2016 DB Prospect Thread

[Cillmatic]

Let's try this agaIn. I'll just say this first, Jalen Ramsey is the best DB in the draft. We need this guy.

[JoeyFlex5]

ill agree. hes my top guy, and being more of a free safety than a cb he will probably go much lower than he should, placing him right in our laps. he appears to be the next great safety in my opinion, he does it all, he is fundamentally sound across the board, has a nose for the ball, great athleticism, great physicality, great range, high iq, and has the exact kind of attitude you are looking for when you are trying to rebuild your secondary with a leader on the back end.

[Inqui]

ill agree. hes my top guy, and being more of a free safety than a cb he will probably go much lower than he should, placing him right in our laps. he appears to be the next great safety in my opinion, he does it all, he is fundamentally sound across the board, has a nose for the ball, great athleticism, great physicality, great range, high iq, and has the exact kind of attitude you are looking for when you are trying to rebuild your secondary with a leader on the back end.

http://www.tomahawknation.com/2014/11/19/7246745/fsu-db-jalen-ramsey-becoming-star-at-position-star-noles-florida-state

 

Ramsey is the dream Ravens DB - as in, back to the old days where they got it all done. Meet the new board favourite.

 

[GrimCoconut]

I absolutely do want Ramsey. He's probably the top player I realistically want. He would solve so many problems for the defense. An elite OL & an elite FS are what this team needs. I feel like the OL should solve itself, depending on what happens, but you can't mask bad safety play anymore. We need a consistent presence back there. I want Ramsey bad. I'd rather put him at FS, too. Him & Will Hill would be devastating. 

[rmw10]

I absolutely do want Ramsey. He's probably the top player I realistically want. He would solve so many problems for the defense. An elite OL & an elite FS are what this team needs. I feel like the OL should solve itself, depending on what happens, but you can't mask bad safety play anymore. We need a consistent presence back there. I want Ramsey bad. I'd rather put him at FS, too. Him & Will Hill would be devastating. 

 

Yep.  I think Ramsey can be an absolutely awesome CB, but I think you get more value out of him at FS.  That threat on the deep end makes the CBs play better.  Earl Thomas is probably the biggest reason that Seattle secondary clicks, and I think Ramsey could have a similar impact with his range back there.

[GrimCoconut]

Yep.  I think Ramsey can be an absolutely awesome CB, but I think you get more value out of him at FS.  That threat on the deep end makes the CBs play better.  Earl Thomas is probably the biggest reason that Seattle secondary clicks, and I think Ramsey could have a similar impact with his range back there.

That's how I see it as well. I believe Ramsey would allow us to open things up completely in the secondary and he would be able to finally bring us back to the point where we can actually get turnovers on defense and strike fear in QBs throwing deep. Him & Will Hill would be an ideal tandem and he should be able to coordinate the secondary on the back-end much like Earl Thomas. He's the piece we are missing and I frankly believe (and I've gone on record saying) that safety is major weakness on this team and throughout the NFL. Elite FS are as rare (if not rarer) than elite QBs. They are far more infrequent than a great OLB/pass rusher. 

[Inqui]

Yep.  I think Ramsey can be an absolutely awesome CB, but I think you get more value out of him at FS.  That threat on the deep end makes the CBs play better.  Earl Thomas is probably the biggest reason that Seattle secondary clicks, and I think Ramsey could have a similar impact with his range back there.

Exactly, and you chuck in his ability to play around the LoS or at CB as needed and you have a legitimate playmaker all over the field. He'd go a huge way to fixing our secondary problems almost overnight imo, and him, Brooks and Hill would just be a filthy safety group.

[52520Andrew]

Best thing about Ramsey from what I have seen is that he has been clutch, saved so many games for FSU last year

[Inqui]

Best thing about Ramsey from what I have seen is that he has been clutch, saved so many games for FSU last year

That too. Iirc he got that decisive pick against Notre Dame and I think that was the play that first made him really stand out for me.

[52520Andrew]

That too. Iirc he got that decisive pick against Notre Dame and I think that was the play that first made him really stand out for me.

