Trestman's Offense: Good, Bad, or Otherwise?

[usmccharles]

He probably could play that role it's just unclear if he can do that good enough to get safeties attention.

one way to find out. No one thought Torrey could be what he was as quick as he was but he was just thrown in there. Never know

[Ravensfan23]

My comment wasn't specific to the Broncos game.  It was on the season as a whole while Perriman is out.  Every team benefits from a deep threat.  The Bears were good but if they had someone to stretch the defense they could have been better.  The comparison to 2010 and the Steelers can be made because. like 2010, we don't have a deep threat right now and like the Steelers to start 2014, we have a fast and big target sitting on the bench.

 

Oh and yes, Marshall, Jeffrey, and Bennett were not speed guys but they outmuscled DBs.  SSS just got out muscled by Talib on the pick 6 and none of the other WRs have shown to be physical enough for that comparison.  People talk about Aiken being a younger Boldin but it hasn't shown at all

Oh then I agree to the notion that he could be a deep threat with or without Perriman honestly. I definitely think there is a place and a plan for Waller. But he's role won't be big unless a guy like Aiken doesn't play well in his role. I think Waller will have a season like Aiken did last year honestly. Never really a focal point of the game plan but given a few designed plays.

I never really saw Aiken as a Boldin type and i think it's foolish for people to compare so many to Boldin because Q was a special talent. People forget that Boldin was a 100 catch guy on the outside and a devastating mismatch in the slot. Aiken is just a guy who can make contested catch and work tight spaces. I've had and continue to have my concerns with his ability of to win outside. I haven't gone back and watched him exclusively vs the Broncos but from what i can remember he only won on routes ran from the slot or inside routes where he used strength to get open. Not ready to write him off but if Waller is given more reps and Perriman comes back sooner then later, Aiken could see a Jacoby Jones like drop in snaps. Jmo

[mdrsharon]

sorry guys, the playcalling was weak.

 lots of true things, Joe really needs some protection to get the pass off, but he needs to mix it up , a lot more.

we should have won that game, gotta get in the end zone, no matter what.

 don't think much of Trestman.

 

until next week...

[ravensdan]

Nothing else was working and at some point I would think the Ravens would change their culture of using WR's based on draft order and tenure in the league. Its worked well for NE and Pitt.

I don't think it has anything to do with draft order. He's more raw than Perriman coming out. It was more likely he would have caused a crucial turnover in such a tightly played game than actually get open where flacco has enough time to connect. Fact is its going to be a slow slow proccess getting anything from Waller and or Perriman. It's going to have to be lights out D and small ball at least half the year. With any luck they will be there to stretch things out late and the playoffs.

[ravensdan]

Rewatched the game on short cut. Saw the end for the first time. One thing that was missing that I didn't like at all is there was not one snap designed for Flacco to roll out or move the pocket. That was really underrated aspect of the offense to negate the Denver Rush in the playoff game. It covered up the deficiencies of the Oline at the time quite a bit. This needs to come back. Kubiak still had manning run a roll out ending in a horrible duck. Flacco is awesome on the move.

[Drew P]

Rewatched the game on short cut. Saw the end for the first time. One thing that was missing that I didn't like at all is there was not one snap designed for Flacco to roll out or move the pocket. That was really underrated aspect of the offense to negate the Denver Rush in the playoff game. It covered up the deficiencies of the Oline at the time quite a bit. This needs to come back. Kubiak still had manning run a roll out ending in a horrible duck. Flacco is awesome on the move.

 

Yes early in the first QTR they ran a rollout they were on it like a duck on a June bug.

[redrum52]

I said it before and I'll say it again.  He can't be judged off of the last game.  O line was basically non existent, and I think, I might have read it was historically bad.  O line couldn't block, so Flacco had no time.  My only beef is the stupid pick to Talib, but other than that, I can't fault either.  Then you must add in the fact, it's not exactly his offense.  Isn't it essentially, Trestman's take on Kubiaks offense?  He's been asked to come in and run his offense under someone else's offense wasn't he?  I, unlike most, actually expected a win, and the team was damn close.  People wanted new weapons and to give to younger guys a try.  This is the growing pains portion of when you have a new OC, and new pieces, playing a larger role.

