The good, bad and ugly vs Broncos

[BmoreBird22]

Exactly. Though, to be fair, Trestman, et al. could've adjusted to the rush and worked in quicker plays, screens, etc.

He tried a bubble screen to Aiken (his only catch that went for -1 yards) and Joe completed nine of his 18 completed passes to the backs (Juice, Allen, and Forsett). There was nothing slowing down that pass rush when the offensive tackles are as bad as they were. I'd fear to see the offensive line bail out for a halfback screen. Joe would get murdered.

[PurpleCity5]

It doesn't matter PC.  We will still witness and hear that our receivers can't get "separation" from the DB's.  We've been hearing that for years and nothing has changed!  At some point, we have to admit that it is the offensive personnel!  They are incapable of out-battling the man in front of them to make a play.  Sad to see when I watch other teams WR's seem to constantly get open and hit with passes in stride for huge gains down the field.

I know how annoying it can be. It seems that year-after-year this seems to be the same problem. Eventually you need to fix it right? That is the reason why we drafted Perriman, to stop that endless cycle. So I'm hopeful. 

 

I mean Breshad was a big piece for the offense and there was no anticipation for him being gone for this long, the only thing we can do is just watch and wait for him to get back. I'm not going to lie, I may be wrong about Aiken being a starter. 

[Militant X 1]

I know how annoying it can be. It seems that year-after-year this seems to be the same problem. Eventually you need to fix it right? That is the reason why we drafted Perriman, to stop that endless cycle. So I'm hopeful. 

 

I mean Breshad was a big piece for the offense and there was no anticipation for him being gone for this long, the only thing we can do is just watch and wait for him to get back. I'm not going to lie, I may be wrong about Aiken being a starter. 

 

The Ravens need more receivers than just Perriman to be able to beat the DB's and we really don't know what type of factor he will be until he his thrown in the mix.

[Passepartout]

Flacco just needs to throw a lot more quicker. And also accurate.

[flynismo]

Well ravensdfan, you know I am a huge advocate for the defensive side of the ball. I always have been however, I want the offense to look good, shine, dominate opposing defenses and to just stop playing and looking like poo-poo. I have absolutely no confidence in our offensive unit as a whole...none! Sure, it's just 1 game but that 1 game was very forth-telling. And to me, to me; sometimes, how you play at the beginning...can, might and oftentimes will determine your end! I don't expect much different from them on Sunday vs the Raiders. We'll see! I hope they prove me wrong!

Well, on the one hand, I think that is being dismissive of how dominant Denver's defense played... on the other hand, we need to see our guys step up regardless of the opposition. The offense does not get a pass for that lackluster performance, but, we shouldn't get too high or low based on week one. Like you said, we'll see...

[usmccharles]

Well, on the one hand, I think that is being dismissive of how dominant Denver's defense played... on the other hand, we need to see our guys step up regardless of the opposition. The offense does not get a pass for that lackluster performance, but, we shouldn't get too high or low based on week one. Like you said, we'll see...

I understand what your saying, but we have to be realistic.  You cant put Aiken up against Revis and expect it to go well, the opposition is what makes the game flow happen.  We just dont have the personel to go up against corners like that and with out a deep threat they dont have to worry about stretching the field.  Im not an offensive genius, nobody here is, and its been mentioned somehwere else, we dont have the WRs to scheme for those quick passes like NE.  Maybe if we had a roster full of Camps. 

[wizard1]

I understand what your saying, but we have to be realistic.  You cant put Aiken up against Revis and expect it to go well, the opposition is what makes the game flow happen.  We just dont have the personel to go up against corners like that and with out a deep threat they dont have to worry about stretching the field.  Im not an offensive genius, nobody here is, and its been mentioned somehwere else, we dont have the WRs to scheme for those quick passes like NE.  Maybe if we had a roster full of Camps. 

 

Ditto that !

[JEEPercreepermd]

He has a sprained PCL, which takes 6-8 weeks to heal. I don't know what people were expecting.

The problem is that they refused to say anything for the longest time. The Ravens under Harbaugh guard injury information like it's Fort Knox.

So the natural fan reaction with what we knew at first was he's out as a precaution, just a bruised knee..making sure there's no fluid or things of that nature..so we're like hey where is this guy if it's not that bad?

If they said at some point that it was infact the pcl and that he would be out until after the season started, at least people wouldn't have villanized the gut so much as if he doesn't want to be out there.