 

I think it was the Miami game but I forget but he pretty much made every play in the series to get the stop on defense. It was some great stuff

[rmw10]

Best thing about Ramsey from what I have seen is that he has been clutch, saved so many games for FSU last year

 

We have problems finishing games or something?

 

 

[52520Andrew]

We have problems finishing games or something?

 

 

 

Exactly lol

[JoeyFlex5]

yeah ive been on the ramsey bandwagon since before the season started but i never thought we would have started out 0-3, so i thought it was a pipe dream. at this point, every loss stings less and less knowing that this guy could fall right into our laps if were picking between 10 and 16. 

 

the only players i would take over him are bosa and treadwell, that is saying alot when youre talking about a FS. its crazy because its such an important position when you consider the league we are in today, and teams still dont seem to value them much.

[allblackraven]

I wish we do bit of a clean-up around our safeties. We are stacked with guys who are best suited to play the box but have nobody who is true FS. I still doubt we'll be able to put our hands on Ramsey, going to be too high for Ravens but there's a good player to be had later - Darian Thompson from Boise State. Has anybody followed him much last couple years? I saw just a little bit last week and few highlights that are available and I like what I see.

[Inqui]

I wish we do bit of a clean-up around our safeties. We are stacked with guys who are best suited to play the box but have nobody who is true FS. I still doubt we'll be able to put our hands on Ramsey, going to be too high for Ravens but there's a good player to be had later - Darian Thompson from Boise State. Has anybody followed him much last couple years? I saw just a little bit last week and few highlights that are available and I like what I see.

I think it's still too soon to be taking any safeties named Darian.

[PurpleCity5]

We'd have to play really bad to get Ramsey. I'm a fan and I'd want him here as a FS as well. 

 

I really like Cameron Suttin, I mentioned this in another thread but this guy looks really nice. Many people have fallen for Hargreaves but he looks unlikely for us, Suttin just looks like he can be a great CB IMO. Love to have him. 

Edited September 29, 2015 by PurpleCity5

[allblackraven]

I think it's still too soon to be taking any safeties named Darian.

That one turned OK in a defense that doesn't require Mensa membership.

[GrimCoconut]

We'd have to play really bad to get Ramsey. I'm a fan and I'd want him here as a FS as well. 

 

I really like Cameron Suttin, I mentioned this in another thread but this guy looks really nice. Many people have fallen for Hargreaves but he looks unlikely for us, Suttin just looks like he can be a great CB IMO. Love to have him. 

From Tennessee? His name is Sutton. I like him, too. 

 

I think you could say Ramsey goes high, but people say the same thing about Clinton-Dix & Collins. Lol, those guys didn't go high at all. I always love it when people say we'll never get X because they'll be too high. Who knows where we end up? Even if we don't get a high pick, who is to say they don't go lower than expected? This happens every year where someone shoots up the board and pushes others down. 

[PurpleCity5]

From Tennessee? His name is Sutton. I like him, too. 

 

I think you could say Ramsey goes high, but people say the same thing about Clinton-Dix & Collins. Lol, those guys didn't go high at all. I always love it when people say we'll never get X because they'll be too high. Who knows where we end up? Even if we don't get a high pick, who is to say they don't go lower than expected? This happens every year where someone shoots up the board and pushes others down. 

Yeah Sutton is who I was talking about. As far as Ramsey goes, you're right, it's a bit too early to tell. He could rise or fall, we don't know. He would fit in well here. I'd love to have him. 

[JoeyFlex5]

i dont see how ramsey would be out of our range, free safeties simply go late. id be willing to bet he is no less than the 3rd db off the board. the "island" cb is what teams value, and safeties in general seem to viewed as lesser players and the safeties that are picked high tend to be the ones with highlight reels littered with huge hits, i think hargreaves, and one of fuller or sutton goes before ramsey, maybe even all 3 of the corners go before him. i mean, justin gilbert, kyle fuller, and calvin pryor all went before haha clinton-dix, and i think its pretty obvious who the best player out of those 4 are, and even during the draft it was pretty obvious. 

 

i think ramsey goes in the mid teens unless we are picking, i feel we would be one of the teams that rightfully would value him much higher than anyone else.

