lack of dependability.

 

He's much more likely to be released than extended in my eyes.

 

yeah its probably either take another pay cut or get released at this point for webb.

 

he is again missing time...

[Winchester]

1. My guess would be that the Bears could ask for a #1 pick and get it if they really wanted to trade him.

 

2. I still see no reason why the Bears would want to trade him. Remember, it requires two parties to agree to a trade, not one.

I agree. However they were reported to be shopping him. I agree a #1 is to much because Alshon is not yet in the category the elite like Dez or Julio. It would be interesting to see him play with SS and learn route running from one of the best ever go couple with his size and skills. If Alshon became an elite detailed route runner to add to his speed and ball skills he could be as good as Dez Bryant. Being that the ravens are looking at a top 10 pick I think a #2 or pair of #3's is reasonable. He would take heat off Perriman and free him up as well. Which would help his confidence.

Somebody mentioned try to sign him and not trade away draft picks. I love that idea!! However the ravens have this gm who only wants so called "bargains" . Nevermind the fact many "bargains" are bargains for a reason and often end up useless as players. If the ravens draft an elite talent, they have to pay him market value anyways. What is the difference if that elite player is not already on your team?? Why does everybody have to be a bargain to be considered?? When taken into consideration all the bargains that are bad signings and are scrubs at that point. Or the bargains that do play well are on the books for $$ even after they to old to be considered starters or NFL caliber then then as a whole bargains cost as much or when considering all the bargains that did not work out. Many times bargains are cheaper for a reason. Many times you get what you pay for!!

When Ozzie only considers bargains, it is strapping and limiting the organizations options. Sometimes you have to trust your organizations coaching,work ethic and atmosphere to sign a marquee talent and trust the ravens have the structure for that player to perform even better than he did on his previous team. And inject your roster with much needed pro bowl talent.

[Winchester]

Couple problems I have with this...

 

1. Assuming you can restructure Pitta is difficult, because he has to have an incentive to do that as well. He still has three years left on the deal after this season, and he himself will make only $5M next season, so its not his problem what the Ravens cap number is, because a lot of that has to do with the signing bonus we gave him two years ago. Asking him to take a paycut from $5M is reasonable, but again, he has to want to do that, which I doubt.

 

Additionally, he really isn't all that concerned about being outright released, because the Ravens save less than $1M against the cap by releasing him. Frankly, the only real options are he retires or he plays for the Ravens as far as I see.

 

2. For Webb, I don't see an extension as realistic. We already got him to take a paycut once and he's scheduled to make $8M last season. We could threaten a paycut again, but my guess is if that happens he will decline and we will have to decide whether he's worth it or not. He still has two years left after this season, and frankly, extending his contract isn't wise given his injury history and lack of dependability.

 

He's much more likely to be released than extended in my eyes.

Completely agree with everything.

[rmcjacket23]

I agree. However they were reported to be shopping him. I agree a #1 is to much because Alshon is not yet in the category the elite like Dez or Julio. It would be interesting to see him play with SS and learn route running from one of the best ever go couple with his size and skills. If Alshon became an elite detailed route runner to add to his speed and ball skills he could be as good as Dez Bryant. Being that the ravens are looking at a top 10 pick I think a #2 or pair of #3's is reasonable. He would take heat off Perriman and free him up as well. Which would help his confidence.

Somebody mentioned try to sign him and not trade away draft picks. I love that idea!! However the ravens have this gm who only wants so called "bargains" . Nevermind the fact many "bargains" are bargains for a reason and often end up useless as players. If the ravens draft an elite talent, they have to pay him market value anyways. What is the difference if that elite player is not already on your team?? Why does everybody have to be a bargain to be considered?? When taken into consideration all the bargains that are bad signings and are scrubs at that point. Or the bargains that do play well are on the books for $$ even after they to old to be considered starters or NFL caliber then then as a whole bargains cost as much or when considering all the bargains that did not work out. Many times bargains are cheaper for a reason. Many times you get what you pay for!!

When Ozzie only considers bargains, it is strapping and limiting the organizations options. Sometimes you have to trust your organizations coaching,work ethic and atmosphere to sign a marquee talent and trust the ravens have the structure for that player to perform even better than he did on his previous team. And inject your roster with much needed pro bowl talent.

1. He actually wasn't reportedly being shopped at all. This whole concept started based on fan overreaction. They saw the Bears trade away two largely unproductive players who had no future and didn't fit well on the team anyway, and because they were struggling, fans and twitter prognosticators who do nothing more than hypothesize and guess suggested that the Bears would be willing to part with him.