[GamingRaven92]

can't really say much about him yet. it's still to early to tell.

[OLD SCHOOL SMASH BALL]

I am wondering if Trestman could have made more adjustments, if he was up in the booth. Its troubling that he didnt adjust his play calling to help Joe, as the Oline was not blocking anybody.

We at least need to have a pair of coaching eyes telling our Offense what the defense is doing to attack us.A d on the same token, need to have plays to call if it all goes to <expletive> like it did Sunday.

[Dfence4champs2052]

Not too early to know ugly when you see it. It was run, run, pass, punt again. That is undeniable.

[OLD SCHOOL SMASH BALL]

Offense got better today, beeded a touchdown at the end, not 3, to save this game. Imo, it came down to that 2nd and goal questionable play call, that everybody was perplexed about. I also think on the previous field goal, when theytgrew bacj to back fades to short guys,that fades toCrockett or Waller,or somebody taller would have been better on that pkay call.

[Ravensfan23]

Did anyone else notice that Trestman used a Yanda in the slot on Gilmore's first TD? That's the reason Gilmore was so wide open, the defense never accounted for him because they thought he was an olineman.

Nice to see a OC finally getting Flacco some easy throws.

[52520Andrew]

Yeah I thought Trestman had some good play calls, wasn't perfect, that pass to Gilmore on 2nd down on the FG drive was not a good call for me but I thought the SSS play was a good response although they couldn't connect.

[kassaiscool]

Trestman obviously puts more importance on the passing game than the running game. But putting the game on Flacco doesn't work to well. The best fit for Flacco is a run first offense like we had last year with Kubiak.

[balfan23]

Still a little early for a definite assessment. No measure of play calling was going to save us in week 1. Yesterday, overall good calls, good results. The last play we ran was well designed and should be a TD if executed properly. 

[Ravensfan23]

Trestman obviously puts more importance on the passing game than the running game. But putting the game on Flacco doesn't work to well. The best fit for Flacco is a run first offense like we had last year with Kubiak.

That's not true. Even Kubiak's offense didn't work well enough until Flacco opened things up in the pass game. Minus the oline performance, how many games last season looked exactly like the Broncos game last week? Far too many. Everybody's first thought is to keep things as close to the 2000 Super Bowl as possible. There was nothing run first about the offense yesterday and it worked well, granted against a poor defense, but worked and some of the same route combos were open against the Broncos. Kubiak and Caldwell had to finally submit to the notion of opening up the offense and running it through Joe doing the playoffs. The problem is, when the offense runs through Joe, the moment it doesn't work people start crying about the Ravens lost their identity.

I've said for a long time, the Ravens need a OC that can allow the offense to stay agressive and put it's foot on teams throat. And yes you can still have an effective run game with an aggressive offense. Trestman is that guy who can and should take the offense to the next level. I hate when the Ravens get into a 3rd and 12 and the commentators say things like, the Ravens don't have a play in the playbook for this scenario, as if it's an offense that can't be trusted.

That run first give the defense a lead and game over era is dead and gone. The Ravens need to stop holding on to it and evolve with the times. I love what Trestman did and i hope it wasn't that aggressive just because of the 10 point hole. If Flacco is the guy most of us believe him to be, then it's about time the Ravens truly turn him loose. If the Ravens aren't careful they'll find a permanent home at #3 in the division because their establish the run first style won't be able to keep pace with the explosive nature of the Steelers and Bengals and you'll end up putting too much on a defense that has shown time and time again that they are no longer dominant.

Let Trestman work and don't handcuff him. If he gets too far away from the run and needs to be reeled in, fine. But don't hire the guy for what he can bring to thos offense and then suppress for the sake of "The Ravens Way"

[Ravensfan23]

Still a little early for a definite assessment. No measure of play calling was going to save us in week 1. Yesterday, overall good calls, good results. The last play we ran was well designed and should be a TD if executed properly.

