2016 DB Prospect Thread

[GrimCoconut]

I've seen a lot of people down on Ramsey lately, but I took the time to put on some tape tonight and I don't see why to be honest.  I get that a lot of people saw him playing close to the LOS, and while that's true, it doesn't mean he's stuck there.  How he's used in college doesn't equate to how he can be used in the NFL.  Ramsey has some of the most impressive closing speed I've seen.  He has incredible range on the back end, regardless of how much he was actually used there.  My biggest concern is his overaggressiveness and questionable ball skills.  He's a dangerous guy on the back end though.  FSU has used him in a myriad of different roles because he can do them all and do them well.

Yeah, I think we can do worse than him. This is a really strong DB class overall. Lots of good safeties and CBs. 

[rmw10]

Yeah, I think we can do worse than him. This is a really strong DB class overall. Lots of good safeties and CBs. 

 

Without question.  I'd absolutely love Ramsey or Hargreaves (haven't seen his last game, FWIW), but I'd almost prefer going in another direction because of all of the other options on day 2.  That's of course based on the assumption that there's a comparable talent left on the board with one of Ramsey or Hargreaves.

[ravensnick]

I watched my share of their games this year for many reasons. Part was matchup and game excitement. The other part was I wanted to see the Harbaugh Wolverines lol. He's certainly been great. I'd love him here. A shame it can't be this year.

What do you think of their QB, Jake Rudock? I really like him.

Rudock started a little rough but it all clicked for him starting at the Rutgers game. He and Chesson made a great combo during the late stretch. I'd really like to get Rudock as a backup, but I could see him rising. I also can see Connor Cook soaring down draft boards and I don't think too many teams will look Cardale Jones before the third day.

[ravensnick]

Without question.  I'd absolutely love Ramsey or Hargreaves (haven't seen his last game, FWIW), but I'd almost prefer going in another direction because of all of the other options on day 2.  That's of course based on the assumption that there's a comparable talent left on the board with one of Ramsey or Hargreaves.

Both (Hargreaves especially) struggled in their bowl matchups.

[rmw10]

Both (Hargreaves especially) struggled in their bowl matchups.

 

Yeah I heard.  I haven't checked either game out.  I'm sure it'll give me some pause of course but the overall body of work for both is still very, very impressive.  I'll take it with a grain of salt and try not to let one bad game be the defining game.

[GrimCoconut]

Rudock started a little rough but it all clicked for him starting at the Rutgers game. He and Chesson made a great combo during the late stretch. I'd really like to get Rudock as a backup, but I could see him rising. I also can see Connor Cook soaring down draft boards and I don't think too many teams will look Cardale Jones before the third day.

Yeah, I feel the same (that he could rise). I really hope he doesn't. I would love to get him in the 4th round or so. He could prove to be a major steal. 

[ravensnick]

Yeah I heard.  I haven't checked either game out.  I'm sure it'll give me some pause of course but the overall body of work for both is still very, very impressive.  I'll take it with a grain of salt and try not to let one bad game be the defining game.

Ramsey's game pretty much told me he needs to play safety at the next level. Ramsey can pretty much only play press man at CB. He struggles at off man or zone. No big deal for him, teams already knew he was a special player at safety and he has shown some talent at CB, giving him more versatility. Hargreaves worries me more. He was playing a guy who has been hot recently, Jehu Chesson, but Chesson isn't exactly a premier talent. He absolutely scorched Hargreaves one on one with a double move for a 30 yard TD.

Edited January 3, 2016 by ravensnick

[ravensnick]

Yeah, I feel the same (that he could rise). I really hope he doesn't. I would love to get him in the 4th round or so. He could prove to be a major steal. 

Agreed. Rudock has shown major progress every year as a starter and I don't think he has reached his full potential yet. He still is second on the Michigan single season passing yard mark. Very impressive. Another year with Harbaugh, and he could have been a top prospect in the draft.

[rmw10]

Ramsey game pretty much told me he needs to play safety at the next level. Ramsey can pretty much only play press man at CB. He struggles at off man or zone. No big deal for him, teams already knew he was a special player at safety and he has shown some talent at CB, giving him more versatility. Hargreaves worries me more. He was playing a guy who has been hot recently, Jehu Chesson, but Chesson isn't exactly a primary talent. He absolutely scorched Hargreaves one on one with a double move for a 30 yard TD.

 

I've always been in on Ramsey as a S primarily, with the versatility to slide to CB if certain situations or if necessary.

 

I did see that one play on Hargreaves and it certainly didn't look good.

[LosT_in_TranSlatioN]

One bad game does not mean he's going to be a bad pro. I think if Vh3 falls to us and there's no LT there we take him without thinking about it.

The tools are there

[rmw10]

One bad game does not mean he's going to be a bad pro. I think if Vh3 falls to us and there's no LT there we take him without thinking about it.

The tools are there

 

Bad games happen.  Even the best have had a really off day.

[ravensnick]

One bad game does not mean he's going to be a bad pro. I think if Vh3 falls to us and there's no LT there we take him without thinking about it.

