The Dean Pees Thread (merged)

[berad]

Wait was he eating popcorn up there? If so I need to see this

 

Can't confirm although there was a substance on his fingers that resembled 'cheeto dust' in the locker room lol.

[The Raven]

And his plan to fix it?

 

 

 

http://www.baltimoreravens.com/news/article-1/Transcripts-Ravens-Media-Availability-924/dc95eed7-1fc0-416c-ba7f-ec52f343a64f

 

Yeesh.

 

Again, he's not wrong.

[berad]

Again, he's not wrong.

 

It's just a weak response and deflection away from any questions of 'the scheme' which is apparently canon. He talked about how he stopped blitzing because he saw a lack of energy but then lamented that there wasn't tight coverage because of lack of energy.

 

So, supposedly, there's nothing that could be done to energize the players to keep the Raiders from having a field-day against them. Changing play calls is out of the question.

 

edit - the point I'm driving at is he seems to just wash his hands of the issues the defense had. You can deflect and say the players need to go harder if you want but I don't think he's going to laminate and frame the Raiders gameplan.

Edited September 25, 2015 by berad

[bMore Heathen]

It's just a weak response and deflection away from any questions of 'the scheme' which is apparently canon. He talked about how he stopped blitzing because he saw a lack of energy but then lamented that there wasn't tight coverage because of lack of energy.

So, supposedly, there's nothing that could be done to energize the players to keep the Raiders from having a field-day against them. Changing play calls is out of the question.

Boy, just fills you with confidence, don't it?

[berad]

Boy, just fills you with confidence, don't it?

 

Run through a brick wall.

 

I think you're with me on this: Pees is not a bad defensive coordinator, nor is he a great one. He's above-average/good if you had to weight pros and cons. There's enough of the same mistakes, inconsistencies, and lapses throughout the years that point to the same common thread - Pees. Just like there are a lot of triumphs to keep his job security.

[bMore Heathen]

Run through a brick wall.

I think you're with me on this: Pees is not a bad defensive coordinator, nor is he a great one. He's above-average/good if you had to weight pros and cons. There's enough of the same mistakes, inconsistencies, and lapses throughout the years that point to the same common thread - Pees. Just like there are a lot of triumphs to keep his job security.

Agreed 100%.

[Dr. Kelley]

Run through a brick wall.

I think you're with me on this: Pees is not a bad defensive coordinator, nor is he a great one. He's above-average/good if you had to weight pros and cons. There's enough of the same mistakes, inconsistencies, and lapses throughout the years that point to the same common thread - Pees. Just like there are a lot of triumphs to keep his job security.

Thank you for posting this, this sums up 100% exactly how I feel about him

[jazz1988]

It's just a weak response and deflection away from any questions of 'the scheme' which is apparently canon. He talked about how he stopped blitzing because he saw a lack of energy but then lamented that there wasn't tight coverage because of lack of energy.

 

So, supposedly, there's nothing that could be done to energize the players to keep the Raiders from having a field-day against them. Changing play calls is out of the question.

 

edit - the point I'm driving at is he seems to just wash his hands of the issues the defense had. You can deflect and say the players need to go harder if you want but I don't think he's going to laminate and frame the Raiders gameplan.

 

I wasn't really feeling that statement by him but he also mention that the team defense didn't have a good week of practice before the game against The Raiders. I guess Pees is trying to blame the idea that staying over on the west coast wasn't a good idea and it hurt the players on defense which lead to a lack of energy.  I'm guess Harbaugh must have agreed  which is why that experiment has been  now canceled.

Edited September 25, 2015 by jazz1988

[Edgar]

Run through a brick wall.

 

I think you're with me on this: Pees is not a bad defensive coordinator, nor is he a great one. He's above-average/good if you had to weight pros and cons. There's enough of the same mistakes, inconsistencies, and lapses throughout the years that point to the same common thread - Pees. Just like there are a lot of triumphs to keep his job security.

