Waller vs Marlon

[cushrinada1986]

At this point we have seen what we kinda have in Brown. We have seen flashes of what Waller can do as well as Brown. Who should be getting more reps with Flacco at the #2 spot of the two?

[Purple Punishment]

Brown has ability. He's being utilized improperly

[redrum52]

I just saw that one of Marlon's best games came against the Browns....

In a loss, so I voted for Waller.

[salamander]

Maybe I will revisit this question after the Browns game if they give both Brown and Waller a decent amount of targets. I hope that these 2 respond to the WR shortage circumstances and the criticisms by proving themselves. Won't know who I think is better til I see more.

Edited October 9, 2015 by salamander

[OldToby]

Go back and watch the past couple games, you can see that Marlon gets open. Idk why the rapport between Flacco and the recievers has been so inconsistent.

[Purple_City39]

It's a hard question to answer.  As has been said, Brown's been open a lot but Joe's not looking his way.  I also think Waller has a much higher ceiling and has the chance to be a bigger playmaker.  

[Ravenseconbeast]

Marlon easy. Marlon has found a way to do more his rookie year vs Waller.

Waller is another tommy streeter with more opportunity.

[balfan23]

I still feel like the jury is out. We need to work with the two of them over the next few games and see what we get. Unfortunately, we have no margin for error in terms of putting up wins anyway we can get them. So it kinda makes it difficult to experiment. 

 

My sense is that Waller will ultimately be a better WR for us going forward, but we need production immediately. 

[757RavensFan]

I'm still on the Marlon bandwagon.  I personally feel his confidence took a huge hit when he lost A LOT of playing time last season b/c of the addition of SSS.  Since SSS is out this week, I'm hoping Marlon will do better on Sunday.  When you don't have to worry about coming out after one play, you tend to settle down and just PLAY.  Hopefully that'll be the case for Marlon this weekend and we benefit from it by getting the W.  

 

Considering that Waller just registered his 1st catch of the season in the 4th game, I would have to see A LOT more from him before I say move him to the #2 spot. 

Edited October 9, 2015 by 757RavensFan

[izvoodoo]

Marlon easy. Marlon has found a way to do more his rookie year vs Waller.

Waller is another tommy streeter with more opportunity.

Waller I think is a much more natural football player than Streeter.  Not to say Waller is odds on going to be an NFL difference maker, but he was much more comfortable as a pass catcher than Streeter.  Still not a safe bet by any stretch of the imagination.  

[JoeyFlex5]

right now, id prefer marlon. 

 

but i treated the vote as "if you had to cut one and keep one who would it be?" so i chose waller. 

 

at this very moment, brown is more proven, and slightly better, but that should be expected from a guy who spent his rookie year as a #2 and his 2nd season as a 3 and 4, but we know that marlon brown has already hit his ceiling and that ceiling is very low, and his floor isnt exactly an impressive one either, and he will bounce up and down from ceiling to floor constantly. 

 

waller i think by next season is leaps and bounds ahead of brown. the big difference i see between them is that waller has a natural sense of body control, albeit its not the greatest, but his ball skills, speed, verticals, and body control are all lightyears beyond what marlon can offer, that alone is enough reason for me, why have a 6'5" WR with no ball skills? waller has everything marlon has and MUCH more

[beanfigger]

Lot of love for our last draft pick who has done nothing in preseason or regular season. I like him a lot and want to see him get a chance, but it isn't guaranteed that every GM and all our coaches and quarterbacks are completely wrong about the guy. Marlon at least did enough to prove he can make a difference when he was undrafted. He earned more of an opportunity than Waller has thus far. I hope they both raise their games and push each other to solid play.

[GrimCoconut]

Marlon Brown at the moment, but this is subject to change if Waller starts to really come into his own.

[redrum52]

Lot of love for our last draft pick who has done nothing in preseason or regular season. I like him a lot and want to see him get a chance, but it isn't guaranteed that every GM and all our coaches and quarterbacks are completely wrong about the guy. Marlon at least did enough to prove he can make a difference when he was undrafted. He earned more of an opportunity than Waller has thus far. I hope they both raise their games and push each other to solid play.