The tools are there

It's not just one bad game. He didn't look very good against Alabama, where Calvin Ridley got the best of him a couple times. Ridley is insanely talented and probably a first rounder in two years, but it is still a tad worrying. Hargreaves is also a tad short for the position at 5"11". IMO, Jalen Tabor outplayed Hargreaves this year.

Edited January 3, 2016 by ravensnick

[52520Andrew]

I've seen a lot of people down on Ramsey lately, but I took the time to put on some tape tonight and I don't see why to be honest. I get that a lot of people saw him playing close to the LOS, and while that's true, it doesn't mean he's stuck there. How he's used in college doesn't equate to how he can be used in the NFL. Ramsey has some of the most impressive closing speed I've seen. He has incredible range on the back end, regardless of how much he was actually used there. My biggest concern is his overaggressiveness and questionable ball skills. He's a dangerous guy on the back end though. FSU has used him in a myriad of different roles because he can do them all and do them well.

The guy is capable of a 10.6 100m so I think people questioning his range are a bit off there. Also an impressive jump. He is undisciplined but having that fear factor over the middle would be huge and I think we are a better team with him at Safety than with him at CB.

[zuilyas]

Yeah I heard.  I haven't checked either game out.  I'm sure it'll give me some pause of course but the overall body of work for both is still very, very impressive.  I'll take it with a grain of salt and try not to let one bad game be the defining game.

Didn't see the Michigan/Florida game, but I did see the FSU/Houston game. Ramsey wasn't awful. He made his share of plays, but he did make some mistakes. Critical one at the end of the game as a result of miscommunication between him and Brutus as to who was going to blitz and who was going to cover the receiver, at least from what I recall. On a side note, and I'm not sure if I or someone else has brought this up before, but Derwin James is an absolute stud.

[PurpleCity5]

I feel like we can't possibly fix all 3 areas in one off season, so we need to make the most of what we can in one or 2 of those areas. Treadwell I think is a safer pick than any db or edge rusher where we stand, not that he's my favorite guy, but I would still like the pick very much

Yes, we cannot fix all areas but I'd personally like to see us aggressively fill in CB and Pass Rusher, since we're working with house money its hard to see how we can fill in all of these needs via FA with OT possibly being a need as well. If we're looking to fill in three of those positions via the draft, then I personally think OLB and CB would have to be those positions.

[nishadrahman13]

It's not just one bad game. He didn't look very good against Alabama, where Calvin Ridley got the best of him a couple times. Ridley is insanely talented and probably a first rounder in two years, but it is still a tad worrying. Hargreaves is also a tad short for the position at 5"11". IMO, Jalen Tabor outplayed Hargreaves this year.

Plus 5'11" is generous. I wouldn't be surprised by a 5'9" measurement at the combine.

[nishadrahman13]

Yes, we cannot fix all areas but I'd personally like to see us aggressively fill in CB and Pass Rusher, since we're working with house money its hard to see how we can fill in all of these needs via FA with OT possibly being a need as well. If we're looking to fill in three of those positions via the draft, then I personally think OLB and CB would have to be those positions.

I totally agree. We need players that can close out wins, and that's OLB, CB, and S. Or AJ Green against the Ravens.

Edited January 3, 2016 by nishadrahman13

[PurpleCity5]

Ramsey's game pretty much told me he needs to play safety at the next level. Ramsey can pretty much only play press man at CB. He struggles at off man or zone. No big deal for him, teams already knew he was a special player at safety and he has shown some talent at CB, giving him more versatility.

I think Ramsey can be either one of two players, Charles Woodson, or Cary Williams. A guy who can move from CB to S, and be a premire talent on either end, something that would be godsent for us, or Cary Williams, a guy who relies soly on being a man-press CB that when asked to do anything else fails.

[PurpleCity5]

I totally agree. We need players that can close out wins, and that's OLB, CB, and S. Or AJ Green against the Ravens.

We need to fill in CB and OLB, I can't imagine going into mext season without making a good investment on both positions.

[ravensnick]

I think Ramsey can be either one of two players, Charles Woodson, or Cary Williams. A guy who can move from CB to S, and be a premire talent on either end, something that would be godsent for us, or Cary Williams, a guy who relies soly on being a man-press CB that when asked to do anything else fails.

Ramsey is easy in the top 5 athletes in CFB.  I think a lot of people are underrating him in that regard. Ramsey won the ACC long jump title, placed 7th in the ACC in the 100m, and was an All American in the Long Jump after placing 4th place in the NCAA Indoor Track Championship. All at 6'1", 200 lbs. I think based on pure athleticism, he is going to have an insanely high floor. His over aggression can hurt him at time, but it is nice to see a player give full effort like Ramsey does. I would be happier draft Ramsey over Hargeaves, even if we ended up stick Ramsey at FS. Ramsey is a rare athlete whose game will fit well into the NFL. I worry about Hargreaves size and speed. He might struggle against NFL WRs despite his amazing technique. 

