The Dean Pees Thread (merged)

[Tru11]

In 2012 when we won the Super Bowl, he was the second coming....  Just saying.  I don't necessarily think that we shouldn't take  a look at this.  I'm typically not a basher of the coaches and coordinators...  mainly because I feel like most of the actual responsibility falls on the shoulders of players.

 

I have watched as MANY players have left our defense, and fallen flat on their faces in other organizations...  It just seems to happen that way.  I believe it has more to do with execution.  Somebody needs to light a fire under these guys....  They had a GREAT week against the Donkey's...  Maybe they got overconfident????  But yeah, they couldn't stop a kiddie carr yesterday.

 

well yeah carr could not be stopped because he had all day to throw.

every QB can do good when there is no pressure and they can just wait for coverage to break down.

 

i think its more a combo of losing suggs and not being @ home to prepare.

 

they broke with their normal routines and it showed with how sloppy they tackled and such.

 

if we dont find a pass rusher who can take over for suggs we will be in trouble.

he might not have gotten alot of sacks but he always got good pressure or at least was the focus for the o-line which lead to others like doom to have it much easier.

 

i really hope babin got alot left and jernigan comes alive or we are doomed.

 

defending the pass starts with getting pressure.

if we are forced to blitz alot of players to get pressure the opponent is going to get alot of big play oppurtunities...

[Tru11]

Can anyone fill me in as to what happened during the game on the Defensive side of the ball? I followed on Gamecast and was

 

nowhere near delighted to see completion after completion on the Raiders side

 

basicially without suggs the others for some reason could not create any pressure on the QB whatsoever which gave carr all the time to pick us apart.

 

on top of that we missed tackles , played undiscipline and basicially missed any form of leadership on defense to straighten things out.

 

To bad people are blaiming Pees for it all lol.

 

most of the time he had the right  play call but the players did not excecute.

 

on the raiders last TD the 2 middle LBers where supposed to cover the middle of the field in zone but no idea where mosley and smith where lol.

 

poor arrington though he had help on the inside..

only mistake he made on the play is giving the receiver a free release.

[Ravenseconbeast]

If we blow it @ bengals/steelers game.   Especially if our defense faulters, you will see something happen.   

 

There is no way Ravens go 0-4/1-3 and just 'play through the season'

[Dr. Kelley]

so we havent won any games since pees took over in 2012?

How many games has the defense blown,some to backup quarter backs no less?

[rmcjacket23]

If we blow it @ bengals/steelers game.   Especially if our defense faulters, you will see something happen.   

 

There is no way Ravens go 0-4/1-3 and just 'play through the season'

My money would be on personnel changes though, not coaching changes.

 

Frankly, when you go 0-4, its kind of hard to see what difference a coaching change is going to make, given that your playoff hopes are gone and anybody who takes over is already on the coaching staff, meaning they likely share at least somewhat similar characteristics and ideologies.

[Tru11]

How many games has the defense blown,some to backup quarter backs no less?

 

they won more games then they blown and for the last 2 years they have been ranked higher then the offense.

 

without them no SB lol.

 

heck not even play offs....

 

how about you let me know how many they have blown 

Edited September 21, 2015 by Tru11

[Dr. Kelley]

they won more games then they blown and for the last 2 years they have been ranked higher then the offense.

without them no SB lol.

heck not even play offs....

how about you let me know how many they have blown

Its actually how comical how hard you are going out of your way to ignore the truth

[JEEPercreepermd]

Dean Pees isn't out on the field not covering guys.

They tried everything yesterday..none of it worked. They just got whooped on the field.

Scheme and play calling can't make up for that

[Tru11]

Its actually how comical how hard you are going out of your way to ignore the truth

 

truth is that he is in the top half of DC in the league lol

 

a fact you and other keep ignoring.

 

fact is his defense has been better then the offense for 2 out 3 seasons he has been here.

 

fact also is that he call the plays and the players have to execute.

a very important fact you are forgetting.

 

not to mention not once did he have all his best player healthy.

 

he was 8th in defense with PS players playing CB lol

[Dr. Kelley]

truth is that he is in the top half of DC in the league lol

a fact you and other keep ignoring.

fact is his defense has been better then the offense for 2 out 3 seasons he has been here.

fact also is that he call the plays and the players have to execute.

a very important fact you are forgetting.

not to mention not once did he have all his best player healthy.

he was 8th in defense with PS players playing CB lol

Your logic is that, since we don't lose every single game each year, Dean Pees is a great coordinator.