Marlon got a chance because Boldin was traded and Jacoby was hurt. The 13 wr depth might be been worse than this years. If Waller was forced into Marlon's situation, I b think he could produce the same type of numbers.

[Edug27]

Waller is unknown potential.

Marlon is proven mediocre.

So most would take the unknown over the mediocre. But I'm not as high on Waller, at least right now. We aren't in a position to spend time developing such a raw player. Give me Marlon this season and we can revisit this in the offseason.

[Ravensfan23]

It all comes down to who Trestman schemes open and who Flacco targets. Both of these guys can make plays and scheme will get then open in most cases but Flacco has to target them. Trestman likes to run a lot of shallow crosses and quick outs. Those routes are basically designed to get guys open being them, so the guy running those routes won't be targeted much unless the defense defends the 2nd route.

What I'm excited about for both guys is if and when the Ravens get into the red zone. I'm a huge Sr fan but i don't want to see one more fade to him when you have 6'4 and above options. Flacco and Trestman have to rely on these guys now and it's a good thing.

I think we'll see Aiken and Brown outside with Williams in the slot in most situations.

[allblackraven]

Tough call in our current WR situation. After promising '13, Marlon showed very little. With the same amount of opportunities, I think Waller would give us better production.

[JoeyFlex5]

It all comes down to who Trestman schemes open and who Flacco targets. Both of these guys can make plays and scheme will get then open in most cases but Flacco has to target them. Trestman likes to run a lot of shallow crosses and quick outs. Those routes are basically designed to get guys open being them, so the guy running those routes won't be targeted much unless the defense defends the 2nd route.

What I'm excited about for both guys is if and when the Ravens get into the red zone. I'm a huge Sr fan but i don't want to see one more fade to him when you have 6'4 and above options. Flacco and Trestman have to rely on these guys now and it's a good thing.

I think we'll see Aiken and Brown outside with Williams in the slot in most situations.

marlon browns sense of positioning on short fades is abysmal, i would not trust flacco floating the ball for him to fight with a defender when we are in scoring position, that is just asking for a redzone int. the problem with marlon brown really is that he absolutely sucks at positioning himself and boxing out/highpointing, steve smith is a better fade target.

[beanfigger]

Marlon got a chance because Boldin was traded and Jacoby was hurt. The 13 wr depth might be been worse than this years. If Waller was forced into Marlon's situation, I b think he could produce the same type of numbers.

Right, "think he could". I honestly have no expectations for him good or bad. Completely unknown to me. Marlon worked his way into reps even before Jones' injury. He bumped a drafted receiver off the roster. Waller has a chance now. Let's see if he can score ten touchdowns. I hope so.

[redrum52]

Right, "think he could". I honestly have no expectations for him good or bad. Completely unknown to me. Marlon worked his way into reps even before Jones' injury. He bumped a drafted receiver off the roster. Waller has a chance now. Let's see if he can score ten touchdowns. I hope so.

Bumping a WR we drafted off the roster doesn't mean much, especially following our track record. True he performed, but why has he fallen so far to the background since then? I fully believe if Camp could stay healthy, Brown would be seeing much less reps. Also, seeing how bad Brown has looked recently, maybe the guys(who are currently unemployed) just weren't that good. This organization sucks at finding their own wr talent.

I think Waller knows how to use his body better than Brown as well.

[52520Andrew]

Can we choose neither?

Brown at least showed something in 2013 but man has he been bad lately

Waller has potential but is raw, would probably roll with Waller and get him some real snaps and pray he develops quick and doesn't lose confidence if not.

[Ravensfan23]

marlon browns sense of positioning on short fades is abysmal, i would not trust flacco floating the ball for him to fight with a defender when we are in scoring position, that is just asking for a redzone int. the problem with marlon brown really is that he absolutely sucks at positioning himself and boxing out/highpointing, steve smith is a better fade target.