[PurpleCity5]

The Ravens need more receivers than just Perriman to be able to beat the DB's and we really don't know what type of factor he will be until he his thrown in the mix.

Well, that is true, can't argue with that. Still, the only thing we can honestly so is be hopeful, if Perriman returns and proves to be that #2 WR, than SSS job gets a whole lot easier.

[CalvinSmoke]

btw, we ran a play action fake roll out early on the first drive, Flacco nearly got killed and had 1 second to throw it.

[berad]

Go look at the "Next up, Denver Broncos" thread and see how many people said, "I don't want to see any of that soft zone crap."

 

It's usually 6-8 yards off (ten is a good exaggerating in most cases), but, conversely, especially in zones where corners are asked to sit back usually (even if they're playing press bail), the corners are also reading the quarterback. On Jimmy's pick six, what is he doing? He's sitting 8 yards back reading Peyton Manning and made one hell of a break on a player that wasn't even his responsibility. That's just intelligent football coupled with great athleticism. That's what people were missing last year. The Ravens probably played more zone yesterday than they did man coverage. I would also venture to say that Jimmy played less press man than he did with a fairly good cushion because he's actually able to break on the ball. I'm almost certain Webb was asked to play press man because he could not break onto the ball in off-man situation.

 

"Soft zone" from my interpretation meaning sitting off with no pressure. Yes, in prior games 10 yds was not an exagerration but the reality. With no pressure, those were easy plays. On Jimmy's play it was an outstanding job by him reading Peyton and breaking on the ball but that throw was forced by Pees having 7 at the line, dropping 2, and Arrington's quick pressure and hit on the QB. Dare I say a zone blitz? That's when the zone is at it's best. When we rushed three, Peyton took his time to make completions.

What Dean Pees did was not that far off what he normally did. Walking a player up the line of scrimmage and then having them bail is not new. He's done it plenty with Daryl/Mosley, Upshaw, and even the slot corners off the edge who will bail into a zone after faking a blitz. It's nothing new. Safety blitzes aren't anything new, either. Again, the execution was just far more acceptable because the players weren't practice squad players, castoffs, and what not.

I've rarely seen Pees do it with a safety and I noticed it a handful of times Sunday. I'll generalize and say that people's biggest issues with Pees is that he will not bring pressure consistently and he'll go vanilla late in games, which allows teams back into it. He did something outside of his norm on Sunday. Claiming he's always done so is not valid with what I, or others, have seen in the past. Players gave Pees credit for having an excellent game plan and talked about disguising their coverages and blitzes. That hasn't happened all the time.

Similar to how Trestman couldn't operate a decent offense due to the lack of protection from the offensive tackles (how do two players get -10 or worse grades?), Pees couldn't do anything last year because he didn't have the proper players. However, equip a good coordinator with the right pieces and suddenly he's going to be able to call a game the way he wants.

There are also things Trestman could have done to help his floundering tackles, things that John Harbaugh addressed. It's not ONLY execution.

We had plans to chip and to keep backs in and things like that. We didn’t get to them as much as we should have. We should’ve gotten to those a little bit more often and slowed that rush down. A lot of that at the end of the game, it is hard to chip your way out in two-minute, because you really have to push the ball down the field. So, you need receivers out to do that. But earlier in the game, we probably could have done a better job of that.”

http://www.baltimoreravens.com/news/article-1/Transcripts-Ravens-Media-Availability-914/d6c07f29-19a7-44b7-96de-485b37bc4eca

[Gordo52]

Per RSR:

–Joe had Ample Time and Space (ATS) on just 5 of 34 drop backs.

–The 15% ATS was the lowest figure in the 91 games I have been scoring it (since the beginning of 2010).

–He twice had just 26% ATS during the 2010 season (at Pittsburgh and vs. Cleveland).

–Since the end of 2010, the Ravens had never given him ATS on less than 31% of throws.

–Joe has had ATS on 1,647 of 3,244 drop backs in the last 5+ seasons (51%).

–The Ravens have gained an average of 8.2 YPP with ATS as opposed to 4.2 YPP without from 2010-14.

–The Broncos achieved this phenomenal pressure rate without frequently bringing numbers.

http://russellstreetreport.com/2015/09/16/filmstudy/ravens-tackles-fail-in-denver/

Barf.