 

There's no indication they were ever seriously considering it or that it was ever realistic. Me personally, it did never made sense. Jeffery is a building block for that franchise, not somebody who doesn't fit or you want to get rid of.

 

2. There's multiple reasons why the Ravens only shop for "bargains". For one, they invest more in their own draft products than other teams, given that they're generally better than other teams at doing it and that they believe in investing in your own players. Its a model a lot of the better teams in the league follow, such as the Packers.

 

Secondly, by investing in your own players, you generally don't have much cap space to be spending on FA's. In particular, expensive or "high end" FAs. That's a market that a lot of the notoriously struggling teams tend to shop in. There aren't a lot of "big splashes" being made in FA by a lot of the better teams in this league.

 

Lastly, the difference between paying somebody elite money that you drafted vs paying somebody elite money from FA is that draft picks, given the rookie wage scale, usually play at least 4 years at significantly less than market value. So while its great to go out and pay somebody like a Jeffery $10M+ a year, it was the Bears who got the benefit of four years of him at probably $10M TOTAL for those 4 years.

 

That's why guys like Julio and Dez are so valuable... because you have them playing at significantly below market value for an extended period of time. When you sign a high priced FA, there's pretty much no time when they will be playing for less than market value, because day one in your organization they were getting paid market value.

 

Its why drafting well is important. Its why the Seahawks are capable of making back to back SB runs... first they had elite level defensive players playing for well below market value, and they had a QB who played very well at about $1M a year. Once those things come to an end, they have to adjust their strategy by retaining a lot of the key players, letting some guys go that they would like to keep, and finding cheaper replacements via the draft or via shopping for "bargain" FAs.

 

If you look at the teams who are typically in the top of the league in the W/L category, a lot of those teams adopt a very similar strategy to what the Ravens do.

[redrum52]

Ozzie won a sb 3 seasons ago with his method, and we were I position last year. Anyone saying the method doesn't work is flat out wrong.

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

Just throwing this idea out there. The ravens could attempt to trade for Kam Chancellor?? The seahawks likely can't pay him what he wants. Then draft the best physical 3 down LB or sign a free agent ilb. The ravens would control the middle of the field in this modern NFL where everybody is throwing the ball around uncontested. Mosley Hill Chancellor and a fast physical 3 down LB to partner with Mosley would strike fear into opposition!! Qb rushers are tough to find and very expensive. But the real key to neutralizing qbs and their weapons is controlling the middle of the field which actually also helps eliminate the big play. I was at the ravens playoff win in foxboro. The real key to shutting them out after halftime was Reed Ellerbe and Pollard controlling the middle and Ray the shorter area of the middle. The patriot WRs were scared and all of their fans knew it!! They were calling Brady and his weapons every name they could think of.lol When the defense controls the short and intermediate throws it makes the blitzes far more effective and Easy to conceal. Everybody wants the impact edge rushers and shutdown corner. But the real key is the collective defense controlling the middle and striking fear into An offense. I know I can be harsh on the ravens flaws. However I am a huge huge sore loser and root for them to win.

But then there's still nobody to help over the top and teams can avoid the middle of the field bc they can throw deep on us all day.

We need a FS that can cover, not yet another safety whose strength is in the box. Hill is not a FS.

Besides, it's not happening. If the Seahawks don't value him as highly as what he's looking for and he's the perfect fit for what they do and arguably the key ingredient....

Why would we pay him that when he'd be a redundant, un-necessary piece in our defense AND cost a high draft pick when were going to have our best draft position in a decade?

Think before clicking submit post.

Edited October 24, 2015 by BOLDnPurPnBlacK

[rmcjacket23]

Ozzie won a sb 3 seasons ago with his method, and we were I position last year. Anyone saying the method doesn't work is flat out wrong.

Agreed. Though I will agree with some people (not all who think Ozzie has been dreadful in the draft recently) that his method ONLY works as long as you are drafting quality players and retaining the key ones.

 

If there's an extended period of mediocre or worse drafts, then the method doesn't work, because poor drafts + bargain FA shopping can't possibly lead to on-field success. This method is completely predicated on having solid drafts, particularly in the early rounds.

 

While its clearly not sustainable to this long term, I have no issue with teams who attack FA aggressively and shop at the top of the market annually because they know they aren't good in the draft. Its their only option, and its a viable one in the short term.

 

Generally speaking, if you can't draft well (particularly in the early rounds) in this league, you've got no shot long-term.