I can count on 1 finger the amount of times Brown has been targeted on a redzone fade over the past 2 years and that number is none. So we are talking about going back to 2013 when he was an UDFA rookie to base that decision? Marlon has done a fine job with back should fades with is also an option in the redzone. A guy will make 0% of the plays he's not given an opportunity to make. I'm not saying he's the best but give him and others a shot. If Marlon were losing a ton of high point jump ball situations I'd agree with you but he's not because he's not even given a chance unless you are watching practice and have insight.

Also Flacco has to take fault in this as well. I've already seen it in his few targets to Waller. If you thow a pass to a 6'5 guy but it isn't high you automatically reduce his size. A 6'5 guy should never have to compete for a ball below his helmet in terms of a ball that should be high pointed. So it goes both ways. Even with the Gillmore int vs Denver. Gillmore basically had to pull the ball off the defenders helmet instead of high pointing the ball. If Gillmore is allowed to extend his arms fully there is no way anyone stops him from completing the catch.

[JoeyFlex5]

I can count on 1 finger the amount of times Brown has been targeted on a redzone fade over the past 2 years and that number is none. So we are talking about going back to 2013 when he was an UDFA rookie to base that decision? Marlon has done a fine job with back should fades with is also an option in the redzone. A guy will make 0% of the plays he's not given an opportunity to make. I'm not saying he's the best but give him and others a shot. If Marlon were losing a ton of high point jump ball situations I'd agree with you but he's not because he's not even given a chance unless you are watching practice and have insight.

Also Flacco has to take fault in this as well. I've already seen it in his few targets to Waller. If you thow a pass to a 6'5 guy but it isn't high you automatically reduce his size. A 6'5 guy should never have to compete for a ball below his helmet in terms of a ball that should be high pointed. So it goes both ways. Even with the Gillmore int vs Denver. Gillmore basically had to pull the ball off the defenders helmet instead of high pointing the ball. If Gillmore is allowed to extend his arms fully there is no way anyone stops him from completing the catch.

ill agree that he has underthrown some of his jumpballs, but you dont need to throw a redzone fade to see that marlon brown has no sense of positioning and body control. when he has to compete with a db for a catch or adjust his body at a running speed to haul in a catch, he fails nearly every single time, he hasnt been thrown endzone fades because in the few chances he gets on those positioning and boxing out passes, he has failed, he isnt trustworthy in those situations. 

 

i wouldnt trust waller yet either, but i know even that one pass where joe threw it pretty much right into the db's chest when he should ave dropped it over the top down the sideline, waller made a better effort on that incompletion and showed better sense of positioning and contesting than i have ever seen from brown, and he didnt even catch the ball lol. 

 

ill take aiken and brown over aiken and waller at this very moment, but not at the expense of waller losing any chance at getting reps, because i think in his little bit of playing time he has showed some promise on some unfair opportunities. marlon brown may not be getting targets, but he doesnt go from being force fed the ball as a UDFA to just being unfairly left out for no reason, he isnt getting targets because he simply isnt trustworthy.

[Guest]

Marlon easy. Marlon has found a way to do more his rookie year vs Waller.

Waller is another tommy streeter with more opportunity.

 

He just needs some good throws.

 

You'll see

 

He is still learning....with more reps he'll catch some of those off the preserve quail Joe has been releasing for him.

[beanfigger]

Bumping a WR we drafted off the roster doesn't mean much, especially following our track record. True he performed, but why has he fallen so far to the background since then? I fully believe if Camp could stay healthy, Brown would be seeing much less reps. Also, seeing how bad Brown has looked recently, maybe the guys(who are currently unemployed) just weren't that good. This organization sucks at finding their own wr talent.

I think Waller knows how to use his body better than Brown as well.

Yes, Marlon Brown is not that good, but he is capable of scoring many touchdowns if forced into a major role. Maybe Waller can, too, but how can we know? How do you know he can use his body better? College tape? Mini-camp? I'm not saying you're wrong, but how can we know anything about him right now? From what I've seen, he can barely get off the line of scrimmage. Edited October 10, 2015 by beanfigger

[Ravenseconbeast]

Yes, Marlon Brown is not that good, but he is capable of scoring many touchdowns if forced into a major role. Maybe Waller can, too, but how can we know? How do you know he can use his body better? College tape? Mini-camp? I'm not saying you're wrong, but how can we know anything about him right now?