Edited September 16, 2015 by Gordo52

[DomMcRaven]

Per RSR:

http://russellstreetreport.com/2015/09/16/filmstudy/ravens-tackles-fail-in-denver/

Barf.

That is seriously disgusting. Goes to show you that with decent offensive line play, we easily had a better chance to win the game. 

[Ravensfan23]

Per RSR:

http://russellstreetreport.com/2015/09/16/filmstudy/ravens-tackles-fail-in-denver/

Barf.

That is exactly why you can't judge the Wrs nor Trestman in this game. People wanna be so quick to qrite off the Wrs but they made themselves available to make plays and Trestman did a good creating matchups but the pressure was just too much.

The Ravens had the biggest disadvantage in this game being that Trestman was asked to call a game using the playbook that the HC created and the DC has spent years in. This was Trestman's first game and he was asked to develop a plan that Kubes and Wade had never seen before. Nearly impossible. There was a ton of good things in the Broncos game offensively it just didn't show up in the stat sheets. I'm sure the Ravens felt much better after watching the game film and seeing the opportunities they had if they just blocked better.

[Tank 92]

That is exactly why you can't judge the Wrs nor Trestman in this game. People wanna be so quick to qrite off the Wrs but they made themselves available to make plays and Trestman did a good creating matchups but the pressure was just too much.

The Ravens had the biggest disadvantage in this game being that Trestman was asked to call a game using the playbook that the HC created and the DC has spent years in. This was Trestman's first game and he was asked to develop a plan that Kubes and Wade had never seen before. Nearly impossible. There was a ton of good things in the Broncos game offensively it just didn't show up in the stat sheets. I'm sure the Ravens felt much better after watching the game film and seeing the opportunities they had if they just blocked better.

This is kind of where I'm at. Things were stacked against Joe and the O pretty much from the start, especially with Monroe going down, again. Even after all of the bad they still had the game won. sigh......... I'm confident that with time they will become a much better unit.

For me the main disheartening factor in the Denver game was Smitty. Not sure how a veteran with SB and HOF aspirations chokes so badly.

[Militant X 1]

Well, on the one hand, I think that is being dismissive of how dominant Denver's defense played... on the other hand, we need to see our guys step up regardless of the opposition. The offense does not get a pass for that lackluster performance, but, we shouldn't get too high or low based on week one. Like you said, we'll see...

 

See, but that's just the thing.  For one, I'm not dismissive as you suggest of how well Denver's defense played.  Our defense played as equally well.  And to say that our guys need to step up regardless of the opposition is actual what I said but in my way!  Let me also address that I'm far from being high or low after one week as well man!  C'mon now!  This is football we all know the drill!  You cats try to jump to the defense of the offense so quickly when I'm talking about the BIG picture overall in my eyes....that being; the Ravens offensive personnel is not that good!  Cause IF they were, we wouldn't still be hearing the same old argument about "the O-line didn't block" or that "the WR's can't get separation" year after year after year.  Would we now?  And we seemingly hear that regardless of who the opponent is as well.  But, it's a long season of course and things do and can change.  I hope to see that with our Ravens!

Edited September 16, 2015 by Militant X 1

[Ravensfan23]

This is kind of where I'm at. Things were stacked against Joe and the O pretty much from the start, especially with Monroe going down, again. Even after all of the bad they still had the game won. sigh......... I'm confident that with time they will become a much better unit.

For me the main disheartening factor in the Denver game was Smitty. Not sure how a veteran with SB and HOF aspirations chokes so badly.

Yea i'd be surprised if the offense doesn't explode Sunday in Oakland. Of course the talk then will be that Oakland's defense sucks but i think the offense will do some good things. Trestman could have definitely done more and even Harbs alluded to this, in terms of helping out in the pressure department, but in my view that didn't take away from what happened in the back end and Trestman's abilities to get LBs and Safeties matched up on WR.

He set up a lot of things in that game that the Ravens weren't able to get to because they didn't convert on 3rd down enough and sustain drives. Then once the offense did start showing life, the 4th quarter was cut short by an 11:00 drive.

To be fair to Steve the only play i though was a huge negative was the pick 6. Flacco basically threw the ball because it was zero coverage and he didn't expect anyone to be able to stop Smitty from getting to his spot. The plays at the end of the game, he has to make that catch but he was open in the endzone twice and pressure forced Flacco to throw bad balls. I liked the way Trestman moved him around and i expect him to bounce back but he won't have a huge season imo. Never really expected that.