I don't know. There are guys running around with their doctorate in music theory that aren't very musical and couldn't compose much of anything.

[The Raven]

There's a lot of merit to what Pees said after the game. When I watched us play, I saw their offensive line beat the balls off of our front seven. They out-physicaled us. They broke our line. All things considered, our secondary wasn't that bad. Nobody can cover that long when you cant' stop the run or get a pass rush. I did not see good effort or energy from anybody in the front seven.

[GrimCoconut]

There's a lot of merit to what Pees said after the game. When I watched us play, I saw their offensive line beat the balls off of our front seven. They out-physicaled us. They broke our line. All things considered, our secondary wasn't that bad. Nobody can cover that long when you cant' stop the run or get a pass rush. I did not see good effort or energy from anybody in the front seven.

Yep. I noticed the same thing. I even said in that one thread for the Raiders that we looked like we has no energy and played with none. The DL was the biggest culprit. The secondary can only do so much and it's clear Pees is depending on the DL to get pressure. When your DL loses the LOS it's rare you win a football game.

[jazz1988]

There's a lot of merit to what Pees said after the game. When I watched us play, I saw their offensive line beat the balls off of our front seven. They out-physicaled us. They broke our line. All things considered, our secondary wasn't that bad. Nobody can cover that long when you cant' stop the run or get a pass rush. I did not see good effort or energy from anybody in the front seven.

 

That's the issue but the question is why?  There had be a reason why the players showed a lack or effort or energy  and that can be contributed to many things such as them not feeling Pees play calling, being tired, feeling discouraged , or maybe The Raiders offensive line beat the fire right out of them.

Edited September 25, 2015 by jazz1988

[salamander]

So, the question is, WHY was the defense lacking in energy and intensity? Should it matter what time zone you are in or without the comforts of home to come ready to play on game day? Being on the west coast, away from home still doesn't explain or excuse a lackluster effort. Did Pees notice a lax effort all week? If so, isn't it his job to notice mid week and get his defense back on track mentally and physically? And, if all this travel effect is real, why wasn't the offense similarly diminished in effort also? The problems may be much bigger than any factors related to staying out west.

Edited September 25, 2015 by salamander

[GrimCoconut]

That's the issue but the question is why? There had be a reason why the players showed a lack or effort or energy and that can be contributed to many things such as them not feeling Pees play calling, being tired, or feeling discouraged .

Well, why would they play lights out against Denver but lazy against Oakland? Canty was out, I believe, against Oakland. Perhaps we are missing that veteran guy on the DL. The LB can't win if the DL loses. Very rarely will linebackers do well despite a bad DL.

[GrimCoconut]

So, the question is, WHY was the defense lacking in energy and intensity? Should it matter what time zone you are in or without the comforts of home to come ready to play on game day? Being on the west coast, away from home still doesn't explain or excuse a lackluster effort. Did Pees notice a lax effort all week? If so, isn't it his job to notice mid week and get his defense back on track mentally and physically? And, if all this travel effect is real, why wasn't the offense similarly diminished in effort also? The problems may be much bigger than any factors related to staying out west.

It's certainly possible the players saw this as a vacation more than anything. I couldn't blame them if they did. It happens and they're human, too. It could explain why the players didn't practice well, either.

[BmoreBird22]

Something no one has proposed is that the defense gave up a 68 yard touchdown on the first drive of the game, fumbled the ball on the first offensive play of the game, and responded with three points. They never took a lead, and often played from behind, until the fourth quarter. You telling me you'd feel good and motivated if you're down by 10 because you flat out got beat and then the offense did nothing for you? 

[ravensdfan]

Yeah, his press conference was all about needing more 'energy and effort' from the players... as he sits in the air conditioned booth and relies on his positional coaches to make adjustments and rally the troops.

Yeah his press conference did not sway me in his favor at all.

[PurpleCity5]

Yeah the lack of energy and intensity is questionable. I really hope the guys pull it together. 