A small sample, but I've never seen Waller get open or beat his man to get the ball.

Browns game should be a great observation. Bc if he can't do anything here(probably the best opportunity to showcase himself this season), he is done in my book.

[omar586]

honestly these guys need an opportunity to prove themselves, need more snaps in games. we will never know their potential if their on the bench. look at the steelers, it seems like that about any WR  the draft is a home run.

[K-Dog]

*shrugs*
It really is close.

Both have pros and cons.   Neither of which I would bet my bottom dollar on.

[Ravensfan23]

ill agree that he has underthrown some of his jumpballs, but you dont need to throw a redzone fade to see that marlon brown has no sense of positioning and body control. when he has to compete with a db for a catch or adjust his body at a running speed to haul in a catch, he fails nearly every single time, he hasnt been thrown endzone fades because in the few chances he gets on those positioning and boxing out passes, he has failed, he isnt trustworthy in those situations. 

 

i wouldnt trust waller yet either, but i know even that one pass where joe threw it pretty much right into the db's chest when he should ave dropped it over the top down the sideline, waller made a better effort on that incompletion and showed better sense of positioning and contesting than i have ever seen from brown, and he didnt even catch the ball lol. 

 

ill take aiken and brown over aiken and waller at this very moment, but not at the expense of waller losing any chance at getting reps, because i think in his little bit of playing time he has showed some promise on some unfair opportunities. marlon brown may not be getting targets, but he doesnt go from being force fed the ball as a UDFA to just being unfairly left out for no reason, he isnt getting targets because he simply isnt trustworthy.

I won't say your wrong but if he isn't trust worthy why is he on the field? I keep hearing media and fans trying to ship this guy out of town but coaches continue to give him opportunities. He has been targeted more then Aiken in two of the four games. All of Aiken's production comes from the Raiders and Steelers game also Brown is seeing just as many snaps as Aiken and Sr. So if he isn't trust worthy why do coaches trust him enough to play him so much? Not beating the table here for Brown's talent, just honestly confused on why he always seems to be the odd man out to everyone but the coaches. If he doesn't step up and make plays while Sr is out I'm all for given someone else a shot but it's crazy to keep writing the guy off when he's not being targeted as much. On the flip side if you can't trust him as a WR then work someone else into the offense.

[JoeyFlex5]

I won't say your wrong but if he isn't trust worthy why is he on the field? I keep hearing media and fans trying to ship this guy out of town but coaches continue to give him opportunities. He has been targeted more then Aiken in two of the four games. All of Aiken's production comes from the Raiders and Steelers game also Brown is seeing just as many snaps as Aiken and Sr. So if he isn't trust worthy why do coaches trust him enough to play him so much? Not beating the table here for Brown's talent, just honestly confused on why he always seems to be the odd man out to everyone but the coaches. If he doesn't step up and make plays while Sr is out I'm all for given someone else a shot but it's crazy to keep writing the guy off when he's not being targeted as much. On the flip side if you can't trust him as a WR then work someone else into the offense.

because we dont have much choice. before sr and camp went down, aiken was the 2 and brown was pretty much 2b, campanaro and waller were our only other options and campanaro was probably still recovering from him training camp injury and waller is very raw. campanaro began to catch fire and suddenly brown and aiken began losing snaps and targets, aiken seized the opportunity for the most part when he got playing time(except for the cinci game) and brown didnt. when campanaro and steve went down, it was between aiken, waller, and brown; aiken caught fire, waller made a clutch game saving play, and brown did nothing at all iirc. 

 

its not that hes the odd man out, its that hes the least talented wideout on the team and after 3 seasons the lack of talent is now getting noticeable. he sees the field because regardless of what he can do, he is a big boy, he can throw a nice block on a quick strike YAC play, he can block the exterior on stretch plays if needed, and maybe he can get a mismatch on occasion, end up with a 6'5" WR facing a 5'10" nickel back, and we know that at the very least he isnt gonna go out there and cause a disaster, i think thats about the extent of him seeing playing time.