You could say that about a few plays. Honestly i don't care about the results with Trestman. I mean obviously it's important but i love the chess match he plays. He put a ton of things on tape for the Bengals and others to have to account for. Of course the oline play was different, but the overall offense was different from last week to this week. During the Denver game 90% of his running plays had either a TE, HB or WR sneaking under the play like a trap block, but he was obviously setting up the play action that he was never able to run vs Kubes. However in this game he showed that look maybe 3 or 4 times. It helped create space.

He also did a great job of running the same plays but from different formations. The results may be jaded because of the competition, but the formations and route combos he put on tape can't be denied. I'm excited to see the game plan next Sunday. I've been waiting for a OC like Trestman for so long. The ability to change your offense from week to week is huge and if these players can play at a high level the Ravens will be a top ranked offense.

[AsianRice]

You could say that about a few plays. Honestly i don't care about the results with Trestman. I mean obviously it's important but i love the chess match he plays. He put a ton of things on tape for the Bengals and others to have to account for. Of course the oline play was different, but the overall offense was different from last week to this week. During the Denver game 90% of his running plays had either a TE, HB or WR sneaking under the play like a trap block, but he was obviously setting up the play action that he was never able to run vs Kubes. However in this game he showed that look maybe 3 or 4 times. It helped create space.

He also did a great job of running the same plays but from different formations. The results may be jaded because of the competition, but the formations and route combos he put on tape can't be denied. I'm excited to see the game plan next Sunday. I've been waiting for a OC like Trestman for so long. The ability to change your offense from week to week is huge and if these players can play at a high level the Ravens will be a top ranked offense.

Well me too; we should had been up by 7  with 1:34 left if Joe hit a wide wide open SSS and the play draw was perfect also. The real problem of that game is our abysmal defense and some stupid personal penalties......

 

Additionally, didn't you see Joe also miss a clear cut, wide open Aiken was when he beat out the outside corner? Joe's throws were off to wide open receivers; possibly due to he hasn't seen so many widely opened WRs for a very long time.....He's too busy perfecting his tight window throw and forgot how to hit lonely man in the open field.....lol

Edited September 21, 2015 by AsianRice

[RavensFanMania]

Too early to tell.  My take is this offense will be very good in the long run.  We just need Perriman on the field just to open things up a bit.  Not having a speedster plus the OL not playing together in preseason really hurt.

 

Hurst did well yesterday but we need Monroe back on the field AND living up to his billing.

 

KO has to pick up his game as well.  Someone remind both Yanda and KO that they are in contract years!

[kassaiscool]

That's not true. Even Kubiak's offense didn't work well enough until Flacco opened things up in the pass game. Minus the oline performance, how many games last season looked exactly like the Broncos game last week? Far too many. Everybody's first thought is to keep things as close to the 2000 Super Bowl as possible. There was nothing run first about the offense yesterday and it worked well, granted against a poor defense, but worked and some of the same route combos were open against the Broncos. Kubiak and Caldwell had to finally submit to the notion of opening up the offense and running it through Joe doing the playoffs. The problem is, when the offense runs through Joe, the moment it doesn't work people start crying about the Ravens lost their identity.

I've said for a long time, the Ravens need a OC that can allow the offense to stay agressive and put it's foot on teams throat. And yes you can still have an effective run game with an aggressive offense. Trestman is that guy who can and should take the offense to the next level. I hate when the Ravens get into a 3rd and 12 and the commentators say things like, the Ravens don't have a play in the playbook for this scenario, as if it's an offense that can't be trusted.

That run first give the defense a lead and game over era is dead and gone. The Ravens need to stop holding on to it and evolve with the times. I love what Trestman did and i hope it wasn't that aggressive just because of the 10 point hole. If Flacco is the guy most of us believe him to be, then it's about time the Ravens truly turn him loose. If the Ravens aren't careful they'll find a permanent home at #3 in the division because their establish the run first style won't be able to keep pace with the explosive nature of the Steelers and Bengals and you'll end up putting too much on a defense that has shown time and time again that they are no longer dominant.