Yeah, good reasoning

[berad]

truth is that he is in the top half of DC in the league lol

 

a fact you and other keep ignoring.

 

fact is his defense has been better then the offense for 2 out 3 seasons he has been here.

 

fact also is that he call the plays and the players have to execute.

a very important fact you are forgetting.

 

not to mention not once did he have all his best player healthy.

 

he was 8th in defense with PS players playing CB lol

 

Hard to heap the credit on the coordinator while deflecting with 'the players have to execute' if it goes bad. So is it the players performing or Pees' masterful gameplans?

[Tru11]

Your logic is that, since we don't lose every single game each year, Dean Pees is a great coordinator.

Yeah, good reasoning

my logic is that he aint as bad as you make him out to be

[GrimCoconut]

Sure, but I don't buy that his seat is even really that hot right now to begin with...

In order for his seat to be hot, you'd have to assume that John wasn't confident in him to begin the season. By all accounts, John was supremely confident in Pees to begin the season.

So what really has changed? Pees defense looked unbelievably dominant in week 1, and they looked unbelievably bad in week 2. So can anybody really say with any certainty what this defense is?

Easy answer right now is to say that we are closer to yesterday's defense than we are to week 1's defense, but you can certainly make the other side of that argument quite easily.

It could be that the loss of Suggs is a lot bigger than we expected, and sort of like losing Jimmy last season, it takes at least several weeks before we learn how to play without him.

You're probably not saying I'm saying to fire Pees, but just in case, I agree. I can't say his seat is hot yet. That's why I said if it doesn't improve, which I think it will. Week 5 things should be better. If we're still sucking on defense I'm not sure we don't start thinking of making a move.

Playing devil's advocate but you could possibly say Harbaugh may be inclined to let him go after what he said in preseason about wanting us to hold a fourth quarter lead for once.

[The Mom Gene]

my logic is that he aint as bad as you make him out to be

I don't question coordinators as much as a lot of people do... but when you go from lights out to dud in week 2?  I'm thinking it's more about the execution and over abundance of confidence in these guys heads....  just sayin.

[Tru11]

Hard to heap the credit on the coordinator while deflecting with 'the players have to execute' if it goes bad. So is it the players performing or Pees' masterful gameplans?

 

its hard to blame the DC when players miss tackles or cant beat their man lol.

 

it goes both ways.

 

over a full season its shown he aint a bad DC and our players are putting up stats when they excecute..

 

it falls on both not just the DC.

[jazz1988]

Your logic is that, since we don't lose every single game each year, Dean Pees is a great coordinator.

Yeah, good reasoning

 

Usually I think majority of  the time a coordinator isn't consider good is if the team overall has a losing season. The only time The Ravens miss the playoffs in Harbaugh era  was in 2013 but that was due to all the issue on offense. You not going to see the  coordinator get fired if  the team makes the playoff/ has  a winning season.

 

 

Dean Pees is not a bad or terrible defensive coordinator at all it's  that he has his issues but i'm not sure if there is any defensive or even offensive coordinator that doesn't have issues.

[rmcjacket23]

You're probably not saying I'm saying to fire Pees, but just in case, I agree. I can't say his seat is hot yet. That's why I said if it doesn't improve, which I think it will. Week 5 things should be better. If we're still sucking on defense I'm not sure we don't start thinking of making a move.

Playing devil's advocate but you could possibly say Harbaugh may be inclined to let him go after what he said in preseason about wanting us to hold a fourth quarter lead for once.

I think he'd be inclined to let him go if this teams performs as poorly as they did yesterday over the course of at least like 2-3 games, meaning we'd probably have to go 0-4 AND have poor defensive performances in all of those.

 

Still, at that point, I personally would just keep him and see if you can find improvement with him throughout the season. Firing a coordinator after starting 0-4 really has basically no benefit for 2015 for this team. Its not like he's going to go external and hire somebody until at least 2016, so all you're doing is promoting internally.

 

That concept COULD work if you were like we were in 2012, a 9-4 team capable of withstanding an interior coaching staff change, because the risk of not making the playoffs was far less.

 

At this point, if you start 0-4 and then fire Pees, you're probably just promoting an internal guy and then reevaluating everything (coaches, players, etc.) in the offseason, so again, I'm not sure what that accomplishes in 2015.

 

I think IF there is a coaching change there, it happens in the offseason at the earliest.

[berad]

its hard to blame the DC when players miss tackles or cant beat their man lol.

 

it goes both ways.

 

over a full season its shown he aint a bad DC and our players are putting up stats when they excecute..