[ravefan52]

i dont see how ramsey would be out of our range, free safeties simply go late. id be willing to bet he is no less than the 3rd db off the board. the "island" cb is what teams value, and safeties in general seem to viewed as lesser players and the safeties that are picked high tend to be the ones with highlight reels littered with huge hits, i think hargreaves, and one of fuller or sutton goes before ramsey, maybe even all 3 of the corners go before him. i mean, justin gilbert, kyle fuller, and calvin pryor all went before haha clinton-dix, and i think its pretty obvious who the best player out of those 4 are, and even during the draft it was pretty obvious.

i think ramsey goes in the mid teens unless we are picking, i feel we would be one of the teams that rightfully would value him much higher than anyone else.

Well he doesn't just play safety. He's playing CB this year. Teams could definitely see him as a potential shutdown type guy with his combo of size, athleticism and instincts.

[rmw10]

i dont see how ramsey would be out of our range, free safeties simply go late. id be willing to bet he is no less than the 3rd db off the board. the "island" cb is what teams value, and safeties in general seem to viewed as lesser players and the safeties that are picked high tend to be the ones with highlight reels littered with huge hits, i think hargreaves, and one of fuller or sutton goes before ramsey, maybe even all 3 of the corners go before him. i mean, justin gilbert, kyle fuller, and calvin pryor all went before haha clinton-dix, and i think its pretty obvious who the best player out of those 4 are, and even during the draft it was pretty obvious.

i think ramsey goes in the mid teens unless we are picking, i feel we would be one of the teams that rightfully would value him much higher than anyone else.

Free safeties aren't going to fall far anymore. There's a huge need across the league and an overall lack of quality players to play there.

Not to mention, he's also a CB.

[JoeyFlex5]

Free safeties aren't going to fall far anymore. There's a huge need across the league and an overall lack of quality players to play there.

Not to mention, he's also a CB.

teams still overvalue the revis island prototype guy far more than a free safety though, at least it appears that way. and he may be a cb but unless he plays 10x better as a cb than he did as a safety than i think most teams would be viewing him as the latter. 

 

maybe im just giving myself reason to think we legitimately can draft him, but i just dont see him going super high unless he plays way beyond his already huge expectations this year.

[RaineV1]

Looking past the first round, there is KeiVarae Russell in the 2nd. A large, physical corner, kinda like Jimmy Smith.

[GrimCoconut]

i dont see how ramsey would be out of our range, free safeties simply go late. id be willing to bet he is no less than the 3rd db off the board. the "island" cb is what teams value, and safeties in general seem to viewed as lesser players and the safeties that are picked high tend to be the ones with highlight reels littered with huge hits, i think hargreaves, and one of fuller or sutton goes before ramsey, maybe even all 3 of the corners go before him. i mean, justin gilbert, kyle fuller, and calvin pryor all went before haha clinton-dix, and i think its pretty obvious who the best player out of those 4 are, and even during the draft it was pretty obvious.

i think ramsey goes in the mid teens unless we are picking, i feel we would be one of the teams that rightfully would value him much higher than anyone else.

Besides, look at where Waynes and Peters went. It's not typical a defensive back is drafted high. It happens but it's rarer than many believe.

[GrimCoconut]

Free safeties aren't going to fall far anymore. There's a huge need across the league and an overall lack of quality players to play there.

Not to mention, he's also a CB.

Name a FS who went high recently?

Randall was the first safety drafted last year and he went 30th. 3 CB went before him, the highest going 11th. 5 CB and 4 S went in the first round of the 2014 Draft. Gilbert was the highest selected. The top safety was Pryor at 18.

In the 2013 Draft 4 CB and 3 S went in the first. Only one CB went in the top 10. The top safey went at 15th. The 2012 Draft meanwhile saw 3 CB and 2 S go in the first and Barron went highest at 7th overall. The 2011 Draft had 3 CB and 0 safeties go in the first round. Moore was first and he went in the second, but this was admittedly a bad safety class overall.

2010 was a strong class for drafting DB early since 5 CB and 2 S went in the first. The top safety was Berry at #5 overall and Thomas was second at 14.

I use this data to say it's possible Ramsey goes before we're up, but history suggests there's a better chance he falls to the teens than goes in the top ten.

