Trestman's Offense: Good, Bad, or Otherwise?

[GrimCoconut]

I'd like to see WRs run beyond the sticks for 1st downs instead of being 3 yards behind the sticks when you need to pick up 5. 

[Static]

Gonna leave Trestman alone until he has something to work with but I liked him giving camp love. I liked the 2TE sets and I loved the running game.

Felt at times that he didn't trust Joe and just wanted to ride the backs though.

[FoxRox75]

Absolutely hated it tonight. WAY too much throwing in the second half; they should have given Forsett the ball a lot more than they did. Don't get me wrong I am grateful for the W, but we were still lucky to win tonight. 

Edited October 2, 2015 by FoxRox75

[Shammy]

Absolutely hated it tonight. WAY too much throwing in the second half; they should have given Forsett the ball a lot more than they did. Don't get me wrong I am grateful for the W, but we were still lucky to win tonight. 

he had nearly 30 carries

[FoxRox75]

he had nearly 30 carries

 

My point is they put the ball in Flacco's hands too often in the second half. For instance - that one drive we had with a little over two minutes, where he threw 4 times with nothing? That was dumb; we still had timeouts and they didn't run it once. 

 

EDIT: ALSO the fake field goal attempt was really dumb. We weren't even in the fourth quarter and it would have been a 3-point game if they took the points. 

Edited October 2, 2015 by FoxRox75

[Gordo52]

Through the first quarter of the season: Bad

Besides Sr, our WR's have sucked big time. Definitely in the bottom tier of the league. Very disappointed no young guy stepped up. Perriman is really screwing us. I really think our offense was going to rely on him. His presence alone would open up so much for everyone else.

Offensive line hasn't looked as dominant as last year. Monroe is a big loss but I still expect more from this group. Mostly surprised by K.O. so far in a contract year playing how he's playing. I think they'll get better as the year progresses and Rick gets comfortable again. Hope

I think we should get Juice & Forsett more involved in the passing game... More screens and quick outs.... Target Maxx more on 3rd downs. He always gives that extra effort and more times than not, seems to get it...Let Joe move around more. Copy some philosophy they're running in Atlanta. We don't have Julio but Joe is more than capable throwing on the run. I know you just can't change things like that mid season but something definitely has to change. Even if that means just adding a few plays, great teams can do it.

Hopefully this extra time between next game will do the coaches and players good. 3-1/4-0 next quarter against Cleveland, San Fran, Arizona & SD is doable.

Edited October 2, 2015 by Gordo52

[OLD SCHOOL SMASH BALL]

I think its time we suck it up, start incorporating Waller and the 2 Tight Ends into the passing game on a regular basis. More game time reps, will get them better quicker.

[gtalk12]

I'd like to see WRs run beyond the sticks for 1st downs instead of being 3 yards behind the sticks when you need to pick up 5. 

 

At least they have a chance of getting open with the short routes....anybody have Derrick Mason's phone number?

[gtalk12]

Anybody saw that Buck run? Or am I the only one impressed with the run that he carried someone on his back with?

[GrimCoconut]

Anybody saw that Buck run? Or am I the only one impressed with the run that he carried someone on his back with?

That was awesome wasn't it? Allen road Allen lol.

[CalvinSmoke]

There's a lot of conflicting posts here, and blaming him for things that aren't his call.

One of you says for him to stop calling deep routes on third down, the other asks him to run routes past the sticks lol.yoi have to realize he's trying everything. The fake field goal is on coach John Harbaugh not trestman. WR are actually seeing our offense make adjustments, it's a nice change of pace.

Edited October 2, 2015 by CalvinSmoke

[Maryland]

I think some people criticize the entire offense without actually looking at what Trestman does. He actually has some pretty creative plays in his offense. Some nifty sweeps, or that fake jet motion sweep he ran with SSS vs Cincy. Surprised he hasn't run more screens. He also has used Chip Kelly's run/pass option a few times in Chicago, haven't seen it yet though. 

 

As a playcaller, he does get pass-happy and ignores the run sometimes, which makes it hard to set up play-action. However, most of the criticisms of this offense reflected upon Trestman (whether unfairly or not) are done so while ignoring the lack of talent we have in our receiving corps and O-line right now. I think with better talent in those two areas (namely in the receiving corps), Trestman could have a pretty potent offense going. 