[A Fish Called Yanda]

Yea i'd be surprised if the offense doesn't explode Sunday in Oakland. Of course the talk then will be that Oakland's defense sucks but i think the offense will do some good things. Trestman could have definitely done more and even Harbs alluded to this, in terms of helping out in the pressure department, but in my view that didn't take away from what happened in the back end and Trestman's abilities to get LBs and Safeties matched up on WR.

He set up a lot of things in that game that the Ravens weren't able to get to because they didn't convert on 3rd down enough and sustain drives. Then once the offense did start showing life, the 4th quarter was cut short by an 11:00 drive.

To be fair to Steve the only play i though was a huge negative was the pick 6. Flacco basically threw the ball because it was zero coverage and he didn't expect anyone to be able to stop Smitty from getting to his spot. The plays at the end of the game, he has to make that catch but he was open in the endzone twice and pressure forced Flacco to throw bad balls. I liked the way Trestman moved him around and i expect him to bounce back but he won't have a huge season imo. Never really expected that.

 

Oakland has a very good pass rush, but not much behind that.  I think the only thing we'll be able to determine from Sunday's game is whether or not our o-line malfunctions in Week 1 were an abberation or the norm.

[CalvinSmoke]

After reading watching the first half I saw that,

Losing Monroe really hurt, he was already having a rough day but it got ugly after that.

We tried two bootlegs in the first quarter, they both nearly got Joe killed

Players were Wide open on two of the sacks Joe had to take. That's the beauty of pressure, (similar thing happened to Peyton at the end of the half)

[rmcjacket23]

Yea i'd be surprised if the offense doesn't explode Sunday in Oakland. Of course the talk then will be that Oakland's defense sucks but i think the offense will do some good things. Trestman could have definitely done more and even Harbs alluded to this, in terms of helping out in the pressure department, but in my view that didn't take away from what happened in the back end and Trestman's abilities to get LBs and Safeties matched up on WR.

He set up a lot of things in that game that the Ravens weren't able to get to because they didn't convert on 3rd down enough and sustain drives. Then once the offense did start showing life, the 4th quarter was cut short by an 11:00 drive.

To be fair to Steve the only play i though was a huge negative was the pick 6. Flacco basically threw the ball because it was zero coverage and he didn't expect anyone to be able to stop Smitty from getting to his spot. The plays at the end of the game, he has to make that catch but he was open in the endzone twice and pressure forced Flacco to throw bad balls. I liked the way Trestman moved him around and i expect him to bounce back but he won't have a huge season imo. Never really expected that.

Oakland needs to serve, at the very least, as a "confidence" game for the offense. They need to be able to protect and move the ball. If they can do that, I'll be content. I don't need to see them putting up 40 for offense, because frankly, I'm not sure this offense is good enough to do that.

 

The idea that "its only Oakland" is viable, because in the playoffs (assuming we consider ourselves to be a playoff caliber team), you're much more likely to face defenses closer to Denver's caliber than you are to Oakland's caliber. So we won't be able to definitively say that the offense is "back" if they have a great game against Oakland, but that we at least know its not solely a personnel and execution problem. Its a combination of the latter with a much more imposing defense.

[Tru11]

This is kind of where I'm at. Things were stacked against Joe and the O pretty much from the start, especially with Monroe going down, again. Even after all of the bad they still had the game won. sigh......... I'm confident that with time they will become a much better unit.

For me the main disheartening factor in the Denver game was Smitty. Not sure how a veteran with SB and HOF aspirations chokes so badly.

 

when did he choke?

[Tank 92]

when did he choke?

Half heartedly tried to one arm a pass in the flat early in the game.......Let Talib out muscle him without a fight on the pick......let the game winning pass go through his hands and hit him in the face mask.

Smitty talks a lot of trash, but completely disappeared for a while last season and has started out this year playing like a rookie. I just don't understand the inconsistency.

[HoldingCall]

Half heartedly tried to one arm a pass in the flat early in the game.......Let Talib out muscle him without a fight on the pick......let the game winning pass go through his hands and hit him in the face mask.

Smitty talks a lot of trash, but completely disappeared for a while last season and has started out this year playing like a rookie. I just don't understand the inconsistency.

Seriously, Steve was out of position to do anything about the pick 6. I blame that on the intense pass rush and good defense by the CB.