 

it falls on both not just the DC.

 

Point being that we have (and have had) WAY more talent than to be inconsistent throughout the years and give up 37 to the Oakland Raiders. Pees shoulders some blame, as you alluded, and I doubt that gameplan goes up on his mantle.

[Tru11]

I don't question coordinators as much as a lot of people do... but when you go from lights out to dud in week 2?  I'm thinking it's more about the execution and over abundance of confidence in these guys heads....  just sayin.

 

but is that the DC fault.

 

he had jimmy in man cov on cooper and jimmy got beat.

how can you blame pees for that lol.

 

or webb falling down while hill left his zone on the crabtree TD?

 

heck on the last raiders TD  both ILB where supposed to cover the middle.

 

neither smith or mosley where to be found lol.

 

thats 3 TDs where you can argue its more the players then the DC....

[GrimCoconut]

I don't think people are giving Oakland enough credit for playing really well. I said even before the game that their OL was a good OL. Penn is a great LT even if he is old. Jackson played great for them last year. Hudson was a very good center from KC. Howard and Webb were their weak links, but Howard had some really strong seasons before. I'm not sure what to think of Webb as a guard but the talent around him is great. We depended on the DL to get pressure they couldn't get due to the opposing OL. They had some nice plays, though.

[Florida Ravens Fan]

Why are the guys playing so far off on a 3rd and short? If that's on the players and not on Pees then Pees is not doing his job. We constantly blow leads and that's definitely a problem since Pees has taken over. Two fourteen point leads against the Pats and we still lose. Yes I know we had practice squad guys for cb, but what is the excuse this year? Webb sucks.... OK so the FO does what to fix this? Our depth at cb sucked and Webb is glass, we will definitely be in bigger trouble if Webb goes down.   

[PurpleCity5]

Here's the point, we're better on defense to give up 37 points to the Raiders. Plain and Simple. There were play calls that made me scratch my head honestly. The dink and dunks seem to be killing us and Pees offers no change to that.

 

When I look at the talent of this roster, this team should be leaps and bounds better than 2014 Ravens defense. Safety's and CBs are a much improved unit and we are still stagnate at DL and LB. I don't think it's a personnel problem, but at times I don't think it's all Pees fault. It's a mixed bag honestly. 

 

This Unit is better than most in the league on paper, so how could we under-preform so awfully in Oakland? It makes no sense. Sizzle is a great player, but one man cannot drag this whole defense down, especially if we're getting Jigg back. 

 

I gatta give Oak credit, they played hard and well. 

 

If we do make a DC change, I doubt it's out of the organization and rather the team. Todd Bowles took over as a secondary coach and rose to become a great coach....though there's not many like Bowles....we could find someone from within ourselves. 

 

Right now, I don't think Pees is in the hotseat, but more 4th QTR slip ups by the defense, and he won't have a hot seat, he'll have a hot tub. 

Edited September 21, 2015 by PurpleCity5

[jazz1988]

its hard to blame the DC when players miss tackles or cant beat their man lol.

 

it goes both ways.

 

over a full season its shown he aint a bad DC and our players are putting up stats when they excecute..

 

it falls on both not just the DC.

 

But we have seen a constant repeat of players just not executing and not tackling properly eventually the DC has to take some  blame for that. We have also seen defensive players creating unnecessary penalties  at the wrong moments as well.  Our defense played better when asked to be play aggressive and seem to respond better at doing that then  asked to play it safe/conservative.

 

I don't understand how you give Derek Carr more respect than Peyton Manning that's crazy to me.  Pees didn't start getting aggressive until like fourth quarter  which is just not going to do. As said this to another Raven fan but I believe Pees is  a good defensive coordinator but he get's way too cautious sometimes because that's how his play calling was after Jimmy Smith got beat for touchdown. 

 

 

Not only does he  get too cautious  at times but he's not even on the sidelines with the players to get a better feeling on what going on and it's bad enough The Ravens communication level hasn't been the same since Reed and Lewis has retired. Dean Pees basically to me only teaches the scheme then when it's game time he's up in podium calling plays by himself. If The Ravens are more of a  aggressive defense and the players like that style better than being conservative can cause problems.As said before Pees went totally conservative after that first touchdown by The Raiders and if you going to be conservative after just facing one of the best quarterbacks in the league in week one that may bother the players  because now you telling the players I have no confidence in you playing aggressive against Derek Carr.  

[gtalk12]

basicially without suggs the others for some reason could not create any pressure on the QB whatsoever which gave carr all the time to pick us apart.