 

/in this day and age, I'd much rather have an OC who is creative in the passing game than the running game. It may betray the ground and pound tradition of the AFCN, but the times (aka rules protecting QBs and WRs) are a'changin. 

Edited October 3, 2015 by Maryland

[CalvinSmoke]

Most of those short passes are dump offs, not plays with the 2 yards flat or out route as the primary reciever. Joe just isn't liking what he's seeing down field

[Tru11]

TBH i think most have no idea what the idea is behind the routes within a play.

to put it blunt alot have no idea about concepts.

its pretty much the same with defense where everyone thinks in man cov when a defender is close to a receiver lol.

 

those shorts routes are there to draw defenders in and open up the intermediate passes or even the deep passes.

 

there was 1 particular play where marlon ran a short drag route while smith ran an in route on 3rd down where flacco threw it to brown for an incompletion.

 

the idea behind that was the draw the ILB in to focus on marlon so that smith would get open behind him for a 1st down.

flacco first read would have been smith and flacco read it well cause the safety came over and would either had the pick or would have blasted smith if flacco made the pass.

he was wise to check it down to brown.

 

you simply cant have everyone run a route pass on the same level cause it would be very easy to defend not to mention you give the receivers lest space to work in and the  margin of error becomes much higher.

 

this actually show how much we really miss a guy who can go deep.

a player like that would open up the defense given receivers who run short and intermediate routes more space to work with and the defense much more space to defend.

[OLD SCHOOL SMASH BALL]

Just saw a QUICK SLANT passing play in the MD vs Michigan game. I dont think that play is in the Ravens Playbook. Would be nice to see it on 3rd and 6 once in awhile.

[ravensdfan]

I don't like his high percentage of runs on 1st & 2nd downs. I don't like that he rarely goes downfield other than 2 min drills. I don't like how he runs his 2 min drill at all really.

[OLD SCHOOL SMASH BALL]

Another thing I noticed, is when our CB's were playing 10-12 yards off the ball, other QB's like Dalton and Carr were shredding us on those 5 yard short pass curls,(its instant separation) and getting yac.

I noticed the Squeelers CB's were doing the same thing to us, playing 10-12yds off, except we would run the 10yds to the coverage, then throw it, thus getting an incomplete.

If we see that on film, or in game, why do we NOT take advantage of it, where other OC's do?

[OLD SCHOOL SMASH BALL]

3rd down play calling is horrible

[Inqui]

With Joe out, I thought I'd jot down a few key offensive stats before our offensive ranking spirals. This is for my own records as much as anything:

 

Yards per game: 11th (364.3ypg)

Points per game: 17th (22.6ppg) - interesting how we've fallen off in the past four or five weeks

Rushing: 18th (3.9ypa). Last year we were 7th with 4.5ypa but the year before we were 32nd with 3.1ypa with similar personnel on the OL so it could be worse.

Sacks allowed: 5th-equal (16 sacks)

Red zone percentage: 18th (53.12% TD rate assuming I read that correctly). Last year we were 14th with 54.93%

Third down conversions: 20th (36%). Last year we were 14th with 41%.

Fourth down conversions: 12th-equal (60%) - interestingly enough we've gone for it 15 times, which is the most times in the league

Giveaways: 19th-equal (17), but we're 30th in the league in TO differential (-8)

 

The stats that really bug me are rushing, red zone percentage, and third down conversions. I think our rushing game's experienced a regression towards the mean after Kubiak's season (imo meaning we're getting a more accurate look at the personnel we have on the OL this season), but the red zone problems definitely predate Trestman. It's harder to make a call on our offensive play on third downs as to whether that owes to a bad system/caller or we just don't have the ammo.

 

We get frustrated by all the passes behind the first-down marker, but I'd be interested in seeing how many of those plays actually saw a guy get open in first-down territory. Looking at the numbers a little further, we've actually rushed for the 8th most first downs so far (67), passed for the 17th most (123), and the refs haven't helped - we're 26th in first downs from penalties (16).

 

Going back to our rushing ypa, while our OL has actually been pretty good at keeping Joe upright, I think we could use a bit of power on the inside for the inside zone plays Trestman likes to run and that should get us closer to that 4.5ypa I prefer to see us hit as well as open things up for our WRs. Fix that and give us a couple of WRs who can move the chains and actually put up a fight in the red zone, and I feel like a lot of our offensive problems will start to sort themselves out.