Let Trestman work and don't handcuff him. If he gets too far away from the run and needs to be reeled in, fine. But don't hire the guy for what he can bring to thos offense and then suppress for the sake of "The Ravens Way"

 

As you pointed out we went against probably the worse defense we played against in years. As soon as we play a decent defense we will get exposed. Joe is too inconsistent to be counted during a 16 game season. That's why he thrives in playoff scenarios where he can get hot for 3 or 4 game stretch. Joe also leaves a lot easy of plays on the field. I'm talking about devastating plays where people are wide open. After watching the game again he doesn't step up in the pocket enough. If he does step up in the pocket its to run.That is why Joe lobs a lot of his passes, hes throwing off his back foot because he doesn't step up in the pocket. We also have one of the worst receiving cores in the league to boot. This is why people say we should be a run first team, even though most Ravens fans wouldn't mind being an explosive offense. Its the situation we have here.

[Ravensfan23]

Well me too; we should had been up by 7  with 1:34 left if Joe hit a wide wide open SSS and the play draw was perfect also. The real problem of that game is our abysmal defense and some stupid personal penalties......

 

Additionally, didn't you see Joe also miss a clear cut, wide open Aiken was when he beat out the outside corner? Joe's throws were off to wide open receivers; possibly due to he hasn't seen so many widely opened WRs for a very long time.....He's too busy perfecting his tight window throw and forgot how to hit lonely man in the open field.....lol

Yea Joe definitely missed some open guys and he quickly hit his first read often times but the play Trestman had drawn up had guys working open late. Really can't fault Joe for being quick with the beaten he took last week lol.

The Aiken miss deep was really bad but i think Joe will continue to get comfortable with these guys and this offense. The play design and timing of the call to Aiken was prefect.

Also i love how Trestman put Flacco in the shotgun and let him work. They were able to still have success in the run game even in the shotgun. Now the Bengals will probably gameplan that and Trestman with feature a heavy 2TE offense next week.

[Ravensfan23]

As you pointed out we went against probably the worse defense we played against in years. As soon as we play a decent defense we will get exposed. Joe is too inconsistent to be counted during a 16 game season. That's why he thrives in playoff scenarios where he can get hot for 3 or 4 game stretch. Joe also leaves a lot easy of plays on the field. I'm talking about devastating plays where people are wide open. After watching the game again he doesn't step up in the pocket enough. If he does step up in the pocket its to run.That is why Joe lobs a lot of his passes, hes throwing off his back foot because he doesn't step up in the pocket. We also have one of the worst receiving cores in the league to boot. This is why people say we should be a run first team, even though most Ravens fans wouldn't mind being an explosive offense. Its the situation we have here.

I agree about Joe's inconsistencies but you'll only master what you spend the most time doing. Being aggressive puts so much pressure on defenses. I don't buy the argument that Joe can't be consistent outside of the playoffs. You have the give the entire offense time to work together and develop. If you continue to change th offense and bring new guys in but don't allow him to run what they are comfortable with the offense won't be able to consistently run. Everyone is talking about how Kubiak has to find a way to work with the great Peyton Manning because the offense has a disconnect. Well that is exactly what Flacco goes through each season. Even though it's still Kubiak's offense, it's Trestman's philosophy and that takes time for a QB to learn and get comfortable with. And by time i mean years, not 6 months and then on to a new guy.

Did you and those people ever stop to think that the reason the WR group isn't looked upon as a good one is because they never get time to develop? I'm so sick of people trashing the WRs. The WRs havw been open the last two games but if you aren't getting the ball to them that work doesn't show up in the result column. A lot of what was open against the Raiders was open against the Broncos but they couldn't get the ball out do to pressure. I keep hearing people say Aiken didn't show up until late in the game, maybe i missed something but wasn't he wide open for a TD but was missed? Wasnt Waller wide open but was underthrown. Camp had moments he got open but the ball didn't go his way. Brown did as well. You can talk about how poor the Raiders were all you want but those guys still had to go out and make catches after getting open and they did. The Pats, Colts, Steelers and a few other teams the Ravens will have to beat to get to the playoffs or in the playoffs don't have great secondaries. These guys don't have to go out and be world beaters be ause Trestman's scheme does a great job of creating space. They just have to make the plays that are available for them to make and they are doing just that so far.