Edited January 3, 2016 by ravensnick

[Cillmatic]

Ramsey is easy in the top 5 athletes in CFB. I think a lot of people are underrating him in that regard. Ramsey won the ACC long jump title, placed 7th in the ACC in the 100m, and was an All American in the Long Jump after placing 4th place in the NCAA Indoor Track Championship. All at 6'1", 200 lbs. I think based on pure athleticism, he is going to have an insanely high floor. His over aggression can hurt him at time, but it is nice to see a player give full effort like Ramsey does. I would be happier draft Ramsey over Hargeaves, even if we ended up stick Ramsey at FS. Ramsey is a rare athlete whose game will fit well into the NFL. I worry about Hargreaves size and speed. He might struggle against NFL WRs despite his amazing technique.

Combine warriors can be the biggest busts. No one says he's not a great athlete. Edited January 3, 2016 by Cillmatic

[PurpleCity5]

Ramsey is easy in the top 5 athletes in CFB.  I think a lot of people are underrating him in that regard. Ramsey won the ACC long jump title, placed 7th in the ACC in the 100m, and was an All American in the Long Jump after placing 4th place in the NCAA Indoor Track Championship. All at 6'1", 200 lbs. I think based on pure athleticism, he is going to have an insanely high floor. His over aggression can hurt him at time, but it is nice to see a player give full effort like Ramsey does. I would be happier draft Ramsey over Hargeaves, even if we ended up stick Ramsey at FS. Ramsey is a rare athlete whose game will fit well into the NFL. I worry about Hargreaves size and speed. He might struggle against NFL WRs despite his amazing technique. 

Yeah, I think Ramsey might have some problems with his transition, if he can prove to be a reliable zone CB then I would be more comfortable. I do think he has a good shot at being our guy and I wouldn't mind. I think his flexibility as a CB and possibly a safety is very valuable. 

[ravensnick]

Yeah, I think Ramsey might have some problems with his transition, if he can prove to be a reliable zone CB then I would be more comfortable. I do think he has a good shot at being our guy and I wouldn't mind. I think his flexibility as a CB and possibly a safety is very valuable. 

I'd play him at FS to give him the freedom to roam the field and make plays. He also has the versatility to line up at CB when needed.

 

 

Combine warriors can be the biggest busts. No one says he's not a great athlete.

Yeah, but Ramsey has three years of proof of on the field talent. He has played multiple positions (Safety and Cornerback with a little linebacker) and has been a force at each position. He isn't a combine warrior (an average player with great athletic ability); he is a two time consensus All American at two different positions. 

Edited January 3, 2016 by ravensnick

[xxDarby]

I feel like a lot of people on these boards are sleeping on Mackensie Alexander. I am really liking his game and I'd be fine if we traded back to get him or traded back into the first to nab him.

[Cillmatic]

I'd play him at FS to give him the freedom to roam the field and make plays. He also has the versatility to line up at CB when needed.

Yeah, but Ramsey has three years of proof of on the field talent. He has played multiple positions (Safety and Cornerback with a little linebacker) and has been a force at each position. He isn't a combine warrior (an average player with great athletic ability); he is a two time consensus All American at two different positions.

He hadn't shown anything at safety and he's shown little at CB. Just look at the game footage. "Safety" isn't playing 5 yards from the LOS for most NFL teams. He can't really backpedal either. Bits on double moves. We have little practical use for him.

[ravensnick]

I feel like a lot of people on these boards are sleeping on Mackensie Alexander. I am really liking his game and I'd be fine if we traded back to get him or traded back into the first to nab him.

I like Alexander a lot. I also think he'd fit pretty well into our scheme. He a tough player and QBs definitely hesitant to throw it his way. His lack of INTs don't show the whole picture. Walter Football proves their foolishness once again because they have him listed as a 3rd or 4th round prospect, because their "inside sources" say that Alexander is a slot CB only. One of the more ridiculous things I have heard. 

Edited January 3, 2016 by ravensnick

[JoeyFlex5]

I feel like a lot of people on these boards are sleeping on Mackensie Alexander. I am really liking his game and I'd be fine if we traded back to get him or traded back into the first to nab him.

not me. He's my top cb. Raine too

[JoeyFlex5]

He hadn't shown anything at safety and he's shown little at CB. Just look at the game footage. "Safety" isn't playing 5 yards from the LOS for most NFL teams. He can't really backpedal either. Bits on double moves. We have little practical use for him.

that's how I feel as well, those expecting him to play cb haven't seen his footwork, those expecting him to play fs haven't seen how badly he bites on double moves and how quick he is to abandon coverage to cheat up closer to the line

[Cillmatic]

that's how I feel as well, those expecting him to play cb haven't seen his footwork, those expecting him to play fs haven't seen how badly he bites on double moves and how quick he is to abandon coverage to cheat up closer to the line

It's just annoying seeing people act like he's the new hope and stuff. He's EXTREMELY overrated, I've created a monster, lol.

[JoeyFlex5]

It's just annoying seeing people act like he's the new hope and stuff. He's EXTREMELY overrated, I've created a monster, lol.

I hyped him as well lol. It's crazy everyone was hyping vh3 over Ramsey and suddenly it reversed for everyone