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

Ozzie won a sb 3 seasons ago with his method, and we were I position last year. Anyone saying the method doesn't work is flat out wrong.

Right? We've got 2 SB's since 2000. There are several franchises who don't even have a playoff win in that span.

And to those who say Ozzie has slipped recently... Then why are we among the top 3-4 winningest franchises since 2008, aka recently?

Recently we've been one of the models of success and consistency in a league built to not allow it, yet recently Ozzie hasn't been doing a good job.

Fans who think that would be miserable as a fan of every single team in every sport. This is football... It's not a science. The best at what they do aren't even close to perfect.

A SB and only 2-3 seasons where you're not competing for one every 10 years is absolutely incredible. INCREDIBLE. Especially for a relatively new expansion team.

I'm disappointed in this season but that's because I'm a fan and want to win. But I also recognize that the grass isn't greener practically anywhere. I can accept a down year as long as we're competing for a title again in the next 2-3 years and this current FO and formula has done exactly that over a span of 20 years.

There is NO ONE better for the job than Oz. And if you think otherwise, even in recent drafts/FA please show me the GMs with a better record, accounting for draft position and the cap space they had to deal with.

I'll wait.

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

Agreed. Though I will agree with some people (not all who think Ozzie has been dreadful in the draft recently) that his method ONLY works as long as you are drafting quality players and retaining the key ones.

If there's an extended period of mediocre or worse drafts, then the method doesn't work, because poor drafts + bargain FA shopping can't possibly lead to on-field success. This method is completely predicated on having solid drafts, particularly in the early rounds.

While its clearly not sustainable to this long term, I have no issue with teams who attack FA aggressively and shop at the top of the market annually because they know they aren't good in the draft. Its their only option, and its a viable one in the short term.

Generally speaking, if you can't draft well (particularly in the early rounds) in this league, you've got no shot long-term.

I think the method can still work because if you have a series of mediocre drafts than your young players aren't earning top second contracts from you and tying up your cap so you no longer have to just bargain shop.

At that point you can spend on proven FA's to carry you a couple years until you hit again and have a solid young core.

And that's the beauty of what he does.

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

I think it is highly unlikely we could afford to sign Jeffery. The Bears have a substantial amount of cap space compared to us and we will use most of our up resigning a few players and our draft pool. We could definitely afford someone like Vincent Jackson or Pierre Garcon if they were to be cut, maybe even someone like Marvin Jones, Mohammed Sanu or Rueben Randle. I think we will use one or two of our many picks to bring in some explosive guys and hope we can sign a veteran cut like Jackson or Garcon

It doesn't matter if Chicago has way more cap space, it only matters if we have enough cap and Alshon would sign for what we offer.

In regards to our resignings and draft taking up most of our cap - I'm not so sure.

I think we end up with $20-25 in free cap. Even if we resign KO in addition to Tucker and some lower tier guys... The 1st year or 2 of contracts are typically very cap friendly esp with young players.

If Tucker gets a deal avg $4-5 mill per year, next year will likely only have a $1.5-$2mill cap charge.

KO can likely be signed with a 1st year cap around $3-4 mill.

All the rest can be resigned for somewhere around $8mill or so. Even if those are light predictions your still likely looking at $8-12 mill for signing FA's outside our own.

Again, in the example of Alshon even if we paid him a big contract the 1st year would likely only be a $4-5mill cap charge and could be worked lower depending upon the base salary allocations, and gauranteed portion/signing bonus.

Don't think he's getting anywhere near Julio/Dez/Thomas money.

So it could definitely be worked out with money to spare. I don't think the cap will be the issue in any individual big name signing. It's whether or not we'll actually shell it out for one player who isn't our own, at a position we typically don't spend a ton on.

[BOLDnPurPnBlacK]

I agree. However they were reported to be shopping him. I agree a #1 is to much because Alshon is not yet in the category the elite like Dez or Julio. It would be interesting to see him play with SS and learn route running from one of the best ever go couple with his size and skills. If Alshon became an elite detailed route runner to add to his speed and ball skills he could be as good as Dez Bryant. Being that the ravens are looking at a top 10 pick I think a #2 or pair of #3's is reasonable. He would take heat off Perriman and free him up as well. Which would help his confidence.