[Tank 92]

Seriously, Steve was out of position to do anything about the pick 6. I blame that on the intense pass rush and good defense by the CB.

Great play by Talib, no doubt. But Smitty just kinda let him out muscle him to the route without a fight at all. Not what you would expect from him.

[Tru11]

Half heartedly tried to one arm a pass in the flat early in the game.......Let Talib out muscle him without a fight on the pick......let the game winning pass go through his hands and hit him in the face mask.

Smitty talks a lot of trash, but completely disappeared for a while last season and has started out this year playing like a rookie. I just don't understand the inconsistency.

 

that last pass got tipped at the last second.

 

thats why it went through his hand and hit him in the face mask.

 

you might have a point if roby did not tip it but in this case the only way for that to be a catch would be if it by some miracle took an incredibly lucky bounce after it hit his face mask....

 

also that INT was not smiths fault at all.

Flacco should have never thrown that pass to him.

BTW talib is 1 of the top press man cov corners in the league.

he is also younger and bigger then smith.

 

there is no way smith or any other WR would win 100% of the match ups against him.

 

it also did not help he was still getting pressed pass 5 yards...

[GhostofGrbac]

I've been saying this for years . Joe Flacco is the AFC's Eli Manning. And thats not a knock on Joe. Eli Manning and Joe Flacco are both good QBs, but he needs weapons around him. He's not like an Aaron Rodgers or Tom Brady that makes players around them better, its the complete opposite. Give them time in the pocket, great weapons on the outside, good running game, good defense etc. they'll tear you up because they have big, accurate arms when they have time.. but if the game is solely on their shoulders then nothing will come out of it except interceptions.

 

And best believe they turn up come playoff time.

 

Exactly. That's not a knock at all. Eli Manning is a damn good QB that has won 2 Super Bowls. 

 

For some reason that bothers some Ravens fans. They think Joe is on the level of guys like Brady and Rodgers. Which he definitely isn't. Those 2 will go down as 2 of the best QB's ever. 

[Ravensfan23]

Oakland has a very good pass rush, but not much behind that.  I think the only thing we'll be able to determine from Sunday's game is whether or not our o-line malfunctions in Week 1 were an abberation or the norm.

But do they have a pass rush that can produce pressure as quick as Ware and Miller consistently did? The issue wasn't necessarily the pressure but the quick pressure. Ware nearly sacked Flacco on a freaking screen play. I'm not saying the Raiders won't get pressure or sacks but i don't think they'll be able to get quick pressure consistently like the Broncos and i don't think they'll be able to stay as patient in the run game like Denver did.

[MichaelJ34]

I think our secondary looked awesome it was nice to see press coverage and physical play froma Ravens defense I have been missing that now ...I hope we hear that some players are back practicing today... We need Jernigan Melvin Taliafero ready to go this week. I keep waiting to hear that Breshad is doing something on the practice field but at this point i am just giving up hope on that.

[Tank 92]

that last pass got tipped at the last second.

 

thats why it went through his hand and hit him in the face mask.

 

you might have a point if roby did not tip it but in this case the only way for that to be a catch would be if it by some miracle took an incredibly lucky bounce after it hit his face mask....

 

also that INT was not smiths fault at all.

Flacco should have never thrown that pass to him.

BTW talib is 1 of the top press man cov corners in the league.

he is also younger and bigger then smith.

 

there is no way smith or any other WR would win 100% of the match ups against him.

 

it also did not help he was still getting pressed pass 5 yards...

Not saying the pick was his fault and yes, Talib is a top CB that made a great read and play, but just no effort from Smitty at all. May not have made a difference, but he could have tried to at least fight through the press. He just gave up.

The DB got a pinky on the game winner yes. But it didn't deflect the ball away at all. You expect a future HOF WR to maintain concentration and make that catch.

Seems Smitty's mind and mouth are making promises that his body can't fulfill.

[PurpleCity5]

Exactly. That's not a knock at all. Eli Manning is a damn good QB that has won 2 Super Bowls.

For some reason that bothers some Ravens fans. They think Joe is on the level of guys like Brady and Rodgers. Which he definitely isn't. Those 2 will go down as 2 of the best QB's ever.

I feel as if Joe had a Superstar WR he can rely on, he would have much more respect. I mean when SSS lit it on Fire at the start of the season last year, Joe looked every bit of an elite QB. Sad that it hasn't happened yet.

Im hoping Perriman is our long lost guy.