[salamander]

It's certainly possible the players saw this as a vacation more than anything. I couldn't blame them if they did. It happens and they're human, too. It could explain why the players didn't practice well, either.

You sure could be right about that Coconut. The defense ranked #1 after week 1 could have contributed to overconfidence that the Raiders would be a cake walk, resulting in a mindset that they didn't have to work as hard. Who knows but your comment rings true to me. Don't think Steve Bisciotti had an all expenses paid vacation in mind when he agreed to foot a million dollar bill for this trip.

[OLD SCHOOL SMASH BALL]

What is the most troubling to me, is Pees doesnt make adjustments when his Defense is getting beat.

I was watching the Bills Pats game before ours, and Tyrod marched the Bills down the field to score and go up 7-0. When they got down to the play before they scored, the TV panned on to Belichek, and he had a pencil and paper TAKING NOTES, and I even posted on here, All I want our team to do, is MAKE ADJUSTMENTS.

If your job is to manage people, and you get paid on their success, and they are failing, WHAT ARE YOU DOING TO HELP THEM??

Are you smart enough to see how you are getting beat while it is happening in front of your face, or do you find out on Monday when you watch film??

I mean, if you aren't the sharpest tool in the shed, maybe you need some assistants to chart plays, and tell you what is happening, so you can do something about it, before its too late. But AT LEAST DO SOMETHING, PLEASE!! ->IN GAME!!!

[allblackraven]

The truth is somewhere in between. Some of the struggles are caused by personnel, some by D coach not doing enough to turn the things around. In practice and especially during the game.

 

We have all (good majority at least) set unrealistic expectations for this year although the backbone of Ravens football, which was always our DL, has gone through major changes. We lost two very important guys (Ngata and McPhee). Our best linemen have 2, 1 and 0 years behind them in the NFL. On top of all that, one of the best defensive players in the league (Suggs) is now lost as well. Canty is always banged up, Urban again sidelined for months, KLM coming after 2 major injuries and no football for 2 years is basically also a rookie.

 

I have all the confidence in the world that Williams, Jernigan and Davis will light up the rest of the NFL in the future but all of them need to learn to play well consistently. At the moment, this is not the case.

 

This is exactly where Pees needs to step up. It's not very hard coordinating D if you can rely on Ray, Ed Reed, Sizzle, Ngata to make calls when they see stuff on the field and then make plays as well. Pees' job is to put this group of guys (talent is obvious) into position to make plays. I don't buy 'no energy' excuse for one second, it's lazy and a cop out off what he's paid to do.

[salamander]

I had that exact same thought in the comments by "Old School", watching Belichick with his #2 pencil scribbling away, making notes on coverage and play observations, ready to make adjustments. You could see his intense concentration and feel the wheels spinning in his brain through the TV set as he was reworking strategy decisions. MAKING ADJUSTMENTS mid game. I hate the Pats but you have to respect Belichick for knowing when and what to do to maximize effectiveness. I also felt envious to watch a rival coach willing and observant enough to alter his game plan when the Ravens D continues with the same game plan even when it is totally ineffective.

Edited September 27, 2015 by salamander

[frozen joe flacco fan]

The truth is somewhere in between. Some of the struggles are caused by personnel, some by D coach not doing enough to turn the things around. In practice and especially during the game.

 

We have all (good majority at least) set unrealistic expectations for this year although the backbone of Ravens football, which was always our DL, has gone through major changes. We lost two very important guys (Ngata and McPhee). Our best linemen have 2, 1 and 0 years behind them in the NFL. On top of all that, one of the best defensive players in the league (Suggs) is now lost as well. Canty is always banged up, Urban again sidelined for months, KLM coming after 2 major injuries and no football for 2 years is basically also a rookie.

 

I have all the confidence in the world that Williams, Jernigan and Davis will light up the rest of the NFL in the future but all of them need to learn to play well consistently. At the moment, this is not the case.