The run first offense is a stagnant offense that requires guys to be basically studs because your offense will be in 2nd/3rd and longs all game. Being aggressive hides the deficiencies the Ravens offense has.

[BSHU_Miami]

I remember the season we went uptempo vs. the bengals week 1 and blown them out. I don't see why we can't be that team Often

[PurpleCity5]

Gilmore will be the X-Factor once again. 

[Ravensfan23]

I remember the season we went uptempo vs. the bengals week 1 and blown them out. I don't see why we can't be that team Often

We should be. But all too often we revert back to the ground and pound style of offense because of the black and blue AFC North. The issue is everybody in the North have explosive offenses except the Ravens. Even the Browns of they kept Kyle Shanny and Gordon didn't get suspended, their offense would have explosive potential with a QB.

Playing aggressive on offense doesn't mean you can't have a clock controlling offense or a offense that's physical. People always say you can't consistently play that way offensively against the defenses in the North but every team in the North struggles with uptempo offensives. The Ravens need to give Trestman the freedom to do his thing with Flacco.

[cobrajet]

Trestman's playcalling is horrid. I want to smash something everytime he has Joe throw a bomb down the field on third and 3. He wastes so many opportunities to keep drives alive with such riduculous playcalling. I feel I am re-living the Cam Cameron days!!!!!!!!

[ratedr]

The question is...what is Trestman's offense really? Isn't he still calling Kubiak's offense? Could explain why the playcalling is so schizo sometimes.

 

If the offense is going to go down in flames Trestman needs to call what HE wants to call.

[PoeDinkum]

I agree about Joe's inconsistencies but you'll only master what you spend the most time doing. Being aggressive puts so much pressure on defenses. I don't buy the argument that Joe can't be consistent outside of the playoffs. You have the give the entire offense time to work together and develop. If you continue to change th offense and bring new guys in but don't allow him to run what they are comfortable with the offense won't be able to consistently run. Everyone is talking about how Kubiak has to find a way to work with the great Peyton Manning because the offense has a disconnect. Well that is exactly what Flacco goes through each season. Even though it's still Kubiak's offense, it's Trestman's philosophy and that takes time for a QB to learn and get comfortable with. And by time i mean years, not 6 months and then on to a new guy.

Did you and those people ever stop to think that the reason the WR group isn't looked upon as a good one is because they never get time to develop? I'm so sick of people trashing the WRs. The WRs havw been open the last two games but if you aren't getting the ball to them that work doesn't show up in the result column. A lot of what was open against the Raiders was open against the Broncos but they couldn't get the ball out do to pressure. I keep hearing people say Aiken didn't show up until late in the game, maybe i missed something but wasn't he wide open for a TD but was missed? Wasnt Waller wide open but was underthrown. Camp had moments he got open but the ball didn't go his way. Brown did as well. You can talk about how poor the Raiders were all you want but those guys still had to go out and make catches after getting open and they did. The Pats, Colts, Steelers and a few other teams the Ravens will have to beat to get to the playoffs or in the playoffs don't have great secondaries. These guys don't have to go out and be world beaters be ause Trestman's scheme does a great job of creating space. They just have to make the plays that are available for them to make and they are doing just that so far.

The run first offense is a stagnant offense that requires guys to be basically studs because your offense will be in 2nd/3rd and longs all game. Being aggressive hides the deficiencies the Ravens offense has.

To some extent this is true. Today more than other games this year I was left scratching my head about Joe's decisions as he'd throw the ball to someone (usually Smith) in tighter coverage than finding his 2nd or 3rd read to Marlon or Kamar. However, it makes me think that it is a product of Joe's lack of confidence in their talent/inablity to execute.

[rafahash]

I like him so far. It would help to have a healthy Eugene Monroe and some weapons for Joe, though.

[CalvinSmoke]

I loved the adjustments made today. Trestman schemes better for our #1 reciever than anyone before him. He gets better every week. And he's very aggressive. Flacco will break 4000 with trestman