[Inqui]

I use this data to say it's possible Ramsey goes before we're up, but history suggests there's a better chance he falls to the teens than goes in the top ten.

Yeah, one thing I meant to say yesterday was that if we're picking in the top half of the draft we should have a decent shot at him (so we could go something like 8-8 and still treat him as a realistic prospect). You never know if this is the year teams finally fall in love with centre-field FS guys, or if they love his ability to play CB and LB (god I love this guy...) but I think the only way he's a pipe dream is if we miss the playoffs.

[JoeyFlex5]

Name a FS who went high recently?

Randall was the first safety drafted last year and he went 30th. 3 CB went before him, the highest going 11th. 5 CB and 4 S went in the first round of the 2014 Draft. Gilbert was the highest selected. The top safety was Pryor at 18.

In the 2013 Draft 4 CB and 3 S went in the first. Only one CB went in the top 10. The top safey went at 15th. The 2012 Draft meanwhile saw 3 CB and 2 S go in the first and Barron went highest at 7th overall. The 2011 Draft had 3 CB and 0 safeties go in the first round. Moore was first and he went in the second, but this was admittedly a bad safety class overall.

2010 was a strong class for drafting DB early since 5 CB and 2 S went in the first. The top safety was Berry at #5 overall and Thomas was second at 14.

I use this data to say it's possible Ramsey goes before we're up, but history suggests there's a better chance he falls to the teens than goes in the top ten.

i think the biggest thing to mention here, is that the db's that go early seem to be either "prototype" cb's or safeties that have tangible qualities, such as an immense number of huge hits and great run support. i dont understand why, maybe kam chancellor changed the way front offices view safeties, but guys like vaccaro and pryor are obviously subpar in coverage but excellent in run support, and those are the safeties that always seem to go early. teams tend to overlook the intangibles when looking at center fielding safeties, i mean derron smith went in the 7th round for gods sake, he was the smartest safety in this class, but because he was smaller and didnt offer many tangibles such as a long line of hitsticks he flew down the boards. 

 

ramsey would need to have an exceptionally special season to go top 10, i still think that a decent cb is valued much higher than an elite FS

[rmw10]

Name a FS who went high recently?

Randall was the first safety drafted last year and he went 30th. 3 CB went before him, the highest going 11th. 5 CB and 4 S went in the first round of the 2014 Draft. Gilbert was the highest selected. The top safety was Pryor at 18.

In the 2013 Draft 4 CB and 3 S went in the first. Only one CB went in the top 10. The top safey went at 15th. The 2012 Draft meanwhile saw 3 CB and 2 S go in the first and Barron went highest at 7th overall. The 2011 Draft had 3 CB and 0 safeties go in the first round. Moore was first and he went in the second, but this was admittedly a bad safety class overall.

2010 was a strong class for drafting DB early since 5 CB and 2 S went in the first. The top safety was Berry at #5 overall and Thomas was second at 14.

I use this data to say it's possible Ramsey goes before we're up, but history suggests there's a better chance he falls to the teens than goes in the top ten.

 

Oh yeah I forgot to respond to this...

 

I guess I should amend that to "elite" FS.  I never viewed Randall as that type of guy.  I think the reason safety keeps falling is because the talent level just isn't there.  I think Ramsey is another class compared to what we've seen the past few years.

 

I won't say with absolute certainty that he's going top 5 or 10 or anything, but I think the general lack of quality FS combined with a guy that looks to be a potential elite level player there won't keep him on the board long.

[GrimCoconut]

Oh yeah I forgot to respond to this...

I guess I should amend that to "elite" FS. I never viewed Randall as that type of guy. I think the reason safety keeps falling is because the talent level just isn't there. I think Ramsey is another class compared to what we've seen the past few years.

I won't say with absolute certainty that he's going top 5 or 10 or anything, but I think the general lack of quality FS combined with a guy that looks to be a potential elite level player there won't keep him on the board long.

I can see it go either way. If we pick in the top 15ish, I think he'll be a Raven for sure if we want him. You have a point on him and make good reasons why he could go high, but it depends on the teams picking at the top, what they need, and other players who certainly get hyped up. Lol you know how it goes.