 

on top of that we missed tackles , played undiscipline and basicially missed any form of leadership on defense to straighten things out.

 

To bad people are blaiming Pees for it all lol.

 

most of the time he had the right  play call but the players did not excecute.

 

on the raiders last TD the 2 middle LBers where supposed to cover the middle of the field in zone but no idea where mosley and smith where lol.

 

poor arrington though he had help on the inside..

only mistake he made on the play is giving the receiver a free release.

 

Our offense seemed to click well, so it was a similar showing as last years playoffs.....was Timmy in?

[Tru11]

But we have seen a constant repeat of players just not executing and not tackling properly eventually the DC has to take some  blame for that. We have also seen defensive players creating unnecessary penalties  at the wrong moments as well.  Our defense played better when asked to be play aggressive and seem to respond better at doing that then  asked to play it safe/conservative.

 

I don't understand how you give Derek Carr more respect than Peyton Manning that's crazy to me.  Pees didn't start getting aggressive until like fourth quarter  which is just not going to do. As said this to another Raven fan but I believe Pees is  a good defensive coordinator but he get's way too cautious sometimes because that's how his play calling was after Jimmy Smith got beat for touchdown. 

 

 

Not only does he  get too cautious  at times but he's not even on the sidelines with the players to get a better feeling on what going on and it's bad enough The Ravens communication level hasn't been the same since Reed and Lewis has retired. Dean Pees basically to me only teaches the scheme then when it's game time he's up in podium calling plays by himself. If The Ravens are more of a  aggressive defense and the players like that style better than being conservative can cause problems.As said before Pees went totally conservative after that first touchdown by The Raiders and if you going to be conservative after just facing one of the best quarterbacks in the league in week one that may bother the players  because now you telling the players I have no confidence in you playing aggressive against Derek Carr.  

 

would you not get cautious when your best CB gets torched by a rookie?

 

i know i would lol.

even more when guys fall down and let wrs run free, while others leave their zone to freelance....

 

i dont really think its about him showing more respect though.

 

a point alot of people dont realise is that the raiders have a better o-line then the broncos.

they where pretty good in pass protection last season.

think even among the best.

 

the broncos on the other hand had 4 new guys starting with i think 2 being rookies and 1 guy who just got signed a week or 2 ago lol.

 

then when you factor in that agains the broncos we still had suggs but against the raiders you have to rely on smith amd upshaw then yeah it might not be much of a suprise that we got more pressure on manning.

[Tru11]

Our offense seemed to click well, so it was a similar showing as last years playoffs.....was Timmy in?

 

He was and he had a late hit on the last drive that gave the raiders 15 free yards which pretty much sealed OT and gave them a bigger chance to win it , in which they did.

 

at least 21 points id chalk up to players screwing up on defense...

[gtalk12]

He was and he had a late hit on the last drive that gave the raiders 15 free yards which pretty much sealed OT and gave them a bigger chance to win it , in which they did.

 

at least 21 points id chalk up to players screwing up on defense...

 

what....happened.....was this the same D from last week? smh

[Tru11]

I don't think people are giving Oakland enough credit for playing really well. I said even before the game that their OL was a good OL. Penn is a great LT even if he is old. Jackson played great for them last year. Hudson was a very good center from KC. Howard and Webb were their weak links, but Howard had some really strong seasons before. I'm not sure what to think of Webb as a guard but the talent around him is great. We depended on the DL to get pressure they couldn't get due to the opposing OL. They had some nice plays, though.

 

you are right.

 

their o-line was solid in pass protection last season.

 

its a much better unit then that patchwork thing the broncos have 

 

to bad not many people know this lol

[Tru11]

what....happened.....was this the same D from last week? smh

 

raiders have a much better o-line then broncos + no suggs= less pressure then last week = more pressure on secondary= even jimmy got burned bad by cooper and guys falling down or out of position.

 

TBH it can be corrected and the raiders where all fired up after getting destroyed last week lol

 

offense played much better though.

 

so if the defense gets their act together we can still make the play offs.

 

dont get into the widespread panic that you read lol.

[gtalk12]

raiders have a much better o-line then broncos + no suggs= less pressure then last week = more pressure on secondary= even jimmy got burned bad by cooper and guys falling down or out of position.

 

TBH it can be corrected and the raiders where all fired up after getting destroyed last week lol

 

offense played much better though.

 

so if the defense gets their act together we can still make the play offs.

 

dont get into the widespread panic that you read lol.

 

Bengals are 2-0