Somebody mentioned try to sign him and not trade away draft picks. I love that idea!! However the ravens have this gm who only wants so called "bargains" . Nevermind the fact many "bargains" are bargains for a reason and often end up useless as players. If the ravens draft an elite talent, they have to pay him market value anyways. What is the difference if that elite player is not already on your team?? Why does everybody have to be a bargain to be considered?? When taken into consideration all the bargains that are bad signings and are scrubs at that point. Or the bargains that do play well are on the books for $$ even after they to old to be considered starters or NFL caliber then then as a whole bargains cost as much or when considering all the bargains that did not work out. Many times bargains are cheaper for a reason. Many times you get what you pay for!!

When Ozzie only considers bargains, it is strapping and limiting the organizations options. Sometimes you have to trust your organizations coaching,work ethic and atmosphere to sign a marquee talent and trust the ravens have the structure for that player to perform even better than he did on his previous team. And inject your roster with much needed pro bowl talent.

Ozzie doesn't only consider bargains.

It's just that teams who attempt to build their team around high prices FAs fail bc you have no idea if they'll play at the same level on your team, and players that do well in their rookie deals ALWAYS get overpaid on their 2nd contract. Which then makes it extremely difficult to actually get the contributions you actually need from that player to justify the portion of the cap they're eating up.

Instead, the best teams spend the money on their own players who have proven successful within the team, spend their money wisely on players who have a high probability of playing better than their contract indicates, and making a big splash on a player when that player is perceived to be the crucial missing piece in a championship.

Spending big when you're not on the verge of a championship is just stupid.

Boldin, Doom and Monroe are examples of spending (through draft currency, money or both) on players who were perceived to be crucial missing pieces to a championship caliber roster.

And considering we won a SB, and came darn close to win a 2nd within a year or 2 of signing all 3, id say the formula works.

And since the teams that follow a very similar model (GB, pats, Pitt, cinci) have been the most consistent championship contenders in recent history, and the teams that routinely buy high priced FA's every offseason are bottom dwellers or have seen very short, 1 yr championship windows.....

I'd say that should about sum it up.

[Winchester]

1. He actually wasn't reportedly being shopped at all. This whole concept started based on fan overreaction. They saw the Bears trade away two largely unproductive players who had no future and didn't fit well on the team anyway, and because they were struggling, fans and twitter prognosticators who do nothing more than hypothesize and guess suggested that the Bears would be willing to part with him.

 

There's no indication they were ever seriously considering it or that it was ever realistic. Me personally, it did never made sense. Jeffery is a building block for that franchise, not somebody who doesn't fit or you want to get rid of.

 

2. There's multiple reasons why the Ravens only shop for "bargains". For one, they invest more in their own draft products than other teams, given that they're generally better than other teams at doing it and that they believe in investing in your own players. Its a model a lot of the better teams in the league follow, such as the Packers.

 

Secondly, by investing in your own players, you generally don't have much cap space to be spending on FA's. In particular, expensive or "high end" FAs. That's a market that a lot of the notoriously struggling teams tend to shop in. There aren't a lot of "big splashes" being made in FA by a lot of the better teams in this league.

 

Lastly, the difference between paying somebody elite money that you drafted vs paying somebody elite money from FA is that draft picks, given the rookie wage scale, usually play at least 4 years at significantly less than market value. So while its great to go out and pay somebody like a Jeffery $10M+ a year, it was the Bears who got the benefit of four years of him at probably $10M TOTAL for those 4 years.

 

That's why guys like Julio and Dez are so valuable... because you have them playing at significantly below market value for an extended period of time. When you sign a high priced FA, there's pretty much no time when they will be playing for less than market value, because day one in your organization they were getting paid market value.

 

Its why drafting well is important. Its why the Seahawks are capable of making back to back SB runs... first they had elite level defensive players playing for well below market value, and they had a QB who played very well at about $1M a year. Once those things come to an end, they have to adjust their strategy by retaining a lot of the key players, letting some guys go that they would like to keep, and finding cheaper replacements via the draft or via shopping for "bargain" FAs.

 

If you look at the teams who are typically in the top of the league in the W/L category, a lot of those teams adopt a very similar strategy to what the Ravens do.

I do not necessarily think it is the strategy that wins games for teams like the packers. They have a franchise qb. There is no proven strategy. You have to adjust your strategy and thinking accordingly to the market, your assets and competition. Kind of like adjusting on the fly like a great route runner does when he gets open from different coverage schemes. Ozzie does not seem to be smart enough to adjust his strategy for each draft and free agent market. Sometimes you sign your own players. Sometimes you can acquire a far better player from another team. Would you prefer to pay Torrey $9mil or Maclin $11mil?? Jimmy $10mil or Grimes $10mil.