 

This is exactly where Pees needs to step up. It's not very hard coordinating D if you can rely on Ray, Ed Reed, Sizzle, Ngata to make calls when they see stuff on the field and then make plays as well. Pees' job is to put this group of guys (talent is obvious) into position to make plays. I don't buy 'no energy' excuse for one second, it's lazy and a cop out off what he's paid to do.

 

I'm really baffled as to what you suggest Dean Pees should do. He's darned if he blitzes and darned if he doesn't. Your comment about Ray, Ed, Sizzle and a healthy Haloti was spot on but they aren't part of the equation. As you point out, the truth is always somewhere in the middle but Pees is not blessed with an abundance of playmakers, especially now that T-Sizzle is lost for the season. I'm not as convinced as you are that our defensive talent is obvious. Assuming you're correct, don't forget the quote from a pretty good Olympic Hockey coach, named Herb Brooks who said, "Hard work will defeat talent when talent fails to work hard." Its going to take a lot of hard work for Elvis' Purple Gang to turn this season around. They have surrendered 56 points in two games. That's more than a third of the points our defense allowed in 16 games in 2000. First, it was Cam's fault. Now, its Dean's fault. When will we wake up and smell the roses? Our D against the run is OK but our D against passing is still way too suspect. We cannot play bump & run press defense against the best WRs in the league w/o getting burned nor can we blitz to bring more pressure w/o getting burned so our defenders play way off their targets and we aren't very good at jumping routes. Didn't T-Sizzle lead the team in pics during the exhibition season?

[ravensdfan]

I'm really baffled as to what you suggest Dean Pees should do. He's darned if he blitzes and darned if he doesn't. Your comment about Ray, Ed, Sizzle and a healthy Haloti was spot on but they aren't part of the equation. As you point out, the truth is always somewhere in the middle but Pees is not blessed with an abundance of playmakers, especially now that T-Sizzle is lost for the season. I'm not as convinced as you are that our defensive talent is obvious. Assuming you're correct, don't forget the quote from a pretty good Olympic Hockey coach, named Herb Brooks who said, "Hard work will defeat talent when talent fails to work hard." Its going to take a lot of hard work for Elvis' Purple Gang to turn this season around. They have surrendered 56 points in two games. That's more than a third of the points our defense allowed in 16 games in 2000. First, it was Cam's fault. Now, its Dean's fault. When will we wake up and smell the roses? Our D against the run is OK but our D against passing is still way too suspect. We cannot play bump & run press defense against the best WRs in the league w/o getting burned nor can we blitz to bring more pressure w/o getting burned so our defenders play way off their targets and we aren't very good at jumping routes. Didn't T-Sizzle lead the team in pics during the exhibition season?

Quite frankly, I'm sick of all the worn out excuses for Pees.

 

Everyone uses 2012 as one: But look at that defense in the playoffs & the SB! (nvm that they gave up a 28-6 lead and should never have been in that position). But, no need to actually do your job when you have Ed & Ray doing it for you on the field.

 

He says week one proves it isn't scheme but anyone with half a brain can see the scheme was not the same week 1 & week 2. Please. He ran delayed blitzes and called a much more aggressive game in Week 1 than Week 2. While he did rush 3 in Week 1, it was nowhere near with the frequency he did in Week 2. Does he not even realize this?

 

Well when the offense fumbles and then only answers with 3 pts is that going to inspire confidence? Another excuse. Are you telling me that offensive performance in week one gave Pees confidence and that is why he was more aggressive?

 

Upshaw, Mosley, Jerrnigan, Williams, KO - all top draft picks on defense. All still there but you doubt the talent? It's the talent?

 

The man threw his players under the bus. He basically said: "Don't look at me guys, I just call the plays."

 

And he pretty much said there is no need to make adjustments in-game or to his "scheme" based on players' strengths! This is a problem. This is a clueless man.

Edited September 26, 2015 by ravensdfan

[BmoreBird22]

Well when the offense fumbles and then only answers with 3 pts is that going to inspire confidence? Another excuse. Are you telling me that offensive performance in week one gave Pees confidence and that is why he was more aggressive?