[sharkh20]

I hate his play calling.  I can't stand OCs that are afraid of the middle of the field and that is exactly what Trestman is.  Those 2 yard outs ARE the primary look, unless Joe is snapping the ball and immediately skipping all other routes.  They are designed quick outs.  When Steve Smith wasn't injured, we still threw that same pass to him every other play.  He was the primary receiver on all of those plays too.  

 

Cam Cameron did this exact same thing as well.  Wouldn't use the middle of the field.  Only did outs and 4 yard timing routes.  Those plays are great when you keep a defense honest in the middle.  When other teams use those quick outs once or twice a game, they work great.  Any team that runs them like we do, has the same problem.  Snap the ball, immediately throw to the out pattern, -3 to 2 yard gain/loss.  We lose yards on first down more than any other team I have ever seen.  It looks like an absolutely frustrating offense to play for.  

 

The other thing is that Flacco's strength is throwing confident darts in the middle of the field.  You had the guy that could make those throws all season, and you never utilize it.  

 

We ran the same plays when we had the guys as we do now.  It isn't an injury thing, it is just a sucky scheme.  Lots of risk, no reward.  Repeating outs is the best way to create a pick 6.  

 

I don't see it as any surprise that Joe looked like Jay Cutler all year.  I had never seen Joe throw spite passes until this year.

 

Our run blocking looks like 2013.  Amazing how we turned it around in that respect last year with a decent OC and then immediately regressed back to terrible this year. 

 

Unfortunately, we are stuck with him next year because Joe got hurt.  He won't be ready in time to work with a new OC.

 

Steve Smith was making up for a lot of the playcalling by breaking 13 tackles a play, but ever since he got hurt, it just isn't working.

Edited November 25, 2015 by sharkh20

[ravensdfan]

Overall it isn't that bad however, his 2 min drill play calling is pathetic as is most of his red zone series.

 

He has gained more balance on 1st & 2nd downs as the season went on (my major complaint was his running on 1st & 2nd down 66% of the time early in the season).

 

That 2 min drill stuff though - he has to fix that quick or be gone. It was one of our strengths that his playcalling has made a weakness.

[DomMcRaven]

Welp, according to NFL.com, we gave up the 5th fewest sacks with 16 and 3rd fewest QB hits with 37.

 

 

Hmmm..interesting. 

[Cillmatic]

Welp, according to NFL.com, we gave up the 5th fewest sacks with 16 and 3rd fewest QB hits with 37.

Hmmm..interesting.

#StickerEffect Edited November 25, 2015 by Cillmatic

[LosT_in_TranSlatioN]

Trestman isn't the problem. There are drives where I cringe but overall he's actually been kindve unpredictable as of late. He was effective in Chicago(not his fault that Cutler doesn't really use his brain), and tbh if we had some weapons this offense would be really dynamic.

Glad he's here to stay. Play calling hasn't been the issue. Lack of talent has been. He's not as good as Kubiak, but not too many are

[Moderator 3]

Interesting rumors popping on Twitter.

Word out of CoMO & B'more puts #Ravens OC Marc Trestman as emerging candidate for #Mizzou head coaching gig. Interview today w/ top brass.

[757RavensFan]

Interesting rumors popping on Twitter.

Word out of CoMO & B'more puts #Ravens OC Marc Trestman as emerging candidate for #Mizzou head coaching gig. Interview today w/ top brass.

 

Good God if that's true a FIFTH offensive coordinator in 5 years if he leaves.  

[Static]

I think its time we let Schuab's system go let trestman do trestman.

[Moderator 3]

Good God if that's true a FIFTH offensive coordinator in 5 years if he leaves.

My thoughts exactly. We may never have an elite offense.

[757RavensFan]

My thoughts exactly. We may never have an elite offense.

 

Looks like it was a false rumor started on Twitter.  

[rmcjacket23]

My thoughts exactly. We may never have an elite offense.

FYI...

 

Patrick Finley ‏@patrickfinley  1h1 hour ago

The Marc Trestman to #Mizzou Tweet was bogus. Carry on. Guess I won't be going to scenic Columbia on the @Suntimes dime.