There's a big difference between getting burned for a 68 yard touchdown, then fumbling and surrendering a field goal and only giving up field goals to a team that was supposed to light up the secondary. 

[jazz1988]

 First, it was Cam's fault. Now, its Dean's fault. When will we wake up and smell the roses? Our D against the run is OK but our D against passing is still way too suspect. We cannot play bump & run press defense against the best WRs in the league w/o getting burned nor can we blitz to bring more pressure w/o getting burned so our defenders play way off their targets and we aren't very good at jumping routes. Didn't T-Sizzle lead the team in pics during the exhibition season?

 

I hope you realize that when Cam was fired our offense was given new life after  it was nearly at a funeral when he was calling plays in 2012. Honestly we most likely don't make it to the playoffs if Cam Cameron is still calling the plays or maybe even winning the super bowl.Cam was a good offensive coordinator but he was too conservative and just like Dean Pees he  failed to make in game adjustments. I even remember there being reports out there that Flacco and Cam Cameron didn't really get along  and even back then players were showing lack of energy like the current defense did against The Raiders.

 

All the stuff that Ravens fans are currently saying about Dean Pees are basically the same stuff Patriots fans were saying about him . I'm not saying Dean Pees is  a bad defensive coordinator but I'm starting to believe that lack of energy or effort may not just be a player thing.

[LosT_in_TranSlatioN]

Cam needed to go. Cam was good for about two years. He does one thing really well. He develops QBs. I'd honestly hire him again to be an OC if we needed another QB. His track record is proven. Two SB winnners, three above average QBs, one hall of famer. Cam did his job well. But he's only good for about two years. He excells in college for one reason. Because he can develop.

I don't hate Dean. I personally think he's fine. Neither bad nor great. He's put together two solid defenses in back to back years for us.

I understand why people hate him. He's not aggresive. Ravens are used to aggresive. But the bend don't break just doesn't flow well with you.

But he's not bad. He called a bad game. It happens. But let's look at the facts here.

1. Zone coverage is absolutely necesary when one of your corners just flat out sucks(Webb). You really want to press with a guy who won't get phyiscal and cannot tackle anymore?

2. We were down a Terell Suggs. Sure. It's just one guy. But he was still an elite defensive player. The best player on the defense. He honestly made Pee's job a lot easier. Being able to disguise pressure. We cannot do that anymore. Granted, we did a good pass rusher in Babin who consistently gets pressure on the QB. But now we're going to be forced to play Dumervil full time which will not allow him to be fresh.

3. The defensive line played like crap. Weird seeing as our best dlinemen came back.

So that alone takes some of the blame off his shoulders.

That said. He deserves some of it. Just because you're down a pass rusher doesn't mean you shouldn't bltz creativley. Which btw, he did vs Denver and that worked out very well vs a QB who's release time is off the charts btw. But as "The Raven" said, you cannot play well when your dline doesn't do it's damn job. Granted, I did expect some struggle with a younger dline.

I'm beggining to think this about the season. If we lose. Our season is probably over admittantly. But this team is a lot younger than we're used to. We have three older guys on the defense now with Suggs gone. Our older veterans consist of one of them being a full time starter and the other three(Babin, Dumervil, and Canty) being guys who rotate heavily. Our oldest player on offense is Steve Smith, followed by Flacco and Yanda who are both younger.

If we do lose. Fine. I'll accept it. That's the case, the season will be about growth. And we don't have a lot of missing pieces tbh.

[PurpleCity5]

Obviously there was a lack of energy/confidence from the players against Oak, I honestly don't know why tbh, I don't think anyone does. Its all speculation whether its the stay out West, Sizzles injury, or Dean's scheme.

Back to Pees, It would take a lot for him to get canned. More 4th QTR slip ups and maybe that would tip it. It has to make Harbs sick blowing those games.

All I know is, this team on defense is way better than what we saw in Oak, so something was up.

Edited September 26, 2015 by PurpleCity5

[BSHU_Miami]

People say this a lot so after 4 years, he still can't find the right players? I just find that hard to believe. If the players aren't behind him then why is he still here? If the coach can't be changed then it has to be the players. I'm sorry but it's a lot easier to replace a coach than it is to replace all of the players on the entire defense. And it's not like we have terrible players. Maybe if the were taught the proper way to wrap up and tackle the defense would work better, right?

So we don't practice tackling?????!!!! unbelievable!!!! He needs to stop relying on our defense to tackle in open space when you dont freaking practive it! I thought we were trying to create turnovers on this defense? Stripping the ball can lead to a turnover. A decent tackle to force an incompleteion is effective too. But nooo we dont practice that...Wow....I'm royally pissed.

 

Same thing I was thinking. Maybe they are not playing with "energy" because they don't buy into his scheme themselves?

 

 

Thank you for posting this, this sums up 100% exactly how I feel about him

[ravensdfan]

Cam needed to go. Cam was good for about two years. He does one thing really well. He develops QBs. I'd honestly hire him again to be an OC if we needed another QB. His track record is proven. Two SB winnners, three above average QBs, one hall of famer. Cam did his job well. But he's only good for about two years. He excells in college for one reason. Because he can develop.

I don't hate Dean. I personally think he's fine. Neither bad nor great. He's put together two solid defenses in back to back years for us.

I understand why people hate him. He's not aggresive. Ravens are used to aggresive. But the bend don't break just doesn't flow well with you.

But he's not bad. He called a bad game. It happens. But let's look at the facts here.

1. Zone coverage is absolutely necesary when one of your corners just flat out sucks(Webb). You really want to press with a guy who won't get phyiscal and cannot tackle anymore?

2. We were down a Terell Suggs. Sure. It's just one guy. But he was still an elite defensive player. The best player on the defense. He honestly made Pee's job a lot easier. Being able to disguise pressure. We cannot do that anymore. Granted, we did a good pass rusher in Babin who consistently gets pressure on the QB. But now we're going to be forced to play Dumervil full time which will not allow him to be fresh.

3. The defensive line played like crap. Weird seeing as our best dlinemen came back.

So that alone takes some of the blame off his shoulders.

That said. He deserves some of it. Just because you're down a pass rusher doesn't mean you shouldn't bltz creativley. Which btw, he did vs Denver and that worked out very well vs a QB who's release time is off the charts btw. But as "The Raven" said, you cannot play well when your dline doesn't do it's damn job. Granted, I did expect some struggle with a younger dline.

I'm beggining to think this about the season. If we lose. Our season is probably over admittantly. But this team is a lot younger than we're used to. We have three older guys on the defense now with Suggs gone. Our older veterans consist of one of them being a full time starter and the other three(Babin, Dumervil, and Canty) being guys who rotate heavily. Our oldest player on offense is Steve Smith, followed by Flacco and Yanda who are both younger.

If we do lose. Fine. I'll accept it. That's the case, the season will be about growth. And we don't have a lot of missing pieces tbh.

I agree on Cam. I always said that about him. Can develop a QB like nobody else but then doesn't know how to take the next step.

 

Disagree on the rest. You said it yourself, our best D lineman came back and looked like that. The talent is there - which means it falls up the line.

 

You said yourself he didn't call the same game in week 1 yet, HE just came out and said that week 1 proves the problem isn't scheme. Um...serious problem there if that's the way he is seeing those two games. Pressures and blitzes are part of your scheme.

 

He essentially said that the defensive performance is not his issue. He threw his players under the bus and said "not me man, my scheme is great! It's them". This is perhaps my biggest thing right now. It shows an unwillingness to take any responsibility and that he sees no reason for him to change anything.

 

People might be unhappy with bend but don't break because of its lack of aggressiveness but we hate Pees because his version breaks more than it bends.

Edited September 26, 2015 by ravensdfan